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Question about eternity ring

twinkies

Rough_Rock
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Messages
5
I've been a long time lurker and have enjoyed looking at everyone's beautiful pieces. I have come across a question that I could not resolve only though pure lurking and searching, so I'd love some input.

I've been researching princess-cut eternity bands and recently had my jeweler design one for me. I asked for a full eternity band using individual .25 ct. princess stones (F/G color, VVS) in a u-prong setting. My ring size is a size 5. We received a written invoice/receipt indicating the above and paid x-amount.

Weeks and weeks later (month and a half), the ring was completed and I picked it up. Apparently, they were having problems making the mold and it was had to be remade over and over. It was beautiful, but looked a bit smaller than the .25 stones we were shown. After emailing back and forth, I was told that the jeweler used .18 ct diamonds instead of the .23-.25 ctw we agreed on (and paid for). He said that creating a seamless full, eternity band in a specific size (size 5) is a very precise task, so in order for it to fit, they had to use .18 diamonds. Also, he says that even though the stones are smaller (.18 vs. .25), they had to use an extra diamond in the band to compensate for the individual smaller stone size.

From a pure visual standpoint, the ring is beautiful and looks fine. However, I feel a bit deceived. If our written invoice, our mutual understanding, as well as our payment was for .25 individual diamonds (F/G, VVS) on a size 5 eternity ring, isn't that what we should receive? Is it true that logistically, they can't make the size 5 ring using .25 (.23-.25) stones in a u-prong setting. (I highly doubt that). More importantly, does using an extra smaller .18 ct. stone equate to using one less larger .25 ct stone?

Hopefully, someone can shed some light, because I kind of feel like it was a bit of a "bait and switch". If we agreed on using .25 stones, that's what I would like. Using smaller stones, b/c they couldn't get it to "fit" (especially without telling me until I questioned it later) doesn't sound entirely proper. Thanks so much for reading.
 
I am a little confused. You say both 0.25ct and 0.25tcw on your eternity ring...0.25ct vs. 0.18ct stones in an eternity ring would definitely be a difference. 0.25tcw vs. 0.18tcw is obviously not as big of a difference and may be accounted for in the size of your finger. It sounds like it is the first based on your description but I just want to clarify to make sure. However, either way it is not what you were quoted and paid for. Since you received a receipt when you paid for it stating what the jeweler had told you they were going to make, I don't understand why the jeweler wouldn't be able to give you at least a partial refund based on that discrepancy. Is this a local jeweler or online?

As to this question "does using an extra smaller .18 ct. stone equate to using one less larger .25 ct stone?" No I would not say that an equal trade off.
 
Thanks for responding. Oops, I mis-typed.

Each individual stone was supposed to be .25 ct (actually .23 to .25 cts). For a size 5 eternity ring, he had ballpark estimated about 18-20 stones for a total carat weight of about 4.7 to 5.0. He ended up using 21 diamonds that were .18 cts. each for a total of 3.78 ctw.

My disappointment is that he didn't end up using the stones we agreed on (as shown on our written receipt). He admits that he tried using .23 size diamonds, but he couldn't get it to look seamless in the shared, u-prong that I wanted. Therefore, he ended up using the .18 ct. stones. (Definitely, we should have been told during the process or at least after we picked-up the ring). He is now offering $500 back, but I have no idea if using one extra .18 ct stone (21 total diamonds) rather than using .25 ct. (20 total diamonds) throughout the band is equitable. My girly, greedy side wants (obviously) the bigger diamonds, but just wondering if $500 is even correct. Since it's not even about the money, but rather the principle, I think I just want to have the ring remade (with another jeweler) with the correct size stones as planned.

BTW, he is a local jeweler that we have worked with numerous times, so all the more perplexing. We bought my 3-stone engagement ring from him (2.25 carat radiant with .5 carat radiants on each side), as well as my "push present" (twins), and my sister's engagement ring. This was my 10-year anniversary gift, now it's kind of leaving a bitter taste in my mouth. :cry:
 
I believe the price difference is more than an extra 0.18ct diamond and $500 that he offered you. More importantly, you want (and I do as well) 0.25ct diamonds, not 0.18ct diamonds. I think your jeweler is not honest and is unethical. First, he should have asked you for permission to use smaller diamonds in the first place. Second, he should have told you after he had put smaller diamonds in your ring. Third, he is cheating you a lot of money with his pathetic offer of only $500, AFTER you questioned him. Don't want to deal with people I cannot trust. I would get full refund and shop elsewhere.
 
This isn't like buying an estate piece, where there's maybe some room for interpretation (it can be hard to measure set stones, so where one appraiser might say "two carats," another might say " only one and a half" - I always figure, so long as you're paid at the lower end of the possible facts, you're good). You custom ordered this. It should have been made to your specs, or the contract was void. It's disingenuous in the extreme for the dealer to have tried to fudge tcw to get around his incompetence.

I'm the first to admit I stink at math, and calculations, so if I'm wrong, somebody correct me. But just going off of some of my eternities for rough numbers, and assuming princesses have measurements roughly equal to french cuts ....

.25 x 20 = 5 carats total weight

Heck, let's say we weigh light and go with .23 stones.

.23 x 20 = 4.6 carats total weight

.18 x 21 = 3.78 carats total weight

That's a big difference, in cost and in appearance. Long story short? I'd be returning this for a full refund. If he can't make it to your specifications, he shouldn't have accepted the commission. Frankly, he should consider himself lucky that you don't report him to the BBB and/or take him to small claims court - his not telling you up front is unconscionable.
 
I agree with Fancy Diamonds - this is a business you have frequented before with good results and this time, on a special event purchase, he has ripped you off --- and only "fessed up" because you called him on it!

I would insist on either getting the ring you ordered as per your paid contract, or get your money back and go elsewhere.

Kind of torn on the 'give him a second chance' thing... I had that opportunity myself last year, and as much as I'd like to have faith in people, several PSers advised me, if they could have done it right the first time - they would have!! Your situation is another example of that.

In the end, I got a full refund, walked away (well--- scuttled away VERY quickly because I couldn't believe I had the money back and didn't want him to suddenly change his mind again!) and then purchased the perfect ring from BGD. I think that's what I'd suggest if you are up for it. Its hard to end a relationship with a business that other family members/friends have had a good result from, but this guy did NOT give you what you ordered and he is being dishonest...

Too little too late, is what I'm thinking!
 
Thank you everyone for your replies. I'm so glad that it wasn't me being crazy. I could understand industry standard and if perhaps I got mostly .23 (when we agreed on .25). However to pay for .25cts. and have it in writing, and then walk away with .18 (a full carat and a half less), just didn't seem to make sense.

I've spoken with him, and he agrees that they tried making the ring using the other larger stones, but they couldn't make it using the setting I wanted. He said he will remake the ring, but it's not possible without using a sizing bar in the back. So, it won't be a true eternity. Will that just ruin the look? I'm guessing (he'll email me pics today) it will be a small space of metal that you can only see if the ring spins.

The other option is to keep my current ring he made (.18 cts. equalling 3.78 ctw.) and get some money back, but that feels kind of lame. To be honest, when I saw the ring, I thought it was beautiful (a little smaller than I thought it would be), but still pretty. Hmmm, not sure what to do. I'll post pics of my e-ring and the eternity, and perhaps I can have some input whether it's too small. I'm such a wimp and I hate walking away based on our history. I know I should, b/c now he could try to use larger (.25), but lesser quality stones....ugh, opens up a whole new set of problems. :rolleyes:

Thank you for all your valuable input.
 
I think you were clearly deceived, if you can return the ring and get your money back, that is what I would do and move on. I think there are plenty of PS vendors who will do right by you. Good luck.
 
twinkies|1361817261|3390072 said:
Thank you everyone for your replies. I'm so glad that it wasn't me being crazy. I could understand industry standard and if perhaps I got mostly .23 (when we agreed on .25). However to pay for .25cts. and have it in writing, and then walk away with .18 (a full carat and a half less), just didn't seem to make sense.

I've spoken with him, and he agrees that they tried making the ring using the other larger stones, but they couldn't make it using the setting I wanted. He said he will remake the ring, but it's not possible without using a sizing bar in the back. So, it won't be a true eternity. Will that just ruin the look? I'm guessing (he'll email me pics today) it will be a small space of metal that you can only see if the ring spins.

The other option is to keep my current ring he made (.18 cts. equalling 3.78 ctw.) and get some money back, but that feels kind of lame. To be honest, when I saw the ring, I thought it was beautiful (a little smaller than I thought it would be), but still pretty. Hmmm, not sure what to do. I'll post pics of my e-ring and the eternity, and perhaps I can have some input whether it's too small. I'm such a wimp and I hate walking away based on our history. I know I should, b/c now he could try to use larger (.25), but lesser quality stones....ugh, opens up a whole new set of problems. :rolleyes:

Thank you for all your valuable input.

You seem a great deal more invested in the relationship--such as it is--than he is. Or he wouldn't have cheated you. You didn't get what the contract specified. He was perfectly happy to pocket the difference in money, and you had to catch the discrepancy and call him on it. With ethics like that, I wouldn't give him another chance, because now you'll have to wonder about every single transaction with this guy. Not worth it, in my book.
 
Aoife|1361818430|3390100 said:
twinkies|1361817261|3390072 said:
Thank you everyone for your replies. I'm so glad that it wasn't me being crazy. I could understand industry standard and if perhaps I got mostly .23 (when we agreed on .25). However to pay for .25cts. and have it in writing, and then walk away with .18 (a full carat and a half less), just didn't seem to make sense.

I've spoken with him, and he agrees that they tried making the ring using the other larger stones, but they couldn't make it using the setting I wanted. He said he will remake the ring, but it's not possible without using a sizing bar in the back. So, it won't be a true eternity. Will that just ruin the look? I'm guessing (he'll email me pics today) it will be a small space of metal that you can only see if the ring spins.

The other option is to keep my current ring he made (.18 cts. equalling 3.78 ctw.) and get some money back, but that feels kind of lame. To be honest, when I saw the ring, I thought it was beautiful (a little smaller than I thought it would be), but still pretty. Hmmm, not sure what to do. I'll post pics of my e-ring and the eternity, and perhaps I can have some input whether it's too small. I'm such a wimp and I hate walking away based on our history. I know I should, b/c now he could try to use larger (.25), but lesser quality stones....ugh, opens up a whole new set of problems. :rolleyes:

Thank you for all your valuable input.

You seem a great deal more invested in the relationship--such as it is--than he is. Or he wouldn't have cheated you. You didn't get what the contract specified. He was perfectly happy to pocket the difference in money, and you had to catch the discrepancy and call him on it. With ethics like that, I wouldn't give him another chance, because now you'll have to wonder about every single transaction with this guy. Not worth it, in my book.

I hate to be harsh, but I agree with Aoife. He did not give you what you paid for or asked for... until you called him on it. This is not honest. This is a dishonest manouevre on his part and that just turns me off when I encounter that, not matter what I've already got invested in a business.

But all in all - it matters not what we think - you are the purchaser and if you are happy with a remade ring or a refund, then that's all that matters!! I hope it turns out the best possible end result that you are hoping for :))
 
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