Question about hard water and diamonds........?????

[Carlotta]

I recently changed my water supply....new (city) water seems much cleaner than our well water, but I no longer have a softener.....
Will the hard water form a "scale" on my diamonds???
I know the jewelers have a chemical they can use, but is ther a good "home remedy?"

What about vinegar?? Would it hurt the white gold, yellow gold, platinum????

Thanks for any ideas/suggestions!

 

[belle]

you could keep a bottle of distilled water on hand to rinse your jewelry after you clean it.

 

[ladykemma]

about every six months or so i give a quick and i mean QUICK "5 second quick dip" in 6 M sulfuric acid. dip it in count to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and rinse by submerging. stone end only not the whole setting.

alternately I have used sulfamic acid found in bathroom cleaners for a quick dip. the squirty stuff with the yellow label.

 

[Carlotta]

Date: 5/5/2006 8:52:05 PM
Author: ladykemma
about every six months or so i give a quick and i mean QUICK ''5 second quick dip'' in 6 M sulfuric acid. dip it in count to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and rinse by submerging. stone end only not the whole setting.

alternately I have used sulfamic acid found in bathroom cleaners for a quick dip. the squirty stuff with the yellow label.

Thanks!!! But think I''ll leave that one to the pros!!!

 

[ladykemma]

i forget not everyone is a teacher of chemistry!

edited to add: here in houston we chip the hard water out of the tap.

 

[JulieN]

Lady Kemma, are you a chem teacher? It''s not everyone who has access to 6M sulfuric acid!

 

[ladykemma]

Date: 5/5/2006 9:08:14 PM
Author: JulieN
Lady Kemma, are you a chem teacher? It''s not everyone who has access to 6M sulfuric acid!

have you noticed how many scientists we have on here?

 

[JulieN]

I''ve noticed a lot of young''uns. Where I am, people marry late. Especially my family and such...usually 27-32.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 5/5/2006 8:13:34 PM
Author: belle
you could keep a bottle of distilled water on hand to rinse your jewelry after you clean it.

yeah but....what can you do after washing your hands in the restroom?

 

[JulieN]

Date: 5/5/2006 9:27:44 PM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 5/5/2006 8:13:34 PM
Author: belle
you could keep a bottle of distilled water on hand to rinse your jewelry after you clean it.

yeah but....what can you do after washing your hands in the restroom?

Cold water will have less minerals in it.

 

[monarch64]

OMG

I had never even thought about this subject before! My parents have hard water (southern IN) and I will remember these tips when I visit again!

 

[ladykemma]

Date: 5/5/2006 9:18:47 PM
Author: JulieN
I''ve noticed a lot of young''uns. Where I am, people marry late. Especially my family and such...usually 27-32.

yeah seems i am chatting with lots of 24 year olds. I am such an old fart.
threadjack? sorry....

 

[perry]

6M sulfuric acid... Of course; I''ll just order some of the internet.... (and you can if you know the names of the companies who supply laboratories). While I''m at it I''ll order some 50% Sodium Hydroxide to mix with it (directly) as a demonstration to folks why you should not play with industrial chemicals....

On the other hand....

Vinigar will work very well for minor hard water coatings, thank you. Just soak the entire ring for a while in a cup of vinigar after you othewise clean it.

If you don''t have the time for that - you can buy a product called "lime-away" (or the generic equivilents) in most grocery stores (house cleaning supply section).

These mild acids will not hurt gold or platinum (or even the common jewelry grade alloys). They are also safe enough that incidental skin contact will not normally harm a person (do not spash into eyes).



Perry

 

[ladykemma]

please be careful not to use hydrochloric acid as it will corrode your metal. vinegar is not strong enough.

 

[Ann]

Like LK, I am in Houston also and yes the water is hard as nails.

(and I''m ancient compared to some of the youngn''s on here too)

Is it ok too dip a ring in alcohol after cleaning? I don''t know where I heard that tip,

but does the alcohol have any effect on the water deposits?

 

[diamondfan]

My cousin is a jeweler who likes Mr. Clean, quick dip, brush with a very soft toothbrush, rinse and air dry. Or use a blow dryer. She does not love ultrasonic cleaners, because they can loosen stones over time I think...

 

[moon river]

Wow, I''ve never thought of this before. PS is such an education. I recentlly went from well water to city water.

I DON''T like it.

 

[Lorelei]

I have very hard water here in the UK and swear by using canned air to blast it off my diamonds, it does help to remove water marks, as to any actual residual film I don''t know.

 

[ladykemma]

the question becomes "how do I keep the calcium carbonate and other dissolved minerals off my ring, and how do i get them off if they are there?

hard water: dissolved calcium carbonate (limestone/chalk) in water with other dissolved minerals. it sticks to objects over time. for example, Know anyone with a cruddy looking aquamarine? covered with "scale"? it needs an acid dip.

don''t soak. acids corrode metals. don''t ruin your setting!

ultrasonic will not get hardwater deposits off, neither will mr clean. you need an acid to remove stuck on calcium carbonate. I personally will use the soapscum remover containing sulfamic acid in a pinch, but i have access to stronger acids

if you want stronger acids ask a chemist friend for a small vial of dilute sulfuric acid. or get it at a pool shop. or fishtank shop.

how a water softener works:
calcium carbonate + sodium chloride (aqueous) ->sodium carbonate + calcium chloride
these products don''t leave a residue, or at least as bad. but make the water taste like baking soda. makes the water high sodium too.

a professional jeweler will remove the stone from the setting and soak or even heat the stone in sulfuric acid.

 

[perry]

Ann: but does the alcohol have any effect on the water deposits?

But of course.... Drink enough of it and you won''t even notice those hard water deposits....

ladykemma: vinegar is not strong enough.
I disagree with this. I use vinegar to clean other things that can get hard water deposits (a CPAP heated humidifier when I travel for a week or more; at home I use distilled water). I just have to let it soak for several hours and the vinegar does the trick.

Personally, I think a person is much better off soaking their ring in vinegar than using many of the much stonger industrial acids out there. Cheaper too.

But so many people want to get things done NOW...


Perry

 

[perry]

ladykemma says (in part):

don't soak. acids corrode metals. don't ruin your setting!

ultrasonic will not get hardwater deposits off, neither will mr clean. you need an acid to remove stuck on calcium carbonate. I personally will use the soapscum remover containing sulfamic acid in a pinch, but i have access to stronger acids

if you want stronger acids ask a chemist friend for a small vial of dilute sulfuric acid. or get it at a pool shop. or fishtank shop.

a professional jeweler will remove the stone from the setting and soak or even heat the stone in sulfuric acid.


You posted this while I was posting my previous post.

I have to say that this does not sound right at all:

First off: Most engagment rings are made principally from Gold or Platinum. Both base metals are immune to most common acids. The elements that Platinum is commonly alloyed with are also immune from most common acids. Gold can be a little trickier - but the better alloys again do not have a major problem with common dilute acids. Chlorine (as in chorinated water and swimming pools can be a problem for alloying elements in gold).

Second: I doubt seriously that professional jewelrs are as a routine putting diamonds in heated sulfuric acid. I don't see such equipment or supplies listed in a common jewelers supply catalog. From an OSHA standpoint and chemical safety - it also does not make sense.

Finally; If someone wants to properely clean their rings and deal with hard water issues - just buy a commercial jewelry cleaning product. There is no need to buy concentrated acids that most people have no idea how to handle from a chemist.

As far as "acids" in general corroding metals.... That statement is far from the real truth. In actuallity - some acids corrods some metals. I can take you into factories that have huge acid tanks to soak metal parts - its called "pickling" or "to pickle" the metal - with no loss of metal at all.

Also, from a metalurgical damage aspect: a few seconds (or even less) contact with a concentrated acid is often far more damaging than a long term exposure to a mild acid.

In the end folks; if you don't want to worry about how to safely clean your jewelry or about who is right or wrong on this forum - a number of companies sell comercially prepared products just for this. That is what the commercial jewelers use.

I'd contact any of the pricescope vendors for advice on where to purchase and what is their favorite product.

I'd also search Pricescope on the cleaner issue as I belive there are already several threads out there on products.

Perry

 

[ladykemma]

perry - i was simply telling the others how to get scale off their stones. a 5 ml vial of dilute sulfuric acid from a fishtank shop is not an osha issue. neither is bathroom soap scum remover sold in the grocery store. i also don''t want people to soak their rings in chlorinated compounds like HCl or lime away and come back to find the ring dissolved.

knock it off.

In a former life I was a CSP so don''t throw credentials at me. I did HAZMAT for a living.

 

[mdx]

The problem with hard water is that it’s an insoluble precipitate formed by ionic reactions when water containing cations with a charge of +2, especially Ca2+ and Mg2+. is heated. So yes a lite acid would work to descale the deposits
Here is a solution you may not like but could work.. Hydrochloric and sulfuric acids are sometimes used in diluted concentrations in toilet bowl cleaners.Check the labels
Apply with a toothbrush, leave a while and rinse off with bottled water.

Johan

 

[Carlotta]

Date: 5/6/2006 8:38:16 PM
Author: mdx
The problem with hard water is that it’s an insoluble precipitate formed by ionic reactions when water containing cations with a charge of +2, especially Ca2+ and Mg2+. is heated. So yes a lite acid would work to descale the deposits
Here is a solution you may not like but could work.. Hydrochloric and sulfuric acids are sometimes used in diluted concentrations in toilet bowl cleaners.Check the labels
Apply with a toothbrush, leave a while and rinse off with bottled water.

Johan

Would it be safe for the metals??? gold and platinum??

 

[mdx]

Diluted Hydrochloric and Sulphuric together would not stain or dissolve gold or plat.

Hydrochloric and Nitric are a bad combination, but I doubt you would find them together in any commercial product.

Johan

 

[Carlotta]

Thanks, Mdx..........

will probably let a pro take care of it........

and use bottled water.........