Reality checking JA setting: Should I ask for this to be changed?

[evergreen]

I ordered a pretty diamond in a simple bezel setting, and it arrived today -- and it's way higher set than I'd expected. I have no idea what their process is for creating settings -- it's clearly not "full-custom." Can I get a reality check on whether it's reasonable to be surprised at the height? Here's the setting: https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ezel-set-solitaire-engagement-ring-item-83060

And the ring I received:


I'm trying to decide if, should they say it is what it is and can't be changed, whether I'd return. I'm a huge fan of low-set rings and this... isn't that.

Screen shot from the spinning CAD:

And an actual example of the ring (the only actual ring the JA site has photographed -- none of the reviews show a profile shot)

 

[distracts]

Yeah that doesn't look like the example given at all. I'd want it remade to be set lower.

 

[flyingpig]

I think it is the combination of the stone set a tad high and the diamond being a tad small.
You really want to see other recently purchased ones with similar sized diamonds, especially for bezel settings. Unfortunately, they are not available this particular setting. Overall, I think it looks slightly off and not as graceful as ones shown on the website. The bezel is a bit thick too for the diamond.
Some stock settings simply do not work well with smaller diamonds.

 

[ItsMainelyYou]

+1 on contemplating a remake
I would also feel it was set too high.

 

[evergreen]

I think it is the combination of the stone set a tad high and the diamond being a tad small.
...
Some stock settings simply do not work well with smaller diamonds.

It's a 1.26ct RB, about 7mm diameter, ring size 6.75 -- didn't expect it to look small! I think those example rings might've been ~2ct (the JA CAD video) and perhaps slightly larger given the higher specific gravity of corundum but on a smaller finger. There were definitely smaller diamonds shown in the reviews where the top-down looked proportional.

 

[LilAlex]

I agree it's too high for the stone. I can not tell if it's a shallow-cut stone but doubt it's multiple mm too shallow.

Pretty hands! Unless you are a giant, I think the bezel is visually shrinking the stone. (It's bigger than my spouse's but feels smaller.) I should MYOB but I vote for a prong-set.

 

[Slickk]

I love bezels and do think they enhance the appearance of size as well (as opposed to what PP lilalex said). I do think there is too much negative space under your stone. I would ask for a remake as I wouldn’t be happy with the height either.

PS please be careful if you wear a wedding band with this as I also have an open gallery bezel that allowed a diamond band to scratch the pavilion of my center stone.

 

[oldminer]

A reasonably skilled bench jeweler could make the ring over a small bit without much trouble. The diamond in your ring is definitely high above the shank. The bezel and diamond element could be lower. Probably, if it was that way when delivered you'd have had no problem.

There is not much in a ring such as this that dictates any necessity for "full custom", but lookers online can't tell such a ring from a cast shank and a die struck bezel soldered together. It doesn't much matter, either. Both might look identical and be equally durable. Getting the diamond height adjusted is certainly possible. Making the bezel a tiny bit more delicate could also be attempted at the same time. The bezel is only slightly divergent from delicate enough.

 

[Tourmaline]

They did a poor job on fitting the CAD to your stone. They should redo it.

 

[evergreen]

PS please be careful if you wear a wedding band with this as I also have an open gallery bezel that allowed a diamond band to scratch the pavilion of my center stone.

Ack, sorry to hear about your pavilion! The big blingy look is fun but, yeah, I can't handle the idea of chewing up either the struts supporting the diamond or the diamond itself! I'm sticking to bezeled diamonds for the band. Love a bezel setting -- I have a couple rings with prongs and they never get worn, whether or not they might flatter the stone more...!

 

[lovedogs]

That is definitely higher than its shown online. I would ask them to remake it

 

[lizzydm26]

I'd return if they can't fix it. Set way too high.

 

[evergreen]

Well. That was my first unpleasant interaction with a JA sales associate (and I've ordered, and even returned, from them 4-5 times). Excerpts:






He also said I cannot, directly or indirectly via a sales associate, communicate with a jeweler there; that their jewelers cannot estimate the height above the band for any setting until the diamond is in hand being set (I asked about an alternative bezel setting they offer); and that -- patronizingly -- diamonds and gemstones are different when I pointed out that the only example actual ring was set considerably closer. The culet explanation is obviously BS. No diamond needs 2mm of airspace to protect its culet.

Classic, "I have been told the answers to these questions, and I have limited direct knowledge of jewelry beyond what i have been told, but I shall stand firm in my ignorance nonetheless. The customer is unreasonable."

Now I don't know what to do. Not least of all because customer service experiences like this one really sour me towards a piece of jewelry which is supposed to be full of good feelings -- seriously, he couldn't have said, "I'm sorry you aren't happy with your setting! I wish we were able to contact the jewelers, but that's just now how we're set up." Etc. A dash of humanity instead of puffery and inappropriate certainty. Grump.

I left an "angry face" as my response to the chat, though of course I imagine nothing will be done.

 

[lovedogs]

Well. That was my first unpleasant interaction with a JA sales associate (and I've ordered, and even returned, from them 4-5 times). Excerpts:






He also said I cannot, directly or indirectly via a sales associate, communicate with a jeweler there; that their jewelers cannot estimate the height above the band for any setting until the diamond is in hand being set (I asked about an alternative bezel setting they offer); and that -- patronizingly -- diamonds and gemstones are different when I pointed out that the only example actual ring was set considerably closer. The culet explanation is obviously BS. No diamond needs 2mm of airspace to protect its culet.

Classic, "I have been told the answers to these questions, and I have limited direct knowledge of jewelry beyond what i have been told, but I shall stand firm in my ignorance nonetheless. The customer is unreasonable."

Now I don't know what to do. Not least of all because customer service experiences like this one really sour me towards a piece of jewelry which is supposed to be full of good feelings -- seriously, he couldn't have said, "I'm sorry you aren't happy with your setting! I wish we were able to contact the jewelers, but that's just now how we're set up." Etc. A dash of humanity instead of puffery and inappropriate certainty. Grump.

I left an "angry face" as my response to the chat, though of course I imagine nothing will be done.

lol, what a silly interaction on JAs part. I would call and ask to speak with a manager, since this person likely doesn't have any idea what you are talking about and is just repeating lines they've been told to say.

 

[lizzydm26]

Sheesh - they are acting like you want a custom ring instead of just the ring as pictured! Hopefully a manager or someone can help. If not, I would return. Or if your feelings have been soured on the whole experience, return and go a different direction.

 

[evergreen]

@lovedogs and @lizzydm26 -- thanks to both of you for talking me down from my sulk. This experience was atypical, based on previous SA interactions at JA, so likely this guy is just a bag of flaming poo himself. I don't know whether they can/will do anything, but calling to speak to a manager is a good suggestion. I have had 2 rings set in JA bezel/semi-bezel stock settings, by the JA jewelers, and they arrived with barely an airline between the culet/pavilion and the base of the setting!

I will call later today. It was helpful that @oldminer above noted that the existing setting could probably be slightly modified by a skilled jeweler -- by cutting the struts that support the bezel, lowering it a little, and welding back on? I'm not opposed to that, though of course I'd prefer JA fix it, and/or switch to the other simple bezel setting they offer (https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...-bezel-set-diamond-engagement-ring-item-53292), if JA can tell me the culet won't be sky-high...! None of the *many* completed rings in that setting are floating way up there...

 

[Sprinkles&Stones]

I want to reach through the phone and smack that SA for you! "it's made how it's supposed to be made". They may as well say "blah blah blah i'm not gonna help you". grrr I'm sorry!

 

[elizat]

For myself, after that interaction I probably would just return the whole thing. Including the stone if it's their stone. I would be done with it and move on.

 

[yssie]

What a lot of tripe Sorry @evergreen. You mentioned you might call in later - I think that’s probably more likely to yield useful resolution.

@YoungPapa @jamesallenrings please, for goodness sake, do something about training your chat representatives. The garbage they spew has gone from bad to worse over the years - these sorts of consumer interactions are embarrassments to both your company and to PS as a sponsored vendor.

Disclosure: I am a many-time happy JA customer.

 

[evergreen]

I called and spoke to a (different, obv) SA and she was SUPER nice, looked at the ring online and told me how pretty and practical the setting was, gave me time to explain the problem, agreed that in general it's better/safer to have the stone set low, and advised me to email the JA service email address with photos, so that's what I will do! Thanks, Marcie with JA. You helped me feel much better, & we'll see what the jeweler/service folks have to say -- if they respond there's nothing they can do due to the stock-mount manufacturing process or something, it will be much easier to accept than from a poorly-informed sales associate. (And, tbh, that wasn't so hard -- Graham, that dude above, is an idiot. ).

 

[evergreen]

For myself, after that interaction I probably would just return the whole thing. Including the stone if it's their stone. I would be done with it and move on.

I was really close to that after closing the chat with the first SA -- it is their stone, and frankly he made it so much easier to return (vs to find a solution that included me keeping the ring) that I'm sure they lose a lot of business/money due to negative interactions like that. Given the tight margins on loose diamonds, they must make money in the setting process, but it's surely a loss if a customer returns a set diamond.

@yssie thanks for tagging the company; there are lessons to be learned here for the customer service reps. They need to be trained for, "What if the ring the customer gets is different from the pictures?" -- I guess Graham was out sick that day , but Marcie was paying close attention! It would also help if JA would post more videos of completed rings so that customers have an accurate idea of the "acceptable range" of setting outcomes. If I had seen a diamond set this high, in this setting, I might not have moved forward.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

My true feeling is to cut your losses, return the setting, and get DK to make one exactly like you want! You'll have CADs to approve before the making of the setting.

 

[evergreen]

My true feeling is to cut your losses, return the setting, and get DK to make one exactly like you want! You'll have CADs to approve before the making of the setting.

I might do some iteration of that -- DK is awesome and I have a growing internal list of projects for him. One of the biggest reasons for buying the diamond at JA, though, was for the ease/low cost of setting it with them as well. The diamond isn't anything particularly special, hahaha - just the right size/budget. Not even super-ideal. I'll see what they say -- really, the other 2 bezel-set rings I've gotten from JA have had super-perfect/custom-quality workmanship. (Returned one bc, basically, the diamond I chose was too small. Not their fault on that!)

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I might do some iteration of that -- DK is awesome and I have a growing internal list of projects for him. One of the biggest reasons for buying the diamond at JA, though, was for the ease/low cost of setting it with them as well. The diamond isn't anything particularly special, hahaha - just the right size/budget. Not even super-ideal. I'll see what they say -- really, the other 2 bezel-set rings I've gotten from JA have had super-perfect/custom-quality workmanship. (Returned one bc, basically, the diamond I chose was too small. Not their fault on that!)

Oh, that's great that they have done great quality bezels for you before! In that case, it sounds like it's totally reasonable to ask them to remake it! I agree that the video is very clear that the round diamond is set quite low!

 

[evergreen]

Oh, that's great that they have done great quality bezels for you before! In that case, it sounds like it's totally reasonable to ask them to remake it! I agree that the video is very clear that the round diamond is set quite low!

These are both JA rings -- they clearly can do a setting really closely matched to the stone itself, and these both happen to be really low-set as well! (Should I be worrying about the culets? Ha!) The pear sapphire was a particular surprise, since it was a wonky cut.





So, I'm optimistic!

 

[YoungPapa]

Hi @evergreen,

I'm just seeing this, and agree the stone is set too high. I've forwarded the thread to some of our team leaders, so expect follow-up by the morning.

We have a TON of new associates and despite spending four weeks In a classroom, empathy and escalation don't come naturally for everyone. We'll use this chat as an example of talking (when we should be listening) and continue to improve. As to your ring, I'm confident we can remake to better match the website pics.

 

[evergreen]

Hi @evergreen,

I'm just seeing this, and agree the stone is set too high. I've forwarded the thread to some of our team leaders, so expect follow-up by the morning.

We have a TON of new associates and despite spending four weeks In a classroom, empathy and escalation don't come naturally for everyone. We'll use this chat as an example of talking (when we should be listening) and continue to improve. As to your ring, I'm confident we can remake to better match the website pics.

Wow, thanks for weighing in -- the experience with the first associate was so atypical compared with the, oh, I don't know, couple dozen interactions I've had with JA staff! While it was an unlucky match with that particular SA (touchy situation, jewelry-nerd-customer, and a less empathetic SA who I guess didn't know about the option to punt to the service email address [always, always punt!]), I am not surprised my contact with the second SA by phone was much more positive. The service email address has a photo of the ring and a description of the problem, and I am grateful to know that I'll be hearing back soon.

I hope you might also consider including more 360 examples of customers' set rings! That is such an incredibly helpful feature, and I would have been happy for any of my JA rings to serve as examples to help others make more informed choices.

May I ask, when someone orders a bezel setting like this through the JA website for a JA stone, do those stone measurements then get transmitted to a CAD artist who tweaks the "stock" design to fit the parameters, then casting and setting? Or is it more like Stuller, where there are stock bezel settings for a 7mm round, 6.5mm round, etc., and the jeweler picks the closest one and makes it work? I am guessing the custom CAD-->setting version, based on how beautifully my previous two bezel/semi-bezel stones were fit. But, in case I branch out to more variably shaped gemstones/diamonds, it would be helpful to know what JA's process is so I can be more informed when selecting settings in the future.

 

[YoungPapa]

Hi @evergreen,

Thank you for giving us the chance to remake the ring and for having such a positive point of view, despite the hiccups.

As to your question, the most accurate answer is 'it depends'. Given our volume, we do manufacture a large amount of our rings in advance, then have a team of setters in NYC that can pull the ring from stock, set the stone, then send over to fulfillment. For bezel settings and halos, we have a library of 10,000+ CAD designs that we've made in the past. If an order comes in and matches an existing CAD, it's printed and used. If we don't have something in the library already, our CAD folks will customize an existing file to fit the new order, then print and manufacture.

My guess is that someone ordered your design in the past and requested the stone to be set high. Your order came in, matched the measurements of that CAD, and that's how we got to where we are now. Our team is already working on a new version that is set to a more standard height.

 

[evergreen]

@YoungPapa that all makes *perfect* sense, and helps me understand your process much better! It also explains why the previous 2 bezel settings were so perfectly fit (and, frankly, this one is too -- no issues with the workmanship whatsoever!). Looking forward to giving your CAD designers more challenges in the future.

 

[HaloJane2021]

I am just curious to know if the girdle size has anything to do with why a diamond would be set higher. I have recently purchased a diamond from James Allen with a halo setting and requested the diamond be set low in the halo setting with no gaps (looking for a “seamless” halo). I am afraid it may come out like yours.

My girdle size is thick-very thick and I have been contemplating cancelling my order. I guess if it does turn out like yours with the diamond protruding out, I will have to give them a call.

@evergreen please keep us updated on how your ring diamonds comes out after it’s been redone!