Red Ruby Color

[voce]

I bought it. I never knew that colored stones would be so addictive, and (un)fortunately I have an addictive personality.

I'm thrilled that the stone was bought by a PSer! I can look forward to more pictures when you're ready to show it off.

 

[ChaiK]

This is from Litnon. I am wondering what red it is. Michael of Litnon has been very kind, candid and patient with me.

He says this does not black out / does not suffer from extinction.

He has a few videos of it on his youtube channel, Litnon gli. It's 11.3 carats Burmese. I know it being Burmese is not going to make it superior to other gems.

I am aware its brown tones can show up in certain light. It is a gem after all, and like all gems, we wear it in the light that makes it shine and perform best.

He describes it as deep red with pure red flashes on his web page. I like that in one of his videos, it is about to rain, and the stone is a vibrant pulsating red against the rumbling thunder. Perhaps it's the romantic in me.

I find myself very drawn to it for some reason. I cannot put my finger on why.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

@ChaiK, what stone is it? A garnet or a spinel?

 

[voce]

@JewelledEscalatorsPlease @ChaiK that has the look of a spinel so I'm betting it's not garnet.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

@remetau,

Did you get the red spinel yet? Sorry for being impatient, no need to respond if you don't want to. I'm just living vicariously through other people's gem purchases

 

[JewelledEscalators]

@voce, what do you mean by 'look of a spinel' ? Is it the colour/lustre or something else?

 

[ChaiK]

It's a spinel. It fits my current dark mood.

Michael of Litnon is really lovely to buy from.

He says the lustre sets it apart from the garnet.

Stone is being shipped to David Klass (I have a pair of Peruvian opals and something else with him to finish off) but I would probably get Wriston of Asiatique in Singapore to set this.

I think when it comes, I will post on the specific gravity thread. I am not a very posty person. I just want to understand red and all its nuances.

This spinel is interesting in that it is a different sort of red. I think the camera picks up darker tones.

Let me see if I can attach a video.

 

[remetau]

@remetau,

Did you get the red spinel yet? Sorry for being impatient, no need to respond if you don't want to. I'm just living vicariously through other people's gem purchases

Well...Kind of. I basically bought it blind since I am stuck in Grenada for the time being and had it shipped to my US address. It arrived, but I haven't seen it yet.

 

[ChaiK]

Ohhhh, @remetau, yours is a lovely lovely red too.

All these different reds, it would be good to understand the colour and their properties in different gems.

 

[voce]

@JewelledEscalatorsPlease the lustre could tell the difference as well. In the still images it's 1) the reflections of the facets (different extinction/shape pattern from garnet, which tends to darken all at the same time under natural light), and 2) the color. Garnets are never true red without modifiers. Typical red garnets have a brownish modifier, rhodolite red garnets have a purplish modifier, and spessartite garnets have an orange modifier.

 

[ChaiK]

@JewelledEscalatorsPlease the lustre could tell the difference as well. In the still images it's 1) the reflections of the facets (different extinction/shape pattern from garnet, which tends to darken all at the same time under natural light), and 2) the color. Garnets are never true red without modifiers. Typical red garnets have a brownish modifier, rhodolite red garnets have a purplish modifier, and spessartite garnets have an orange modifier.

Voce, you really know the reds so well. That's what Michael was trying to explain to me and I did not get it.

I had to show him a dead garnet stone for him to laugh and confirm this spinel will have pure red flashes and will perform well in low light too. I must say though, that the garnet is lovely in its own right and I own two of them.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

Well...Kind of. I basically bought it blind since I am stuck in Grenada for the time being and had it shipped to my US address. It arrived, but I haven't seen it yet.

Ah, well something to look forward to then.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

@voce @ChaiK,

I can see what you both mean by lustre in the video. In terms of colour, I can't tell from the stills on the Litnon website the difference betwen the red garnets and the dark red spinels, other than the red garnets being darker, but it has more parts that are dark than red compared to the spinel - is this what you are referring to in terms of extinction pattern, Voce?

Regarding the flashes of colour and performing well in low light, come to think of it that is the case with my spinel. I didn't know you can get this kind of thing with dark red spinels too - would love to see photos once the stone arrives! Chaik, is this your first spinel?

 

[motownmama]

The siren in the video is hilarious. Look at this stone!!!!!

 

[JewelledEscalators]

Here is my spinel in low light - indoors with curtains closed, the room is not as dark as the photo shows. In low light, the colour almost intensifies. Apologies for the fuzzy photo.

 

[voce]

@voce @ChaiK,

I can see what you both mean by lustre in the video. In terms of colour, I can't tell from the stills on the Litnon website the difference betwen the red garnets and the dark red spinels, other than the red garnets being darker, but it has more parts that are dark than red compared to the spinel - is this what you are referring to in terms of extinction pattern, Voce?

Regarding the flashes of colour and performing well in low light, come to think of it that is the case with my spinel. I didn't know you can get this kind of thing with dark red spinels too - would love to see photos once the stone arrives! Chaik, is this your first spinel?

No, I don't mean more parts that are dark, as the extinction itself is really highly influenced by cut.

Look at the still photos in post #62, particularly the last two. When garnets get dark, they get "hazy" with a "mask" where the flashes of the facets are not as intense, and the edges of the facets don't have that sharp look.

 

[fredflintstone]

That looks like a red spinel to me, not ruby. Burmese rubies don't have an orange modifier, but some Burmese spinels (flame spinels) do, as do some red spinels from Mahenge, Tanzania. Most jewelers aren't well educated on colored stones, so unless they specialize in colored stones, or unless the gem already comes with a lab report from AGL or GIA, I don't trust what they claim. They may really believe they are representing what they are selling correctly, but the truth is another thing entirely from belief. How long ago did you buy it, and what did you pay for the stone? I hope you didn't pay ruby prices for red spinel.

Not true. There are Burma Rubies with an orange modifier. But I'm not saying what this stone is one way or another. Only that orange modifiers in Ruby come from many sources, if not all. Some actually prefer it.

 

[fredflintstone]

I didn't pay Ruby price , it was from an elderly couple getting rid of some things to move across country. She said it wasn’t a Burmese Ruby, but a Thai Ruby. I just no it’s nothing like my vintage Burmese Pendant.

Most, but not all Thai Rubies have a purple modifier. Where there is chromium in Burmese Rubies that is the major coloring agent, iron is the major coloring agent for Thai Rubies, though chromium is present. The have less fluorence than their Burma cousins. They also can have an orange modifier. Most by a far majority are heated to drive out the brown modifier form to much iron content. Thai Rubies used to be very common, not so anymore.

 

[fredflintstone]

Oh,one more thing. Thai Rubies are much more cheaper than Burmese of equal quality.

 

[fredflintstone]

>PrecisionGem,

Interesting picture. For all the talk about spinels being the closest in appearance to ruby, I've never seen a 'ruby red' spinel because all the red spinels I've seen have a somewhat orangeish tone to them, whereas I've seen plenty of rubies with orangeish tones.

I have a red ruby ring and a red spinel ring, and the ruby is never mistaken for a spinel, whilst the spinel is occasionally mistaken for a ruby, even though it being a Tanzanian neon pink/orange red spinel, I can't see how. I've been told by a jeweller that they have seen ruby/sapphires the colour of the spinel. I find that hard to believe, but admittedly, I've not seen enough red spinels in person, being based in Europe.

Have you seen any 'ruby red' spinels that don't have any orange tone to them, say like a crimson colour?

>PrecisionGem,

Interesting picture. For all the talk about spinels being the closest in appearance to ruby, I've never seen a 'ruby red' spinel because all the red spinels I've seen have a somewhat orangeish tone to them, whereas I've seen plenty of rubies with orangeish tones.

I have a red ruby ring and a red spinel ring, and the ruby is never mistaken for a spinel, whilst the spinel is occasionally mistaken for a ruby, even though it being a Tanzanian neon pink/orange red spinel, I can't see how. I've been told by a jeweller that they have seen ruby/sapphires the colour of the spinel. I find that hard to believe, but admittedly, I've not seen enough red spinels in person, being based in Europe.

Have you seen any 'ruby red' spinels that don't have any orange tone to them, say like a crimson colour?

There are red Spinels that are dead ringers for the best Ruby. I think many here equate Ruby to pure red, where in fact all have a slight orange or purple modifier even if it is only 10%-15%. Hard for the human eye to detect the difference. Also, to the trained eye, Spinel has more fire (dispersion) is singularly refractive and is much more crystalline in general.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

No, I don't mean more parts that are dark, as the extinction itself is really highly influenced by cut.

Look at the still photos in post #62, particularly the last two. When garnets get dark, they get "hazy" with a "mask" where the flashes of the facets are not as intense, and the edges of the facets don't have that sharp look.

Ah, I see. Thanks.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

There are red Spinels that are dead ringers for the best Ruby. I think many here equate Ruby to pure red, where in fact all have a slight orange or purple modifier even if it is only 10%-15%. Hard for the human eye to detect the difference. Also, to the trained eye, Spinel has more fire (dispersion) is singularly refractive and is much more crystalline in general.

@fredflintstone

Do you have any pictures or links of a spinel that you consider to be a dead ringer for the best Ruby? The more eye candy the better

 

[ChaiK]

The siren in the video is hilarious. Look at this stone!!!!!

And the thunder in the other one too. Hehe. It’s that dark and gloomy a red, with screaming red hot flashes. I could see it that way too.

 

[ChaiK]

Not true. There are Burma Rubies with an orange modifier. But I'm not saying what this stone is one way or another. Only that orange modifiers in Ruby come from many sources, if not all. Some actually prefer it.

Tanzanian rubies can have an orange tinge too.

 

[ChaiK]

Not true. There are Burma Rubies with an orange modifier. But I'm not saying what this stone is one way or another. Only that orange modifiers in Ruby come from many sources, if not all. Some actually prefer it.

Ignore my comment above about the Tanzanian.

I meant to say yes, I have seen a red Burmese ruby with a slight very slight orange tinge, and because of that, it was such a wonderful bright red.

 

[Nick_G]

@fredflintstone

Do you have any pictures or links of a spinel that you consider to be a dead ringer for the best Ruby? The more eye candy the better

I'm not fredflintstone, and this is a mineral specimen rather than a cut stone, but assuming the photo is accurate, this spinel is up there with the best rubies for colour:

Spinel

Single red octahedral crystal of spinel, partly transparent with fractures and feathery inclusions. Copyright © Lawrence Violett

www.mindat.org

 

[ChaiK]

These are spinels (not mine).

 

[fredflintstone]

Tanzanian rubies can have an orange tinge too.

Yes, Ruby from any source can.

 

[fredflintstone]

@fredflintstone

Do you have any pictures or links of a spinel that you consider to be a dead ringer for the best Ruby? The more eye candy the better

Vietnam Red Spinel 3.40 cts.

 

[JewelledEscalators]

Oooh, the video for this stone is even better

I wonder if it's already sold (not that I can afford it or anything). It's like a perfect ruby that you can't find in reality.