***Ruby Help Needed***

[flea_sly]

@flea_sly Yeah, so it's clearly the same ruby. And there's certainly a notable discrepancy in price ($11,995 vs. $14,300). It's possible that DBL previously moved this gem, and it remains on their site in error. Inken may have come into possession of it (and the price was raised somewhere along the line to account for current value). I say that because it definitely looks like Inken took her own set of photos... I recognize the backdrop as being her studio. But DBL is also based in NYC, so I'm not sure if maybe they are simply using the same supplier. In that case, it's possible the price difference reflects Inken's concierge costs.

With regard to whether my opinion of the gem has changed in looking at DBL's listing... nope. This is a very fine ruby. And I'm sure obtaining an updated lab report, if you were so inclined, would be an easy fix. The GIA and AGL are in walking distance of Inken and DBL's offices.

So Inken has told me before llamacat found the link to this same ruby, that she has it in her possession from the (supplier in NYC). I think basically it's on loan from the supplier (DBL). So to me it appears that the price difference between DBL $11,995 vs. Inken $14,300 is concierge service fee. That is a $2,300 dollar service fee.....

I don't know what to think or feel about this. What is your take on this now that we know the exact facts?

 

[Sydneyphoenix]

So Inken has told me before llamacat found the link to this same ruby, that she has it in her possession from the (supplier in NYC). I think basically it's on loan from the supplier (DBL). So to me it appears that the price difference between DBL $11,995 vs. Inken $14,300 is concierge service fee. That is a $2,300 dollar service fee.....

I don't know what to think or feel about this. What is your take on this now that we know the exact facts?

Go with DBL, obviously. Might have to think of what to say to Inken.

 

[VividRed]

@flea_sly Yeah, so it's clearly the same ruby. And there's certainly a notable discrepancy in price ($11,995 vs. $14,300). It's possible that DBL previously moved this gem, and it remains on their site in error. Inken may have come into possession of it (and the price was raised somewhere along the line to account for current value). I say that because it definitely looks like Inken took her own set of photos... I recognize the backdrop as being her studio. But DBL is also based in NYC, so I'm not sure if maybe they are simply using the same supplier. In that case, it's possible the price difference reflects Inken's concierge costs.

With regard to whether my opinion of the gem has changed in looking at DBL's listing... nope. This is a very fine ruby. And I'm sure obtaining an updated lab report, if you were so inclined, would be an easy fix. The GIA and AGL are in walking distance of Inken and DBL's offices.

Agree with @Autumn in New England.

If Inken and DBL are using the same supplier, I guess you can make your own assessment on what you pay for (stone vs vendor’s margin). It’s a business, not a charity, and people need money. If I were you I would ask DBL if it is still available.

The other option is that Inken borrowed it from from DBL on memo. I would argue that her markup is high but again, nothing is free in this world. I guess you could have found that ruby by yourself by browsing around a bit, but Inken delivered you three fine options and did it quicker than you ever could. That’s part of her job and how she makes a living.

Luckily there are awesome people here on PS who scout around, looking at you @llamacat

 

[VividRed]

Maybe contact the starlanka guy.

After all, when shopping around, one would look at various vendors; that is the norm - to look-see and understand prices and quality before you buy.

Have you seen his entire inventory to make such comment?

Beautiful good rubies at 1.something carats are not above 10k usd, unless you add in premiums for I don't know what.

From my - admittedly limited - experience, there is nothing good below 10k per carat, talking unheated Burmese. It just about starts at 10k retail, if you have contacts.

If you like pink, purple, or orange in your red, then yes, absolutely agree with you. If you want RED and Burma, not so much.

Mozambican rubies below 10k/ct have orange in them, most of the time, or are pure red and too dark.

 

[VividRed]

From my - admittedly limited - experience, there is nothing good below 10k per carat, talking unheated Burmese. It just about starts at 10k retail, if you have contacts.

If you like pink, purple, or orange in your red, then yes, absolutely agree with you. If you want RED and Burma, not so much.

Mozambican rubies below 10k/ct have orange in them, most of the time, or are pure red and too dark.

@ChaiK - don’t get me wrong, I agree that it is expensive. Very, very expensive. I collect red gems since 3.5 years and and always on the lookout for the next purchase. If fine rubies (vivid red, fluorescent, medium tone, eye clean, no window, unheated), my collection would be a lot larger than it is

 

[llamacat]

Agree with @Autumn in New England.

If Inken and DBL are using the same supplier, I guess you can make your own assessment on what you pay for (stone vs vendor’s margin). It’s a business, not a charity, and people need money. If I were you I would ask DBL if it is still available.

The other option is that Inken borrowed it from from DBL on memo. I would argue that her markup is high but again, nothing is free in this world. I guess you could have found that ruby by yourself by browsing around a bit, but Inken delivered you three fine options and did it quicker than you ever could. That’s part of her job and how she makes a living.

Luckily there are awesome people here on PS who scout around, looking at you @llamacat

Lol, I wasn't looking for anything in particular, but I do enjoy perusing our recommended vendors' websites and came across the stone.

 

[flea_sly]

Lol, I wasn't looking for anything in particular, but I do enjoy perusing our recommended vendors' websites and came across the stone.

thank you very much for seeing that and posting it in here!! I appreciate you very much for looking out for a fellow PS!

 

[VividRed]

Lol, I wasn't looking for anything in particular, but I do enjoy perusing our recommended vendors' websites and came across the stone.

Of course, but your unintended action probably saved our fellow a few thousand dollars

 

[flea_sly]

Agree with @Autumn in New England.

If Inken and DBL are using the same supplier, I guess you can make your own assessment on what you pay for (stone vs vendor’s margin). It’s a business, not a charity, and people need money. If I were you I would ask DBL if it is still available.

The other option is that Inken borrowed it from from DBL on memo. I would argue that her markup is high but again, nothing is free in this world. I guess you could have found that ruby by yourself by browsing around a bit, but Inken delivered you three fine options and did it quicker than you ever could. That’s part of her job and how she makes a living.

Luckily there are awesome people here on PS who scout around, looking at you @llamacat

@VividRed @Autumn in New England

She is going to look at some other rubies for me this week to get me more options. She also told me that she is able to hold that burmese ruby in the meantime until a decision is made. @VividRed in my opinion after she said that, I believe it's borrowed from DBL on memo.

@VividRed I agree that nobody does anything for free in this world and I will say she has answered every single one of my thousand questions with accurate information and with haste. She is also going out again this week to look for more stones just so I can look at more inventory and see what/if I like others. My only issue now is that burmese ruby is marked up $2300.00 USD. For some that might not be a ton of money, but for someone like me, it took me over a year to save up the money I have for this stone.

Kind of caught between a rock and a hard place knowing this now. Not sure how to present it to her. suggestions?

 

[Bron357]

Hmmm.
Tricky I guess, but $2,300 on $12,000 is like 20% commission.
I get that you can’t expect people to work for free, everyone’s time is money, but have you had $2,300 worth of service?
Given that the same ruby is available at retail ie not through a gem broker / importer/ cutter, it’s not unexpected that your search (well, another PSer anyhow) found the same ruby. And at a better price.
Be honest with Inken, say my bf/gf/mother/ bestie friend/ whoever has been helping you look you know searching through eBay, Etsy, First Dibs, Loupe Troop, all over the place and found you a lovely Burmese ruby for a great price. But then you realised that it was the same Burmese ruby you had called in, except it’s a fair bit cheaper.
Now while you 1000% appreciate Inkens help and effort in searching, it’s hard for you to justify paying 20% over the other retail price. $2,300 is a lot of money for you.
Perhaps Inken might say her time and her costs (shipping and insurance) and her ability to put 3 beautiful rubies together at this time for you to consider is why the price is 20% more.
Like I said tricky.
You could just say to Inken, thanks very much but nothing is grabbing me at this time and I now appreciate I don’t get as much ruby as I thought I would so I’m thinking I need to keep on saving hard to build up my ruby account.
Of course if you then straightaway approach Diamonds by Lauren, Inken might “twig” to the situation and youll never be able to use her again.

 

[VividRed]

It is both fortunate and unfortunate that the price different is so transparent.

While I understand her markup, I would obviously not pay for it if I had a cheaper option, which is clearly available here.

 

[Enhoerning]

Hello everyone,

It has come to my attention that there is some confusion about the 1.05 ct unheated Burma ruby emerald cut I am offering for sale, and considering the nature of the speculation, I think it makes sense for me to chime in and set the record straight:

The 1.05 ct ruby in question is currently consigned to me for sale by the legal owner. The legal owner is not “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any company affiliated with them. The stone is owned by a business partner and friend of mine.

I just talked to the legal owner of the stone, and they neither know “Diamonds by Lauren”, nor have they authorized “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any other company other than me, to sell the ruby in question. At this time, I am the only person authorized to offer this stone for sale, and it is in my physical possession.

Again, “Diamonds by Lauren” is listing this gemstone for sale without permission, and without having the stone actually available. Please note: if ordered from “Diamonds by Lauren”, they will not be able to deliver this ruby, not now or anytime in the future.

I have reached out to “Diamonds by Lauren”, requesting them to remove the unauthorized listing from their website.

As for the matter of pricing: naturally, a company that offers a gemstone for sale that is neither owned by them, nor actually available through them, can put whatever price they want up on their website.

I do not wish to speculate about the motives “Diamonds by Lauren” has to advertise this stone for the price mentioned as part of their unauthorized listing – I can only repeat that the ruby in questions is only available through me.

Kind regards

Inken Krause / Enhoerning Jewelry

 

[pokerface]

What a strange situation. DBL must have had the stone at some point because they were able to take their own photos. There is obviously more to this story, and I am certainly curious about what would happen should someone attempt to purchase the stone from DBL. For what it's worth, I would not purchase the stone in question at all because I don't like the dark spot/window which is apparent in photos and videos by both vendors.

 

[Rad_Fan]

Op, did you have to put down a deposit for the gem hunt service and would you lose it if you go elsewhere?

 

[Autumn in New England]

Hello everyone,

It has come to my attention that there is some confusion about the 1.05 ct unheated Burma ruby emerald cut I am offering for sale, and considering the nature of the speculation, I think it makes sense for me to chime in and set the record straight:

The 1.05 ct ruby in question is currently consigned to me for sale by the legal owner. The legal owner is not “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any company affiliated with them. The stone is owned by a business partner and friend of mine.

I just talked to the legal owner of the stone, and they neither know “Diamonds by Lauren”, nor have they authorized “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any other company other than me, to sell the ruby in question. At this time, I am the only person authorized to offer this stone for sale, and it is in my physical possession.

Again, “Diamonds by Lauren” is listing this gemstone for sale without permission, and without having the stone actually available. Please note: if ordered from “Diamonds by Lauren”, they will not be able to deliver this ruby, not now or anytime in the future.

I have reached out to “Diamonds by Lauren”, requesting them to remove the unauthorized listing from their website.

As for the matter of pricing: naturally, a company that offers a gemstone for sale that is neither owned by them, nor actually available through them, can put whatever price they want up on their website.

I do not wish to speculate about the motives “Diamonds by Lauren” has to advertise this stone for the price mentioned as part of their unauthorized listing – I can only repeat that the ruby in questions is only available through me.

Kind regards

Inken Krause / Enhoerning Jewelry

Thank you for the clarification, Inken! I will withhold my speculation about DBL, as well, since I don't know the details. But this reminded me of something that happened on ebay once. I was selling an emerald, and a prospective customer came to me to say that my stone, using my photos and description, was also being offered by a seller in Pakistan. I'm not sure what the endgame was there, since they clearly did not have physical possession of my stone. But my guess was that they were going to substitute it with an inferior one, if purchased. Obviously DBL is a reputable dealer and would never do that. But my point is that I've seen this sort of thing happen before due to a myriad of reasons, some perfectly innocent and some a bit more nefarious. Sometimes it's just a matter of an old listing with old pricing that a vendor neglected to remove. Anyway, @flea_sly, you have your answer!!

 

[Rfisher]

What a strange situation. DBL must have had the stone at some point because they were able to take their own photos. There is obviously more to this story

Ditto. More to the story here.

DBL listed it a bit over two years ago, by looking at their insta history. That alone could explain the price difference that’s being discussed here.

Could be as simple as poor website maintenance in alignment of what stones on on hand and what aren’t.

I doubt it’s as nefarious on DBL’s part as Inken is eluding to. But I doubt her intention in saying what she did, is truly nefarious either.
I’m sure there’s a good chance the person co-signing it now (that has claimed no knowledge of DBL) isn’t the same person who co-signed it 2 years ago to DBL.

 

[Autumn in New England]

I’m sure there’s a good chance the person co-signing it now (that has claimed no knowledge of DBL) isn’t the same person who co-signed it 2 years ago to DBL.

The high-end gem game, because inventory is so limited, can be quite incestual sometimes, @Rfisher!

 

[ChaiK]

@ChaiK - don’t get me wrong, I agree that it is expensive. Very, very expensive. I collect red gems since 3.5 years and and always on the lookout for the next purchase. If fine rubies (vivid red, fluorescent, medium tone, eye clean, no window, unheated), my collection would be a lot larger than it is

I stand by what I know, that a 1.something carat fine ruby (not talking about pedigree, but a good vivid ruby with high fluorescence) does not cost 14k usd. I don't wish to change your opinions and beliefs. I am simply telling you what I know and have experienced right up to very recently (the last two weeks).

 

[2Neesers]

I don’t know much about Ruby’s, but I love that you are thinking of this gift for your wife. I hope you enjoy the search and find your perfect ruby.

There is a supply house called Gem2000 and they have several available Ruby’s listed. If you see something that interest you, they can be called in to a jeweler like Africa Gems or Pearlman’s. I have found Pearlman’s to have the better prices and you can enter the item number in to Pearlman’s site to see the retail price of the stone.

Link to available Gem2000 stones with certification. They are sorted by descending weight. You could update it to sort by ascending weight or start at the last page to see the stones closer to 1ct.

Gem 2000 Inc

Gem 2000 is a fair, honest and reliable source for the finest color gemstones mother nature has to offer. The Gem 2000 Gem Search allows you to search our extensive inventory of fine color gems.

www.gem2000.com

Link to Pearlman’s page to enter in item number to check pricing.

Gemstone Search- Pearlman's Jewelers

 

[flea_sly]

Hello everyone,

It has come to my attention that there is some confusion about the 1.05 ct unheated Burma ruby emerald cut I am offering for sale, and considering the nature of the speculation, I think it makes sense for me to chime in and set the record straight:

The 1.05 ct ruby in question is currently consigned to me for sale by the legal owner. The legal owner is not “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any company affiliated with them. The stone is owned by a business partner and friend of mine.

I just talked to the legal owner of the stone, and they neither know “Diamonds by Lauren”, nor have they authorized “Diamonds by Lauren”, or any other company other than me, to sell the ruby in question. At this time, I am the only person authorized to offer this stone for sale, and it is in my physical possession.

Again, “Diamonds by Lauren” is listing this gemstone for sale without permission, and without having the stone actually available. Please note: if ordered from “Diamonds by Lauren”, they will not be able to deliver this ruby, not now or anytime in the future.

I have reached out to “Diamonds by Lauren”, requesting them to remove the unauthorized listing from their website.

As for the matter of pricing: naturally, a company that offers a gemstone for sale that is neither owned by them, nor actually available through them, can put whatever price they want up on their website.

I do not wish to speculate about the motives “Diamonds by Lauren” has to advertise this stone for the price mentioned as part of their unauthorized listing – I can only repeat that the ruby in questions is only available through me.

Kind regards

Inken Krause / Enhoerning Jewelry

Thank you very much for the clarification in this matter. I was utterly confused about why DBL had the same ruby for sale on their website.

 

[VividRed]

I stand by what I know, that a 1.something carat fine ruby (not talking about pedigree, but a good vivid ruby with high fluorescence) does not cost 14k usd. I don't wish to change your opinions and beliefs. I am simply telling you what I know and have experienced right up to very recently (the last two weeks).

@ChaiK I know you’ve been looking at gems for longer than me so I won’t insist, I can only speak from my experience. May I ask, where you find this material? Maybe I am missing some important sources, maybe you have access to gems at wholesale prices, or maybe we have different taste in rubies. I would be grateful if you could share, and happy to be proven wrong, especially if it brings me more red shinies

 

[ChaiK]

@ChaiK I know you’ve been looking at gems for longer than me so I won’t insist, I can only speak from my experience. May I ask, where you find this material? Maybe I am missing some important sources, maybe you have access to gems at wholesale prices, or maybe we have different taste in rubies. I would be grateful if you could share, and happy to be proven wrong, especially if it brings me more red shinies

I am surprised, after 3.5 years of collecting, you are convinced 14.3 k usd is the right price for 1 carat of ruby.

I have told you. You can go and ask the Starlanka guy. Others have mentioned Harshil. Or you could ask Wriston to keep a lookout. And when you buy, somehow, other vendors get hold of your contact details, and they WhatsApp you.

I am now moving on from this thread as I seem to be doing a lot of repeated posts here of the same thing, and I don't want to be seen as trying to push any vendor to anyone. I simply thought it would be a good idea to advise looking at prices clearly and carefully. It really is a 1.something carats. I can understand this sort of pricing for larger rubies per carat, above 3 to 4 carats let's say. But not at 1.something carats.

It was good to watch the thread unfold and now, I think anyone reading this thread can make up their own minds and decide for themselves.

 

[VividRed]

I am surprised, after 3.5 years of collecting, you are convinced 14.3 k usd is the right price for 1 carat of ruby.

I have told you. You can go and ask the Starlanka guy. Others have mentioned Harshil. Or you could ask Wriston to keep a lookout. And when you buy, somehow, other vendors get hold of your contact details, and they WhatsApp you.

I am now moving on from this thread as I seem to be doing a lot of repeated posts here of the same thing, and I don't want to be seen as trying to push any vendor to anyone. I simply thought it would be a good idea to advise looking at prices clearly and carefully. It really is a 1.something carats. I can understand this sort of pricing for larger rubies per carat, above 3 to 4 carats let's say. But not at 1.something carats.

It was good to watch the thread unfold and now, I think anyone reading this thread can make up their own minds and decide for themselves.

That is an interesting answer and arguably not a very friendly one. Whatever. I never said that 14k is the norm, I just said there is nothing fine (as in, top quality) below 10k per carat. Orangy red rubies from Mozambique certainly cost less than 10k per ct, but are not what I would call fine rubies.

 

[2Neesers]

Here are screenshots of a handful of the untreated rubies from the Gem2000 inventory via Pearlman’s.
They might not interest you, but it’s always a good idea to explore all of your options. It‘s almost impossible to judge a stone off of one studio picture, so these are just a starting point.
Pearlman’s is family owned and was a popular vendor here years ago. I haven’t heard them referenced here lately. When I spoke with Bill Pearlman years ago, he was very friendly and helpful. They can also be purchased through Africa Gems, though their listed prices are higher, they might be willing to price match.



This one is over your budget, but a nice size and looks beautiful so I had to share.


This one leans pink, but looks very bright in the video and is well within budget .


This one looks like it may lean orange, but that’s not mentioned in the description. It is also looks bright and is well under your budget.

 

[CircularBrilliant]

I had major sticker shock when I first began looking into rubies, and they only seem to get more expensive with every passing day. Some of the comments in this thread gave me hope that perhaps I was just looking at the wrong vendors. Based on a couple of the recommendations, I looked at Starlanka's website and saw that there was indeed much lower pricing on their stones compared to other vendors I had looked at. I reached out to Suhail to ask whether any of their rubies have strong fluorescence (which is more important to me than origin), and his response was "Sorry none of our ruby will have flouresence." Perhaps that helps explain some of the price difference. I thought I would report back in case it's helpful to anyone else looking.

 

[VividRed]

I had major sticker shock when I first began looking into rubies, and they only seem to get more expensive with every passing day. Some of the comments in this thread gave me hope that perhaps I was just looking at the wrong vendors. Based on a couple of the recommendations, I looked at Starlanka's website and saw that there was indeed much lower pricing on their stones compared to other vendors I had looked at. I reached out to Suhail to ask whether any of their rubies have strong fluorescence (which is more important to me than origin), and his response was "Sorry none of our ruby will have flouresence." Perhaps that helps explain some of the price difference. I thought I would report back in case it's helpful to anyone else looking.

Of course it explains it, these iron rich rubies have a strong orange secondary and no fluorescence. They can be nice, to be sure, but not what one can call fine rubies. To each their own, but I think they look like garnets, just a lot more expensive

 

[Bron357]

Agree @VividRed , the reason why Burmese rubies are so reknown is their other worldly fluorescence. They just glow like fire embers.
Rubies without strong fluorescence are still lovely but can look like garnet or Rubellite tourmaline and if you’re paying big dollars for a gem, you want it to be representative of its kind.

 

[icy_jade]

That is an interesting answer and arguably not a very friendly one. Whatever. I never said that 14k is the norm, I just said there is nothing fine (as in, top quality) below 10k per carat. Orangy red rubies from Mozambique certainly cost less than 10k per ct, but are not what I would call fine rubies.

I saw a 2 ct African PB (GRS certed but really nice color) at a gem show for less than $16k recently. Maybe you are talking western world prices hence the high prices? Not here to get involved in an argument but I think it’s important to set the record straight so that noobs are not misled.

 

[pokerface]

Really interesting that @ChaiK did not post a single example of a high-quality ruby with fluorescence for under $14k/ct - or any example at all.

I am surprised, after 3.5 years of collecting, you are convinced 14.3 k usd is the right price for 1 carat of ruby.

I have told you. You can go and ask the Starlanka guy. Others have mentioned Harshil. Or you could ask Wriston to keep a lookout. And when you buy, somehow, other vendors get hold of your contact details, and they WhatsApp you.

I am now moving on from this thread as I seem to be doing a lot of repeated posts here of the same thing, and I don't want to be seen as trying to push any vendor to anyone. I simply thought it would be a good idea to advise looking at prices clearly and carefully. It really is a 1.something carats. I can understand this sort of pricing for larger rubies per carat, above 3 to 4 carats let's say. But not at 1.something carats.

It was good to watch the thread unfold and now, I think anyone reading this thread can make up their own minds and decide for themselves.

 

[VividRed]

I saw a 2 ct African PB (GRS certed but really nice color) at a gem show for less than $16k recently. Maybe you are talking western world prices hence the high prices? Not here to get involved in an argument but I think it’s important to set the record straight so that noobs are not misled.

That sounds about right, maybe on the cheap side. Burma material in high quality and that size runs over 80k, Mozambique is still affordable. And yes, Western prices are higher in general, but not in the top end, in my opinion. Do you have pictures of that Mozambican ruby