Second thoughts on 3.03 VS1 M

[elle2586]

I have a size 6.5. 3.03 VS1 M good cut. No fluorescent. Ring is 14k yellow gold.
My husband and daughter says it is beautiful. The jewelers said it is beautiful. Although I am very grateful, I’m having second thoughts.

My husband and I have been married for years and this ring is a significant upgrade. Diamond was chosen at the jewelry store (which I don’t know much of and then found this group today).

I feel the diamond is huge (again, it could be because I never had one before). In some lighting, I promise I see green. ‍

I figure I ask you all as you all may be more in tune to what looks nice and doesn’t.

is this diamond too big for my finger size/length? Color ok? Should I get a smaller diamond but better cut and color?

 

[Rfisher]

How long have you had it?
What is the jewelers return policy?

If you are still questioning it and are still doing research and landed here - yes I think you should get something else, if the jewelers return policy allows it or you can financially accept the re-do.

As for seeing green - does the stone have a lab report, and if so- what does it say? Just M or anything else?

my opinion, it looks lovey on you - but if you have these specific questions/doubts I would not use my compliments to sway you to stop those questions and doubts.

if you want smaller with higher color, better cut you have plenty of company here on PS.
if you choose larger with lower color and compromise in cut /clarity - you have plenty of company here, as well.

 

[Diamond Girl 21]

I think the size looks great on you. The other questions can really only be answered by you. It's all about personal likes and dislikes. It sounds as though you really aren't happy with this particular stone. Do you have the opportunity to shop in person? It would be really helpful for you to see different color, cut, and clarity ranges in person. Personally, I would go for the best cut I could afford, even if I had to sacrifice size. But again, that's just my opinion.

 

[lizzydm26]

The diamond definitely does not look too big on you. It looks like a great size with nice finger coverage for your hand.

If you are having second thoughts - might be good to explore your options. It doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks if you are not happy with it.

 

[sledge]

I have a size 6.5. 3.03 VS1 M good cut. No fluorescent. Ring is 14k yellow gold.
My husband and daughter says it is beautiful. The jewelers said it is beautiful. Although I am very grateful, I’m having second thoughts.

Congratulations on the upgrade! I know you are feeling a little uncertain. I'm sorry about that, but I hope we can provide you some details to either assure you with the purchase or point you in the right direction towards a happier spot.

In some lighting, I promise I see green. ‍

You could be seeing green for a number of reasons. Remember, a diamond is million little mirrors that is reflecting and picking up the lighting and colors of it's environment. Perhaps wearing a green shirt, or in a room with green walls or maybe outside with green bushes could give you a false illusion of it being "green". Some people mistake this with the sky, where a stone may appear blue because the stone is reflecting what it sees.

As for seeing green - does the stone have a lab report, and if so- what does it say? Just M or anything else?

To elaborate on this a bit more, every stone has a color "undertone" of sorts. In most stones, the common undertone is yellow. However, brown & grey exist and then all sorts of other colors can exist.

As you can see in the chart below, GIA graded stones have to report different color undertones at different overall color grades specific to the tint. For instance, yellow is reported as a color until you reach >Z. Whereas, brown & grey has to be reported in stones >J. Should your stone have a green undertone, it would need to be reported if the color is >F.

So if your stone has a green undertone, and it's GIA graded, it should also state it has a green undertone since it is M color and falls below the F ceiling.

Victor Canera

www.victorcanera.com

is this diamond too big for my finger size/length? Color ok? Should I get a smaller diamond but better cut and color?

Much of this is a personal question. How big is too big? My wife insisted anything >0.50 carat was too much. I ended up buying her near 1 carat although I originally wanted to buy her 2 carats. Now she thinks I was wise, and can see a future to going bigger but she's in no rush to get there.

Part of her concern is that in her practice she works with disadvantaged families & kids. She does not want her ring to negatively effect her clients in any manner. So for her, a 3 carat stone is likely never in the cards unless she changes professions or gets different clientele. Or perhaps has two rings so she doesn't have all those concerns when at her practice.

As a guy that wears a plain band this isn't even a concern for me. I doubt I would ever have a huge rock like that, but if I did I would simply tell people to pound sand if they didn't like it or made snide comments. My wife and I are very different that way. But the pressure is real. If all your friends & family are sporting 1 carats, it can make it socially awkward.

Assuming we aren't dealing with a psychological question of "is it too big" then I can safely say your ring looks good on your finger and IMO isn't too big.

Where I do get a little more picky is the cut. I simply want the best as I feel the whole purpose of owning a diamond is to watch it do the magic fire dance. That is my opinion and yours may vary, which is okay.

If you would like to post a copy of your lab report, we can analyze it further to determine cut. Also, maybe some more close ups to better gauge quality.

Lastly, color is very subjective. My wife and I both prefer very white. I bought her an H and with what I have learned I would buy an F+ if I got a redo. That doesn't mean F+ is the best color, but simply what we both like and more importantly she likes.

To me, your stone looks a bit warm for my tastes, but some of that is because of the yellow gold prongs. Swapping to white gold/platinum prongs may make the stone appear a little whiter. But just spit balling, I don't see M as a problem unless you do. And honestly, only YOUR opinion matters as you wear the ring!

 

[bright&shiny]

I can’t possibly improve on what has been said already. No matter what the specs are, it comes down to what you like/love.

This is a great place to learn more about all aspects of diamonds, particularly cut, than you are likely to learn elsewhere. Many here prefer super ideal cuts but others love the quirks and beauty of other cuts. I love both and as an example, I have a recent thread here about a N surprise where I found a great High colored diamond. It performs well and was priced well too. I’d post the link, but I’m on my cell phone and can’t do it right now.

In the meantime, if you have a certificate or any dimensions of the stone available, consider posting them. The experts here can help you with the cut question and comparable stones - if that’s what you’d like to see.

Regardless, congratulations on your upgrade - it looks very nice on your hand!

 

[sledge]

I might add that GIA assigns their cut grades but they are very broad in nature. Even their excellent cut grade isn't always excellent. You really have to look at the proportions and the stone in question to determine how it really falls. And then because of GIA gross rounding, it's still a bit of a guessing game. That is where in-person evaluations and/or an idealscope or ASET scope comes in handy.

Since GIA's best cut grade is excellent, those grades lower are typically considered to be less good. And in a broad sense I think that is fairly accurate. However, you will occasionally find a rare bird.

Enter this unicorn. Better known as MSS #16. It only qualifies as a good cut but I would take this stone all day long. Those fat sexy 62 LGF's make for some nice attractive chunky facets that I think are so attractive in the old cuts, yet this is a modern round brilliant (MRB).

Granted, this stone is the exception to the rule, but they do exist is my point!

OctoNus : Master Stone Set - diamond 16

Upper Left - MSS13 Ca 34, Pa 41, Tb 57,
Lower Left - MSS16 Ca 37.5, Pa 40.6, Tb 57,
Upper Right - MSS17 Ca 39, Pa 40, Tb 61,
Lower Right - MSS18 Ca 37.5, Pa 40.4, Tb 57

 

[distracts]

I don't think the diamond is too big but this particular diamond would not be to my taste, and if I had to go smaller to get an ideal cut, I would Usually "too big" is best examined by your social circle - does this diamond put you more in line with your social circle, or less? If you are a person who is sensitive to if you "stick out," then you probably want to get a size that is about average for your social circle. A lot of people on this forum want to stick out through their jewelry though!

I notice you are taking pictures by the window - is it possible some of the green is reflections of the greenery outside? Diamonds reflect color A LOT so if there is green in your environment, it will reflect the green back to you and look greenish as a result. The place I see green in your picture is on the crown facets that are angled toward the window.

Part of her concern is that in her practice she works with disadvantaged families & kids. She does not want her ring to negatively effect her clients in any manner. So for her, a 3 carat stone is likely never in the cards unless she changes professions or gets different clientele. Or perhaps has two rings so she doesn't have all those concerns when at her practice.

Sledge, as someone who volunteers a lot, "multiple rings" is always the answer.

 

[sledge]

Sledge, as someone who volunteers a lot, "multiple rings" is always the answer.

Yup, this is certainly the answer. I have been trying to talk her into upgrading her current stone for quite some time. She ain't having it, lol. She said I can buy her a new stone after we do X, Y & Z.

She's making it really difficult for me to scratch my diamond itch. I want to buy her all this jewelry and she's cool with what she has. It's killing me I tell you!

 

[lovedogs]

Yup, this is certainly the answer. I have been trying to talk her into upgrading her current stone for quite some time. She ain't having it, lol. She said I can buy her a new stone after we do X, Y & Z.

She's making it really difficult for me to scratch my diamond itch. I want to buy her all this jewelry and she's cool with what she has. It's killing me I tell you!

Whereas my DH is like "another diamond?!?!? whyyyyyyy???". So maybe a 2 week "wife swap" wherein you buy ME jewelry is in order??? lol

 

[mrs-b]

Hi @elle2586 -

Can I ask who graded your diamond? Is it graded by GIA? Is there fluorescence in it, by any chance?

I have to be honest here - it looks a little milky to me. I'm also not fond of the setting, as the prongs on your diamond seem uneven and overly large.

Are you still able to return it? If not, then I'm hoping you love it. If you are still able to return it, do you have any interest in doing that, or would you prefer to keep it and were just here hoping for a little encouragement? (perfectly valid, by the way)

Share where your head is with this and we'll go from there.

And welcome!

 

[sledge]

Whereas my DH is like "another diamond?!?!? whyyyyyyy???". So maybe a 2 week "wife swap" wherein you buy ME jewelry is in order??? lol

LOL, the wife would probably leap at this opportunity. Just remember, you have to deal with all my shenanigans too. Apparently, I'm quite crafty.

Is there fluorescence in it, by any chance?

I have to be honest here - it looks a little milky to me.

She said no fluor in her initial post so I'm taking that at face value.

I also noticed the milky look in the center. But the outside edges look okay. Kind of has me concerned it may be too shallow and casting a fish eye effect.

I hope OP can post a copy of her report to review.

 

[distracts]

LOL, the wife would probably leap at this opportunity. Just remember, you have to deal with all my shenanigans too. Apparently, I'm quite crafty.



She said no fluor in her initial post so I'm taking that at face value.

I also noticed the milky look in the center. But the outside edges look okay. Kind of has me concerned it may be too shallow and casting a fish eye effect.

I hope OP can post a copy of her report to review.

Yeah, my guess is what mrs-b is seeing as milkiness is actually a cut issue. If you look at it from the side it looks totally clear. It just doesn't have crisp faceting like an ideal cut.

 

[sledge]

Hey @elle2586, not sure what you paid for your stone but here is a super ideal that just eeks in under 3 carats. Color is an improvement at K as you seemed a little concerned. Cut is splendid. Clarity is still VS1. Wire price just under $25k.

If you can return the other stone & get a refund, it might be a potential alternate.

Diamond | 2.902 ct K VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4278619

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.902 carat K color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4278619

www.whiteflash.com

 

[distracts]

Hey @elle2586, not sure what you paid for your stone but here is a super ideal that just eeks in under 3 carats. Color is an improvement at K as you seemed a little concerned. Cut is splendid. Clarity is still VS1. Wire price just under $25k.

If you can return the other stone & get a refund, it might be a potential alternate.

Diamond | 2.902 ct K VS1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4278619

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 2.902 carat K color VS1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4278619

www.whiteflash.com

I think it’s quite possible OP paid less than $15k for the current stone, which would not let that one be an alternate.

 

[Lookinagain]

If you were in love with your stone, I wouldn't comment, but it seems you aren't so I have to say that the first photo does not look like your diamond has the sparkle that most are looking for. I'm not sure it is actually the color, but might be the cut, so if you have the certificate, I think it would help if you would post a photo of it as you may get better advice that way. Since you may think it is too large for your hand ( which it probably isn't depending on social or work situation) then perhaps a smaller stone that sparkled more would make you happier. Also, you haven't (I don't think) said how long you have had it. Have you cleaned it well? That also may impact the way it looks to you, as well as in photos.

 

[lovedogs]

I wouldn't be happy with the cut, and would personally prefer a smaller stone with better cut. Warmth doesnt bother me at all, so I dont mind the color, but the cut just wouldnt be ok for me. But of course your opinion is the only one that matters in the end.

 

[DejaWiz]

Can anyone else concur with what I'm potentially seeing?

Looks like a wide and shallow cut, perhaps around a 60/60 with a very shallow crown height...maybe 12.5-13.5%, but hard to tell.
Fisheye effect in the table.
Haziness/milkiness in the table.
Possibly seeing the color of the setting being pulled up around the culet area through the pavilion when looking down at the table, suspecting that non-complementing angles are present.



As others have mentioned, if your jeweler has a return/exchange policy that you are still inside of the terms and conditions of, then focus on an alternative option, and make sure you compare each candidate in a mock-up setting (that is near/identical) side by side with yours in a variety of lighting conditions.

Try to focus on the following, in order of:
1. Cut quality and complementing proportions.
2. Clarity and type/impact of any inclusions.
3. Color grade.
4. Carat weight.

...this is usually the exact opposite approach of priority that most shoppers take, and most jewelers push for to maximize profit over quality.




For best performance, stick with the criteria in the red column, which is better than GIA's own criteria.



One thing that isn't in the list is crown height. My preference is 14.5% minimum, no exceptions, and 15.0-16.0%, ideally.

 

[sledge]

I think it’s quite possible OP paid less than $15k for the current stone, which would not let that one be an alternate.

Maybe. It’s from a B&M store so they likely have higher prices than online.

Based on available inventory online, look at the price variance between 3.01 and 3.03 carats.

My guess is $20k+.

What I know for sure is whatever the budget, we can adapt and find her the best stone for the buck. Doesn’t have to be a super ideal.

 

[distracts]

Maybe. It’s from a B&M store so they likely have higher prices than online.

Based on available inventory online, look at the price variance between 3.01 and 3.03 carats.

My guess is $20k+.

What I know for sure is whatever the budget, we can adapt and find her the best stone for the buck. Doesn’t have to be a super ideal.

I was basing this off PS diamond search, which shows 8 in 3-3.05 range, M VS1, going from $13951-16728. If you sort in price order, it doesn't look like the carat size is making a significant difference there.

Admittedly I had forgotten the b&m pricing difference.

What search are you using?

 

[sledge]

Hey @elle2586, you can clearly see where there is green reflecting onto the stone from the background elements as mentioned in posts #5 & 8 above.

Oddly enough, on my way home from work yesterday afternoon, I was thinking about this thread and was stuck behind a semi. It was a perfect opportunity to show what was going on with the diamond.

Obviously the tanker don't have a road & grass painted on it. Instead it's a very shiny & reflective chrome that was also constantly picking up its surroundings.

Try to focus on the following, in order of:
1. Cut quality and complementing proportions.
2. Clarity and type/impact of any inclusions.
3. Color grade.
4. Carat weight.

...this is usually the exact opposite approach of priority that most shoppers take, and most jewelers push for to maximize profit over quality.

There is no single right answer on the order of the 4 C's. This is a personal opinion and will vary for each individual and any cultural preferences specific to them.

And that pains me a bit to say as I think cut should always be the top priority, lol. But I have to constantly remind myself that is my preference and not a hard fast rule.

For best performance, stick with the criteria in the red column, which is better than GIA's own criteria.



One thing that isn't in the list is crown height. My preference is 14.5% minimum, no exceptions, and 15.0-16.0%, ideally.

This is WF's ACA specifications, which are based on AGS values and is a pretty tight set of criteria that will narrow down the selection quite a bit.

You have to adjust a bit for the way GIA rounds their values and uses different nomenclature (ie excellent instead of ideal).

Also, because there will be less inventory in larger stones, M color range and/or budget you may need to be a little more flexible and push towards the fringes to find something that meets all criteria.

 

[sledge]

I was basing this off PS diamond search, which shows 8 in 3-3.05 range, M VS1, going from $13951-16728. If you sort in price order, it doesn't look like the carat size is making a significant difference there.

Admittedly I had forgotten the b&m pricing difference.

What search are you using?

Using the diamond pricing feature here on PS. Aside from having to enter a specific size (instead of range) it's a quick way to filter results.

https://www.pricescope.com/diamond-prices

However, I think I found a fallacy. The above uses the same PS search engine you used, but you did it via the traditional method instead of the link I used. This became obvious when I read your reply.

In the 3.03 example, even though I clearly selected M-VS1, when I clicked on the results that are presented in the screen caps above in post #19, it takes you to the traditional search screen to show you the stones it used in providing that dollar rage. This is when I noticed the search actually auto-changed the results to K-M color. And in-fact, all the results were K colored stones instead of M's.

I get what the system was trying to accomplish, but this is a very frustrating result. I would rather see no results, or at least some visible warning that says changes were automatically made to yield more results.

It's my fault for not double-checking before your post got me scratching my head. Thanks for keeping me in check, even if indirectly, lol. Sorry for the confusion this may have caused.

@John Pollard please have a look and fix this.

 

[Tonks]

I might add that GIA assigns their cut grades but they are very broad in nature. Even their excellent cut grade isn't always excellent. You really have to look at the proportions and the stone in question to determine how it really falls. And then because of GIA gross rounding, it's still a bit of a guessing game. That is where in-person evaluations and/or an idealscope or ASET scope comes in handy.

Since GIA's best cut grade is excellent, those grades lower are typically considered to be less good. And in a broad sense I think that is fairly accurate. However, you will occasionally find a rare bird.

Enter this unicorn. Better known as MSS #16. It only qualifies as a good cut but I would take this stone all day long. Those fat sexy 62 LGF's make for some nice attractive chunky facets that I think are so attractive in the old cuts, yet this is a modern round brilliant (MRB).

Granted, this stone is the exception to the rule, but they do exist is my point!

OctoNus : Master Stone Set - diamond 16

Upper Left - MSS13 Ca 34, Pa 41, Tb 57,
Lower Left - MSS16 Ca 37.5, Pa 40.6, Tb 57,
Upper Right - MSS17 Ca 39, Pa 40, Tb 61,
Lower Right - MSS18 Ca 37.5, Pa 40.4, Tb 57

OHMYGOODNESS.

Not to thread jack, but WOW. I knew I liked bigger LGFs, and that stone (MSS16) is absolute perfection. Technically would it be more of a transitional?


To the OP, your stone is a beautiful size for your hand, and if it is a significant change, it may take some time to get used to. However, if you want to do any research to confirm your decision (or to help you make a different one), you are definitely in the right place.

 

[LLJsmom]

Yup, this is certainly the answer. I have been trying to talk her into upgrading her current stone for quite some time. She ain't having it, lol. She said I can buy her a new stone after we do X, Y & Z.

She's making it really difficult for me to scratch my diamond itch. I want to buy her all this jewelry and she's cool with what she has. It's killing me I tell you!

Sorry thread jack. Sledge, Do you really exist? Are you a PS bot??? . The world could come to an end and I would never hear that from my DH.

Dear @elle2586, I don’t remember who said it in an earlier post, but the fact that you ended up on PS says that you do have sincere questions and concerns about your diamond. Please do stay and do as much research and share thoughts and ask questions. Anything you’re curious about I assure has been asked by many others here. No judgement. And don’t squash your feelings and uncertainties about your diamond. Air them out and follow the path it takes you, which may be to another or right back to the same stone. You should be allowed to find your peace with your stone and ring cause that rock ain’t cheap, and you’re the one wearing it and staring at it all day. Good luck and have fun with the journey.

 

[sledge]

Sorry thread jack. Sledge, Do you really exist? Are you a PS bot??? . The world could come to an end and I would never hear that from my DH.

LOL, I’m quite real. She has to deal with me and all my shenanigans so she deserves way more.

I used to get all twisted sideways before about stuff like that. Then I realized she is simply the person I love most in this world. Unless her desires sacrifice our financial well being or other major life aspect then the rest is just fluff and not worth worrying about.

Do you really think I like peach or purple colored sheets? Both which she has names for that aren’t those, and that I can never remember. Not at all. But I really like sleeping with her in those sheets. It’s all about perspective.

We both make mistakes, but thankfully she has her head screwed on right where it matters most so I try to give her the world.

 

[Mreader]

@sledge just please tell me you two use a top sheet. I’ve heard that the youngins don’t anymore .

 

[sledge]

@sledge just please tell me you two use a top sheet. I’ve heard that the youngins don’t anymore .

Hahaha, it doesn’t matter much to me but yes, definitely a top sheet because she prefers it.

And I’m not really sure the thread count but I know my sheets weren’t up to snuff. She promptly bought me new sheets as gift while we were dating. Really? Who does that. In fairness if you run, jump and slide you can make it to the other side. Yes, I know from experience. She doesn’t like that either, lol. So I wait until she’s on a trip to practice my skills. So yes they are silky smooth too.

 

[oncrutchesrightnow]

Yup, this is certainly the answer. I have been trying to talk her into upgrading her current stone for quite some time. She ain't having it, lol. She said I can buy her a new stone after we do X, Y & Z.

She's making it really difficult for me to scratch my diamond itch. I want to buy her all this jewelry and she's cool with what she has. It's killing me I tell you!

I hereby volunteer to be the random lady you met on the internet who you sent diamonds to.

 

[oncrutchesrightnow]

I have a size 6.5. 3.03 VS1 M good cut. No fluorescent. Ring is 14k yellow gold.
My husband and daughter says it is beautiful. The jewelers said it is beautiful. Although I am very grateful, I’m having second thoughts.

My husband and I have been married for years and this ring is a significant upgrade. Diamond was chosen at the jewelry store (which I don’t know much of and then found this group today).

I feel the diamond is huge (again, it could be because I never had one before). In some lighting, I promise I see green. ‍

I figure I ask you all as you all may be more in tune to what looks nice and doesn’t.

is this diamond too big for my finger size/length? Color ok? Should I get a smaller diamond but better cut and color?

Welcome! Thanks for posting pics of your ring. Jewelry pics are always appreciated.

The diamond does not look too big.

Ithink in the long run you would be happier returning the stone, looking around a bit more including here, and you can always go back to that one if it is what you really like.

 

[Cerulean]

My original engagement ring diamond was an M that had a green tinge in certain lights and was a mediocre cut. (it is not GIA certified)

I was so displeased with the diamond over time that I swapped it for something totally different. I dont mean to discourage, because you may love this stone, it comes down to personal preference. if color / cut are bugging you now, then I would exchange it