Should I tell my friend what I really think?

[Imdanny]

So did I get this right? She's coming to you for advice for her problem? If so, you would be doing her a disservice to be anything less than candid and through about your opinion, IMO.

In other words, she's asking you. So, yes.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

As tempting as it is to weigh in on others relationships, I think when it comes to a close friend, biting your tongue is probably the best advice I never took...

A couple of years ago I was on a posting binge about a dear friend of mine who was having marital issues. Opposite of your situation, I really hoped my friend would leave her husband. I struggled endlessly on wanting to her to leave for her safety...and when she didn't, it broke my heart and frustrated me. Long story short, she never left him...but she and I parted ways.

I often think about her. And at the points in times when I really miss her I wish I could go back in time and do things differently. I wish I could have kept my big mouth shut and just supported her decisions because at the end of the day it's her life, stay or go, she's the one who had to live with that. I could have loved her and wanted what was best for her, but I could only judge and observe based on my experiences and reality, not hers and that's not a decision I should have any part in.

So, that leads me to my advice. It can be super tempting to say "oh no, no, no" from where you sit...but inside her own life she has to figure out what works best for her and her children. You can make all the lists of rational reasons why she should stay all day long, but if she's already checked out emotionally, then what good does it do?

Obviously she's unhappy, and you've already suggested counseling, beyond that, be a support to system or be a listener. She's a big girl, and if leaving her husband ends up being a big mistake--then that's 1000% on her.

Just please, don't make my mistakes.

 

[Miss Sparkly]

Hey everyone,

Sorry I've been MIA lately, but things have been crazy since I've decided to go back for my Master's - I'm studying for the GRE.

Anyway, the reason that I'm popping on is because I was hoping to get your advice on something - my best friend is coming to me for help with a problem, and I'm not sure what I should tell her ...

My friend told me that she's seriously considering ending her marriage, and I think it's a really bad idea for a variety of reasons. The reason that she wants to leave is that she & her husband are fighting all the time, and she feels like he never wants to help her with their kids (they have a toddler & an infant). I have suggested that they go to counseling, and she's up for it, but doesn't think that he will go.

Here are the reasons that I don't think that she should leave him, but I don't know if I should tell her any of these, or if I did they might end the friendship:

1. She is just not nice to her husband, so from what I see he is just fed up with it & is no longer taking her nonsense without dishing it back at her. She also always turns down physical intimacy with him. She comes from a family where every relationship ended in divorce, and was a baby when her own parents split, so I know that she had no model of a relationship - just leave when the going gets tough.

Good. He shouldn't have to put up with that. I hate to think of how she treats her children. Verbal abuse is just that. ABUSE

2. This is her third marriage, she is in her late 30s, and she now has 2 small children. I met her after her second marriage, and even though she is attractive, she was having trouble meeting anyone who wanted to date her seriously since she had been divorced twice in her 20s, and initiated both of the divorces. I really think this is her last chance at a long-term relationship, and if she bails, I don't think she'll be able to find a man who wants to deal with her track record.

It's like my husband says whenever I find what I'm looking for. "Great! That's the last store we'll be looking in" Why? Because once I found it I don't need to keep looking. I'm sure other stores had what I'm looking for too, I just didn't need to continue at the time. It's beyond me what some people are willing to deal with

3. It's true that her husband doesn't help much with the kids, but I think it's mostly her fault. She constantly criticizes the way he takes care of them, so he just gave up, since he can't do anything right in her eyes. I think that if she stopped being so controlling, he would help more.

And this leads back to, how does she treat her kids? Verbal abuse is ABUSE

I've tried to give her advice on the third point, since my husband helps a lot with our kids, and she just blew it off saying that he's a different type of guy. I told her that's not true, I just don't criticize & micromanage him, and she seemed to get a little offended.

Once again it's not her, it's everybody else. And when it's everybody else it always will be everybody else. She was looking to you to validate her side of the story.

So, you can see why I am hesitating to bring up the other issues - that she treats him poorly & that I think her prospects are not good if she divorces him (she only has a GED & never went to college so even though she works her salary is low), but I don't know if it's my place - to me those things are obvious, but my husband & other friends think that since I'm her best friend I should point out all of these worst-case scenarios before she files for divorce on a whim (like she did with her first two marriages).

So, do I take her out & try to gently talk this stuff over or no? I would feel like an awful friend if I said nothing & she ended up regretting it if she leaves him, but I do feel like some of these issues are her fault, and I'm not sure that she'll take to hearing that kindly. I also feel a responsibility to those two babies to try to help the parents before it's too late. What would you do?

What would I do? Well I'm pretty blunt but I would tell her straight up what she is doing to her family and how she is hurting her life. No sugar coating. One way or another this has to stop. And trust me, it is NOT better for the couple to stay together in a household like this for the children. It only hurts the children more.

 

[Imdanny]

Here's something I don't know. Is she coming to you because she wants your advice as in wants "help"? Do she truly want to hear whatever you have to say to her? Does she want to hear what she wants to hear? It's not possible to know from your post, and, really, from not knowing her, enough about her to know what her motivation is. I still lean on the side of being honest and direct, because if you don't tell her what you think, then there is no way that she can possibly benefit from your advice. Maybe she doesn't want to hear things she doesn't want to hear, but how would you be doing her any favors if you're not honest with her, ultimately? That's just my opinion. Also, I think it's a lot less likely that a person would ever resent you for trying to keep them together with their spouse than the opposite situation, which would be if you didn't want them to reconcile, but they did. This is a different situation, and if you come down on the side of them staying together, and they don't, she certainly can't blame you if she decides to leave, and she ends up in hardship.

 

[Jessie702]

I have a friend, who is slighty like your friend, but its a whole 'nother set of issues. Inside of 2 marriages, she has only had 1, but the difference, is she has 4 kids, two who have mental disablities, and she, the friend, lives in fairytale land. My advice, to you, is, if she is a good friend, someone who will be in your life forever, who you would trust with your children, than yes, say something to her, but nicely. If she isnt a forever friend, and may, im not syaing she is, but may be trying to get attention, than no, dont say anything. If she wants to leave even, without working things out, than thats her issue, and her mistake. You cant save someone who doesnt want to save themselves" You can give a man a fish, and he will eat for a day, but if you teach a man to fish, he can eat a lifetime" thats the same thing, you have to think of when it comes to your friend, what time of friend she is, and if, she gets upset by you saying this, can you take losing her?

 

[movie zombie]

i've posted this before but here it goes again. something i read a long time ago and try to remember: "before you try and change someone else, remember how hard it is to change yourself".

you've suggested counseling to her. good move.

she asks for your opinion: you are candid and say you're surprised he's stayed with her and not dumped her already. when asked why you think this, you give your examples and be prepared to call her an "ex"-friend.

is this woman really a friend? i know i'm rather odd but i find it impossible to be friends with someone who i do not respect re how they treat their own family.

and i'd also wonder if she is treating her husband in this manner in an effort to drive him away....but only a good counselor/therapist is going to be of assistance here.

MoZo

 

[rosetta]

nope, you're not alone mozo.

i too would find it difficult to keep up a relationship with such a person.

i always look at how people treat family, and actually, how they treat people who serve them waiters etc.

it can be very telling.

 

[Imdanny]

And if she rejects you because you give her an honest opinion what kind of friend is she to you really?

 

[iota15]

I find change can be made with tactful advice, but somewhere, even deep down, that person has to (i) have some recognition that there may be a problem with her, and (ii) have some (even minor) desire to make that change. Otherwise, you're just making a lot of white noise and given what you plan to say, you'll lose your friend to boot.

I would hold off talking to her at this point - not only because you want to keep the friendship, but because you'll effectively lose her and she won't gain anything.

Your friend is not only NOT ready to change, but she still thinks other people are the problem. Until you see she's ready to take her piece of responsibility in this fiasco, you'll just be blowing a lot of hot air... at no one.

 

[Imdanny]

One option might be to plain tell her you don't feel comfortable talking about it because you feel she needs a counselor who knows how to handle these things, etc., etc.

And then you'd be off the hook.

 

[february2003bride]

Vesper-

Some people just should not get married and it sounds like your friend is one of them. There are people who really are best and happiest at just dating.

Does she treat her friendships the same way she treats her relationships? If so, be prepared that if you talk to her and are honest, that she'll cut you out of her life. If she can do it easily to three husbands, she can do it with a best friend.

My parents should have divorced years ago. My mom is exactly like your friend in terms of the always in the right (even when she's not), her way or no way, micromanager and on top of that, a temper. They are still married after 48 years but my poor father just swallows the verbal abuse. He's in his mid seventies with Parkinson's and sadly will pass away still in love with my mom but depressed from taking the abuse. For your friend's DH, for his own sanity, he really should divorce her. As the child of a marriage like that, it sucks watching that be a primary relationship example.

 

[diva rose]

She has issues stemming from her childhood - she needs to address them.
If she was brought up like that - most likely she sees that as how you act/respond in a marriage.

I agree with most of the ladies here - she will not listen to everything you say.
I've been there and done that with friends. Women will hear what they want to hear.
And even if she does appreciate your advice, she won't follow it because it's just human nature.
Most people just do what they want to do. In addition, behaviour is hard to change. It takes effort and identification.
Sounds like she doesn't feel she is doing anything wrong and it's all her hubby's fault.

I think it's best you ask her to try to make the marriage work and seek therapy.
If her husband wants to save the marriage - he will attend. If he doesn't - well that is his problem.
At least your friend is taking a step.

 

[Cehrabehra]

I don't find that verbal confrontations always go well because the other person can put up mental blocks and effectively derail it. I would write it out AND talk to her with the paper in hand.

I would be willing to lose a friend over this... if she truly has self destructive tendencies an intervention could help, and if it doesn't she'll probably continue to make screwball choices the rest of her life - drama mama.

I think that early childhood is a tough time on marriage as the men get used to sharing their wives and the women get used to being spread much thinner. It is REALLY hard on marriages and it doesn't surprise me *at all* that they're not really understanding one another or giving each other sympathy for the situation they share. This is more than just about whether or not she's happy this MOMENT. She has children to consider and while I don't condemn divorce, done without the big picture is just foolish. She's looking at this year, this situation only. Life changes. It changes and changes again. Why did she marry him in the first place? Did they have shared goals?

I wouldn't say nothing... but know that ultimately it's none of your business. I just couldn't watch the trainwreck without at least calling a "look out".