Slipped into the pink diamond rabbit hole...help pull me out!

[lurkie91]

Congrats on a great find! I bought a pair of slightly smaller 0.25ctw (ungraded) pinks from Dolly (xothebijouxbox on ig) and she set them into baby bezels for me. I had planned to get baby halo jackets made for them to increase the coverage and presence, but that’s fallen down my priority list. A few pictures of the diamonds unset (upper right pair), earrings on/off and the halo inspo pics. Have fun with your project!

 

[lilmosun]

They look great on you!

I'm a bit jealous...most earrings get lost on me (i.e. don't hang right).

On the upside, it removes the temptation to buy which saves a lot of money

Congrats on a great find! I bought a pair of slightly smaller 0.25ctw (ungraded) pinks from Dolly (xothebijouxbox on ig) and she set them into baby bezels for me. I had planned to get baby halo jackets made for them to increase the coverage and presence, but that’s fallen down my priority list. A few pictures of the diamonds unset (upper right pair), earrings on/off and the halo inspo pics. Have fun with your project!

 

[lurkie91]

They look great on you!

I'm a bit jealous...most earrings get lost on me (i.e. don't hang right).

On the upside, it removes the temptation to buy which saves a lot of money

Thanks! The bezels add a teeny bit of width/coverage, though I still plan to get the tiny jackets done at some point, when I get around to it. These were a spontaneous purchase and then I ended up buying bigger diamonds studs two months later and blowing through my earring budget

 

[kenny]

I don't buy loose white diamonds...much less colored diamonds. And now I am freaking a bit because I just made a totally uneducated impulse pink diamond purchase without any knowledge or idea what to do with them.

I went to visit my local bench and I wanted to buy something since I gave him no business during Covid. Great affordable bench, honest guy but his pricing is always all over the place. He was showing me stuff that he bought from an estate and these caught my eye. Unlike a lot of FCDs I've seen (which aren't many), I liked the color (good saturation, no brown modifiers, baby pink to purplish pink depending on lighting). Came with GIA reports (shown below) so I bought them. I paid $1500 for the pair. That puts them on par with the some of the rarest CS in terms of per carat price for melee size stones...yet it isn't uncommon to see pink diamond melee in settings? Now I am looking at prices on-line and they seem to be all over the place. Without knowing how to differentiate outside of the obvious, at least it seems like I didn't overpay - phew! Like other CS pricing, it's so confusing. Another rabbit hole . They don't give clarity but there are no chips, etc.

The real problem (since they are already purchased and a sunk cost) is I have no idea what to do with them as they are different sizes and small. I don't wear dainty well. Not even sure it's worth doing anything custom with them or if I just keep as one-off novelties in the gem box.

Anything you can tell me about the quality/relative value of these based on the stats and/or suggestions for setting (or not) would be most appreciated. Thank you~

Wow, I'm happy for you getting such great stones and an astonishing price!
WOW!
I love everything about pink diamonds, except their price.
But you got the ultimate when it comes to both price and quality.
Whoever sold these for $1,500 is nuts, Argyle provenance to boot!

And Yisse, thanks for the link to Argyle verification site.
I've been looking for that for around a decade.
It's interesting how GIA and Argyle's grading differ for my pinkie.
Maybe I'll start a thread on this to see if other Argyle owners have the same experience.

 

[lilmosun]

Thanks @kenny . Glad to hear your thoughts as while scanning PS, I saw your name come up often as knowledgeable on FCDs.

The crazy sparkle combined with good color has me hooked on these. It's a good thing that FCDs are crazily outside of my budget or I'd be in so much trouble

It's interesting how GIA and Argyle's grading differ for my pinkie.
Maybe I'll start a thread on this to see if other Argyle owners have the same experience.

Please do as I would be interested a s well.

While GIA graded both diamonds as purplish pink - Argyle only graded one as purplish pink (5PP) and the other as pink champagne (PC2) .

Do some of yours have similar degrees of difference?

To my eye, both of mine are definitely pink show a purple modifier in bright light. Even under a flash light and magnified, the hue looks the same to me on both stones whereas based on the argyle color chart, I would expect a a clear discernable difference side by side - i.e. brown (with a pink modifier) in the PC2 stone. I don't see it and usually I am sensitive to any hint of brown (and yellow) modifiers.

Obviously the argyle grade is a bit of a disappointment but given what I paid and the fact that it doesn't look like a PC2 to my eye (or GIA's), I am not going to fixate on it.

 

[demantoidz]

Thanks @kenny . Glad to hear your thoughts as while scanning PS, I saw your name come up often as knowledgeable on FCDs.

The crazy sparkle combined with good color has me hooked on these. It's a good thing that FCDs are crazily outside of my budget or I'd be in so much trouble


Please do as I would be interested a s well.

While GIA graded both diamonds as purplish pink - Argyle only graded one as purplish pink (5PP) and the other as pink champagne (PC2) .

Do some of yours have similar degrees of difference?

To my eye, both of mine are definitely pink show a purple modifier in bright light. Even under a flash light and magnified, the hue looks the same to me on both stones whereas based on the argyle color chart, I would expect a a clear discernable difference side by side - i.e. brown (with a pink modifier) in the PC2 stone. I don't see it and usually I am sensitive to any hint of brown (and yellow) modifiers.

Obviously the argyle grade is a bit of a disappointment but given what I paid and the fact that it doesn't look like a PC2 to my eye (or GIA's), I am not going to fixate on it.

I'm no FCD expert but GIA's grade probably carries more weight than Argyle's. I guess it depends on the buyer though? I am surprised by the differences.
From your pics, I was surprised that GIA graded the one deep when it seemed lighter than the intense. Figured the photos were not accurate.
I still think you got a superb deal!

 

[yssie]

I'm no FCD expert but GIA's grade probably carries more weight than Argyle's. I guess it depends on the buyer though?

Is that the case industry-wise? I don’t know - not rhetorical. I would personally value an Argyle evaluation much more highly than GIA’s, but I’m one (non)buyer…

 

[demantoidz]

Is that the case industry-wise? I don’t know - not rhetorical. I would personally value an Argyle evaluation much more highly than GIA’s, but I’m one (non)buyer…

I am not sure, just thinking out loud. GIA is the standard for all FCD colors (including those which Argyle doesn't produce). The majority of Argyle diamonds still get GIA reports as well. If I had a report from a top lab, I would not get a second report from a different lab whose opinion matters less in the industry. Maybe they get two reports to get a second opinion on the color (so they can price a stone based on the better grading) or because different buyers have different report preferences.

I did find this - though its not an unbiased opinion - stating that Argyle's grade is much more important. Would love to find an academic source discussing this. If they are right, my speculation was incorrect.

Argyle Certification vs. No Argyle Certification (GIA only)

Argyle Certification vs. No Argyle Certification (GIA only) DEFINITIONS: Argyle Certified (cut and certified by the Argyle) Non-Argyle (not of Argyle origin) Argyle Origin (cut from Argyle seconds) Abstract: This report takes a close look at why Argyle certified pink diamonds are growing in...

adorianassets.com

"5. GIA Colour Grading vs. Argyle Colour Grading

The GIA grade all diamonds in the face-up position, in a white non-fluorescent plastic tray. The surrounding ambient lighting is removed from the equation by the use of a viewing box. Then, by using a standardised geometry system, the observer visually estimates the diamonds colour.


The diamond’s colour grade is based on a combination of its size, shape, faceting arrangement and color. GIA describes a single colour as being a “characteristic” of the diamond as a whole. This characteristic colour is the overall blend of appearance.


Once the characteristic colour has been determined, the diamond is side-by-side compared with two or more colour reference diamonds. The objective of the comparison process is to place the pink diamond between various colour strength reference diamonds, not to match it to a particular colour reference. This leaves a wide spectrum of colour saturations that will all be given the same GIA colour grade.


The Argyle pink colour grading system is the world’s most accurate way of determining a pink diamonds true colour and value. The Argyle uses a similar viewing box and grade in the same face-up position as the GIA. But unlike the GIA, the Argyle perfectly match their diamonds colour strength/saturations to an exact colour reference diamond. With 35-colour saturation in its system, compared to seven-colour saturation in the GIA grading system. This makes a GIA colour grade almost irrelevant to correctly value a pink diamond."

 

[gregchang35]

wow- you got an amazing deal with those pinks! congrats!!!!
i cannot wait to see what you do with them.

 

[lilmosun]

Thank you @gregchang35 and @demantoidz !

I am surprised by the differences.
From your pics, I was surprised that GIA graded the one deep when it seemed lighter than the intense. Figured the photos were not accurate.
I still think you got a superb deal!

Yes, since I had certificates, I just took some quick shots as I assumed PSers could give me feedback on the papers.

If I look closely, the fancy intense diamond is more saturated whereas fancy deep is darker in tone. So looking at this diagram it makes sense.

In magnified photographs, I see a stronger purple modifier whereas with the smaller stone it's very slight. Maybe this all explains the difference in what Argule vs GIA saw when grading.

Comparing them side by side, color of the fancy intense (smaller) is much nicer imo. On the other hand, that's side by side and both are nice. The larger size of the fancy deep makes it hard to say which I would keep if I were to sell one (which I am not).



I have been spending way too much time reading about Argyle diamonds since this purchase. Here are my lay person (i.e. to be corrected) takeaway:

Rio Tinto showed pure marketing genius. He took something rare and made it rarer elevating the Argyle brand. Before the mine closed, the reality is that 90% of pink diamonds came from the Argyle mines. Yet only a fraction are selected to be cut/inscribed/certified by Argyle. The rest of the rough was sold off in lots much of which contained what they considered seconds.

However, it doesn't mean that there aren't fine pink diamonds from Argyle without their certification. Never one for paying for brands myself, IF I were in the market for a pink diamond for jewelry - I probably wouldn't go after the Argyle certification - it's a bonus but one, like other prestige brands, increases the cost many times.

Not only does an Argyle certification confirm source (one which 90% of pink diamonds come from anyway) but it also ensures mine to market chain of control by Argyle - recognized as an ethical source (similar to blockchain being used by other stones).

I also read that after they evaluate/inscribe their diamonds, Argyle sends the diamonds to GIA. That is why most Argyle certified diamonds also have GIA certs. If so, I assume those without GIA certs are because they got lost in the chain of ownership. Why would Argyle do this? My guess is that it adds an additional layer of prestige from a recognized diamond lab. Look at the number of owners who kept their GIA certs but not their Argyle certs (and sadly Argyle, unlike GIA, does not issue duplicates). Even the packaging on mine reference GIA but not Argyle.

Finally, from what I have read the Argyle method for color grading is considered more accurate in the industry. It was developed specifically for pink diamonds and uses more direct color references than GIA. That being said, I do think there are degrees of subjectiveness in any colored stone evaluation. My PC2 does not look at all like (to my admittedly untrained eye) the one in the Argyle color chart or pictures I've seen of other PC2 diamonds which have a noticeable brown or orange modifier. In comparing side-by-side, my 5PP has better color but nothing that puts the other stone in an entirely different color range.

 

[pinkjewel]

Beautiful pink diamonds. What a great find!! I do see a teeny, tiny bit of a brownish modifier in the one diamond, but can't imagine it being classified as a champagne diamond by Argyle. They both look like lovely pink diamonds. I'll be interested in seeing what you do with them.

 

[lilmosun]

Beautiful pink diamonds. What a great find!! I do see a teeny, tiny bit of a brownish modifier in the one diamond, but can't imagine it being classified as a champagne diamond by Argyle. They both look like lovely pink diamonds. I'll be interested in seeing what you do with them.

Thank you and great eye. Under 10x magnification, the color on the PC2 stone is not only darker in tone but less crisp in color...which I assume is due to the slight brown modifier. But yes, it still is still predominantly pink and purple...not anything like the PC2 diamonds in other pictures or the Argyle chart.

 

[demantoidz]

Thank you and great eye. Under 10x magnification, the color on the PC2 stone is not only darker in tone but less crisp in color...which I assume is due to the slight brown modifier. But yes, it still is still predominantly pink and purple...not anything like the PC2 diamonds in other pictures or the Argyle chart.

Lots of great info and I learned some new things, thanks. Admittedly, I do not really care about Argyle origin as it currently has no rich historic significance like Burma for rubies and such. Its more about marketing as you mentioned. I am not sure how correct the claims of the best Argyle pinks beating the best pinks from other locales terms of saturation. But I should look more into it for educations sake.

Have you taken a look at Leibish's or other site's Argyle stones and their report's designations?

This one immediately stood out as orangey/brownish, yet GIA saw none of that, and Argyle called it 3PR (R=rose, does that mean leaning into orange or brown but not enough to be called that?)

Pink Diamonds: Shop Natural Loose Pink Diamond | Leibish

Pink Diamonds are considered extremely rare. LEIBISH specializes in natural Pink Diamonds. Discover our range of pink diamonds for unique investments, jewelry and collectors.

www.leibish.com

And this one got PC3, closest they have to your grading, yet it looks extremely brownish to me (and GIA agreed) and you say yours is not that different from your intense. Odd. Perhaps they were overly harsh with your stone. But how great yours look is more important considering the price you paid

Colored Diamonds: Shop Natural Loose Colored Diamond | Leibish

LEIBISH specializes in Natural Fancy Colored Diamonds & Colored Diamond Jewelry. Discover our collection of fancy color diamonds.

www.leibish.com

 

[demantoidz]

Nevermind, I see you did mention comparing to other stones with the same grading - I for some reason only remembered reading you compared it to the charts.

 

[LD]

Well pull me down that rabbit hole because that's a sensational find! You lucky lucky thing! Congratulations on such an incredible find.

 

[lilmosun]

Well pull me down that rabbit hole ..

Thank you...and only if you take me down yours

Nevermind, I see you did mention comparing to other stones with the same grading - I for some reason only remembered reading you compared it to the charts.

I did but it's always nice to have a second set of eyes do the same...so I appreciate your effort and comments....so thank you!!

 

[Venti25]

*mouth drop* what a steal and yay for trusting your impulse gut!! Love the orange as well!!

 

[Nosean]

1500 - for both?
Insane…

Did you check the fluorescence? Fortunately the “pink“ diamonds from Argyle mine (Ia A<B) show very often a medium to strong blue fluorescence and wavy graining. „Pink“ means it doesn’t matter whether vivid purplish pink or brownish pink - they are easy to identify.
Argyle report is overrated in my opinion - makes them much more expensive.

The Marquise is only 0,09 ct Fancy Intense Pink (GIA)
You see the wavy graining at 6 in the left lighter reflection.
The blue fluorescence (LW) in the second pic.

Marlow on Instagram: "Two tiny Fancy intense pink diamonds from Argyle and a russian deep brownish purple pink diamond from 0,05-0,09 ct. The long wave fluorescence is typical for Argyle. #pinkdiamond #pinkdiamonds #argylepinkdiamond #fancydiamonds

152 likes, 7 comments - marlowgems0711 on June 2, 2021: "Two tiny Fancy intense pink diamonds from Argyle and a russian deep brownish purple pink diamond from 0,05-0,09 ct. The long wave fluorescence is typical for Argyle. #pinkdiamond #pinkdiamonds #argylepinkdiamond #fancydiamonds...

www.instagram.com

top are both FIP and Argyle - a lighter and deeper intense pink.
bottom is russian - deep br. Purple Pink.

 

[katharath]

Oh my goodness!! lilmosun, I know I’m late to this party (my first time browsing PS in ages, really) - but WOW, I just had to congratulate you on this. What a beautiful, lucky find!! (And I just want to say, I know what a truly kind and thoughtful person you are, you absolutely deserved this). Glad you added to the pinks with the orange/yellows as well. Just totally thrilled for you!

 

[pink diamond lover]

WOW. BIG THANK YOU @yssie and @Asscherhalo_lover (and others) for the info. I did not realize the inscription meant Argyle or linked to another certification.

In passing, I always thought FCDs were just out of my budget and so I figure it was a chance to own some. Online, I saw prices from $2K to crazy numbers and assumed these must be lower quality somehow. I am a little in shock...I hesitated in asking and while I hoped I got a good price wanted to be clear that if I didn't, it was OK. Never expected anything quite like this.

@kgizo @ItsMainelyYou @thirdrock - Thank you for the setting suggestions! Unfortunately, now I might be afraid to wear them

@LilAlex so true...maybe not for drugs but not having a clue what things are worth.

@T L thank you but it's how I feel every time you post one of your beauties.

Best thing about PS...having experts to help research stuff and a community to share the thrill of a find.

I am not familiar with forums. How can i see the diamonds you are talking about lilmosun?

 

[demantoidz]

I am not familiar with forums. How can i see the diamonds you are talking about lilmosun?

The first post on the first page of this thread. Link to the first page:

Slipped into the pink diamond rabbit hole...help pull me out!

I don't buy loose white diamonds...much less colored diamonds. And now I am freaking a bit because I just made a totally uneducated impulse pink diamond purchase without any knowledge or idea what to do with them. I went to visit my local bench and I wanted to buy something since I gave him no...

www.pricescope.com

 

[pink diamond lover]

The first post on the first page of this thread. Link to the first page:

Slipped into the pink diamond rabbit hole...help pull me out!

I don't buy loose white diamonds...much less colored diamonds. And now I am freaking a bit because I just made a totally uneducated impulse pink diamond purchase without any knowledge or idea what to do with them. I went to visit my local bench and I wanted to buy something since I gave him no...

www.pricescope.com

I see thank you! Beautiful

 

[lilmosun]

Thank you @Venti25 @Nosean yes, $1500 for both lol. I didn't check for florescence but will have to remember to do so when I decide to get them out of the safety deposit box where they sit until I decide to do something with them.

Oh my goodness!! lilmosun, I know I’m late to this party (my first time browsing PS in ages, really) - but WOW, I just had to congratulate you on this. What a beautiful, lucky find!! (And I just want to say, I know what a truly kind and thoughtful person you are, you absolutely deserved this). Glad you added to the pinks with the orange/yellows as well. Just totally thrilled for you!

@katharath Thrilled to have you join my party...anytime! I am blushing at your words...your presence has been missed!! We need to catch up.

@pink diamond lover - I saw your beautiful larger pink and am jealous! So glad the more experienced folks here were able to help you as they did for me on this thread!

 

[pink diamond lover]

Thank you @Venti25 @Nosean yes, $1500 for both lol. I didn't check for florescence but will have to remember to do so when I decide to get them out of the safety deposit box where they sit until I decide to do something with them.


@katharath Thrilled to have you join my party...anytime! I am blushing at your words...your presence has been missed!! We need to catch up.

@pink diamond lover - I saw your beautiful larger pink and am jealous! So glad the more experienced folks here were able to help you as they did for me on this thread!

Me too lilmosun! ty

 

[caolsen]

Best. Bargain. Ever.