State schools vs privates

[MrsWhitney]

I like how DH's parents handled it. If he went to state school, they'd pay his full tuition and if he wanted to live on campus, he would have to pay for that himself. If he went to private school, they would pay the equivalent of state tuition and he had to pay the rest.

He got into several schools, including some good private ones in a nice city that he really wanted to go to... and yeah, he wanted to go there for the city experience (he admits that now, at the time he was annoyed he couldn't have his cake and eat it too). Anyway, he's practical. He chose the state school. It wasn't far from where he lived, so the first semester he lived at home and commuted. He hated it because he was definitely missing out. Second semester he lived on-campus, at his expense (skin in the game, work ethic, learning balance). He made some great friends that semester that he is still friends with today. After that, he lived in apartments shared with other students, again at his expense.

All around, best decision. He is smart, good at recognizing opportunity, and a hard worker. He was on top of internships and job placements (helped him choose his field) and knew how to balance work with fun. All of that had a lot to do with where he is today (very good place). Once employed, he took advantage of his employers program to help pay for his masters. In no way was his state school degree a hinderance. However, he did choose a major/field for which that school was known to be very strong. He had no debt, and that has been so huge for his/our quality of life. Once graduated and employed, he was able to start saving aggressively right away, which lead to being able to buy a home and building equity, and so forth.

His brother chose the other route. I don't believe the semi-prestigious private school degree was more beneficial to him than DH's state school degree was to DH. I believe DH is in a better place in terms of fulfillment and finances. Some of that could, of course, be due to differences in personality and ambition (may be important to note that DH is very smart, DH's brother maybe more so). I suspect DH's brother could have arrived at the same place he's at with a state school degree, or at least starting out with that and at some point transferring to a private school or saving that for his masters.

Good luck, and how wonderful that your daughter has so many wonderful options! That's a great 'problem' to have!

This is a great post RainyDaze! I agree her daughter is fortunate to be in a wonderful spot to have options (if I could give that to all the students I have seen over the years without getting into a lot of schools, or even having parents even able or willing to help)... and you are right, personality is important! And intelligence...charisma... if we were God, or a higher being, maybe we would have the answers to such a personal decision that is impossible to determine the actual outcome...

 

[Marquise_Madness]

I'm currently at a private school. It's lovely because the classes are small for all majors, and my professors will stop me on campus to make sure I'm doing okay.

My boyfriend went to another private school where he got around half tuition as well, but he became a resident advisor so that he got free room and board which really helped defray housing and food costs. (My boyfriend is absolutely brilliant- I'm sure his IQ is genius level, and he did well on tests.) He says that since his school was prestigious that he had a lot of connections with alumni to get a good job straight out of college and has worked hard and was able to purchase a house at age 27. He still is paying student loans but they're manageable.

I've heard of people making their kids pay for school and then their parents paying them back afterward so that they don't lose money but they have to deal with making payments. My parents are currently paying for everything. I am graduating debt-free which I cannot thank them enough for. We haven't had to take out a single loan which I can't even imagine.

Let her choose which she wants.

 

[sonnyjane]

[
I find the notion of willingly going into debt absurd, yes. We tell people on here all the time to stick to their budgets - don't go into debt for a diamond. Why for education? I'd rather my children NOT be strapped with crippling debt for most of their adult lives.
Wanting to live further away? Not absurd. Paying $100,000 to live further away? Yes, absurd.

People that buy homes "willingly go into debt". Different people see different value in different things. Some may think going to a certain school IS worth that extra money. If I had a free ride to school A and school B wanted $100,000 yes, that's a decision that probably doesn't make sense, but if school A wants $60,000 and school B costs $80,000, then it's easier to see why someone might pick school B if it had something school A didn't even if it was more expensive.

 

[telephone89]

I'm just saying that the rest of the world gets along fine not going into debt for school. I would much rather spend $100k on a house than a school. In fact, I did. I bought my first property at 24. I could only do that because I saved well and had no other debt. A house also goes up in value. I just wonder what kind of society encourages children to spend this much money on 4 years of their life, and hope they get a job after. Hope they pay off the loans before they're 50. Hope that it actually means something, or makes them an adult.

 

[MrsWhitney]

I'm just saying that the rest of the world gets along fine not going into debt for school. I would much rather spend $100k on a house than a school. In fact, I did. I bought my first property at 24. I could only do that because I saved well and had no other debt. A house also goes up in value. I just wonder what kind of society encourages children to spend this much money on 4 years of their life, and hope they get a job after. Hope they pay off the loans before they're 50. Hope that it actually means something, or makes them an adult.

I personally (and again this whole thread is preference, nothing more) find education priceless. Then again, I am highly educated, so I value it. I purchased a home at 25, and still prefer experience, formal education, my network, more important than my home.

If you prefer your values, good for you! I I don't think our society is bad for encouraging education, or even debt. We need to be smart and responsible about the debt, sure. And it would be great if the U.S. did subsidize education at a more proportional rate, but I do not think there is a problem at all with our society, and encouraging education (which still statistically demonstrates a higher income AND quality of life over a lifetime in the country we are in).

 

[purplesparklies]

My oldest is 14 so we are not yet discussing specific options but we have let him know that he will have choices. That choice will be only one of the important decisions he will make as he begins his adulthood. We will have a specific dollar amount that we are willing to contribute. Regardless of where he chooses to go, he will have some responsibility for funding his own education. He can fulfill his portion by earning scholarships, working or taking loans. His choice of school will have a huge impact on how much his responsibility ends up being as our contribution will remain the same. He will make the choice and have to live with the consequences. I believe he will choose a state school as it makes financial sense to do so and he is already very logical and business-minded.

In your situation, I would sit with her and lay it all out on paper. Costs associated with each option. Contribution you are willing to make. Discuss the bottom line for each option. I would be very clear to include information about loans and what those loans would mean for her future. Research typical starting pay for the field she is interested in and help her come up with a list of likely expenses. Will she be able and is she willing to add a loan payment to that list of expenses?

My husband is in an upper management position and does the hiring for his group. In his business, which my son has shown an interest in, the school has no impact. It is important to have the appropriate degree/degrees and experience. Period. My husband went to a state school and has been very successful and is highly respected in his field. My field, although I am not currently working, also does not give any benefit or preference for those whose degrees are from private or Ivy League universities.

 

[Slickk]

I can only speak from experience with my two college graduate children as my college experience was decades ago and I was state schooled. Both of my achieving kids chose to go private over state, knowing the loans they would incur. DH and I paid the majority and thankfully we were able to help them graduate with less than $20k in loans each, which I do feel helped them have a stake in the game. I will say, they now both have great positions in prestigious well-known companies with generous salaries. My son's school had well-attended job fairs with the big corporations which he connected with yearly and now works for one. DD also made invaluable connections that allowed a wider field of opportunities.
Would they have had the same advantages at state, we won't know, but they chose their colleges, wanted the smaller classes and thrived. Since the decision was theirs they could never blame DH and me for any unhappiness they might've had if we had forced or coerced them to go public when they really wanted private.

 

[amc80]

I think part of the issue with the choices is the huge difference between them. Can a compromise be worked out? Such as go to the local school but live on campus, even if just for the first year? Dorm life is such a huge part of college, and it would be a shame to miss out on that just because you happen to live near the school.

On a side note, I went to a UC with in state tuition. I was waitlisted at my first choice school, which was a top tier private school. I'm so glad I didn't go there, I'd be up to my eyeballs in debt. As it worked out, I only had about $20k in loans for both undergrad and grad school.

 

[Maria D]

I'm just saying that the rest of the world gets along fine not going into debt for school. I would much rather spend $100k on a house than a school. In fact, I did. I bought my first property at 24. I could only do that because I saved well and had no other debt. A house also goes up in value. I just wonder what kind of society encourages children to spend this much money on 4 years of their life, and hope they get a job after. Hope they pay off the loans before they're 50. Hope that it actually means something, or makes them an adult.

telephone89, I totally agree with you. I am always counseling my high school students to NOT take on massive amount of debt for their college education, especially if they plan on majoring in something that's not all that lucrative. There was an article last year in a local paper about the massive amount of debt that students incur and it featured one young woman who was already $90,000 in debt in her third year at Maine College of Art. Seriously??? She'll be $120K in the hole when she graduates with a Bachelor in Fine Arts degree from a school that isn't even a "name" school. I think it's lunacy. Now I have nothing against art school, or spending a lot of money on education even if the rate of return is going to be low - but to be saddled with that kind of debt from the moment you are starting your life as a young adult is life-changing. In other words, if you've got generous benefactors (parents? grandparents?), or are awarded huge scholarships, or are majoring in something highly lucrative, then fine - spend your heart out. Otherwise, realize that college/university is what YOU make of it and get a great education at a school you can afford.

Here's what happens with many of my school's very best students. They work their tails off getting excellent grades, playing sports, being involved in as many extracurriculars as possible, studying for the SAT/ACT, volunteering, for all four years in the hopes of getting into an Ivy League or otherwise elite school. Getting in is winning the golden ticket. The ivies are extremely well endowed and if you can get in, they make it so that costs will not factor into your decision to go. Harvard, for example, asks families earning between $150 and 180K/ year to pay 10% of income toward their costs, including room & board. That means it could cost LESS to go there than to a state university. (And once you're in, graduating is practically a given. With their current grade inflation practices, 91% of Harvard grads graduate with honors.) So it only makes sense to work towards this goal if you've got the smarts and the drive.

The problem, of course, is that admission rates to these "highly selective" schools is by definition extremely low. Most of these kids do not get in, even though they have been working very hard and are as good a candidate as the lucky ones that do get accepted. Their choices come down to other expensive "name" private schools and public state schools. In the northeast, there are so many good private schools that kids think of the state university as "lesser," especially the one in their home state. My students are thrilled to get in to a choice private college, but if their parents are "comfortable" they are usually not offered enough in scholarships to avoid taking on a huge amount of debt. Since they have been pretty much been brainwashed to believe that the expensive private school is where students of their caliber should go (because just about anybody can get into the state school) they will take out loans to make it happen.

Last year, one of my seniors was crying when she came to the realization that although she was accepted to her first choice school she could not afford to go there. This girl got a full scholarship from our flagship state school, but she felt like she had worked so hard for four years for nothing (her words).

 

[sonnyjane]

^^^ even an Ivy League education can't guarantee you work. I know at least three friends from high school (one from Yale, one from Dartmouth, one from Penn) that haven't been able to find work in their field even 10 years later.

 

[ihy138]

I went to the same private institution for undergrad and graduate school. I paid about 50% of the full cost for undergrad, and about 30% for graduate school thanks to scholarships and grants. Unfortunately, I am still in moderate debt that I do feel is a hindrance at times. My parents couldn't help me at all. Despite this, I would not trade my education for the world. It is priceless in that nobody can take it away from me. Not just my degree, but critical thinking skills and the like. During undergrad, I took classes at state colleges for transfer credit in order to graduate early (and save further money). I can say without a doubt that the caliber of education provided at those state schools did not remotely compare to what I received at my university. Not all state schools are created equally, but I did notice a difference and felt thankful that I had access to a better school even if it was through loans.

It also depends on the program itself. The master's program I attended is known and respected for my particular discipline, and I have gotten jobs over professionals who attended other programs because of my affiliation with it.

 

[Maria D]

^^^ even an Ivy League education can't guarantee you work. I know at least three friends from high school (one from Yale, one from Dartmouth, one from Penn) that haven't been able to find work in their field even 10 years later.

well hopefully they got a good financial aid package and aren't also in debt!

 

[Maria D]

I went to the same private institution for undergrad and graduate school. I paid about 50% of the full cost for undergrad, and about 30% for graduate school thanks to scholarships and grants. Unfortunately, I am still in moderate debt that I do feel is a hindrance at times. My parents couldn't help me at all. Despite this, I would not trade my education for the world. It is priceless in that nobody can take it away from me. Not just my degree, but critical thinking skills and the like. During undergrad, I took classes at state colleges for transfer credit in order to graduate early (and save further money). I can say without a doubt that the caliber of education provided at those state schools did not remotely compare to what I received at my university. Not all state schools are created equally, but I did notice a difference and felt thankful that I had access to a better school even if it was through loans.

It also depends on the program itself. The master's program I attended is known and respected for my particular discipline, and I have gotten jobs over professionals who attended other programs because of my affiliation with it.

While I agree that this is true, I also know for a fact that not all private schools are created equally. I could name some comparatively expensive private schools that do not offer as good an education as the public college in the same state. (And while Trump University comes to mind, I am talking about accredited schools! )

I think this is an area where the US is very different from other countries. My daughter went to university in Canada at a school that is ranked #1 or #2 for Canada year after year. But, the difference between the top schools in Canada and the "middle of the road" ones is not nearly as great as we would see in the US. Also, it is much easier to get into #1 in Canada - but much harder to graduate. They don't have the grade inflation of the ivies and their requirements are greater. Yale, for example, requires only 36 semester courses for an undergraduate degree. University of Toronto requires 40, with courses that include labs and mandatory tutorial sessions still counting as one course.

 

[telephone89]

Maria D - That is so interesting! Thanks for sharing both sides. Only one of my friends actually has any student debt, and that was because she chose to go to an American uni for grad school. Her program is very specific and only a few schools in the world offer grad programs for it, so she made that choice. In Canada, it is just not as common for people to go into debt for school. Heck, most of my friends and now my friends' kids didn't even live on campus. But we live in a large city with a few different educational institutions. But even living on campus isn't 'the thing' to do here haha. Just another thing I do love about PS - learning about the differences between (pretty similar) cultures.

 

[iLander]

I'm just saying that the rest of the world gets along fine not going into debt for school. I would much rather spend $100k on a house than a school. In fact, I did. I bought my first property at 24. I could only do that because I saved well and had no other debt. A house also goes up in value. I just wonder what kind of society encourages children to spend this much money on 4 years of their life, and hope they get a job after. Hope they pay off the loans before they're 50. Hope that it actually means something, or makes them an adult.

I agree! There has been some movement toward looking at school costs and weighing it against wage results. It's basically checking the ROI (return on investment) of tuition. I think it is extremely important for parents and kids to weigh these things.

I also find that if everyone followed the "Expectations of society", that have developed over the last few years, they would be hopelessly in debt! Much more so than previous generations. Consider these ballpark figures:

- tuition - easily $20K to $100K or more in debt.
- ER - $10K to $50K or more
- fancy wedding - $25K to $40K or more

So, at the low end a kid can START life with $55K in debt! This was the purchase price of my first house! The high end is almost $200K! Which is MORE than the cost of our second house! How can they scrape out the money for a house down payment? What about retirement? Did you know that the average 50 year old has less than $32K set aside for retirement?*

So, yeah, the less debt (for any reason), the better.

* http://www.businessinsider.com/ebri-retirement-savings-by-age-2015-7

 

[chrono]

iLander,
My family sort of calculated the ROI when making the decision as to which university I would attend. I applied to both private and state schools and selected the state school because it was less expensive. All the schools I applied to and was accepted at are accredited but we could not justify the higher cost and I didn't want to start off my career with debt.

 

[Queenie60]

We allowed our daughter to choose the school she is attending - CU Boulder. She applied to several schools and got into all of them with the exception of one. She was accepted to a few California State schools which would have been much less expensive however, it's her education and we want her to be happy. She's at the tail end of her freshman year and is very happy with her choice. Initially I tried to take charge of her choices but my husband convinced me to back off. Glad I allowed her to choose as she would not have been happy at a So. California school as she's not a "beach girl" as she told me, she's an outdoor type girl!! Fortunately we are in the position to pay for her education. I do however understand the need for scholarships, etc. as it's a shame that so many kids leave school with debt and are not able to get jobs based on their degree and intern experience. It's tough out there and I feel that all of them should have an opportunity to have a college education. Living in the dorms for the first year is a good experience for them. Good luck - hope your child can get the education experience she desires.

 

[Haven]

I'm sorry if I missed this, but has your daughter spent time on these different campuses? And I mean more time than just a one-day tour? I think *fit* is the most important issue here, and that all depends on your daughter and her particular needs and personality. Can you spend a night or two on campus with her, or better yet, does she know anyone at the schools with whom she can spend a night or two? Has she sat in on any classes?

I am a Dave Ramsey debt-free devotee, so I am firmly in the don't-go-into-debt-if-you-can-avoid-it camp. That being said, I attended the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign for undergrad, a public state school, and even with scholarships I had to take out student loans because my parents could not help out at all. I graduated undergrad with just under 20K in student debt, and back in the late nineties the sticker price to attend was around 18K per year for tuition, room & board, and materials. So, not too bad. I went on to earn graduate degrees from two private universities in Illinois, and then a post-grad certificate at App State in NC (public), and then another one at a different state school here in Illinois. I have never conceptualized the value of these relative experiences as a public vs private issue, rather they were all vastly different because they were vastly different schools. My employers/scholarships/grants have paid for all of my graduate work except for one degree, so I did not have to take on huge amounts of student debt. I would not have attended so many different programs if they were not funded by others.

In general, I am not a big supporter of taking out student loans when they can be avoided, particularly in your daughter's situation where she isn't sure what she wants to study. Yssie's point about attending a particular elite school because of a particular program is important, and I agree with her there. But to attend a pricey school without a specific focus? I would strongly discourage my child against that. But of course, I have already shared that I am highly debt-averse in general, and I also don't do things like take out car loans.

I should tell you that I am a full-time faculty member in a community college, and I strongly believe in both my institution's mission to provide access to higher education to those who lack the various privileges to attend selective universities, and the value of what we provide to our students academically. So, this likely skews my perspective--another disclaimer, I suppose.

Whatever she decides, it sounds like your daughter is in a wonderful position to have to make such a choice. I wish her all the best in college. My undergraduate years were transformative years for me, and I am very grateful I had the opportunity to attend my particular institution. It was a good fit.

 

[Queenie60]

Haven has made some very good points. I too believe in the Community College route, especially when they can't decide which direction they want to take. Those two years of general ed at a community college can relieve them of a lot of debt. Fortunately our daughter knows which direction she wants to take however had she been unsure I would not be as willing to spend $50,000 ++ per year for her education. I know many young adults who did the Community College route and transferred into some fine Universities that they would not have been able to attend had they applied as freshman. It's a good way to go.

 

[Haven]

This discussion reminds me of Malcolm Gladwell's book David and Goliath, he discusses college options in one chapter. I found this PDF online, though I am not sure that it is copied exactly correctly from the book, since I did not produce it. He makes some interesting points, but I also think that the individual student, and her needs and temperament and desires, trump all.

https://www.ash.nl/ftpimages/401/download/download_1009994.pdf

 

[Maria D]

This discussion reminds me of Malcolm Gladwell's book David and Goliath, he discusses college options in one chapter. I found this PDF online, though I am not sure that it is copied exactly correctly from the book, since I did not produce it. He makes some interesting points, but I also think that the individual student, and her needs and temperament and desires, trump all.

https://www.ash.nl/ftpimages/401/download/download_1009994.pdf

Thanks for passing this along Haven, very interesting! I've been meaning to read this book, will definitely have to get a copy. It's interesting to me that in both vignettes, the students decided they weren't good enough or smart enough to pursue a science degree because they got B's in a required course. Seriously?! In my day (haha, old-lady-speak) we got C's and even D's and just kept on going. No one was expected to change majors just because their GPA wasn't 3.7+. I blame grade inflation. I valiantly try to combat it at the high school level and it's soooo hard. A student will ask "what can I do to get an A" but I structure my assessments so that if you can do everything you were supposed to learn you will get a B+/A-. To get an A you have to be able to do the problems that force you to apply your learning in a novel way. Not everyone can do it every time within a time limit. Here come the tears...won't be able to get into [insert elite school here] with that B+ in Calculus.

sorry for the thread jack....

 

[IS_EDS]

^^^ even an Ivy League education can't guarantee you work. I know at least three friends from high school (one from Yale, one from Dartmouth, one from Penn) that haven't been able to find work in their field even 10 years later.

Did they graduate near the bottom GPA-wise?

Ivy League schools can look good on the resume (I suppose) but that is less important for technical majors (I believe). What is even more important for technical majors is the ranking of the department of a student's major. For example, there is a ranking of Electrical Engineering departments of schools, and top 30 departments (schools) feature a bunch of state schools (i.e., they are not just all expensive private Ivy schools). Thus one can be smart by choosing a state school that is highly-ranked for a particular major and also somewhat affordable.

If you pair this choice with hard work (a high GPA), internships (extra $$) and a scholarship, you can get a very good degree and graduate with no/almost no debt and be in a good position to get a job upon graduation.

 

[IS_EDS]

I think employers look at 1) your major, 2) your GPA. If her major (or 2nd major) is technical and her grades are excellent, she won't have problems finding jobs. For example, 2 years ago I graduated with a BS in Electrical Engineering with an extremely high GPA and 2 honors, and I had no trouble finding a job. People who have trouble finding jobs upon graduation are probably those who chose easy majors or just did not study hard.

Major. If she does not want a technical major (chemistry, math, stats, electrical/computer engineering or computer science, etc) as her only major, it may make sense to have a technical major as her 2nd major or may be she should get a technical minor as a sort of insurance against being unemployed.

Tuition. While in school and during the summer, she can work as an intern (part-time while in school and full-time during the summer), earn money and pay her tuition, at least in part. I did that during my 3rd and 4th year and it helped with my expenses.

As someone in higher ed, and the private sector in Engingeering, I think you need to realize you are in a specific industry. You are in Engineering. When I was in Advising for HSSoE for the UC, of course your major is most important and GPA. But what about all the other sectors? They do not require a professional undergraduate major; therefore your network/school are the most important. RARELY are you asked about your GPA (if ever).

You may be right that in certain fields you will not be asked about your GPA.

In engineering (in my experience) -- and there can be other majors with the same rule -- one needs a high GPA to secure prestigious internships and jobs (with a low GPA you may not even get to be interviewed by an employer of your choice).

 

[Haven]

This is obviously just an anecdote, but back when I was in undergrad most of the engineering majors secured jobs long before graduation, no matter their rank. One of my dear friends was a mediocre student, yet he has always done extremely well "in the real world" with his engineering degree. Maybe the Chicago area is a hotbed for engineers, I doubt it but who knows, but that degree seemed like the ticket to a job that paid well right out of school. We went to U of I, which I believe was a highly ranked engineering school back then. The engineering campus was certainly very well funded, I used their library to study because it was SO nice.

 

[IS_EDS]

This is obviously just an anecdote, but back when I was in undergrad most of the engineering majors secured jobs long before graduation, no matter their rank. One of my dear friends was a mediocre student, yet he has always done extremely well "in the real world" with his engineering degree. Maybe the Chicago area is a hotbed for engineers, I doubt it but who knows, but that degree seemed like the ticket to a job that paid well right out of school. We went to U of I, which I believe was a highly ranked engineering school back then. The engineering campus was certainly very well funded, I used their library to study because it was SO nice.

Certain companies/research labs care about your GPA (and they ask about it). With an engineering degree, if you don't care what company you will work for, you can apply to some company and get a job/some job.
For example, one of my classmates had a mediocre GPA, he got a job/some job. Another person had a high GPA and now works for Microsoft (which is not a job/some job but a prestigious job).

 

[Nicolette]

If she is amenable to the state school, she could start there and knock out the first two years of general education - if she likes the state school, is doing well, and they have a good program in her chosen major, she can get her degree there... or she can transfer to another school with a better program in her major and finish out there. At least the first two years would be debt-free, and your daughter would still have the option to transfer elsewhere if that would benefit her most.

This is a smart idea, too. One thing though is that transferring still has the emotional change...and as a former transfer student, I did miss the continuity....

Newbie here but I would like to mention that transferring to a school with better programs for her may be painfully expensive. Most transfers do pay full tuition.

 

[rubybeth]

I realize that this thread is a couple weeks old now, but I wanted to share my sister's and my experience. We both lived at home during undergrad and went to the local university, which our parents generously paid for. Wide range of major choices, and I selected a BA in English. My sister was more science-minded, and majored in Communication Disorders. After working for a couple years in related fields, I decided to get my graduate degree, and went to a private school for that, getting my Master of Library and Information Science. My sister went to grad school straight out of undergrad, at a top ranked public university for her field (speech language pathology). I wound up with about $35k in debt, and she has over $100k. I got married while in school and DH and I paid off our combined $54k in school loans in four years; my sister works in a school and is really hoping that Public Service loan forgiveness is still an option in about 7 years.

The lessons I've learned is that it's more important to study something you like and are good at at a school you're okay with than the name on your diploma, for most fields. My sister loves her job, is very good at it, but I'm not sure the name-brand school made a difference in terms of her ability to be hired (she definitely learned a lot and mostly enjoyed the educational aspects of grad school, but the name on the diploma seems irrelevant). My grad school has some name recognition in my field, but also, not sure that really matters--it's more likely I'd be hired because of my work experience (I worked in a library all through college and grad school) than because of my university's name.

 

[evergreen]

Nala, I'm not sure you're still looking for replies on this, but just saw it pop up and thought I'd offer my experience. Of course, that's all I really have!

I graduated from a public magnet high school and could choose between a small (fewer than 900 undergrads, though part of a consortium), not-well-known, private liberal arts women's college all the way across the country which offered me a full tuition/room/board scholarship, or my local state school of 20,000 undergrades (also a full scholarship). So, it took money entirely out of the equation. Obviously, the two schools were extremely different.

I knew I wanted to be a science major. The liberal arts school offered 3 science majors: biology, chemistry, or physics.

But here's what I knew about me: I don't do well when I feel "buried" by other people. I need a mentor, someone who I feel cares about my success (other than myself or my parents). I do way better when professors know my name and care about me individually -- it motivates me to work hard in the course. So even though it didn't make sense from a major perspective, personally, I knew I would do better in a smaller school environment.

I ended up switching majors (from physics to biology) halfway through and graduated in 4 years to attend a top-5 medical school, which I paid about 75%-tuition (after grants) for and will be digging myself out of that $100k of loans for a long time to come -- or, hopefully, since I will be remaining in academic medicine (which pays a lot less than private practice but affords me the opportunity to do meaningful clinical research, which I love!) I will have those loans forgiven after 10 years working at a publically-funded nonprofit academic medical center or perhaps will be awarded grants from the National Institute of Health to assist with loan payback. Right now, because of the low pay during my five years of medical residency, I've only managed to cover the interest... But depending on what your daughter does after college, her graduate school might not cost an arm and a leg.

What I think would have happened if I'd gone to the state school: I would probably still have done reasonably well, well enough to attend my local/state medical school, where tuition was much lower and I would have graduated with perhaps $20-50k in debt. The debt hasn't affected my decisions of what to do with my life (i.e., I do not feel pressured to go into private practice to pay them off) because I hope and trust the system (NIH, public service loan forgiveness) that recognizes the huge pay disparities between private practice and academic medicine will provide some assistance. And, of course, even on an academic salary I would be able to pay back those loans in time anyway.

But I would have gone to a less-well-regarded medical school, because my grades -- motivated by terrific mentors, to whom I am forever grateful -- would have been lower at the state school, and I would not have matured as a woman as much if I'd gone to a co-ed school. I was pretty shy, and college made me much more assertive by providing the small, intimate, safe environment I needed to grow into my own strengths. I don't really think the *name* value of my private school was terribly significant -- but what I accomplished there, and exceptional letters of recommendation from professors who clearly knew me very well, was. Name value is extremely important when transitioning from medical school to medical residency, but that's another story.

I guess it comes down to the atmosphere-vs-personality interaction to which others have alluded! If your daughter is a self-confident, assertive woman who has no trouble speaking up and having her voice heard, I see no reason she wouldn't excel in a large public school. I really have no idea how a large public school is different from a large private school, except for name recognition... but a small private school can be an extraordinarily different experience from a large public school.

And then again, there are people who are just sorta committed to college, or sorta committed to academics and all that other stuff but will never really excel academically. I knew who those people were in my college classes, so they must exist, though nobody ever thinks, "That's me!" But if you think your daughter may be among them, and may not focus down and instead bounce around from major to major and eventually graduate with "something," finding herself working in a tangentially-related field where probably a lot of majors, and a lot of backgrounds, would have been compatible, I don't know that a private school will offer much beyond perhaps some more helpful career counseling & connections into the workforce.

That's, um, very long and stream-of-consciousness. But I do conduct alumnae interviews for my undergrad (even though I graduated over 10 years ago! ) and see a lot of different sorts of high-school women applying. Some, I can tell, would excel just about anywhere... some might not excel anywhere... and a handful really need the intimacy of a small private school to help them mature and develop into the person they deserve to be. I was among the latter group, and am endlessly grateful that scholarships allowed me to make the choice I did!

hth.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

I was just discussing this with a friend deciding on where to go for grad school. In reality, beyond my initial job interview, no one has ever asked my GPA or where I went to school. I do not view all state schools are inferior to private. I went to a state school for both undergrad and graduate school. My graduate school was excellent and 1/4 of the cost as a well known private school. Not only was it cheaper but it was a BETTER program. Paying off my loans within 6 months of graduating was an amazing feeling.

 

[rubybeth]

I was just discussing this with a friend deciding on where to go for grad school. In reality, beyond my initial job interview, no one has ever asked my GPA or where I went to school. I do not view all state schools are inferior to private. I went to a state school for both undergrad and graduate school. My graduate school was excellent and 1/4 of the cost as a well known private school. Not only was it cheaper but it was a BETTER program. Paying off my loans within 6 months of graduating was an amazing feeling.

So true! My husband is at the public university for grad school, and it's been possible for us to afford the tuition with no loans, and just me working right now as he does his internship. It's kinda crazy. A lot of his classmates are looking for jobs that offer the loan forgiveness option, but he doesn't have to even think about that--it's all paid for. It's honestly a huge relief after having what felt like a lot of debt going into our marriage. We decided after paying it off that we'd never take on debt like that again, unless it was for a house.