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ammayernyc

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So, after months of trying to talk to my bf about US, the future, and all that scary stuff to no avail, I have decided to write him a letter. So, I was a bad little worker and wrote it today during work. I showed it to a friend of mine who knows both of us and the situation very well, and after some pointers, I think I have completed it.

I have decided to give it to him tonight. I''m not sure how. But more important, I''m so scared about his reaction. Last time I tried to talk to him about this he told me that it was an inappropriate time since he was so stressed at work. He actually made me feel bad for trying to talk about stuff. In fact, he was angry with me for several days.

But it is eating me up inside so I cannot let it go anymore.

For people who don''t know my history with him, he is a complete non-talker. He internalizes every feeling, no matter what I try. He answers straightforward questions like, how do you feel about this, with ''I don''t know.'' We''ve been together for over three and a half years and living together for almost one. We talk about the future in concrete terms, such as vacations and things, but never emotional or marriage things. My family has reached a fever pitch about us not being engaged and even his friends are starting to ask me when it''s going to happen.

So, I hope that I have the courage to give it to him tonight and that maybe we''ll even talk about it.

Sorry for the long speech... just that you ladies are all so supportive and that''s exactly what I need right now!
 
*hugs* and encouragement for tonight!!!

I''m so glad to hear that you''re going to let him know more about how you have felt. I truly hope everything works out beautifully!!
 
AP...The best of luck to you!!! How hard that you have to resort to letter-writing because of his inability to communicate. May I make a suggestion? When you present this letter, you may want to say something like, "I felt the need to write this and give it you. Please read it. When you''re done, let me know. I won''t say another thing until you''re ready to talk, but I need you to tell me when I can expect a response from you so we can talk more about it."

Then you''ll need to stick to your word...It''ll be hard, but this way there''s no blame upon presenting it to him and you are letting him know what you need to get some kind of closure over this issue...

Again...good luck to you!! Let us know what happens. *fingers crossed*
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Amanda, I don't know your whole story, but I hope everything works out. It usually does, but sometimes (moments like this), it's difficult.

Hang in there girl, and I think you definitely need to sit down and have a serious conversation. About him getting upset at you for wanting to talk....I don't think that's acceptable. I know work can be very stressful, but you should never bring work home and get mad at your SO for wanting to talk to you. If he does bring it home, he should be opening up and talking to you about it instead of keeping it bottled inside and then venting it out on you.

I know how it is when your bf doesn't respond as well as you like. My bf didn't like to talk about that kind of stuff at the beginning, after several years, he slowly started to change. I'm not saying that'll be your case, all I'm saying is it takes a lot of work from both parties. That's what a relationship is about, compromising and meeting in the middle.

Good luck with tonight.
 
Good luck tonight!
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Timing is everything...

We have some friends who just broke up because one was ready for the next step and one wasn't. The girl was so bitter about him not wanting to move fwd it was coloring the rest of their lives and she was playing games with him mentally trying to get him to show he cared and/or move fwd but he was just typical clueless male. He was sick of it and is not even sad she's gone. Now that he knows everything she was saying to us re: him not wanting to move fwd he thinks she's a psycho. We didn't like her anyway...but she obviously doesn't realize that compromise and communication are two key components of a mature relationship. It's not about one person's timeline if the other isn't ready. You can't force something and in this instance, they were just mis-matched on timing.

Your BF just sounds like he's not ready. Sometimes you have to wait. Sometimes you just move on. I think it's good you are forcing something by giving him this letter, whether it is a step fwd or a step away from each other. At least it's *something* and something is better than the day to day of nothing, especially when one person wants more.

Personally I laid my hand on the table at 1.5 years and said, this is the deal....I'm not waiting around forever, I love you and you are the one for me but if I'm not the one for you then lets let go. I want to know by year 2 what you think. By year 2 he was ready to get engaged, but it took him a long 6 months to work things out in his head. We also didn't live together until we knew we were getting engaged. I've been there and done the whole aimless relationship living together thing and it didn't work out in the end.

Good luck.
 
Amanda- I think the letter is a great idea. I like AChiO''s idea too- about giving him the letter and allowing him some time to digest it (as in a few hours or a day), since he has a hard time communicating.

I really hope this will open up some dialogue between you two!

Oh, and it''s really uncool that he would be MAD about you wanting to discuss your relationship! Have you tried kicking him?
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Good luck though! I hope you get the answers that you are looking for.. HUGS!!
 
Ooh good luck tonight! I know, it can be scary, but i think writing the letters is so theraputic. Personally, it can be easier for me to get everything I want to say out in a letter than in person. Sometimes I''ve given them to my bf, other times I havent, and it was just something I needed to get out for myself. Try not to let your family or friends get to you too much (easier said than done), you both need to work at things at your own pace. Hope everything goes well tonight!
 
Good luck tonight, Amanda. I think the letter is a very good idea, you''ve been totally making yourself crazy not knowing where you stand, wondering if he''s on the same page and I think the letter is the way to go about telling him how you feel, considering his inability to communicate.

Let us know how it goes- hopefully you''ll feel better just giving it to him and the best end result with be an open, honest conversation!
 
Amandapanda,
Like everyone else has said so elequently the letter is a good idea and I would agree that before handing it over to him you just say that you put your thoughts down on paper and that when he''s ready to talk you will be ready to listen. Seems to me that he isn''t ready for the next step. But a good talk is in order. You guys should be able to talk without feeling like your intruding. If it were me and I do like to talk, it would drive me nuts. So getting it out in the open is a good idea. Being married takes a lot of communication, I''ve been married for 19 years. It''s a must for a sucessful marriage. Good luck, and I will hope to hear good news tomorrow.
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AP: Good Luck with everything. I really hope that he opens up to you, but I feel that if he''s not ready, he should have at least had the decency to tell you that in the past. I''m keeping my fingers crossed for you, but if he doesn''t communicate his interest in moving forward, I think you should prepared to walk. Just remember as much as you love him, you have to love yourself more. Please keep us posted. *hugs*
 
I think the letter is a good idea-his lack of non-verbal expression might make the letter a better form of communicaion when it comes to deep feelings.

That being said, your future and your desires for marriage and a family are very important, as are his dreams and life goals. You both need to decide what you want from life and from eachother...hopefully, it''s the same but if it''s not, you need to TALK about it and resolve the situation one way or another.

If you don''t, one day you;ll wake up and your life will be half over and you''ll STILL be waiting for him to express himself... There is a big difference between going on for hours about your "feelings" and giving straightforward answers to important questions about your future.

I wish you good luck and hope everything works out as you want it to.
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Amanda, I really hope that everything goes well for you!! I know how much you''ve been hoping things would go forward with you and your bf, I really hope that time is now and he will see what a wonderful future can be in store for the two of you. My thoughts are with you, let us know how it goes, we are rootin'' for you!
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Hi all.
Well, to update:

We went out to dinner last night, which I didn''t expect. I expected to have dinner at home and then I would give him the letter and maybe we would discuss it. But instead, I had to give it to him in the cab ride home. I told him that it was just some things I wanted to talk to him about and that if he just told me when he finished it I would give him time to think about it before we talked.

Cut to this morning. He didn''t read the letter last night. He didn''t take it with him to work this morning. I almost threw up when I realized that he had just left it sitting on the chair with the rest of the mail from yesterday. I had a good cry in the shower and now feel better, but am alternating between livid and calm and sad.

The purpose of this is not to get him to move to the next step. I just want to talk about it. I am not giving him and ultimatum. In fact, I said that specifically in the letter. I just explained that it was extremely hurtful that he would be mad at me for wanted to discuss our furture. Maybe I''m totally off base, but he seems to want a future with me. We make plans together, he talks about moving to Florida together in a couple of years, he encouraged me to give his mother a picture of us as a Christmas present for goodness sake.

He truly has a problem with communicating. In 3.5+ years, I have only seen him close to crying once -- even when he broke his leg in half (literally). He even admits to me that he internalizes everything and doesn''t like talking about it.

In my heart, I know that he wants us to be together. He just won''t make a step until it''s necessary, and I''m telling him now that it''s necessary. Even when we moved in together it was a 10 minute conversation -- A: My lease is up soon. G: Okay. A: What are we going to do? G: I don''t know. A: Well, what do you think. G: I don''t know. A: Well, we need to figure out what we''re going to do. G: Okay, I''ll talk to the management company tomorrow about breaking my lease and to see if there are any other apartments in the building. A: Great.
The next day, he did just what he said he would and that night we looked at two apartments and by the next week we signed a lease.

At this point, I am just so frustrated that he did not read the letter. He is the one who initially wanted to look at rings. He is the one who encourages me to look at them. He is the one who talks about when he gives me one...

Maybe he wants it to be a surprise. But it''s coming at the enpense of my sanity.
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Sorry for the long vent...
 
I''m so sorry that the letter writing plan to not go as you wanted. For him to not read the letter or even to take it to work is terrible. I don''t blame you one bit for being upset.

As I''ve been reading your comments I''ve been seeing a major red flag in your relationship. I know you love this man and he probably loves you too. But it is really worrisome that he doesn''t communicate with you. Even if you do manage to get through to him about your future via the letter or some other way, if you do get married you will face a life time of dealing with someone who internalizes and doesn''t talk. And the need to talk through things definitely doesn''t end with getting engaged or married--in fact doing those things only intensify the need to communicate. Research shows that the number one reason people divorce is communication--often communication over money issues, but it covers all sorts of things. If I were you, I''d really think long and hard if you can live with this personality trait the rest of your life.

That being said, since he recognizes is internalization of everything, is he will to go to counseling with you? Perhaps you both could learn how to communicate with each other more effectively and in the process maybe he would learn how to feel more comfortable expressing things to you. And maybe you learn to read his nonverbal cues etc.

I don''t mean to be a downer--I really hope that when he reads his letter he wakes up and at least talks to you and everything works out. Good luck and keep us posted!
 
Oh Amanda....
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I''m so sorry he didn''t even read the letter... I don''t even know what to say ~ but I totally understand that black hole feeling in the pit of your stomach and the fluctuating emotions. It''s almost like him saying that your thoughts and feelings aren''t important and don''t warrant his attention. BUT, I don''t think that is the case - I just think he is a guy and doesn''t understand what he is communicating by not reading the letter... I''m on my way out the door but I''ll be thinking of you. I would give it a little time before I''d bring it up - if it''s still sitting in the same chair tomorrow morning then I might be tempted to do a little ''communicating'' about it.
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Take care.
 
Oh AP! I am so srroy for everything you are going through. I agree with Mara we cannot push one person faster then they want to go. That said it doesnt sound like that was your letters intention. I hope that this works out and I am NOT trying to hurts your feelings...but are you sure this is what you want? Five years from now it might be the same thing with a child, house, car, moving for a job. One of the bestt things about realationships is knowing wehere the other is coming from and caring how they feel. I have read many posts from women and men on here who have solid marriages. My own parents have been married 26 years, they all have one peice of advice in common the lines of communication need to be open. Marriage and Family classes will tell you the same thing. I hope he will sit and disscuss things with you but you need consider if you want to go through this everytime their is a major life issue at hand. *hugs*
 
AP I''m so sorry that the letter hasn''t gone as planned. I agree with what others have said, communication is very important and is not something that can be ignored. I think you need to do some soul searching about what you really want for yourself in life and in a life partner. And most importantly you need to spend the rest of your life with someone that makes you happy and makes you laugh, and that y''all bring out the best in each other. Best of luck. *hugs*
 
OH, I am so sorry!! My heart goes out to you! I am hoping that he just wanted to wait until this weekend to open it, but he really should have opened it last night.
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The most important thing is your health and your sanity! Do whatever you need to do.
*hugs* and encouragement
 
Thanks so much ladies!

I do feel that he is being a boy and was tired last night and didn''t want to read it. I don''t think he knows how much that hurts me though.

I feel that I am probably a little more frantic about this than the normal person since I have lost so many loved ones in my life that all I really want is some stability.

I know that communication is very important. We do talk about things. My friend who helped me with the letter reminds me that if I give him an out, he will take it. So, I guess that''s what he did. However, when we moved in together, he could have taken that out too by saying that I should renew my lease or something indicating that he didn''t want to be with me. But he didn''t.

I don''t know. I just wish I could talk to him now but he''s busy at work. I guess it''s better though because I think I would just blow up at him now...
 
If I were to put us in that same situation, I would say that my bf didn''t read the letter because he is so stressed out at work. He knew the letter was going to say things to make his mind wonder or worry or wander. He didn''t want to deal with that on his mind all day while at work. I think he will read that letter as soon as he''s home from work, however, what I would realize is that he chose himself (again) over me. It is more convenient for him to read the letter when it is appropriate for him than to read it because it was important to you. AND by leaving it in the house where you could see it was his way of letting you know not to call and bring it up today because obviously he hasn''t read it. But also, it sends out the wrong message - your letter is not important so I shuffled it in with the cable bill. Kinda like, whenever I get to it.... I don''t know, I hope I''m wrong here, but it sounds like there''s too big of a gap between his concepts of ''us'' and ''me.'' He''s too focused on how everything applies to him without consideration on how it affects you or how you might perceive things. I hope I''m off base here - just seems like a situation I''ve been through before
 
amanda,
I know this is a forum and there is no way we can know all the details of your relationship. I have been married 5 years, and know matter how tired my husband is he ALWAYS takes time to listen to me or would have read a letter I had poured my heart into. If my husband didn''t do that, he wouldn''t be my husband. I would not of married him. Making excuses for him only leaves you more hurt and confused. You are going to have to decide of this is the type of person you want to spend your life with and not leave it up to him to decide for you. I send "hugs" your way b/c I know how hard this must be on you..
 
Amanda, I don''t know whether to be sad or angry. I am sad for you because you poured your heart out to your boyfriend and he didn''t even read the letter. And I guess I am angry for the same reason--isn''t he even curious to see what you wrote?! I''ve been in your shoes and I wish I could tell you that there is an easy solution but there really isn''t. You''re not doing anything wrong, he just needs to communicate with you. I do believe that he loves you and wants to have a future with you but he needs to realize that as a woman, you need to HEAR it from him! In my silly romantic heart, I hope he is planning some kind of wonderful surprise for you. But in case he isn''t, you have to be prepared to accept whatever comes your way. When he finally does read the letter, your relationship is going to change either one way or the other. Stay strong, take care of yourself and always know that you can come here to vent. Good luck, keep us posted. Sending good thoughts your way...
 
Amanda,
I am so sorry that he didn''t read your letter. He should have taken it to work with him and taken time to read it. I don''t know what to say except that you need to really think about is this what you want in a relationship?? I don''t know that I could be with someone that wouldn''t let me share my feelings. Just my 0.2. Good luck and hugs!!!
 
I know what all of you are saying is correct. We do need to communicate more. But right now I am in a time of my life when I am not strong enough to think about us not being together. I also want to illustrate what a wonderful guy he is and how I know that he truly cares about me but is being his usual buttheaded self:

We started dating in December 2001. My mother passed away in January 2002. He came to the hospital the night before she died because he wanted to meet her. He felt extremely strong about that. He stayed with eventhough I was a complete emotional wreck. My father had passed away two years before my mom, so I was left with no one. So, any normal guy would walk away from someone like me. I certainly wouldn't have blamed him if he did. But he didn't. He stayed and has loved and protected me since.

He loves and cares about me. He truly does. But he has always thought about himself first and I have always let him. So, I have certainly enabled him to act this way so I can't expect him to change so quickly now. I know it sounds like an excuse, but I'm really only letting him off the hook halfway since I will insist that he read it tonight.

Also, to make matters worse, I am one, big PMS ball...
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Unfortunately, I am one of those woman who you can always tell is pmsing because I cry at the drop of a hat and freak out a little...
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Thank you again for all of your thoughts and encouragement!
 
Date: 7/22/2005 11:43:29 AM
Author: mrssalvo
amanda,
I know this is a forum and there is no way we can know all the details of your relationship. I have been married 5 years, and know matter how tired my husband is he ALWAYS takes time to listen to me or would have read a letter I had poured my heart into. If my husband didn''t do that, he wouldn''t be my husband. I would not of married him. Making excuses for him only leaves you more hurt and confused. You are going to have to decide of this is the type of person you want to spend your life with and not leave it up to him to decide for you. I send ''hugs'' your way b/c I know how hard this must be on you..

mrssalvo...I''m so glad you brought this up...amanda, mrssalvo has some important points here. I''m SO sorry that this is a crazy time in your relationship, and it does hurt!! I can appreciate that you need him in your life right now. Recognize then that he may be able to meet your emotional needs entirely and you need to determine if this is okay with you.

I''ve written such letters to my husband late at night when he''s asleep and I''ve put them in places where I know he''ll get them. When he wakes up in the morning, he''ll read it...granted that''s not the time to discuss it as he is leaving for work, but he''ll at least acknowledge my feelings and then assure me that we''ll talk about the issues that night. When he gets home, we do talk...If my husband couldn''t approach me about such issues, there''s no way I would''ve married him...I need that in a relationship and I won''t compromise over this issue.

We couldn''t possibly know everything about your relationship, so there''s obviously more there than just this issue alone, or you wouldn''t have put up with him for as long as you have...concentrate on the good things for now and hopefully he''ll read your letter and open up....

Best of luck!!
 
I don''t think he sounds like a horrible person or that he doesn''t love you...but this guy has some MAD ISSUES! As do you. Really it sounds to me like the two of you are functioning on two separate planes, and maybe with entirely different sets of expectations, certainly with two different sets of personalities. God only knows why men do what they do or why they think the way they think, men and women certainly are from different planets but it''s up to the individuals involved to want to make things work.

When I was 20 and typically 20-stupid, I had a boyfriend who was a horrible boyfriend but he was a good person. I say this because he was nice to everyone else and very helpful and this and that and that but as a boyfriend and someone I was in a relationship with, he sucked. He didn''t treat me right, didn''t put me first, didn''t care about me, didn''t respect me. At the time I knew but didn''t care, I was 20 and just having fun and he was definitely not long-term material anyway. When you were defending him as a good person, for whatever reason this old boyfriend popped into my mind.

Anyway, I don''t know how old you are or your background, but please do not stay with this man or vice versa because you are in a bad spot in your life or need something or someone there. Quite possibly he could make a wonderful friend but maybe he''s NOT the one for you as a husband? Just something to consider...it just sounds like from your last post that you are aware of some potential dealbreakers, but maybe choose to live with them because you can''t be alone. No one should feel like that. People are generally stronger than they think...but as long as they always have a crutch to lean on, they will never find out that strength for themselves.

Let me also advise you that things that bother you right now about your boyfriend, or serious problems in your relationship like not being able to discuss things, will not go away if you get engaged or married. In fact, it seems at times those only get worse and/or become larger because you ARE locked into it for life. So you really need to learn how to address issues and challenges in a positive way that works for you both or else if you do move forward at some point, nothing gets BETTER...many times the things that were not working out initially only get worse.

I''d suggest counseling for both of you if you really want to make this work. He needs to learn how to communicate in a structured way, not just when he feels like it (aka talking about rings) and to be more respectful of you and your feelings regarding the relationship, and you need to learn whether or not this man is someone you can live with for the rest of your life...and not as a crutch and if not be strong and move on and make your own way in the world.

My two cents. I always HATE giving relationship advice on here since it seems very presumptuous and what I have to say is normally not usual the ''rah rah everything will be okay'' that alot of people give, but I call them like I see them and figure if someone posts about their relationship trials on a public forum, especially in a place like the Hangout where everyone visits, then they get my full two cents and sometimes a dime.
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Date: 7/22/2005 10:56:00 AM
Author: IslandDreams
I''m so sorry that the letter writing plan to not go as you wanted. For him to not read the letter or even to take it to work is terrible. I don''t blame you one bit for being upset.

As I''ve been reading your comments I''ve been seeing a major red flag in your relationship. I know you love this man and he probably loves you too. But it is really worrisome that he doesn''t communicate with you. Even if you do manage to get through to him about your future via the letter or some other way, if you do get married you will face a life time of dealing with someone who internalizes and doesn''t talk. And the need to talk through things definitely doesn''t end with getting engaged or married--in fact doing those things only intensify the need to communicate. Research shows that the number one reason people divorce is communication--often communication over money issues, but it covers all sorts of things. If I were you, I''d really think long and hard if you can live with this personality trait the rest of your life.

That being said, since he recognizes is internalization of everything, is he will to go to counseling with you? Perhaps you both could learn how to communicate with each other more effectively and in the process maybe he would learn how to feel more comfortable expressing things to you. And maybe you learn to read his nonverbal cues etc.

I don''t mean to be a downer--I really hope that when he reads his letter he wakes up and at least talks to you and everything works out. Good luck and keep us posted!
I didn''t comment before now but I was thinking exactly the same thing. I also see a HUGE red flag. Keep in mind that the man you are living with today is on his BEST behavior. People don''t change, in fact as your relationship continues you may find that he becomes even more un-communicative. He didn''t even bother to read your letter when he knew it was important to you. I would have been extremely hurt too. You have to decide if you can live with that for the rest of your life. I hope he will be more willing to work things out with you in the future.
 
Date: 7/22/2005 12:31:18 PM
Author: Mara
I don''t think he sounds like a horrible person or that he doesn''t love you...but this guy has some MAD ISSUES! As do you. Really it sounds to me like the two of you are functioning on two separate planes, and maybe with entirely different sets of expectations, certainly with two different sets of personalities. God only knows why men do what they do or why they think the way they think, men and women certainly are from different planets but it''s up to the individuals involved to want to make things work.

When I was 20 and typically 20-stupid, I had a boyfriend who was a horrible boyfriend but he was a good person. I say this because he was nice to everyone else and very helpful and this and that and that but as a boyfriend and someone I was in a relationship with, he sucked. He didn''t treat me right, didn''t put me first, didn''t care about me, didn''t respect me. At the time I knew but didn''t care, I was 20 and just having fun and he was definitely not long-term material anyway. When you were defending him as a good person, for whatever reason this old boyfriend popped into my mind.

Anyway, I don''t know how old you are or your background, but please do not stay with this man or vice versa because you are in a bad spot in your life or need something or someone there. Quite possibly he could make a wonderful friend but maybe he''s NOT the one for you as a husband? Just something to consider...it just sounds like from your last post that you are aware of some potential dealbreakers, but maybe choose to live with them because you can''t be alone. No one should feel like that. People are generally stronger than they think...but as long as they always have a crutch to lean on, they will never find out that strength for themselves.

Let me also advise you that things that bother you right now about your boyfriend, or serious problems in your relationship like not being able to discuss things, will not go away if you get engaged or married. In fact, it seems at times those only get worse and/or become larger because you ARE locked into it for life. So you really need to learn how to address issues and challenges in a positive way that works for you both or else if you do move forward at some point, nothing gets BETTER...many times the things that were not working out initially only get worse.

I''d suggest counseling for both of you if you really want to make this work. He needs to learn how to communicate in a structured way, not just when he feels like it (aka talking about rings) and to be more respectful of you and your feelings regarding the relationship, and you need to learn whether or not this man is someone you can live with for the rest of your life...and not as a crutch and if not be strong and move on and make your own way in the world.

My two cents. I always HATE giving relationship advice on here since it seems very presumptuous and what I have to say is normally not usual the ''rah rah everything will be okay'' that alot of people give, but I call them like I see them and figure if someone posts about their relationship trials on a public forum, especially in a place like the Hangout where everyone visits, then they get my full two cents and sometimes a dime.
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Not presumptous at all. I wouldn''t have posted my problem if I only wanted rah-rah advice.

I know there are lots of things we have to work out. Basically, that''s what the letter is about. We have never been ''talkers.'' I am certainly guilty of that too. My bf definitely needs therapy. I have been in it for many years. Every time I see her, my therapist tells me that I need to talk to him but I''ve always resisted for one reason or another.

I spoke to a friend of mine who is a guy and is very honest with me always about this sort of stuff. He said that yes, I have a right to be upset but that my bf obviously has no idea how upset I am because he wouldn''t have done that to me if he knew. My friend advised me to take it slow since I have never discussed the future with my bf that it is unfair to load all of this on him suddenly and then expect him to instantly have an open dialogue with me.

I know that we have a lot of work to do. I am not staying with him because I need to be with someone. I staying with him because I need to be with him. One of my past relationships was with someone who tell me he loved me and pretend to treat me well, but then basically cheated on me with anything that walked, including my roommate.

I am also a lot calmer right now. I know that when he reads the letter it will change our relationship one way or the other. I just need to stop making up scenarios in my head about what could or could not happen.
 
Amanda, I think everyone has given you a few different things to mull over, a lot of my thoughts would''ve been similar. I know how much it takes out to write those letters. I wish he would''ve realized how important that was to you. Maybe it is a red flag, maybe it isnt, the dynamics of every relationship are different, and I only know what you share with us. I think the bottom line is when you sort all of this out, you need to look at what is best for you, we all want you to be happy
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Good luck with it all, feel free to vent any time.
 
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