Terror attacks in Brussels this morning :((

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="diamondseeker2006
I am not sure about the travel safety issues yet (maybe steering clear of major cities is okay, but you can't get there unless you fly into one), but I wholeheartedly agree with the rest: great sympathy for those who must live with this threat daily and that men of good will can be found in all countries, ethnic groups, and religions. I do not know how the world will manage to overcome radical Islamic terrorism, but I hope countries of the world will unite to deal with it more effectively.[/quote]


How??...When our Prez does not acknowledge the fact that there are such group as "radical Islamic terrorism"...

 

[marcy]

I watched it on the news today. It is so sad and awful.

 

[AGBF]

I'll bet Trump is grinning this morning.

What an awful thing to say and as much as I dislike Trump, I seriously doubt he's grinning about the latest terrorist attack...

Yes it's awful!
I agree completely.

It's awful that, IMO, Trump will use this tragedy to fan fear and hatred to gain the ultimate power-job.
Just watch.

Trump won't do anything that any other politician wouldn't do - they could all "capitalize" on the tragedy in some way, shape, or form.

George W. Bush did something no other president would have thought of doing. He invaded IRAQ...a country which had ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with the terror attacks of 9/11 on the United States...right after 9/11. (In case anyone was asleep for those attacks the countries we might have correctly held culpable were Afghanistan, where Osama bin Laden was then based with the Taliban and al Qaeda, and Saudi Arabia where all the al Qaeda pilots who flew the terror missions hailed from.)

It was the complete destabilization of Iraq that led to the power vacuum in Iraq and Syria that enabled ISIS to emerge. I do not know anyone who disputes that. Had Saddam Hussein remained in power-horrible tyrant that he was-there would have been no ISIS and no mass exodus of refugees from Syria to Europe wreaking havoc in Europe.

So can one ignorant man, one president who is totally uninformed on foreign policy but charged up on his own ego change the face of the earth? Yes. George W. Bush did. So why couldn't Donald Trump? Why couldn't he be terrible trouble. Worse than any other president? The worst thing to happen to the world since...uh...George W Bush?

Deb/AGBF

 

[missy]

Yes Deb, I agree with you and it is a sobering and very scary thought. Sometimes life issues feel overwhelming and this is just one of those crises that absolutely is overwhelming in every way. I hope and yes pray that our country chooses the best leader possible to help us out of this horrible mess. If there is even a way out which right now seems pretty bleak.
Continuing to keep the families and loved ones of the people killed and hurt as well as all of the Belgium people in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[MarionC]

Deeply affected here by these events, and distraught that it turns every news source into a tabloid.

My belief is that no matter who the president is, no matter what anti-terrorist plans are put in place, finding terrorists is looking for a needle in a haystack. I am sorry to be so negative, but what can stop a few invisible [until after the act] people from wrecking havoc? Thousands of people working to find a handful of people! Look where it has gotten us so far.

When I flew back into the states in December to LaGuardia it was a scene of chaos at the security checkpoint. Airport employees pushing & rushing through the line of passengers, quickly flashing a badge at the single ID checker who was also trying to herd us...only one security kiosk functioning and passengers breaking out of the line to go into the security area to find trays for putting things on the conveyer through x-ray. So the gov't can talk all it wants. This is the reality on the ground.
Soldiers with guns and dogs at the airports. It's a sham. They are never going to see it coming.


Tell me something positive. Please.

 

[momhappy]

I'll bet Trump is grinning this morning.

What an awful thing to say and as much as I dislike Trump, I seriously doubt he's grinning about the latest terrorist attack...

Yes it's awful!
I agree completely.

It's awful that, IMO, Trump will use this tragedy to fan fear and hatred to gain the ultimate power-job.
Just watch.

Trump won't do anything that any other politician wouldn't do - they could all "capitalize" on the tragedy in some way, shape, or form.

George W. Bush did something no other president would have thought of doing. He invaded IRAQ...a country which had ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with the terror attacks of 9/11 on the United States...right after 9/11. (In case anyone was asleep for those attacks the countries we might have correctly held culpable were Afghanistan, where Osama bin Laden was then based with the Taliban and al Qaeda, and Saudi Arabia where all the al Qaeda pilots who flew the terror missions hailed from.)

It was the complete destabilization of Iraq that led to the power vacuum in Iraq and Syria that enabled ISIS to emerge. I do not know anyone who disputes that. Had Saddam Hussein remained in power-horrible tyrant that he was-there would have been no ISIS and no mass exodus of refugees from Syria to Europe wreaking havoc in Europe.

So can one ignorant man, one president who is totally uninformed on foreign policy but charged up on his own ego change the face of the earth? Yes. George W. Bush did. So why couldn't Donald Trump? Why couldn't he be terrible trouble. Worse than any other president? The worst thing to happen to the world since...uh...George W Bush?

Deb/AGBF

I agree with you and many people can agree (in hindsight) that we should have left Iraq/Sadam alone (as well as Bin Laden). Having said that, it would have been difficult to predict the outcome of those actions and hopefully, we've learned our lessons in that regard (in our current dealings with leaders like Assad, etc.).
My point was not to say that a single individual and/or presidency can't cause harm, but to single out Trump (which is what I was specifically responding to), is not fair. I think many of the presidential candidates are particularly frightening in terms of our security/safety because there is potential harm from politicians who might do too little as well as those who might do too much...

 

[ame]

I woke up to that news and immediately thought of Paul Slegers and his team and everyone in the Bourse.

<Snip>

Thank you Ame and others who have asked.

Paul and his family are safe at this time.

My heart is heavy as I work today. But I, like millions of others, continue to live my life as it should be lived. If nothing else because we wish to show the terrorists that they can kill and maim, but they can not win by doing so.

Wink

I appreciate you letting us know. Sorry I am late to reply.

It is sickening to see these events keep occurring, Paris, Turkey, Belgium...over and over. What is next?!

 

[MarionC]

What if the word "terrorist" were changed to "unfortunate soul" and the events were reported, then dropped except for dry details of developments?

The media hands the unfortunate souls everything they want on a silver plate: a frenzy of fear - - - 34/7 front-page news, with every little detail & graphic images of the victims. The media gives the preps power while spreading the fear. Horrible.

 

[Bonfire]

Calling this mere terrorism is incomplete. This is a war against the West and Islamic State has made it a global jihad.
What is America's strategy on Islamic State? That's the problem, we don't know. This administration doesn't have one!

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="AGBF|

It was the complete destabilization of Iraq that led to the power vacuum in Iraq and Syria that enabled ISIS to emerge. I do not know anyone who disputes that. Had Saddam Hussein remained in power-horrible tyrant that he was-there would have been no ISIS and no mass exodus of refugees from Syria to Europe wreaking havoc in Europe.


Deb/AGBF
[/quote]


Agree 101% that Bush made the wrong move by taking out Hussein. However, Prez Obama still refuses to call a spade a spade ..."radical Islamic terrorism". Why is Prez Obama so afraid to use these words?...

 

[Bonfire]

Obama has had 7 years to step up and show leadership. Bush bashing is getting old. It's long past time to stop blaming and start leading.

 

[AGBF]

Calling this mere terrorism is incomplete. This is a war against the West and Islamic State has made it a global jihad.
What is America's strategy on Islamic State? That's the problem, we don't know. This administration doesn't have one!

This is a fine topic. I just hope that you were not directing it at me. It is irrelevant to my point about Trump. The issue I was addressing was whether one man could make a difference or whether all politicians were equal. I was pointing out that one man who made a horrible decision (Bush) could change the fate of the world.

Furthermore, I think that Donald Trump, being a businessman and not someone who has ever served in the House or Senate and had any experience with foreign relations, is more likely to be ignorant about foreign policy (like George W. Bush). Bush, after all, was only a governor from Texas (after being a drunk). But there have been smart governors...he just happened to be a dim one.

If you want President Obama to sharpen his policy about ISIS, why not say what you would like him to do. I take it you know that he has already attacked ISIS strongholds in Syria militarily. So say what more, specifically, you would like him to do. Don't just complain generally.

 

[msop04]

This is so incredibly sad. There is a couple from East TN (my home) who are missing. I pray for the families and all involved, both here and abroad.

 

[AGBF]

Obama has had 7 years to step up and show leadership. Bush bashing is getting old. It's long past time to stop blaming and start leading.

You posted this while I was typing. As I wrote, President Obama attacked ISIS bases. What else is on your agenda?

Also: all discussion of policy is not "bashing". Discussion, even if not complimentary, is called "analysis". And it gets even older when done by the historians of the future...as it will be. People are not going to stop discussing President Bush because you have decided the discussion has gotten "old". His decision to invade Iraq will be discussed for decades, if not centuries.

AGBF

 

[AGBF]

This is so incredibly sad. There is a couple from East TN (my home) who are missing. I pray for the families and all involved, both here and abroad.

It is. My 95 year-old father has been bent over the newspaper for hours, reading and re-reading the story. Sad world events have always disturbed him, but this story, at his age, seems to have devastated him. He can't seem to get over it.

 

[Bonfire]

Whoa! Why would you feel this is personally directed at you? I am responding relevantly to this thread.
"Terror attacks in Brussels this morning ". What nerve did I hit with you? A few bombings by Obama in the past does not make a policy. Why the accusatory tone for me to state my policy? Sheesh, I have a right to my opinion even if it differs from yours Deb. Friendly conversation is my intention. Peace out.

 

[momhappy]

Obama has had 7 years to step up and show leadership. Bush bashing is getting old. It's long past time to stop blaming and start leading.

You posted this while I was typing. As I wrote, President Obama attacked ISIS bases. What else is on your agenda?

Also: all discussion of policy is not "bashing". Discussion, even if not complimentary, is called "analysis". And it gets even older when done by the historians of the future...as it will be. People are not going to stop discussing President Bush because you have decided the discussion has gotten "old". His decision to invade Iraq will be discussed for decades, if not centuries.

AGBF

It's not our job (as the general public) to have an agenda. That's why we elect and/or pay folks to make educated decisions about those types of issues.
I agree with Bonfire - it's time to look forward, not backwards. It'a all very easy to sit back and complain about how Bush handled things poorly, but what does it gain us at this point? I would hope that we learned from those experiences. I have not been impressed with the Obama administration and how they've handled our National security. As I said before, we can criticize those who do too much (like Trump for example), but there is a also a danger/risk in those who do too little (like Obama).

 

[msop04]

They are hurt, but ALIVE! [emoji1316]
http://www.local8now.com/content/news/Family-of-missing-Gatlinburg-man-in-Brussels-says-theres-still-no-update-373228981.html

 

[MissGotRocks]

Obama has had 7 years to step up and show leadership. Bush bashing is getting old. It's long past time to stop blaming and start leading.

You posted this while I was typing. As I wrote, President Obama attacked ISIS bases. What else is on your agenda?

Also: all discussion of policy is not "bashing". Discussion, even if not complimentary, is called "analysis". And it gets even older when done by the historians of the future...as it will be. People are not going to stop discussing President Bush because you have decided the discussion has gotten "old". His decision to invade Iraq will be discussed for decades, if not centuries.

AGBF

+101%. This was a mistake that will reverberate for many years to come. The solution to the problem is not as easy as making a policy to address it. I would wager that almost anyone in the office of the President today would be hard pressed to come up with a reasonable, effective solution - regardless of what they might think. Americans don't want another war with boots on the ground and I'm not sure that would be the most prudent step at this point anyway. The terrorists are willing to give their lives; some even welcome death for their perceived notions of rewards and that very fact makes it a very difficult thing to fight. We're learning today that Belgium was warned, aware of these particular terrorists, ISIS had threatened more to come and still it happened - all with security at high alert. It is an enemy unlike any other. I'm guessing that it will eventually take a world wide effort to eradicate and that possibility is extremely frightening as well.

 

[AGBF]

They are hurt, but ALIVE! [emoji1316]
http://www.local8now.com/content/news/Family-of-missing-Gatlinburg-man-in-Brussels-says-theres-still-no-update-373228981.html

I am so glad. With terrible tragedies like this, each miracle is even more wonderful. Hearing good news after so much bad is like finding that one earthquake victim alive when we had all ceased to hope. Thank you for posting this, msop.

Deb

 

[Maria D]

It's not our job (as the general public) to have an agenda. That's why we elect and/or pay folks to make educated decisions about those types of issues.
I agree with Bonfire - it's time to look forward, not backwards. It'a all very easy to sit back and complain about how Bush handled things poorly, but what does it gain us at this point? I would hope that we learned from those experiences. I have not been impressed with the Obama administration and how they've handled our National security. As I said before, we can criticize those who do too much (like Trump for example), but there is a also a danger/risk in those who do too little (like Obama).

You answer your own question. What does it gain at this point? Sober reflection so that we can learn from those experiences!

 

[momhappy]

^and I agree! I would hope that we can learn from those experiences....but to simply point fingers at Bush for his wrongdoings is not productive IMO. Hussein/Bin Laden (to name a few) were evil guys and I would like to think that the world is a better place without them, but unfortunately, there has been significant consequences to those actions, so there are no easy answers in these types of scenarios.

 

[ksinger]

It's not our job (as the general public) to have an agenda. That's why we elect and/or pay folks to make educated decisions about those types of issues.
I agree with Bonfire - it's time to look forward, not backwards. It'a all very easy to sit back and complain about how Bush handled things poorly, but what does it gain us at this point? I would hope that we learned from those experiences. I have not been impressed with the Obama administration and how they've handled our National security. As I said before, we can criticize those who do too much (like Trump for example), but there is a also a danger/risk in those who do too little (like Obama).

You answer your own question. What does it gain at this point? Sober reflection so that we can learn from those experiences!

And to which I would add, the lessons we could have learned, SHOULD have learned, came before Iraq and not after. In that regard, I am despairing of our collective ability to learn the lessons of history. The intel and experience to know better than to start that war, was there, but was ignored in order to indulge the desired ideology of the people in charge. Extrapolating the outcome was not hard at all, if you were paying the least bit of attention. And we were failed by a few people who could have perhaps changed the course of things, people like Colin Powell. His caving to groupthink and a distorted vision of loyalty, is still one of the most depressing pieces of that whole picture. I thought better of him, thought he'd be stronger.

The war in Iraq was a forgone conclusion just looking for a convenient excuse, and the American people were blind with anger and mostly willing to be duped by a very very flimsy rational for war. This fact has been well-documented and is pretty impossible to refute.

Looking forward and thinking you're going to make better, more informed choices, only works if you understand where you've been, and I still don't meet many people who have bothered to rectify their willful ignorance of the situation at the time.

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="ksinger|

And to which I would add, the lessons we could have learned, SHOULD have learned, came before Iraq and not after. In that regard, I am despairing of our collective ability to learn the lessons of history. The intel and experience to know better than to start that war, was there, but was ignored in order to indulge the desired ideology of the people in charge. Extrapolating the outcome was not hard at all, if you were paying the least bit of attention. And we were failed by a few people who could have perhaps changed the course of things, people like Colin Powell. His caving to groupthink and a distorted vision of loyalty, is still one of the most depressing pieces of that whole picture. I thought better of him, thought he'd be stronger.

[/quote]


No different than Prez. Obama...His way of thinking is that if we be nice to those radical Islamic terrorist groups they'll be nice to us, really?..

 

[ksinger]

[quote="ksinger|

And to which I would add, the lessons we could have learned, SHOULD have learned, came before Iraq and not after. In that regard, I am despairing of our collective ability to learn the lessons of history. The intel and experience to know better than to start that war, was there, but was ignored in order to indulge the desired ideology of the people in charge. Extrapolating the outcome was not hard at all, if you were paying the least bit of attention. And we were failed by a few people who could have perhaps changed the course of things, people like Colin Powell. His caving to groupthink and a distorted vision of loyalty, is still one of the most depressing pieces of that whole picture. I thought better of him, thought he'd be stronger.

No different than Prez. Obama...His way of thinking is that if we be nice to those radical Islamic terrorist groups they'll be nice to us, really?.. [/quote]

As usual DF, your analysis of a political situation has all the depth and nuance of a bumper sticker.