Tourmaline aficionados lend me your eyes !!

[NoOrganic4Me]

Good Morning

I have this 9 carat Emerald Cut Bi Color Neon Violet Blue Tourmaline... This was originally aquired in Minas Gerais Brasil.
I am not sure if this is the paraiba before heat treated to make windex blue,,,, or is this just violet paraiba,,, or neon blue indicolite..
I am so confused and I cannot find info online about any other color but windex blue or gray blue or green blue. Can anyone help me to possibly identify the type of tourmaline this may be or point me in the right direction where I can do more research on it.
Thank you

 

[Lady_Disdain]

Are you sure it is tourmaline?

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

I purchased in a lot with tourmaline mineral specimens and one very light blue paraiba cabochon and I was told it was tourmaline , but never had it officially tested.....

Do you think it may be Quartz ?

 

[chrono]

I take it there is no paperwork? No proof that it is copper bearing and no proof of its origin other than what is on your receipt? It looks very saturated but could be just a "regular" but pretty bi-coloured tourmaline. It is too purple to be considered indicolite. Not knowing who you purchased it from, I hope you won't be offended by my questions.
1. Is it tourmaline? Is it a natural stone or synthetic or simulant?
2. Has it been tested for copper content?
3. Does it have an independent 3rd party proof of origin?
4. Does it glow?

ETA
In that case, the first thing I'd do is have a gemmologist run an RI on it to determine if it is a tourmaline or something else. I doubt it is a copper bearing Paraiba tourmaline.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Good Advice... I will do that, Thank you..
I wish I did not live in a small town.... if this were Manhattan... I could hop a subway to the GIA and grab a pretzel on the way.

Thanks everyone.. I will get it evalauated

 

[Lady_Disdain]

I purchased in a lot with tourmaline mineral specimens and one very light blue paraiba cabochon and I was told it was tourmaline , but never had it officially tested.....

Do you think it may be Quartz ?

Identifying a stone from a picture is madness, etc, etc, etc. But, yes, it does remind me of bicolour quartz. Sending it to a lab would be a good idea but, at the very least, take it to a good GG.

 

[chrono]

Like these? They are quartz, not tourmaline.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Yes, that looks like it alright..... why did it seem prettier when I thought it was a tourmaline....
Those pictures you have posted look like my stone got arrested and those are its Mug shots, not very attractive......
Quartz it is....
No wonder I could not find any info on as a bi-color tourmaline.. that because it is a quartz.
Thanks again

 

[Fly Girl]

Perhaps calling your stone a combination of Rock Crystal and Amethyst, instead of quartz, sounds better.

Anyhow, I love those bi-color stones. Enjoy your new pretty!

 

[LD]

I purchased in a lot with tourmaline mineral specimens and one very light blue paraiba cabochon and I was told it was tourmaline , but never had it officially tested.....

Do you think it may be Quartz ?

Identifying a stone from a picture is madness, etc, etc, etc. But, yes, it does remind me of bicolour quartz. Sending it to a lab would be a good idea but, at the very least, take it to a good GG.

I'd bet good money on that as well.

In all honesty, this is NOT a paraiba tourmaline irrespective of the fact that it came from Minas Gerais and MAY be a Tourmaline. It doesn't possess the qualities of a Paraiba I'm afraid.

One other thing and I think it's already been alluded to, is that this could well be synthetic. Interestingly, it can be the case that the closer to the mine you buy, the more likely you are to get synthetics!

There are plenty of bi-colour tourmalines in the market but they are not expensive and are most definitely not classed as Paraiba. Sorry.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Aww Thanks, yes I love bi-color stones too.
You know some of the shopping networks are selling " Quartz Doublets" who ever heard of such a thing.. maybe one day this baby will be worth alot of money since it is 100% Quartz.... NO doublet here !

 

[T L]

There is also synthetic bicolor quartz, so be careful.

 

[airplay355]

It's too late now Just enjoy it for what it is.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

TL,
When I read your post last night I just had to laugh out loud... it was hillarious !
I wanted to you to know: Thou shall not covet thy neighbor's Synthetic Bi-Color Quartz Doublet. (The 11th commandment)

 

[T L]

TL,
When I read your post last night I just had to laugh out loud... it was hillarious !
I wanted to you to know: Thou shall not covet thy neighbor's Synthetic Bi-Color Quartz Doublet. (The 11th commandment)

There is lots of bicolor synthetic quartz out there. I'm not making this up.

Here's an example.

http://www.tradekey.com/product-free/Bicolor-Quartz-Gemstone-For-Jewelry-1540819.html

You are asking us to ID a stone from a photo, which is impossible, so people are just trying to help by putting everything out there so you, and other consumers, can beware of it.

 

[chrono]

Am I missing something here? The caution with regards to synthetic bi-colour quartz was not meant to be a joke as such a thing exists.
http://www.gemselect.com/other-info/synthetic-quartz.php

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Wow.. I seriously did not think that synthetics reached the world of Quartz... It is amazing to me.. I guess anyone who likes to collect gemstones needs a refractometer or you will never know what you have. Another post mentioned that even if you buy close to the mines, they are selling synthetics there also.. and I saw a news special on that exact topic.. warning even at the mines, the locals are getting their hands on synthetics and selling them along side the geniune stone as a lot ... It's scary out there !!!

 

[chrono]

Some synthetics are so close to the real thing that the RI reading is virtually identical and hence, the refractometer isn't of much use except to weed out simulants.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

You hear so much about the high demand from the Asian markets and European markets for gemstones , that vendors prefer to sell there because they will pay premium.. so the days of getting the so called "deal" is over.. if you don't pay retail, accompanied with an appraisal, you don't know what you are walking away with in your gem box, or you go to as many estate sales as you can.

 

[T L]

You hear so much about the high demand from the Asian markets and European markets for gemstones , that vendors prefer to sell there because they will pay premium.. so the days of getting the so called "deal" is over.. if you don't pay retail, accompanied with an appraisal, you don't know what you are walking away with in your gem box, or you go to as many estate sales as you can.

Appraisals are not always appropriately written, and some gemologists do not have the advanced equipment available to determine all treatments and synthetics. All appaisals on valuable stones, IMHO, should be accompanied by a reputable lab report like AGL, GIA, or some of the prestigious European labs like SSEF and GRS, in order to truly determine the value of a gem. These particular labs, and not all labs, are equipped to determine the "difficult to detect" treatments or synthetics out there.

 

[chrono]

I wish it were as easy as you wrote. Appraisals can be useful but not always. Firstly, appraisals are almost always accompanied by a lab report and mostly only for insurance purposes. The reason being is that many gemmologist are well versed in diamonds but not as familiar with coloured gemstones, not having the necessary equipment to test for certain treatments. Not all labs are created equally as well. Certain labs have better equipment and more experienced gemmologists on staff. With estate sales, one has to know what he or she is doing as well. Synthetic stones were very popular in the past, stone could have been swapped out at some point, and there's no knowing what treatment it could have undergone.

 

[LD]

You hear so much about the high demand from the Asian markets and European markets for gemstones , that vendors prefer to sell there because they will pay premium.. so the days of getting the so called "deal" is over.. if you don't pay retail, accompanied with an appraisal, you don't know what you are walking away with in your gem box, or you go to as many estate sales as you can.

Actually what you've described is the perfect way to get ripped off.

Paying retail is foolish. As TL has said (and she's one of our most learned collectors) an appraisal may not be worth the paper it's written on. I have all the equipment to test gems and to make a fairly reasonable guess at a stone and I also have a degree so does that mean I should write appraisals? If I'm affiliated with a certain outlet, will my appraisal REALLY be objective? That's basically what you get from a large proportion of appraisals.

Appraisers need to be highly knowledgeable about a huge range of coloured gemstones, have seen a good proportion of the gem they're assessing (otherwise it's very much learned from books/photos) what makes them valuable or de-values them, market rates and a host of other variables. For example, I could probably give a reasonably good idea of the value of an Alexandrite or Paraiba Tourmaline but there are other gemstones that I haven't handled/bought for a number of years and so wouldn't attempt to do this.

ETA: I see TL and Chrono have both replied and we've all cross-posted so you're basically getting the same thoughts, written differently, in 3 ways!

By the way, another giveaway with your stone is the lack of inclusions. Typically bi-colour tourmalines are included (not always) but yours looks suspiciously clean.

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Good to know...

Thank you everyone... by the way, I am going to take this stone to a local jewler to have a look... If anyone is interested , I will post here and let you know what they say.. all of your posts have me really curious now to unveil its true origin... it is like meeting a blind date for the first time... so if interested I will post the results.

Thanks everyone !

PS sometimes I wish the guidence counselors in high school or career day mentions the jewelry business..... or offer a class on it in highschool, not just college because highschool is where you form a love for certain sciences...... I think alot more people would seriously consider it as a career choice. it is such an interesting field.. a bit of glamour, a bit of science.. The perfect storm as they say !

Thanks again everyone !

 

[chrono]

I am interested in the outcome of the meeting. Do let the jeweller know ahead of time so you don't waste the trip out there. Not all jewellers are well versed with coloured stones nor have the right equipment to ID them. I've read too many stories where they thought a chrysoberyl is a peridot, a spinel was a ruby, and more similar such experiences.

 

[minousbijoux]

I love when gems do that - kinda like the printer ink cartridge running out

 

[NoOrganic4Me]

Took it to a local Jewler today, He said he could check it for me... he went into his back room then came back out and said that according to his calculations it is in fact a tourmaline not a Quartz. Then I asked asked him if he is sure because maybe it could be an amethyst. He said no it is a bi-color tourmaline. Clear and Purple with Blue/Deep Hot Pink tones.
He said he could not tell me specifics , but he could mail it into a lab out of state for analysis and he will review the findings with me when they came back.
All I kept thinking about was that lady who posted that she sent her gemstone to Thailand or China and they still haven't recieved it. It would break my heart if that happened to this Gemstone. I said no thanks just knowing its tourmaline is enough.
He told me that the clear part of the crystal is clear with some inclusions , but if you hold it in certain angles it has a cats eye to it and then under other angles it is clear again,,,, he found facsinating.

I took some new pictures tonight just in case the others were not showing it off properly.

Thanks to everyone who helped, I really learned alot and I respect all of your opinions greatly, Cheers to everyone !

 

[minousbijoux]

I'm happy to hear that its the outcome you wanted. That said, I would want to make sure that the jeweler knew what he was doing and I would want to know what tests he conducted. It is a pretty cool and uncommon tourmaline.

 

[chrono]

What so you mean by him not telling you any specifics? I'm surprised he went to the back room to test your stone without you being present. Also, do you know what tests did he run?

 

[michellechan2211]

Yes, I'm with the "what tests did your jeweler do" people here. But congrats! If it really is a tourmaline, its an unusual one

 

[rodrigofromparaiba]

hi,i from paraiba in Brazil,paraiba is estate, really it not a tourmaline ,is a Amethyst,Minas gerais dont have tourmaline,thy