Tucson 2013: A Consumer Perspective

[Justin_Cutter]

Hey Friends,

So this past Sunday my Wife and I decided to go to the Tucson Gem Show in the Tucson Convention Center. This particular show is open to the public for purchase and exhibition. We went to the show on a mission to find a 3-5ct Pink Sapphire. Because of this time was limited so I was not able to stop and take as many pictures as I would have liked; however I manged to take a few that I think the community will appreciate.
There was several other shows going on around Tucson, but many require you to be a dealer to enter and purchase goods. In a effort to maximize our time in Tucson I picked the largest show that was open to the public and took my chances.

The overall experience was great fun for a Gem lover. From beautiful mineral specimens, to exquisite turquoise necklaces, the Tucson Gem Show has something for everyone! I highly recommend that if you ever have a chance to attend take advantage of the opportunity! There is even some fun educational activities for children!

I was able to hold and loupe many extraordinary gemstones. The king of which was a 4.95ct Muzo Emerald that was perfectly clean to the eye with top color! The only treatment was light oiling. I politely asked the dealer if I could see the Muzo Emerald. He looked at me a said with a smile..."you have a good eye" The emerald was not visibly marked Muzo, but the color was a dead giveaway. Breathtaking is the only way I can describe this stone. That perfect bluish green color just danced in my eyes. A larger Muzo Emerald has long been one of my person dream stones to own, so to have one in my hand was a incredible experience. This particular Emerald was priced at $96,000 but offered to me at $40,000!!! Perhaps one of the better deals I will ever see in my lifetime but alas I was not in a position to make a purchase of that size.
Now my fellow emerald lovers are probably thinking ok ok show us a picture of this beauty!!! Sadly I have failed you. I was so excited to see and touch the emerald that I totally spaced and forgot to take a picture. But fret not I do have some emerald eye candy for you below!

As I went from dealer to dealer I made a point to ask pricing on a few different types of Gems that I personally love. I wanted to get a feel for where the pricing is headed in 2013. I am happy to share my findings with the community. I gave the most attention to Mahenge Spinel since that market seems to be changing quickly.

Mahenge Spinel
$1250-$1500 per carat in the 1-3 carat range. This is 25%-50% increase from 2012.
In the 3-5 carat range prices were consistently $1500-2000 per carat. 5+ carat prices were all over the place but expect to see $3000-$5000 per carat at retail.

Blue Sapphires (Heated)
Up 20% from 2012

Pink Sapphires (Heated)
Up 20% from 2012

Padparadscha Sapphire (Heated)
Very consistent with what I saw in 2012 surprisingly!

Ruby (Unheated)
Up 15%-20% from 2012

Colombian Emerald
Very consistent with what I saw in 2012.


Now before anyone starts freaking out please remember theses are Retail prices which most of the dealers at this particular gem show seemed to be. I only found 1 or 2 gem dealers at this show that sold closer to wholesale pricing.
Most of the vendors that we recommend here on PriceScope do not sell at full retail pricing... Something I greatly appreciate!

Something else I noticed from overhearing other deals and from my own negotiating. It seems that most dealers at the show are willing to negotiate price a little. Now I went on Sunday which was the last day of the show so perhaps that had a influence on the flexibility of pricing.

A word of warning to potential attendees of this show. If you go with the intention of purchasing a gem I would definitely recommend reviewing what the current market pricing is on the particular gem you are looking for. Most of the dealers were pretty consistent with pricing but there were a couple dealers who's pricing was way to high! Here is a example.

I was offered a 5ct Pink Sapphire that was heated with a unknown origin for $35,000. $7000 per carat for a fancy heated sapphire!?!?! No thank you! That dealer was also very rude.

Looking back I wish I could have spent 2 or 3 days in Tucson checking out the other shows but for a 1 day trip this what a great experience. I did end up finding what I was looking for and I will be starting a separate thread soon.

Enjoy the pictures!
~Justin

 

[royalstarrynight]

Thanks for this post! Gorgeous pictures too! Anymore to share?

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Thanks for this post! Gorgeous pictures too! Anymore to share?

Sadly no I was very disappointed when I realized just how few pictures I had taken. I was so busy running from dealer to dealer looking for a sapphire that I simply forgot to keep taking pictures.

~Justin

 

[royalstarrynight]

Another sapphire?? How exciting!
You chose such an amazing ering for your fiance! It'll be hard to top!

 

[Rosebloom]

Great review - thanks!

 

[slksapphire]

justin,

very informative ... 2 questions for you: what is the mkt for UNHEATED sapphires doing AND, most importantly, did you find a pink sapphire?

you know what's coming next ... show us the pix!

 

[minousbijoux]

I was able to hold and loupe many extraordinary gemstones. The king of which was a 4.95ct Muzo Emerald that was perfectly clean to the eye with top color! The only treatment was light oiling. I politely asked the dealer if I could see the Muzo Emerald. He looked at me a said with a smile..."you have a good eye" The emerald was not visibly marked Muzo, but the color was a dead giveaway. Breathtaking is the only way I can describe this stone. That perfect bluish green color just danced in my eyes. A larger Muzo Emerald has long been one of my person dream stones to own, so to have one in my hand was a incredible experience. This particular Emerald was priced at $96,000 but offered to me at $40,000!!! Perhaps one of the better deals I will ever see in my lifetime but alas I was not in a position to make a purchase of that size.

As I went from dealer to dealer I made a point to ask pricing on a few different types of Gems that I personally love. I wanted to get a feel for where the pricing is headed in 2013. I am happy to share my findings with the community. I gave the most attention to Mahenge Spinel since that market seems to be changing quickly.

Now before anyone starts freaking out please remember theses are Retail prices which most of the dealers at this particular gem show seemed to be. I only found 1 or 2 gem dealers at this show that sold closer to wholesale pricing.
Most of the vendors that we recommend here on PriceScope do not sell at full retail pricing... Something I greatly appreciate!

Something else I noticed from overhearing other deals and from my own negotiating. It seems that most dealers at the show are willing to negotiate price a little. Now I went on Sunday which was the last day of the show so perhaps that had a influence on the flexibility of pricing.

A word of warning to potential attendees of this show. If you go with the intention of purchasing a gem I would definitely recommend reviewing what the current market pricing is on the particular gem you are looking for. Most of the dealers were pretty consistent with pricing but there were a couple dealers who's pricing was way to high!

Thanks for the debrief. A couple of things. First, I am not surprised that the dealer complemented your "good eye," as lol, that is a classic sales technique that I hear often at gem shows; I have yet to hear a seller tell someone they had a "bad eye."

Second, I've seen that same phenomenon of all over the place prices at other shows. The only thing I can say is that to some extent what I've seen is a correlation between quality and price (duh!) in that the places with the highest prices typically have the highest quality stones. Did you see that, or were the prices completely arbitrarily priced by the dealers? I have never understood how in a room with each other, their prices can vary so greatly. I know that it depends on how much they in turn have paid, but I still think its odd, as the typical informed consumer like you will go from dealer to dealer and comparison shop. My problem is that I sometimes fall in love with one particular stone from one particular dealer and then I'm in trouble losing my objectivity...

 

[Justin_Cutter]

royalstarrynight, Thank you! The pink sapphire I bought is actually for a family member of mine. She in a area that has limited selection so she asked me if I would help put a pink sapphire ring together for her. I will probably take care of setting the stone for her as well. She is like a 2nd Mother to me so I am happy to take care of this for her.

slksapphire, Excellent question. I guess I should have added something in my review about Unheated Sapphires. The issue is that Unheated Sapphire pricing isn't as consistent as Heated Sapphires. Origin aside when we are talking about top quality Blue Unheated Sapphires (Medium-Medium Dark Tone and Vivid Saturation- much like your sapphire) I am seeing a 50%-100% increase in price depending on the stone and dealer. It use to be that most dealers would look at you funny if you asked for a unheated sapphire, but lately it seems dealers are much more aware of the desire for unheated sapphires. Unheated Sapphires are rarer than ever and dealers seem to know it. In regards to Fancy Colored Sapphires- being unheated seems to be good for a 25%-50% increase in price. This seems to hold true for Sapphires up to 5 carats. 5 carats seems to be the threshold for dealers to start exponentially increasing the price. Of course I can't really blame them. 5+ carat blue unheated sapphires are soooo rare. Very much a needle in the haystack situation.
No worries I will start a new thread for the 3.95ct Unheated Pink Sapphire I just bought!

minousbijoux, Thanks for stopping by! I totally know what you mean. I think in this case the dealer was just happy to not have to explain why the Muzo Emerald is special. Not like it is hard to separate a Muzo from other emeralds....95% of the time the color is a dead give away. I guess that is one of the things I love about emeralds. Based on color and glow someone with minimal experience can make a good educated guess on origin.

You are absolutely correct. I wish I could edit what I wrote about mahenge spinels. For those prices that I posted a buyer should expect TOP color, good cutting, and eye clean if not 10x loupe clean stones. If any of these requirements are not met the dealer should not be asking those prices. I saw some of the most amazing Mahenge Spinels on Sunday! The quality was absolutely incredible! The only dealer that really had great quality and reasonable pricing was the one I bought the pink sapphire from.

I know what you mean I actually found the pink sapphire I bought about 1 hour into my search. It was hard for me to walk away to look at other dealers. I knew when I saw it that it was the "one" but I had to be sure there wasn't something better for the money. Thankfully it was still there when I came back 2 hours later! The only other pink sapphire that could compare with the one I bought was the 5ct pink sapphire I mentioned. The outrageous price on that stone made it a easy pass thankfully. Had the price been remotely realistic then I would have had a hard decision to make.

~Justin

 

[minousbijoux]

I look forward to seeing your sapphire.

As to prices, have any theories to pricing? Do the highly priced vendors think that the public won't shop around (I've actually been guilty of this early on in collecting - and even now if I'm smitten too fast ), or do they think the lower priced ones will sell first, but if they sit tight and wait, someone will eventually buy from them, or, do they expect that you will devote hours to patiently bargaining and knocking them down in price? I am really curious about this.

 

[meredeth11]

Oh, nice post, pictures here are really nice!!Thanks!!!
In fact I am looking forward to see the sapphire too. Waiting for the good news as well

 

[Justin_Cutter]

I look forward to seeing your sapphire.

As to prices, have any theories to pricing? Do the highly priced vendors think that the public won't shop around (I've actually been guilty of this early on in collecting - and even now if I'm smitten too fast ), or do they think the lower priced ones will sell first, but if they sit tight and wait, someone will eventually buy from them, or, do they expect that you will devote hours to patiently bargaining and knocking them down in price? I am really curious about this.

Thanks! I am looking forward to posting pictures.

Good thoughts! I am very curious as well and have put a lot of thought into this topic.

A dealer once told me. "If I only stocked 5+ct Gems I would starve to death" I think that says a lot. Yes the larger more valuable stones can be really rewarding when they sell, but you have to find the right buyer which can take years depending on the value.

At Tuscan I would say that 95% of the Gem dealers that I spoke with had a great range of stones. $50 to $100,000 stones was common to see. Usually the ratio was about 10/1. 10 Affordable stones for every 1 high end stone. This makes me think that the "bread and butter" of a gem dealer's inventory are stones that are under $3000. The ratio for some of the larger dealers looked more like 100/1.

In my experience almost every dealer figures in about 5%-15% negotiation room at gem shows and sometimes even retail stores. The largest discount I have ever been given on a purchase was 25%. I really think this depends on the stone though. I love negotiating and I feel it is always worth a shot. Sometimes a stone is just so nice that it demands the top market price and a dealer won't budge on the price.

I also think that if a dealer knows that you are in love with a stone the odds of you getting a better price diminishes greatly. The more you love it the more likely you are to pay the asking price. I guess what I am saying is that when it comes to face to face purchases you kind of need a poker face.

When I was going from dealer to dealer at the show I would immediately tell them what I was looking for. 90% of the dealers told me they couldn't help me once they found out that I was looking for a 3-5ct pink sapphire. Pink Sapphires seemed to be a hot item at the show this year which was shocking to me. Many dealers had great options in the 1-2ct range but nothing larger. There was only 4 larger pink sapphires in the whole gem show!

meredeth11, Thank you and your welcome!
~Justin

 

[JewelFreak]

Justin, thank you for such a thorough review, good info & WOW photos. My eyes rolled back looking at the emeralds! Pretty taken with the turquoise sculpture, too -- who woulda thought of doing that?

Double-digit price increases seem to be the theme of the last several years, sigh.

Most retail businesses say they make a higher profit margin on lower-ticket items & of course sell more of them. Sounds like the gem world fits into that theory. Bread & butter inventory.

Looking forward to seeing your pink sapphire. You're a very thoughtful relative. Want to adopt me??? I'm easy, though not cheap!

--- Laurie

 

[chrono]

Excellent review and pictures. It is understandable that picture taking was completely forgotten in the excitement of the moment (which lasted hours ). Disappointing that price increases have gone up by at least 25% but good to know that top material is still out there. Gone are the days of $1000/ct for top quality Mahenges in the 5 carat range. Gone are the days of $1000/ct for top unheated blue sapphires in the 5 carat range.

You can adopt me too. I'm inexpensive and very low maintenance. The gem buying / gifting part probably isn't inexpensive though.

 

[Justin_Cutter]

JewelFreak and Chrono,
Yea the market is going in a unfortunate direction but like Chrono said, at lease quality material is still available. Ugh I am so mad at myself for not taking more pictures!!!
Oh well next year I will take more!

Haha!!!! Yes I will gladly adopt both of you! You both have excellent taste and would make a great addition to the family! I am not cheap either so you would be in good company!
Thanks for stopping by! Pink Sapphire pics coming soon.
~Justin

 

[LD]

Naughty PSer concentrating on buying/looking and not taking more photos

I'm surprised that pink sapphires have risen by 20% as the demand has really been centred on the blue ones (thanks to the Royal engagement). I wonder if this increase is just an across the board increase because demand has dropped due to recession? Although that wouldn't make sense because blues are outstripping everything! Thinking out loud I wonder if the Asian market is looking more to pink sapphires?

Mahenges - actually I think if you have a good one, you could probably charge very high prices!

Emeralds - I'm really interested that you've not seen an increase since 2012. I had an Emerald valued in about 2000 and again about 7 years later and interestingly, the value hadn't changed much. The price per carat had not, like other gemstones, risen as much. It's always amazed me because they are so gorgeous but I there is so much superstition with green and then the worry of the durability of an Emerald that I suppose they're not high up on a wish list.

Great photos and I especially love the Emerald trapiche and the fluorites. Thank you for sharing and hope to see your new purchase soon.

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Naughty PSer concentrating on buying/looking and not taking more photos

I'm surprised that pink sapphires have risen by 20% as the demand has really been centred on the blue ones (thanks to the Royal engagement). I wonder if this increase is just an across the board increase because demand has dropped due to recession? Although that wouldn't make sense because blues are outstripping everything! Thinking out loud I wonder if the Asian market is looking more to pink sapphires?

Mahenges - actually I think if you have a good one, you could probably charge very high prices!

Emeralds - I'm really interested that you've not seen an increase since 2012. I had an Emerald valued in about 2000 and again about 7 years later and interestingly, the value hadn't changed much. The price per carat had not, like other gemstones, risen as much. It's always amazed me because they are so gorgeous but I there is so much superstition with green and then the worry of the durability of an Emerald that I suppose they're not high up on a wish list.

Great photos and I especially love the Emerald trapiche and the fluorites. Thank you for sharing and hope to see your new purchase soon.

I did see a couple 10ct+ Mahenges and the pricing was very high! $10,000 per carat was not uncommon.

Honestly LD I have a theory on the Pink Sapphire bump at the show. In 2012 Argyle really showcased there pink diamond collections and I feel that dealers might be responding to that. Most people can't afford a 3 carat pink diamond, but a 3 carat pink sapphire is a different story. Perhaps dealers are expecting a increased desire in pink stones thanks to the Argyle promotions? This is just my theory.

I agree it is vexing that Emerald value has not climbed like the other gemstones. You make good points about the wear ability of emeralds possibly being a factor. Emeralds are probably my favorite gem, so in some ways I am glad the pricing stays consistent.

~Justin

 

[Richard M.]

Double-digit price increases seem to be the theme of the last several years, sigh.

There's vastly increased demand/competition for scarce colored stones, especially from China and India. And the purchasing power of the dollar keeps dwindling against other world currencies thanks to inflationary U.S. fiscal policies. We haven't begun to see the worst of it in my opinion.
Richard M. (Rick Martin)

 

[pregcurious]

Thanks Justin, for this interesting post.

 

[smurfett_333]

This is a long shot but do you happen to have any info on that cushion pad sapphire you have photographed? I loved looking at your pics and reading your review! Sadly here in Guam I have no expectations of being able to travel to a Gem show anytime soon

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Richard M., Thanks for stopping by. I agree the American Dollar is in a delicate position.

pregcurious, No problem, Glad you enjoyed it!

smurfett_333, That Pad was in one of the cases of the dealer that I bought the pink sapphire from. When I make my new thread I will name the dealer. I am sure he will be easy to get in contact with. The Pad had a very nice color, but the stone does have a small window. It would probably close up once set, but I can't be sure. I did not handle that particular stone so I don't know the asking price.

~Justin

 

[michellechan2211]

Thanks for the information Justin! It kinda sad to know that just as I'm getting into the hobby the price increases are getting higher but such is the law of demand and supply .-.

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Thanks for the information Justin! It kinda sad to know that just as I'm getting into the hobby the price increases are getting higher but such is the law of demand and supply .-.

You are very welcome! Yes this is true, but hey look at it this way- Emerald is saying constant. Perhaps a Emerald for one of your first gem purchases? Or the flip side- jump on another gem before the prices go even higher!!!

~Justin

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Here is a link to the thread with the 3.95ct Pink Sapphire that I purchased at the show!
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/3-95ct-pink-sapphire.185847/
~Justin

 

[CYIW]

i think my new favourite stone is emerald

 

[minousbijoux]

Justin: here or in your other thread can you tell us the name of the vendor that had the $35K pink sapphire? It would be good knowledge to be forewarned that a gem dealer's prices are high. TIA

 

[corundum_conundrum]

Really informative post--thanks Justin.

It seems almost every day on PS there is a new person looking for a blue sapphire for an e-ring. A delightful choice to be sure, but not great for prices. Since there's so much interest in these stones, and often confusion about price discrepancies, would you mind positing some very rough real number "gem show" prices for the unitiated in addition to the percentage increases you have provided?

It sounds bad that heated have increased, and unheated have increased wildly, but I don't really know what they've increased from.

Thanks!

 

[michellechan2211]

Thanks for the information Justin! It kinda sad to know that just as I'm getting into the hobby the price increases are getting higher but such is the law of demand and supply .-.

You are very welcome! Yes this is true, but hey look at it this way- Emerald is saying constant. Perhaps a Emerald for one of your first gem purchases? Or the flip side- jump on another gem before the prices go even higher!!!

~Justin

Except that I'm just a poor college student ^^; And yeah, I might just do that, except the money might be better used on an exchange...decisions decisions.

 

[Justin_Cutter]

Justin: here or in your other thread can you tell us the name of the vendor that had the $35K pink sapphire? It would be good knowledge to be forewarned that a gem dealer's prices are high. TIA

minousbijoux, I wish I could remember the name of the vendor. I wasn't at the booth long. Just long enough to hear that crazy price.

Really informative post--thanks Justin.
It seems almost every day on PS there is a new person looking for a blue sapphire for an e-ring. A delightful choice to be sure, but not great for prices. Since there's so much interest in these stones, and often confusion about price discrepancies, would you mind positing some very rough real number "gem show" prices for the unitiated in addition to the percentage increases you have provided?
It sounds bad that heated have increased, and unheated have increased wildly, but I don't really know what they've increased from.
Thanks!

corundum_conundrum,
I will try my best but blue sapphire prices are not that easy to be extremely acurate with. So like you said these prices are "rough ideas"

3 Carat Blue Sapphire
Medium to Medium Dark Blue Tone
Strong Saturation
Eye Clean
Good Cut
Heat Treatment Only

In 2012 this stone would be in the range of $1250-$1800 per carat. Now its $1500-$2150 per carat.
Hope this helps. Again this is just my personal experience and others may have experienced different pricing.

Except that I'm just a poor college student ^^; And yeah, I might just do that, except the money might be better used on an exchange...decisions decisions.

michellechan2211, Emeralds in the 1-2 carat range can be very affordable... providing they are not Muzo of course. Gem collecting can be tough some times. I have been there. Keep your chin up!
~Justin

 

[CYIW]

"In 2012 this stone would be in the range of $1250-$1800 per carat. Now its $1500-$2150 per carat."

Not what I wanted to hear (on many levels)!

 

[Justin_Cutter]

"In 2012 this stone would be in the range of $1250-$1800 per carat. Now its $1500-$2150 per carat."

Not what I wanted to hear (on many levels)!

CYIW, The prices I quoted are prices you could find from a reasonable dealer at a gem show, not necessarily a retail dealer.
A dealer always reserves the right to charge a special price for a stone that is well "special" regardless of the size. We might not always agree with it, but that's the dealer's prerogative.
~Justin