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visited my local jeweler. dilemma

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garek007

Shiny_Rock
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Jan 27, 2010
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HI,

So we''ve been talking in another thread about his (the one about visited my jeweler yesterday and james allen).

I finally dropped in to check him out. He seemed pretty decent, not too pushy and even though he knows I bought my stone from Union Diamond, no comments about how he could have gotten a better price or anything like that. For the most part he was pretty good.

So he showed me a bunch of stones, different options on things he can make for me. I started by showing him the Danhov I liked and a few James Allens. The Danhov is probably too expensive for me to purchase as is, so he offered to make something similar but with fewer diamonds, thus bringing down the cost.

So here are my dilemma''s.
1) He showed me many rings that looked pretty good, but while I was there I noticed a scott Kay design that I had been pondering but from looking at pics only I had decided against because it did not look so good to me. In person however, this ring looked absolutely stunning. So this ring normally retails at around 4500 (in platinum) and he would sell his at around 3900. But I can get this ring from Union Diamond for around 2600. Now I''m not 100% sold on this setting, BUT after seeing it in person it is much nicer than I thought it would be, and my biggest issue is that I know I can get it for about 2000 dollars off of retail. I can''t seem to figure out if I want it because I know I get such a good discount, or if I really like it. I have a hard time passing up such a good deal, a designer ring for 2k off retail.

PLUS, after letting him spend 45 minutes showing me settings I would feel kinda guilty walking away and ordering another setting from another seller (especially after I used his store to see what it really looks like).

2) It seems like he makes good work and I can do something custom that combines the look of the Scott Kay ring with something that I can actually tailor more to my liking and it will cost less, but then, it wouldn''t be a designer Scott Kay. It would still look the same and maybe even better, because I could customize it to be exactly what I want.

So what do I do? I have a hard time passing up such a good deal on a Scott Kay. Am I just getting caught up in a name?
 
So if UD sells that setting for $2600-then $4500 is not really retail. Retail is what you can buy something for, not the "suggested" price the manufacturer sets.

I would tell him, and show him, that you can buy the setting from UD for $2600 and see if he can come close. If not, I would go to UD personally.

Is this the same jeweler as before? Or a new one?

Have you inspected his pave/three stones/whatever you are considering closely? And alongside the Scott Kay? Are the prongs as even on the pave, etc? Just make sure of this before commissioning him to make something custom. Custom is not returnable and not for everyone.
 
You feel guilty walking away but do you feel the guilt is worth $2000 in his pocket?
 
Yeah, what AprilBaby said.

It''s one thing to feel guilty that you wasted someone''s time, but it''s totally another thing to feel they have wasted your time. I think that a vendor who has been provided with the information to make an informed decision has an obligation to you to say "Well, I can''t beat that price". Boom. Decision made.

However, communication is a two-way street. You need to be prepared and willing to divulge the information you have and the options you are considering. Otherwise, your guilt is a little bit....deserved. Yanno?
 
I’m with Neat Freak. Be honest with him and tell him what you’re thinking. Show him the advertisement from Union and ask him if he can do better on the price. Even if you DON’T buy from him, you will be doing him a favor to tell him why he lost you as a customer and if he does meet the price or otherwise provide enough to sugar to earn your business then you both win.

Lastly, even if you end up shopping somewhere else for the ring, remember that they've treated you well and consider shopping with them next time you need something. Not every dealer does the best on every single deal. One of the hardest parts of jewelry shopping is finding a dealer that you trust and with whom you can communicate well. As you enter the world of married men, I assure you, you WILL be needing a jeweler again in the future.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 
Date: 2/22/2010 11:14:54 PM
Author:garek007
HI,

1) He showed me many rings that looked pretty good, but while I was there I noticed a scott Kay design that I had been pondering but from looking at pics only I had decided against because it did not look so good to me. In person however, this ring looked absolutely stunning.

1.) You did well by looking at things in person. Jewellery doesn't always represent its beauty well on the internet. Also, great (and poor) craftsmanship is VERY difficult to assess over the internet.

So this ring normally retails at around 4500 (in platinum) and he would sell his at around 3900. But I can get this ring from Union Diamond for around 2600. Now I'm not 100% sold on this setting, BUT after seeing it in person it is much nicer than I thought it would be, and my biggest issue is that I know I can get it for about 2000 dollars off of retail. I can't seem to figure out if I want it because I know I get such a good discount, or if I really like it. I have a hard time passing up such a good deal, a designer ring for 2k off retail.

1a.) It seems like you have a mixture of things going on here. You're torn between the emotional and practical sides of the purchase. Take some time to let your brain work it out. Also, take into consideration what your GF would prefer (style wise), that may offer you some guidance. If it doesn't, don't let the pressure get to you just keep working through it.


PLUS, after letting him spend 45 minutes showing me settings I would feel kinda guilty walking away and ordering another setting from another seller (especially after I used his store to see what it really looks like).

1) The ONLY reason people have retail stores is to let people browse inventory and enable themselves the opportunity to share the knowledge with the HOPES of getting a sale. Don't feel guilty!!! How many car dealerships do people drive through before they buy? How many furniture stores do you visit before making a purchase. Do what is right for you, offer him the opportunity to price match, if he can't, save the money. You'll feel better about it after the emotions are removed from the situation.


2) It seems like he makes good work and I can do something custom that combines the look of the Scott Kay ring with something that I can actually tailor more to my liking and it will cost less, but then, it wouldn't be a designer Scott Kay. It would still look the same and maybe even better, because I could customize it to be exactly what I want.

Is he willing to offer you a CAD image of what he is going to manufacture? That will definitely help you with your purchase decision. Your ring would not not be a "Designer Scott Kay", exactly - It would be a Designer GAREK007 "inspired" by Scott Kay. Both are great options. Again I'd consider if your GF is overly concerned to have recognized designer ring or if she would appreciate your design input to make some a little more personal.

So what do I do? I have a hard time passing up such a good deal on a Scott Kay. Am I just getting caught up in a name?

A good deal is a good deal! If I were you (and I was a few weeks ago) I'd take a little time let things absorb before deciding. I forget what your timeline is but if you can give yourself a couple of days, you'd be doing yourself a favor. For what it's worth, I decided to take a few days, stop looking at rings/settings and just clear my pallet. I ended up taking longer than a few days but after spending (literally) months researching, I needed a break. Without question, it helped me finalize a design.
Click to expand...


Also, keep in mind many people have gone through the same thing you are. Don't get overwhelmed, in my limited experience, this seems part of the process.




Good Luck!

ps: sorry for the long winded post
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Date: 2/23/2010 12:02:01 AM
Author: AprilBaby
You feel guilty walking away but do you feel the guilt is worth $2000 in his pocket?
Click to expand...
Agree...has he earned $2k worth of your money in those 45 minutes? Definilty consider him for future purchases.
 
thanks all for the responses.

1) yes it's the same jeweler as my other post
2) Neatfreak, I guess in a way you are right, but I've seen this ring on other sites (like Pearlman's) and it is selling for 4600. So that seems to be the going rate and Union is really cutting me a good deal. I didn't look at his stones closely no, I forgot to do that. He DOES do CAD though.

3) I haven't asked to price match because up until yesterday I didn't want the Scott Kay (until I saw it in person). Still not 100% sure that's the one. And he can't do price matching if we go with a custom design.

4) Union's price is pretty low, I think there's a reason for this, I don't think it's normal (compared to other sites I've encountered). I think they got a good deal and are passing it on to me, so I doubt he can match the price. To ask him in my opinion would not even really be fair because the price is so low.

5) Finally, my guilt is only part of the problem. I'm not necessarily sure that I want the Scott Kay. I think part of my doesn't want to pass up an amazing deal. For this reason, I haven't come right out and said 'match this price' because I'm not sure I want the Scott Kay. I may just be getting hung up on the fact that I can get a great deal on it. Is the deal worth doing it even if I think I can design something better with my local jeweler, I mean, it is a Scott Kay after all.

6) I should add that now he is going to look for tapered diamonds that are a certain size and will look right with my princess cut. He has started doing work for me. It's not fair to him to let him spend too much time doing this if I am not going with him right? how should i tell him?
 
A good price on something you don’t really want is no bargain.

There’s also the possibility that the price listed by Union is an error. If you decide this is the ring for you, make sure that it’s really available at that rate, especially if the price is what is driving you forward.

I again suggest that honesty is a marvelous strategy. It's what you expect of them and it only fair that you offer it in return. I agree that you should not be asking him to do 'free' preliminary work on a job that you don't expect to happen.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver
 
good point denver on the honesty. If I decide to purchase it I will give him a chance.

it is the right price. I confirmed it verbally with Leah over at UD.
 
Garek, first I would decide what you ring you want. Do you want the Scott Kay because its a lovely ring or because you can get a deal?

You seem to be debating process issues rather than outcome issues - do I want custom so I can customize my ring? Do I want a designer ring that I can get a really good deal? Do I want to purchase from a local store so that I can have local cred?

Seems more important (to me, at least) to get a ring that you love and can afford, even if its not the greatest deal or you have to establish a new relationship with a local jeweler because you purchased it online.

Last, I''ll just remind you of the cautions about going custom from the other thread. Its great if you are sure of what you want in a design and confident in the skills and stylistic aesthetic of the jeweler, but never without risk. I''d figure out what you want first, and then evualuate if custom is the best way to get there.
 
Why would Union sell the Scott Kay setting for so much less than everyone else? Are you sure that''s the price for the platinum version and not white gold?
 
Cara yes you nailed it. I''m getting stuck in process issues.

The Scott Kay looked lovely after seeing it in person yesterday. Is it for me? Who knows, but it is really nice. I would LOVE be able to have my fiance brag and say, "I''ve got a Scott Kay" especially when I know how much they really cost.

Is it perfect? Probably not, could be a few things I''d do differently. Is it good enough? maybe? Especially considering the deal I''m getting. I''m not necessarily SURE of anything, especially what I''d want in a custom setting. I can start with a ring, and as long as the jeweler worked with me I could tweak it until it looks how I want. I have an idea of what I want and I think it would be really great to be able to customize a setting to be exactly what I envision. I could take a Scott Kay and add side diamonds, or a Danhov and remove some side diamonds so it meets my budget, you get the idea. But then, I wouldn''t be able to brag about having a designer ring.

Confused yet?

Laila, the price is correct. The got a really good price on some a while back and they don''t post on their website because they only have a few, but they have them in the building and it is what they say.
 
Please don''t take this the wrong way but I think you may be putting too much stock in the Scott Kay brand. Yes, they are quality pieces and they are "designer" pieces but I''m not sure the name means much to the average non-diamond person at all.

And of the PS members who have SK rings, I would be willing to bet those members chose the ring because SK had a design they loved, not because they restricted themselves to SK and went from there.

Personally, I would much rather brag to my friends about my ring that my boyfriend helped to design, than brag about a brand name. And really, you get more opportunities to brag about that, anyway. When people are admiring her ring, it''ll sound weird if she volunteers that it''s a SK. It''ll just sound sweet if she says, "thanks, I love it, my fiance designed it for me!"
 
Date: 2/23/2010 2:42:39 PM
Author: karpouzi
It''ll just sound sweet if she says, ''thanks, I love it, my fiance designed it for me!''
Click to expand...

I know this was intended for garek007 but it helps me confirmthat I''m traveling down the right path.
thanks for the input karpouzi!
 
I''m all for a good deal and I personally am a huge fan of designer rings. Not for bragging rights, but because many of them are extremely well made with high quality craftmanship that will withstand a little normal wear and tear. Scott Kay rings are very well made and they stand behind their products. But, I learned a long time ago that a deal is only a deal if it''s exactly what you want. I agree that SK rings look better in person than in the giant web pictures but if you have to convince yourself to love it b/c of the deal that it still may not be the right ring. It''s better to find the right ring and then find where you can get the best deal on it. IF the SK is the one then def. go with UD where you are getting a heck of a great price!
 
I have a Scott Kay ring (that I also got discounted at 65% through Jared''s Galleria - you can search for my post that includes pictures) and SK rings do look better in person than on their website or from their catalog. That said, I think SK rings are extremely overpriced. If you can get one discounted and you love it, go for it. I wouldn''t have paid the full retail price for my SK setting (sorry, but true!). However, the workmanship on my ring is perfect. I love my setting and wouldn''t trade it in for a different one!

Also, I''m not sure there are "bragging rights" with a Scott Kay ring outside of PS. Only two of my friends and my DH know my ring is a SK. All of my other friends have complimented my ring but I wouldn''t say that it was a SK unless I was asked. To be honest, even if I did willing share that it was a SK, that anyone would know who that designer was!

And just a heads up- Scott Kay rings are being discounted (settings and wedding bands- mens and ladies) at Jared''s Galleria right now. I was in yesterday getting my rings cleaned and browsed while waiting. The SA told me that at certain Jared stores were getting new SK rings in and discounted most of their in-store inventory to "vault value" prices. It''s worth a look!
 
Well, what does the lucky girl want or like in a ring? This assuming you garek are the ring-buyer and not ultimate ring-wearer. Have you gone shopping with her, has she shown you rings from magazines, described what she wants, etc? If you are wanting to surprise her, maybe get an inexpensive setting for the proposal and then ring-shop together after for the final setting? Sorry if you've addressed this in prior threads, I'm just trying to figure out what is going into your setting selection. If it is just your preferences, maybe adding hers into the mix would help point you in a more solid direction.

ETA: I have a designer ring, but I've never mentioned the name of the designer unprompted to anyone IRL. And I'm not sure that it would mean anything to most people. But I've gotten several compliments on its style from friends and random people both and those are always great to hear! I mean, unless you go Tiffany's or Cartier or maybe Harry Winston, only people that fly in certain circles will know jewelry designers by name. If you travel in that set then maybe its worth it but I'd buy designer for other reasons. ie, you like the product, the product is unique and a 'duplicate' would probably not be the same, the brand's reputation for things like durable, well-made pave in their settings, in my case, and their reputation for customer service and standing behind their products. For example my husband unknowingly bought a discontinued-style for my e-ring, and no problem the designer made a custom matching wedding band for my old-style e-ring once we figured that out. Great service if pricy.
 
Cara, I''ve decided to pick the setting, not to let her help. I want it to be something I came up with and I want to give her the final ring when I do.

It''s hard. good point about the ''bragging rights'' and nobody caring. This is true. It would be great to have one for the craftsmanship although I think this local guy does good work too. He''s been in business for 30 years he says. I just got back on the Scott Kay one because I saw it in the store and it looked better than I thought. Maybe I should head to Jared so I can look at it closer.
 
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