What can I get for $100,000 at Harry Winston? Cartier? and Tiffany?
- Thread starter Ping
- Start date
- Status
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 33,852
Kaleigh
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2004
- Messages
- 29,571
My fiance has been to Tiffany and asked them to quote the price on a ring in Legacy setting with a 3-5 ct stone. He was told that the store would have to do a search for the stone and then do a customization - and the price would vary depending on the quality of the stone.
With our budget, I have no idea what to expect for the quality of the other three C''s for a 3-5 ct stone that I could get from those brands. And that''s why I am here trying to get as much information as I could before I go out to get what I deserve for the price that we are offering.
Kaleigh
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2004
- Messages
- 29,571
widget
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2004
- Messages
- 4,255
Interesting thread!
If I were Ping, I''d do a lot of window shopping on the net, and determine ahead of time what size and shapes of diamonds I liked best. (for me it would be a 4-5 carat asscher). Then I''d contact a reputable dealer outside of China, and let them find a couple of candidates for me to come and consider.
Lordy...wouldn''t that be FUN!!!???
widget
If I were Ping, I''d do a lot of window shopping on the net, and determine ahead of time what size and shapes of diamonds I liked best. (for me it would be a 4-5 carat asscher). Then I''d contact a reputable dealer outside of China, and let them find a couple of candidates for me to come and consider.
Lordy...wouldn''t that be FUN!!!???
widget
Kaleigh
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2004
- Messages
- 29,571
Can I "bargain" at those stores
? I just feel that it wouldnt be fair if I were to simply tell them my budget, and then leave it up to them to pick the stone for me. Especially when I know nothing about what I should expect.
I''ve surfed online trying to get a better understanding of the price from those stores. HW for example, was said to have an AVERAGE price tag of $100K -- when I expect something SPECIAL rather than average for that price.
Thanks for all of you for your kind feedbacks and assistance -- it''ll really help me feel more confident and know what I should look for next time when I walk into those stores.
I''ve surfed online trying to get a better understanding of the price from those stores. HW for example, was said to have an AVERAGE price tag of $100K -- when I expect something SPECIAL rather than average for that price.
Thanks for all of you for your kind feedbacks and assistance -- it''ll really help me feel more confident and know what I should look for next time when I walk into those stores.
Ooooh, Ping did you open a can of worms!!
An asscher is an art deco cut which was the fore-runner of the emerald cut. Square, cut corners, step-cut, YUMMY. It has enjoyed a recent renaissance and is now a branded cut--the Royal Asscher-- although a lot of the asschers out there are generic square emeralds (cheaper, often equally yum.....it''s a question of # of facets). Do a search on asschers and you''ll see a bunch of info. Go to www.danielk.net and you''ll see a big old asscher in a very similar setting to the legacy (micro-pave bezel/halo) on the start page. Also, www.artofplatinum.com ..... (The stone you admired in Mara''s avatar is an asscher too, though her fab e-ring isn''t.)
I have looked at/tried on the legacy.....it''s beautiful, but to my eye wasn''t as fiery as some other stones I''ve looked at. LOVE the setting so much, but the stone itself is a step-cut cushion....I think they''ve patented that particular cut, so there won''t be much lee-way cutwise with Tiffany.....you can look at some minor variation in colors and clarities (I don''t think they go below VS2?) but as far as cut goes...not so much (with that particular cushion) (correct me if I''m wrong, others?)
You will have a fabulous ring no matter what you do, but with your budget, you could get a heck of a rock of the BEST cut, to your ABSOLUTE specifications (not just what''s pre-fab in the system) and then do an INSANE custom job with someone like Leon Mege (again.... check out artofplatinum, or do a search on PS for Leon, Lovey, or Reena, and you''ll see what I''m talking about.)
I have looked at/tried on the legacy.....it''s beautiful, but to my eye wasn''t as fiery as some other stones I''ve looked at. LOVE the setting so much, but the stone itself is a step-cut cushion....I think they''ve patented that particular cut, so there won''t be much lee-way cutwise with Tiffany.....you can look at some minor variation in colors and clarities (I don''t think they go below VS2?) but as far as cut goes...not so much (with that particular cushion) (correct me if I''m wrong, others?)
You will have a fabulous ring no matter what you do, but with your budget, you could get a heck of a rock of the BEST cut, to your ABSOLUTE specifications (not just what''s pre-fab in the system) and then do an INSANE custom job with someone like Leon Mege (again.... check out artofplatinum, or do a search on PS for Leon, Lovey, or Reena, and you''ll see what I''m talking about.)
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2002
- Messages
- 31,003
oh my gosh that daniel k shot is just to die for!!!
100k would be fab for a 5-6c asscher.
ping, you asked about my picture...that is a 5.5c 1906 cartier asscher photoshop-set onto my eternity diamond e-ring by a pscoper...it's not real...but i loved it so much i kept it! aspirations and all.
ping you mention trying to get educated before going into HW or Cartier or Tiffany. i have to say that i think much of what you would learn on here would go against shopping at those three stores. i think we have heard that Tiffany will give you Sarin information aka more details on a diamond, but I don't know about C or HW. They may be insulted you would ask. people who come on here normally don't have 100k to spend on a luxury purchase like a diamond, most of us are people who had a budget and have to make our fantasy purchase fit within that number...so we come here, we try to get educated so that we can go and get the biggest stone for our $$...but that normally does not involved names like HW etc.
i guess what i am trying to say is i don't know how much HELP people here can be for someone with 100k to spend who plans to spend it in a name brand store and not source their own stone and/or ring. going into Tiff and buying a Legacy ring is not the same as someone on here researching for 3 months to find the best RB ever. not that i want to deter you from asking, but i just don't know what you can really take away other than you are paying markup of around 40% if you shop at one of those stores. with a 100k purchase....you are buying something that you could build elsewhere for 70k. That's alot of money to leave on the table. Sure a Legacy is a unique setting that would be hard to build elsewhere, but if you are shopping for a regular round stone...it's hard to compare.
i don't really know what you could get at tiff for 100k in terms of the legacy...one thing may be to ask 'plee'...she is a pricescope member and she was given a tiff legacy a while back for an e-ring, i recall it maybe being around 2-3c and it was huge on her hand...so maybe private message her and ask what she paid (if she knows!). maybe that will help you.
but in reality, i agree with whoever else said to call the stores you are interested in and ASK them what you could get for 100k. asking us is all fine and good but again if you do not plan to source your own stone and do all the legwork yourself etc then in reality, asking who you are planning to buy from instead of us seems the smartest way to spend your money and your time.
oh and re: average ring being 100k at HW...from my EXTENSIVE 'The Bachelor' watching ....
the rings they showed on there when they shopped at HW were something like 2-3c stones, ovals, cushions etc with tons of pave in the settings and they would say things like 'this is 60k retail' etc. so i think for 100k you could get something pretty cool at HW and it would not be small or 'average' I would think.
anyhow i am babbling now!! good luck whatever you decide.
100k would be fab for a 5-6c asscher.
ping, you asked about my picture...that is a 5.5c 1906 cartier asscher photoshop-set onto my eternity diamond e-ring by a pscoper...it's not real...but i loved it so much i kept it! aspirations and all.
ping you mention trying to get educated before going into HW or Cartier or Tiffany. i have to say that i think much of what you would learn on here would go against shopping at those three stores. i think we have heard that Tiffany will give you Sarin information aka more details on a diamond, but I don't know about C or HW. They may be insulted you would ask. people who come on here normally don't have 100k to spend on a luxury purchase like a diamond, most of us are people who had a budget and have to make our fantasy purchase fit within that number...so we come here, we try to get educated so that we can go and get the biggest stone for our $$...but that normally does not involved names like HW etc.
i guess what i am trying to say is i don't know how much HELP people here can be for someone with 100k to spend who plans to spend it in a name brand store and not source their own stone and/or ring. going into Tiff and buying a Legacy ring is not the same as someone on here researching for 3 months to find the best RB ever. not that i want to deter you from asking, but i just don't know what you can really take away other than you are paying markup of around 40% if you shop at one of those stores. with a 100k purchase....you are buying something that you could build elsewhere for 70k. That's alot of money to leave on the table. Sure a Legacy is a unique setting that would be hard to build elsewhere, but if you are shopping for a regular round stone...it's hard to compare.
i don't really know what you could get at tiff for 100k in terms of the legacy...one thing may be to ask 'plee'...she is a pricescope member and she was given a tiff legacy a while back for an e-ring, i recall it maybe being around 2-3c and it was huge on her hand...so maybe private message her and ask what she paid (if she knows!). maybe that will help you.
but in reality, i agree with whoever else said to call the stores you are interested in and ASK them what you could get for 100k. asking us is all fine and good but again if you do not plan to source your own stone and do all the legwork yourself etc then in reality, asking who you are planning to buy from instead of us seems the smartest way to spend your money and your time.
oh and re: average ring being 100k at HW...from my EXTENSIVE 'The Bachelor' watching ....
anyhow i am babbling now!! good luck whatever you decide.
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2002
- Messages
- 31,003
now i am daydreaming on what i would buy....
here is one:
http://www.icestore.com/jewelry/fancy_diamond_jewelry_detail.asp?ID=216
but that daniel k asscher is a close second.
here is one:
http://www.icestore.com/jewelry/fancy_diamond_jewelry_detail.asp?ID=216
but that daniel k asscher is a close second.
widget
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2004
- Messages
- 4,255
I've got to jump in here an defend Ping's inclination to shop at one of the Big Name jewelry houses like Cartier or HW. If I were in their situation, that is what I would do....for the comfort and confidence (no small thing, considering the size of the investment) and the assurance that I would end up with a magnificent stone.
I'd never consider going to an "unknown" dealer unless he came with tons of strong recommendations from KNOWLEDGEABLE friends and business associates....and even then I'd ask for more references!
I'm lucky enough to actually own my "dream diamond"...I inherited it. I can't imagine ever wanting anything bigger or better. I know that my Dad acquired it through an independent jeweler, but one he knew personally through other business connections (I think they were Rotarians together)....my Dad knew NOTHING about diamonds but he was very well taken care of. I'm pretty sure that if he hadn't known somebody "in the biz", that he would have gone to one of the Big Guys...
Bargaining with these guys? I don't know...it doesn't hurt to try. Mentioning to M. Cartier that you're considering a stone of Mr. Winston's might help..
widget
I'd never consider going to an "unknown" dealer unless he came with tons of strong recommendations from KNOWLEDGEABLE friends and business associates....and even then I'd ask for more references!
I'm lucky enough to actually own my "dream diamond"...I inherited it. I can't imagine ever wanting anything bigger or better. I know that my Dad acquired it through an independent jeweler, but one he knew personally through other business connections (I think they were Rotarians together)....my Dad knew NOTHING about diamonds but he was very well taken care of. I'm pretty sure that if he hadn't known somebody "in the biz", that he would have gone to one of the Big Guys...
Bargaining with these guys? I don't know...it doesn't hurt to try. Mentioning to M. Cartier that you're considering a stone of Mr. Winston's might help..
widget
windowshopper
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2004
- Messages
- 2,023
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2002
- Messages
- 31,003
widget
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2004
- Messages
- 4,255
ame
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2004
- Messages
- 10,883
NoonersMom
Shiny_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2004
- Messages
- 353
Ahhh, to have a 100K budget.
How exciting! Everyone has given you good advice. Educate yourself & do the research before you start looking or before you contact a dealer. It appears that you should first research the different shapes available....ascher, round brilliant, cushion, flanders, old european cut, emerald cut, regent, etc. Once you see the different cuts and read up on their unique qualities...both in optics & durability....then narrow it down based on your preferences.
All things equal, is the goal to completely use the budget or shop for a gorgeous 3-5 carat diamond that is value for the dollar? While I can appreciate your apprehension about going to dealers/suppliers that aren''t a household name, if you educate yourself and have the proper controls set up to minimize risk you don''t have to worry about being taken. Personally I would prefer to get value for the dollar, regardless of my financial situation. $20-$30,000 is a lot to pay for a name & marketing campaign.
Once you do the research, inquire about reputable dealers. This is a community board & as such there are many recommendations for both diamond dealers & bench jewelers. Do the research. Then you can take it from there with the reputable dealers. Speak with the few you have short listed. Find one that you are comfortable working with and suits your style. Once you do that you can schedule a trip to the US to meet with the dealer & view diamonds they have specifically brought in for you. You can bet that many reputable dealers will be falling over themselves to assist you with your request. You may also want to consider hiring an appraiser to accompany you. This will ensure you have an unbiased opinion and again, minimizes your risk.
On the opposite side of the coin, if you prefer not to invest the time & energy into this purchase, then go with the household names & pay the mark up for what you believe is piece of mind.
Either way, best of luck! Let us know how it turns out.
All things equal, is the goal to completely use the budget or shop for a gorgeous 3-5 carat diamond that is value for the dollar? While I can appreciate your apprehension about going to dealers/suppliers that aren''t a household name, if you educate yourself and have the proper controls set up to minimize risk you don''t have to worry about being taken. Personally I would prefer to get value for the dollar, regardless of my financial situation. $20-$30,000 is a lot to pay for a name & marketing campaign.
Once you do the research, inquire about reputable dealers. This is a community board & as such there are many recommendations for both diamond dealers & bench jewelers. Do the research. Then you can take it from there with the reputable dealers. Speak with the few you have short listed. Find one that you are comfortable working with and suits your style. Once you do that you can schedule a trip to the US to meet with the dealer & view diamonds they have specifically brought in for you. You can bet that many reputable dealers will be falling over themselves to assist you with your request. You may also want to consider hiring an appraiser to accompany you. This will ensure you have an unbiased opinion and again, minimizes your risk.
On the opposite side of the coin, if you prefer not to invest the time & energy into this purchase, then go with the household names & pay the mark up for what you believe is piece of mind.
Either way, best of luck! Let us know how it turns out.
This site has been very very helpful -- thanks, everyone!Date: 5/18/2005 1:10:36 PM
Author: widget
Sorry, you guys...I didn''t mean to offend you, or Ping, or anyone!
I guess I just spoke from habit, or perhaps my own defensiveness. I guess I tend to think that on sites such as this, buying diamonds from Tiffany''s and such is sometimes not viewed with a great deal of respect...
sorry...
I''ve got tons of ideas and inspirations on styles ever since I posted this message. Now I know what I should expect from whichever place that I decide to purchase.
I did a bit homework last night on cut, and here''s another question: Are some cuts tend to be more expensive than others? (i.e. emerald cuts tend to be more expensive than say, round brilliant for the same quality of stone) Why is that?
PS. Let me know if I should start another thread for this question....
Firefly
Rough_Rock
- Joined
- Apr 17, 2005
- Messages
- 20
In most Asian countries like Hong Kong, Singapore and Malaysia .. . most average to somewhat high-end jewellers would give you a 5 - 10% discount off the price tag if you ask.
As I''ve not purchased anything from designer brands such as Cartier, Tiffany''s, Chopard .. I wonder if they would give you a better deal seeing that you''re buying something as substantial as USD 100k.
As I''ve not purchased anything from designer brands such as Cartier, Tiffany''s, Chopard .. I wonder if they would give you a better deal seeing that you''re buying something as substantial as USD 100k.
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2003
- Messages
- 15,808
This is true... I am not sure if some official ranking is nailed, but IMO the order from most to least expensive goes: round (most expensive), princess, radiant and cushion, square emerald cut (asscher, not branded), ovals and pears on the same slot, marquises and lastly emerald cut. Old cuts (Oec and Omc) rank up with the manque shapes, I would think.
Anything branded would be at least as expensive as ideal cut rounds (both more than your average round brilliant and on top of the list above).
This list must be highly debatable: it is easy to establish that rounds are the most expensive and step cuts the least on average, but there are large price differences between stones within each group - so that "average" does not mean much.
widget
Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2004
- Messages
- 4,255
Valeria: Aren''t some cuts more expensive than others because they require less efficient use of the rough? I know this is true of some colored gems, anyway...
Ping...I thought of another possible source of high-end diamonds in your "neighborhood": Sotheby''s or Christie''s auctions in Asia. They often sell "Designer" pieces, perhaps for less than they would cost "new"..
Here''s an unsigned ring being offered for sale at Christies in Hong Kong that fits your budget....Oval diamond, 4.01cts, D, IF.
It''s a bad picture, but it sure looks yummy!
widget
Ping...I thought of another possible source of high-end diamonds in your "neighborhood": Sotheby''s or Christie''s auctions in Asia. They often sell "Designer" pieces, perhaps for less than they would cost "new"..
Here''s an unsigned ring being offered for sale at Christies in Hong Kong that fits your budget....Oval diamond, 4.01cts, D, IF.
It''s a bad picture, but it sure looks yummy!
widget
Kaleigh
Super_Ideal_Rock
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2004
- Messages
- 29,571
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2003
- Messages
- 15,808
Well... each shape tries to do that really. Diamond rough comes in lots of different shapes. And more than the shape of the rough goes into that cuting decission (flaws that need to be avoided, prices and market demand for whatever shape and size). I really do not know these things well enough ... Some older posts by "Paul Antwerp" contain some interesting details from the right source.
codex57
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 1,492
Date: 5/17/2005 10:34:03 PM
Author: Ping
Can I ''bargain'' at those stores? I just feel that it wouldnt be fair if I were to simply tell them my budget, and then leave it up to them to pick the stone for me. Especially when I know nothing about what I should expect.
I''ve surfed online trying to get a better understanding of the price from those stores. HW for example, was said to have an AVERAGE price tag of $100K -- when I expect something SPECIAL rather than average for that price.
When you shop at HW or Tiffany''s, you''re going there for the convenience of them having the sales people figure out what you want. Showing you beautiful stones. Price is not supposed to matter to those customers.
When HW says it has an average price tag, that means out of all the stones they sell, when you add up all the price tags and then divide by the number of items it was, the average comes out to $100K. They''re not saying their items are average. They''re gonna say all their items are special. I think something got lost in the translation.
Reality check tho. You shop at HW, your $100K doesn''t make you a big baller (big shot, high roller, hen duo chien). They''ve got clients who will drop $1,000,000+. But, it''s still a good sum of money and you should expect to get treated royally there.
HW and Tiffanys can be as much about the name as the stone itself tho. Part of what you''re paying for is to say it came from that luxury house. Kind of like buying a Rolls Royce. Yes, the car has some impressive features, but a good chunk of the money you spent was for the status of the name. People here will talk about cut a lot. That''s cuz you can''t identify a diamond as being from HW or Tiffany''s by sight. You have to tell them (brag about it). As such, the objective stuff is how clear and sparkly it is. That''s why cut is so important. I''m not that knowledgeable about HW, but I do hop into Tiffanys from time to time and while their stuff is very good, it''s not necessarily the best quality. You pay a huge premium for the name. I chose quality instead.
I''m not that up to date on Chinese culture. My family''s not that traditional. But, consider how important color and clarity are. Apparently, good clarity is good luck in the Vietnamese culture. Most in the Chinese range of cultures want D or as close to it as possible (kinda how we like 24K gold). Take that into consideration. You might want to sacrifice getting from a name brand so you can get a bigger size, better color and clarity, and better cut.
And don''t worry about asking so many questions. I was in Shanghai (and other parts) a few years ago. It''s changed since my trip before that (abotu 15 years ago). It''s amazing how much China has changed. Much easier to get into now. But, being an ABC, it''s very interesting to see mainland Chinese deal with the sudden wealth they have and the clash of the new Western culture and shopping expectations with the traditional bargaining culture.
Rank Amateur
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2003
- Messages
- 1,555
lawmax
Brilliant_Rock
- Joined
- Dec 31, 1999
- Messages
- 1,317
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2004
- Messages
- 9,159
- Status
Past, Present, Future: The Meaning of Three-Stone Engagement Rings
Past, Present, Future: The Meaning of Three-Stone Engagement Rings - 04/14
300x240.png)