Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting it?

[Geebee625]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Has she even seen the ring yet? She might see it and be blown away and not even care about what the color is on paper. If she is as inexperienced as you say she is, she might not even be able to tell it's an "i" color. I think you have to show her all of the videos/info you researched so that she is educated on the purchase as well. My advice is to enjoy this moment. It should be a happy time! If it doesn't work out with the diamond you will find a way to make it right. You obviously care a lot about her since you have gone to so much trouble already!

On a side note, I am in the market for a diamond just like the one you bought with similar specs. I think you got a fantastic deal! Would you let me know the jeweler you used? I am also in the NYC area.

 

[heididdl]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Is it worth 5k to upgrade.

Well. No. But I also don't think that getting her an I when she said she doesn't want one is right. She is entitled to her personal opinion and color tolerances are important and very individualized. I believe you should respect her color request. But you can go down to a 1.8 ct H color for the same amount of money. And that way she gets the color she wants and everything is still in budget.

I don't believe in expanding budgets. There is a reason you set that budget in the first place. Stick to it. But go down to a 1.8 ct H to respect her color request

I have a different take on how I read your post That after going to Tiffany and Cartier that she wouldn't consider an I . Well after I go to Tiffany and Cartier my H color looks not as white to me. But if I shop anywhere else or look at everyone else rings, my stone is looks plenty white. So before you '"upgrade" you need to have another conversation with the GF especially if the seller won't return this one. if he does then you can revisit and do what Gypsy recommends a slightly smaller stone with higher color.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

OK. So now that you've given us more information, here are my (revised) thoughts.

You are out of the return policy. So PROPOSE NOW with the I. Let her wear it for 2-3 weeks. If there is an issue with the color and you guys want to go back to the vendor and see what he can do for you, you might as well do it AFTER she's seen this one and worn it for a while. Not going to make any difference, it's out of the return policy.

You really should have proposed within the return window, but that ship has sailed.

That said, being color sensitive isn't the same as being able to spot color. Spotting color just means your eyes work correctly. Color sensitive means that you can spot the color AND YOU LET IT BOTHER YOU.

I do still think that communication is important. And so are budgets. So if you DO decide TOGETHER to upgrade the color, I would seriously consider going to 1.8 carats at that time. 17k is a healthy budget.

Additionally, I would advise that any lurkers not go to Tiffany for their color tolerance evaluation. Tiffany uses an in house grading system. Hearts on Fire dealers are a much better comparison because they use AGS for their lab reports.

Best of luck to you!

I gave it to her about two weeks ago and when we look at it we don't see color, although once in a while she says something to the effect of "are you sure?" I didn't see it during my first go around when people said an "I" was fine, but I look now and I have doubts too. I think it's in my head but if I objectively look at it I see white.

I still think she'd prefer this 2.09 over an H 1.8.

I did speak with the seller today, who I won't name but is very well known on these forums, and basically he said too bad I'm at 45 days and would need to spend 150% of the price to upgrade. That surprised me but not much I can do about it. Guess we'll see how it looks in the setting and go from there.

By the way, let's say I did lose my mind and decide to spend another $8,000. Would these internet sellers mark up the price of the new diamond to make it a bad deal for me or could I still expect to pick something on the James Allen website and buy it for $1000 less than the marked price?

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Has she even seen the ring yet? She might see it and be blown away and not even care about what the color is on paper. If she is as inexperienced as you say she is, she might not even be able to tell it's an "i" color. I think you have to show her all of the videos/info you researched so that she is educated on the purchase as well. My advice is to enjoy this moment. It should be a happy time! If it doesn't work out with the diamond you will find a way to make it right. You obviously care a lot about her since you have gone to so much trouble already!

On a side note, I am in the market for a diamond just like the one you bought with similar specs. I think you got a fantastic deal! Would you let me know the jeweler you used? I am also in the NYC area.

Want to buy mine? I'll give you a good price . Since there's no way on this forum to send a private message it was ERD.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

[quote="jimyhoff|1398482553|
I did speak with the seller today, who I won't name but is very well known on these forums, and basically he said too bad I'm at 45 days and would need to spend 150% of the price to upgrade. That surprised me but not much I can do about it. Guess we'll see how it looks in the setting and go from there.

?[/quote]


So, how much more $$$ to upgrade?

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

[quote="jimyhoff|1398482553|
I did speak with the seller today, who I won't name but is very well known on these forums, and basically he said too bad I'm at 45 days and would need to spend 150% of the price to upgrade. That surprised me but not much I can do about it. Guess we'll see how it looks in the setting and go from there.

?

So, how much more $$$ to upgrade?[/quote]

I'd have to buy another diamond that's at least 150% of what I paid for this one and I'd get credit for what I paid for this one (and of course give this one back). What I don't know is if they'd be as aggressive with the price of the new one. I think I got a pretty good deal on this one.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

ERD is very reputable. I don't think they'd mark up unnecessarily on your trade in.

And to be fair, you are outside your return policy. A policy you were told about. As for upgrade. Considering the deal you got at the start, it's actually generous. Most vendors who discount below the listed JA price will tell you that there is no upgrade policy.

He's giving you JA's trade up policy (which is 150%) without you having to pay the JA's price at the outset.

That's actually a good deal. Most vendors that offer trade ins have marked up the stone from the start to allow for a trade in cushion. That's how the industry functions.

I suggest you get it set, and enjoy it. I's are very white. And I'd wear one happily. Heck I'd wear a J happily.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

[quote="jimyhoff|1398482553|
I did speak with the seller today, who I won't name but is very well known on these forums, and basically he said too bad I'm at 45 days and would need to spend 150% of the price to upgrade. That surprised me but not much I can do about it. Guess we'll see how it looks in the setting and go from there.

?

So, how much more $$$ to upgrade?

I'd have to buy another diamond that's at least 150% of what I paid for this one and I'd get credit for what I paid for this one (and of course give this one back). What I don't know is if they'd be as aggressive with the price of the new one. I think I got a pretty good deal on this one.[/quote]
So, $24K more?..

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No. 8.5 K more.

He spent 17K originally.
The new stone has to be worth 50% more than the original.
So 8.5k more.

The new stone has to cost 150% of the original stone TOTAL.

So the new stone needs to cost $25,500 total. Then he gets 17k credit for the trade in. So he pays 8,500 for the upgrade.

OK?

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

ERD is very reputable. I don't think they'd mark up unnecessarily on your trade in.

And to be fair, you are outside your return policy. A policy you were told about. As for upgrade. Considering the deal you got at the start, it's actually generous. Most vendors who discount below the listed JA price will tell you that there is no upgrade policy.

He's giving you JA's trade up policy (which is 150%) without you having to pay the JA's price at the outset.

That's actually a good deal. Most vendors that offer trade ins have marked up the stone from the start to allow for a trade in cushion. That's how the industry functions.

I suggest you get it set, and enjoy it. I's are very white. And I'd wear one happily. Heck I'd wear a J happily.

I'm not complaining, just surprised there isn't a little flexibility. It's not like it's been a year or it's been set in a ring. Has just been sitting in my safe. Oh well.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No. 8.5 K more.

He spent 17K originally.
The new stone has to be worth 50% more than the original.
So 8.5k more.

The new stone has to cost 150% of the original stone TOTAL.

So the new stone needs to cost $25,500 total. Then he gets 17k credit for the trade in. So he pays 8,500 for the upgrade.

OK?

Well, if he can swing the extra $8,500 he can go up to a G color.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

And James Allen states a 60 day return policy (better) but their upgrade is 200% value (worse).

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No. 8.5 K more.

He spent 17K originally.
The new stone has to be worth 50% more than the original.
So 8.5k more.

The new stone has to cost 150% of the original stone TOTAL.

So the new stone needs to cost $25,500 total. Then he gets 17k credit for the trade in. So he pays 8,500 for the upgrade.

OK?

Well, if he can swing the extra $8,500 he can go up to a G color.

Or a large H. Should I be asking for $25.5k recommendations that will blow her away?

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No. 8.5 K more.

He spent 17K originally.
The new stone has to be worth 50% more than the original.
So 8.5k more.

The new stone has to cost 150% of the original stone TOTAL.

So the new stone needs to cost $25,500 total. Then he gets 17k credit for the trade in. So he pays 8,500 for the upgrade.

OK?

Well, if he can swing the extra $8,500 he can go up to a G color.

Or a large H. Should I be asking for $25.5k recommendations that will blow her away?

Don't hurt to ask ERD..

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Or a large H. Should I be asking for $25.5k recommendations that will blow her away?

No. The trade offer will be good for a while (ask him how long) and so there is no point. Get the stone set. Have her wear it for a while. Then see what happens.

For now, stick to what you have.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

By the time I buy the setting an upgraded ring is almost $30k. I could maybe see a couple thousand more but $30k is way too much money to spend on a ring. Good advice to stick with what I have for the time being.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

By the time I buy the setting an upgraded ring is almost $30k. I could maybe see a couple thousand more but $30k is way too much money to spend on a ring. Good advice to stick with what I have for the time being.

Yeah. That's just WAY TOO MUCH on an uncertainty. She may end up loving her stone as it is.

I'd make sure you get a setting that has 6 prongs or a bezel to cover up the sides.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

She picked something very close to the Cartier 1895 pave. Almost exact unless you compare it closely to a picture.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

4 prongs. Well, then hopefully she'll love it.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

I was in NYC early this week and had a chance to spend a couple hours on 47th street yesterday. I guessed wrong about half the time when dealers put an H and an I side by side. Most told me you can't tell a difference between the two. I think I'm content on color now.

I did have a few interesting experiences and a question. One dealer tried to tell me a diamond doesn't sparkle unless the girdle is "thin to very thin" and the diamond he was showing me produced a warning when running through the HCA scale that the girdle could be dangerously thin. I told him I'd prefer something with a medium to slightly thick girdle and his response was "wow you really don't know anything about diamonds". What an a-hole.

Another pulled me into pretty much a closet office and showed me a few diamonds he said were perfect. The first had a 53% table and only VG/VG/VG stats with a large feather at the edge and the second he walks in and says I don't know how this got graded SI1 when it should be VS1. The diamond had visible pepper spots on the table. Another scammer.

One thing that did bother me was when I asked about fluorescence several dealers said they'd never sell a diamond with fluorescence because they're cloudy and don't sparkle. Several pulled out an extreme example of a likely very strong cloudy diamond to show side by side. Everything I've read tells me medium fluorescence can be desirable in an I color stone and I don't think I see cloudyness in mine. I never did have a chance though to look at it side by side with a non fluorescent well cut I diamond.

Was I wrong to save a few bucks and buy a diamond with medium fluorescence?

 

[luvsdmb]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

I would love to see your diamond, do you have any pictures?

 

[Tekate]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Seems nothing has changed since the 1980s... a jeweler in Poughkeepsie NY showed us a cloudy, very fractured diamond and said that was all we would get for the money we could spend (5K in 1986!).. so we went to the diamond district in NYC and we bought what is now considered and 'average' stone for 7.8K... it's a nice stone.. not awesome for todays standards.. but I would truly stick with the most reputable dealers on Pricescope.. if a company is willing to allow their name here on Pricescope I would think they are on the up and up.. while we are members it sometimes seems that MANY more people read the forums.. I love your stone btw it's beautiful.. engagement periods are a 'loopy' time. girls get together and compare and even the most level headed girl can become emotional on a stone.. (speaking from experience congrats and best of luck.

I was in NYC early this week and had a chance to spend a couple hours on 47th street yesterday. I guessed wrong about half the time when dealers put an H and an I side by side. Most told me you can't tell a difference between the two. I think I'm content on color now.

I did have a few interesting experiences and a question. One dealer tried to tell me a diamond doesn't sparkle unless the girdle is "thin to very thin" and the diamond he was showing me produced a warning when running through the HCA scale that the girdle could be dangerously thin. I told him I'd prefer something with a medium to slightly thick girdle and his response was "wow you really don't know anything about diamonds". What an a-hole.

Another pulled me into pretty much a closet office and showed me a few diamonds he said were perfect. The first had a 53% table and only VG/VG/VG stats with a large feather at the edge and the second he walks in and says I don't know how this got graded SI1 when it should be VS1. The diamond had visible pepper spots on the table. Another scammer.

One thing that did bother me was when I asked about fluorescence several dealers said they'd never sell a diamond with fluorescence because they're cloudy and don't sparkle. Several pulled out an extreme example of a likely very strong cloudy diamond to show side by side. Everything I've read tells me medium fluorescence can be desirable in an I color stone and I don't think I see cloudyness in mine. I never did have a chance though to look at it side by side with a non fluorescent well cut I diamond.

Was I wrong to save a few bucks and buy a diamond with medium fluorescence?

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

I would love to see your diamond, do you have any pictures?

First link on the first page of this thread.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Seems nothing has changed since the 1980s... a jeweler in Poughkeepsie NY showed us a cloudy, very fractured diamond and said that was all we would get for the money we could spend (5K in 1986!).. so we went to the diamond district in NYC and we bought what is now considered and 'average' stone for 7.8K... it's a nice stone.. not awesome for todays standards.. but I would truly stick with the most reputable dealers on Pricescope.. if a company is willing to allow their name here on Pricescope I would think they are on the up and up.. while we are members it sometimes seems that MANY more people read the forums.. I love your stone btw it's beautiful.. engagement periods are a 'loopy' time. girls get together and compare and even the most level headed girl can become emotional on a stone.. (speaking from experience congrats and best of luck.

Thanks. I like it too but have had doubts on and off. The fluorescence thing being the latest. The people in the diamond district will tell you anything, most of which probably inaccurate. It's funny all the diamonds I was shown looked nice in their lighting but the numbers told me they weren't great.

 

[thecat]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

ERD is very reputable. I don't think they'd mark up unnecessarily on your trade in.

And to be fair, you are outside your return policy. A policy you were told about. As for upgrade. Considering the deal you got at the start, it's actually generous. Most vendors who discount below the listed JA price will tell you that there is no upgrade policy.

He's giving you JA's trade up policy (which is 150%) without you having to pay the JA's price at the outset.

That's actually a good deal. Most vendors that offer trade ins have marked up the stone from the start to allow for a trade in cushion. That's how the industry functions.

I suggest you get it set, and enjoy it. I's are very white. And I'd wear one happily. Heck I'd wear a J happily.

I'm not complaining, just surprised there isn't a little flexibility. It's not like it's been a year or it's been set in a ring. Has just been sitting in my safe. Oh well.

Your return period is most probably also ERD's return period to the supplier. Had you return the diamond during that window, ERD only incurs shipping cost to return to supplier. Outside of that period, ERD is stuck with it as in house inventory so they will need capital for your new stone. Hence, the upgrade policy kicks in. So it doesn't matter if you only have it 45 days or a year.

 

[Gypsy]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No you weren't wrong on Fluorescence. You did good. I would personally love Fluorescence in my diamond.

Here, read this: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/calling-all-florescence-experts.198989/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/calling-all-florescence-experts.198989/[/URL]

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

No you weren't wrong on Fluorescence. You did good. I would personally love Fluorescence in my diamond.

Here, read this: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/calling-all-florescence-experts.198989/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/calling-all-florescence-experts.198989/[/URL]

Thanks! That's exactly what two different stores told me in NYC yesterday (the erroneous cloudy part).

 

[TC1987]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

I...
One thing that did bother me was when I asked about fluorescence several dealers said they'd never sell a diamond with fluorescence because they're cloudy and don't sparkle. Several pulled out an extreme example of a likely very strong cloudy diamond to show side by side. Everything I've read tells me medium fluorescence can be desirable in an I color stone and I don't think I see cloudyness in mine. I never did have a chance though to look at it side by side with a non fluorescent well cut I diamond.

Was I wrong to save a few bucks and buy a diamond with medium fluorescence?

There are loads of diamonds here on PS that have medium or strong blue fluor and are not the least bit cloudy. Brian Gavin has a whole product line of Brian Gavin Blue fluorescent diamonds, too. You'd be able to see cloudiness or haze, and you haven't. If UV light is present, the fluor will help to whiten your diamond's face-up color. It may not help the side view as much but should help some. Since it's medium blue, I doubt that the stone will take on a blueish or violet tinge in sunlight.

You stated that you and your gf are not seeing an obvious tint in it. That's good. I think if you had a J or K, you'd have something to worry about. I'd just try for a setting with G/H/I colored sidestones. The general rule is stay within 2 color grades of the center. D/E/F might contrast too much.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

I was in NYC early this week and had a chance to spend a couple hours on 47th street yesterday. I guessed wrong about half the time when dealers put an H and an I side by side. Most told me you can't tell a difference between the two. I think I'm content on color now.

I did have a few interesting experiences and a question. One dealer tried to tell me a diamond doesn't sparkle unless the girdle is "thin to very thin" and the diamond he was showing me produced a warning when running through the HCA scale that the girdle could be dangerously thin. I told him I'd prefer something with a medium to slightly thick girdle and his response was "wow you really don't know anything about diamonds". What an a-hole.


One thing that did bother me was when I asked about fluorescence several dealers said they'd never sell a diamond with fluorescence because they're cloudy and don't sparkle. Several pulled out an extreme example of a likely very strong cloudy diamond to show side by side. Everything I've read tells me medium fluorescence can be desirable in an I color stone and I don't think I see cloudyness in mine. I never did have a chance though to look at it side by side with a non fluorescent well cut I diamond.

Was I wrong to save a few bucks and buy a diamond with medium fluorescence?

Tell them that they are full of B.S.

 

[jimyhoff]

Re: Worth upgrading this 2ct I color diamond before setting

Now that the diamond found its setting she loves it. To everyone that's seen it the diamond looks white as can be, especially outside in the sunlight. We went to have it set in Chicago this weekend and the jeweler commented on how nice the diamond is, so everyone is very happy and I spent under $20k for a near replica of what Cartier sells for $70k. Not bad.

We've found it impossible to capture in a picture what this looks like in real life.