...and GUEST?! Being an LIW is rough

[ash313]

Hey ladies,

Just need to vent a moment. So SO''s cousin is getting married in August in Chicago. Black-tie, super formal affair (fun! I''m totally looking forward to it, even if that''s not something I would choose for myself).

So we''ve been talking about this wedding for ages, got the save the dates months ago, etc. We live very close to the bride''s parents (his aunt and uncle) and visit them often.

I have been dating my SO for 9 and a half YEARS, and we have lived together for 2 and a half of them. I have always felt very much a part of his family, felt like I belonged, etc.

So, here''s where the venting comes in. We get the invite yesterday for his cousin''s big wedding (return address is from his aunt and uncle), and it''s addressed just to him. Hmmm, I think, ok, well I guess maybe they''re just being formal. The inner envelope is addressed to SO "AND GUEST." There was something about that that just really bothered me. I mean, I know we''re not engaged yet, so that''s probably the "formal" thing to do, and I''m not blaming his family for it, but it just sort of reminded me of my "unofficial" place in the family. I''m sure if we were engaged my name would have been on there, and married it would have been on the outside address, obviously.

So I went for a long run and was feeling much better afterward.

SO came home from work and I showed him the invite, and asked in a joking way who he was taking as his guest? He kind of laughed and said "that''s weird they didn''t put your name, maybe they were just being formal?" I said that''s what I figured, although I thought proper etiquette was to put the person''s name if they were in a long term relationship and you knew that''s who they were bringing? I don''t know...

So then he said "You are not my "and guest" you are much more to that to me and to my family" and gave me a nice, long hug and kiss. He totally recognized that it bothered me and responded, which felt so good. I told him I wanted it to say "Mrs. ___" and he was like "I understand."

So that was nice, but still, it bothered me!

Grrr....does anyone else have moments like these? Where you feel like you have "outsider" status officially no matter how much they welcome you and take you in? Like until you have that ring, you''re still just sort of a "floater?"

 

[Lauren8211]

Ugh! I''ve totally been there.

SO''s brother got married last year, and we got an invitation addressed to him, with "and guest" on the inside. We had been dating nearly 2 years at that point, and living together for a while. It kind of stung, especially since I was invited to the wedding shower, bachelorette party, etc. It''s like, would it have killed you to put my name on the damn envelope? Ugh!

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 10:10:23 AM
Author: elledizzy5
especially since I was invited to the wedding shower, bachelorette party, etc. It''s like, would it have killed you to put my name on the damn envelope? Ugh!

Wow, I can''t believe that! I wasn''t invited to all the other festivities. I can''t imagine if I were, and still no acknowledgment on the envelope! It''s just a silly little thing, but feels good to know others are having the same reaction as me...

 

[KatM]

yeah, it can hurt sometimes. after several years we actually haven''t been to a wedding together, but i have been in a similar situation. we were visiting his aunt and uncle for the holidays, and one of them said, "m, get your *friend* a drink." it really stung.

on the plus side, it sounds like you have a very sweet FF. he sounds very empathetic and concerned about how you feel.

 

[fieryred33143]

I’m sorry this happened to you ash

All I can say is don’t sweat it. The truth is that while you have been with him for close to 10 years, maybe the new bride doesn’t know your last name…or maybe she read in some wedding etiquette book somewhere that if they are not married, you extend the invite to the guy plus guest. I don’t know…but there could be reasons other than vindictive reasons, you know? Etiquette says that you are supposed to address to both but maybe she just wasn’t aware??
I wouldn’t sweat it. The same thing happened to us and I didn’t see it as a big deal. My boyfriend was upset but it turns out that the girl (they had been dating for a year before getting married) couldn’t even remember my first name and didn’t bother to ask her fiance (my boyfriend’s cousin) for my name.

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 10:48:13 AM
Author: fieryred33143
I’m sorry this happened to you ash


All I can say is don’t sweat it. The truth is that while you have been with him for close to 10 years, maybe the new bride doesn’t know your last name…or maybe she read in some wedding etiquette book somewhere that if they are not married, you extend the invite to the guy plus guest. I don’t know…but there could be reasons other than vindictive reasons, you know? Etiquette says that you are supposed to address to both but maybe she just wasn’t aware??

I wouldn’t sweat it. The same thing happened to us and I didn’t see it as a big deal. My boyfriend was upset but it turns out that the girl (they had been dating for a year before getting married) couldn’t even remember my first name and didn’t bother to ask her fiance (my boyfriend’s cousin) for my name.

You''re totally right, thanks for your kind words.

It''s funny, it''s not that I am mad at his family or his cousin (the bride). Truly, I''m not. There were probably many reasons she may not have put my name on there (some you outlined above).

The part that made me upset was the obvious reminder that we are not an "official" couple, you know? Since we live our lives as such a real couple, as if we are married, I sometimes forget that others (or society) don''t see us that way necessarily. But there it was, in calligraphy..."and guest."

I don''t need validation from others that we are a good and real couple, I am just so looking forward to the day when he will be my FIANCE, not my boyfriend (better yet, husband!) and invites will be addressed to Mr. and Mrs.! This was just a piece of mail that was like: you aren''t there yet!

 

[fieryred33143]

Date: 7/2/2008 10:57:01 AM
Author: ash313
You''re totally right, thanks for your kind words.

It''s funny, it''s not that I am mad at his family or his cousin (the bride). Truly, I''m not. There were probably many reasons she may not have put my name on there (some you outlined above).

The part that made me upset was the obvious reminder that we are not an ''official'' couple, you know? Since we live our lives as such a real couple, as if we are married, I sometimes forget that others (or society) don''t see us that way necessarily. But there it was, in calligraphy...''and guest.''

I don''t need validation from others that we are a good and real couple, I am just so looking forward to the day when he will be my FIANCE, not my boyfriend (better yet, husband!) and invites will be addressed to Mr. and Mrs.! This was just a piece of mail that was like: you aren''t there yet!

I totally hear you on that one. I go through the same things sometimes. I remember one time where I was nearly in tears. We were at his grandmother’s house for dinner and she has a French poodle that is just this nasty little thing. But if she gets to know you, she can be really sweet. Well, this same cousin’s wife (they are now divorced BTW…only lasted maybe 8 months) tried to pet the dog and she barked. I went to the dog and said “hey calm down” and picked her up to take her away.

You know what she said??? “I can’t believe she likes you and not me. You’re not even family!!!”

I almost died. I try not to say anything to not cause problems and usually my boyfriend will speak up. But before he could, his father did.

It still stung…that was a quiet ride home.

 

[Lauren8211]

Date: 7/2/2008 11:15:50 AM
Author: fieryred33143

I totally hear you on that one. I go through the same things sometimes. I remember one time where I was nearly in tears. We were at his grandmother’s house for dinner and she has a French poodle that is just this nasty little thing. But if she gets to know you, she can be really sweet. Well, this same cousin’s wife (they are now divorced BTW…only lasted maybe 8 months) tried to pet the dog and she barked. I went to the dog and said “hey calm down” and picked her up to take her away.

You know what she said??? “I can’t believe she likes you and not me. You’re not even family!!!”

I almost died. I try not to say anything to not cause problems and usually my boyfriend will speak up. But before he could, his father did.

It still stung…that was a quiet ride home.

WOW, Fiery. I don''t know how you resisted the urge to smack her across the face!!

Good to know someone was there to stand up for you.

 

[fieryred33143]

I so wanted to throw something at her...I was considering letting the dog go bite her

But it was his grandmother’s birthday and for her sake I didn’t start any conflict. To be honest, I probably would not have said anything in front of the family. Plus she’s young. When this happened she had just turned 20. She was one of those 20 year olds that tried to come across as she was much older but ended up acting much younger. I think they broke up because she went away on vacation without him and slept with someone else. Very classy.

 

[princesss]

Actually, (and more mannerly people, please correct me if I''m wrong) the formal thing to do would be to include your name, because the proper thing to do is know the names of the people you are inviting to your wedding.

I''m sure it wasn''t intentional, but I''m sorry your feelings were hurt.

 

[robbie3982]

Wow, that''s really rude of them! Especially since you''ve been dating for 9 years!

 

[merlinthecat]

Do you ever talk about getting engaged Ash?

Everyone who is in a good relationship wants things to progress. Getting engaged, finding a home together, getting married and maybe even children too.

 

[lliang_chi]

Ash,

I can understand why you feel upset. In modern day etiquette, I think you''re supposed to write your name on the line below your SO''s. But oh well. Etiquette is dead these days, 1) no one knows what proper etiquette is, and 2) It''d probably just offend someone either way.

I''ve got a worse story. A good friend of mine, T, and her FI were invited to his cousin''s wedding. The invite went to his house and it had "and guest" on it. And my friend and her FI were engaged BEFORE this cousin, so it''s not like they didn''t know. T got pissed, T''s FI got pissed. Word went back to the bride''s mom in a polite way that T isn''t a "and guest" and she''s going to be family in a month. Bride''s mom said in return: "Well ACTUALLY, proper etiquette says that if a couple is not living together to address the invite as ''and guest''. That''s what you''re *supposed* to do." No apology, nothing.

The bride however did called T''s FI and apologized, so almost no harm.

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 11:58:14 AM
Author: merlinthecat
Do you ever talk about getting engaged Ash?


Everyone who is in a good relationship wants things to progress. Getting engaged, finding a home together, getting married and maybe even children too.

Yes, we do. I have picked out a ring and we have a timeline (will likely get engaged before the end of this year and married next winter - we are both in grad school).

And we''re considering buying a home when I graduate next spring, but we live together now.

You''re right that we all want things to progress, and things have certainly been progressing. Sometimes I am just so anxious for it to happen sooner!

 

[JulieN]

That was rude. Don''t feel bad, sweetie!

 

[fieryred33143]

Date: 7/2/2008 12:13:16 PM
Author: lliang_chi
Ash,

I can understand why you feel upset. In modern day etiquette, I think you''re supposed to write your name on the line below your SO''s. But oh well. Etiquette is dead these days, 1) no one knows what proper etiquette is, and 2) It''d probably just offend someone either way.

I''ve got a worse story. A good friend of mine, T, and her FI were invited to his cousin''s wedding. The invite went to his house and it had ''and guest'' on it. And my friend and her FI were engaged BEFORE this cousin, so it''s not like they didn''t know. T got pissed, T''s FI got pissed. Word went back to the bride''s mom in a polite way that T isn''t a ''and guest'' and she''s going to be family in a month. Bride''s mom said in return: ''Well ACTUALLY, proper etiquette says that if a couple is not living together to address the invite as ''and guest''. That''s what you''re *supposed* to do.'' No apology, nothing.

The bride however did called T''s FI and apologized, so almost no harm.

That''s actually true. If they aren''t living together then its addressed "and guest."

I think people take etiquette too seriously to be honest. If you know their name...then add it. If you don''t know, call and ask. There''s no sense in hurting someone''s feelings because a book told you that was the write way to do it. I mean really...is it that hard to say "hey how do you spell your girl''s name?" and add it on??

 

[Keepingthefaith21]

Date: 7/2/2008 10:57:01 AM
Author: ash313

The part that made me upset was the obvious reminder that we are not an 'official' couple, you know? Since we live our lives as such a real couple, as if we are married, I sometimes forget that others (or society) don't see us that way necessarily. But there it was, in calligraphy...'and guest.'

I don't need validation from others that we are a good and real couple, I am just so looking forward to the day when he will be my FIANCE, not my boyfriend (better yet, husband!) and invites will be addressed to Mr. and Mrs.! This was just a piece of mail that was like: you aren't there yet!

I think a lot of the ladies here understand where you are coming from. Let me tell you from personal expeirence, it's no better a feeling when you do get mail that is addressed Mr. and Mrs. when you are not married.

About a year or so ago someone thought it would be funny if they dropped my name and address at a bridal expo. They figured it was a way of giving my SO a little nudge. For MONTHS I got letters and post cards and mailings from local vendors that all said "Congratulations on your engagement!". The first few I opened I shrugged off but the following weeks of endless reminders that I wasn't engaged or planning a wedding began to wear me down. Looking back it was probably during that time when my LIWitis reached its peak. Luckily things have eased up...a lot!

I'm sure the invite was an oversight and nothing more than trying to follow some dictation of etiquette. It could have been worse...it could have been just his name on the invite

 

[Guilty Pleasure]

Date: 7/2/2008 12:13:16 PM
Author: lliang_chi
Ash,


I can understand why you feel upset. In modern day etiquette, I think you''re supposed to write your name on the line below your SO''s. But oh well. Etiquette is dead these days, 1) no one knows what proper etiquette is, and 2) It''d probably just offend someone either way.


I''ve got a worse story. A good friend of mine, T, and her FI were invited to his cousin''s wedding. The invite went to his house and it had ''and guest'' on it. And my friend and her FI were engaged BEFORE this cousin, so it''s not like they didn''t know. T got pissed, T''s FI got pissed. Word went back to the bride''s mom in a polite way that T isn''t a ''and guest'' and she''s going to be family in a month. Bride''s mom said in return: ''Well ACTUALLY, proper etiquette says that if a couple is not living together to address the invite as ''and guest''. That''s what you''re *supposed* to do.'' No apology, nothing.

The bride however did called T''s FI and apologized, so almost no harm.

Someone should have let that mother know that actually, the appropriate thing to do would have been to send T her own invitation to her own home and not include an "and guest" on FI''s invitation. I understand people not wanting to spend extra money on lots of invitations - some of my invitations come to my SO''s house with our names listed together. However, if that woman is going to get uppity about etiquette, then bring her back down a notch! It is always better to list the person''s name instead of making them an "and guest".

OP - I know what you mean about the internal slap in the face. I''ve known my guy for 6 years (dated on and off), so it feels blech getting little reminders like that. On the reverse, it made me really happy when the last wedding invitation came to both of us and not just him and a guest. If you are living together, there really is no reason she shouldn''t have taken the time to find out your full name, but brides can get tunnel vision!

 

[Blair138]

Ash-I TOTALLY RELATE!!! My (now) FI''s cousin got married in March-I went to the bridal shower and have been in the family as long as her-I believe my name was on the invite BUT my name was spelled wrong on my placecard-it irked me so much to know she didn''t care to even double check-and it''s not like my name is hard to spell.

The invite thing has happened SO MANY TIMES I cannot even count anymore-I used to get really upset and would tell my BF "guess I''m not family" or "who you gonna take?"-I eventually got over it but it sucks big time-hang in there

 

[purrfectpear]

Sounds like some of this angst is misplaced anger?

If you are living together isn''t it your SO who has put you in the position of not being Mrs. or FI?

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 3:28:09 PM
Author: purrfectpear
Sounds like some of this angst is misplaced anger?


If you are living together isn''t it your SO who has put you in the position of not being Mrs. or FI?

I can see where you might think that, but I would have to respectfully disagree. To your first point, I am not "angry" with anyone, nor am I experiencing angst. Just excited for the day when I won''t be an "and guest." When you know your relationship is so strong and committed (to you) and you as a couple recognize it as such, and the family has known you for nearly 10 years and you have been present at every holiday, funeral, function, etc. and then are reminded by an "and guest" designation that your relationship is not always recognized by others as such, it is sometimes hard.

To your second point, SO has not "put" me in any situation that I haven''t chosen to be in,
or rather, that we haven''t chosen as a couple. We are very clear about our intentions with each other. Which are: totally committed to each other and ready to be married, and wanting the proposal to be a special surprise.

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate your willingness to read between the lines and search for insight.

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 3:16:21 PM
Author: Blair138
Ash-I TOTALLY RELATE!!! My (now) FI''s cousin got married in March-I went to the bridal shower and have been in the family as long as her-I believe my name was on the invite BUT my name was spelled wrong on my placecard-it irked me so much to know she didn''t care to even double check-and it''s not like my name is hard to spell.


The invite thing has happened SO MANY TIMES I cannot even count anymore-I used to get really upset and would tell my BF ''guess I''m not family'' or ''who you gonna take?''-I eventually got over it but it sucks big time-hang in there

Thanks, Blair

That''s the way I approach it, too, with a light heart and humor. We sometimes even joke around with it and say "Will you go to this important family wedding with me? They''re allowing me to bring a guest, and I think it''s time you met them." Hahaha...oh, well!

 

[Anna0499]

Date: 7/2/2008 3:42:06 PM
Author: ash313

Date: 7/2/2008 3:28:09 PM
Author: purrfectpear
Sounds like some of this angst is misplaced anger?


If you are living together isn''t it your SO who has put you in the position of not being Mrs. or FI?

I can see where you might think that, but I would have to respectfully disagree. To your first point, I am not ''angry'' with anyone, nor am I experiencing angst. Just excited for the day when I won''t be an ''and guest.'' When you know your relationship is so strong and committed (to you) and you as a couple recognize it as such, and the family has known you for nearly 10 years and you have been present at every holiday, funeral, function, etc. and then are reminded by an ''and guest'' designation that your relationship is not always recognized by others as such, it is sometimes hard.

To your second point, SO has not ''put'' me in any situation that I haven''t chosen to be in,
or rather, that we haven''t chosen as a couple. We are very clear about our intentions with each other. Which are: totally committed to each other and ready to be married, and wanting the proposal to be a special surprise.

Thanks for your reply, I appreciate your willingness to read between the lines and search for insight.

To be fair, you did say you were here "venting" so that''s probably why she, upon reading your OP, thought you were upset about something. I think you answered your own concerns in the above post...perhaps you are more frustrated at still being an "and guest" instead of a FI/DW & because the invitation reminded you of it you felt a bit heated at the invitor. Honestly, I don''t understand why people even care how they are referred to in other people''s invitations unless it is clearly disrespectful. It''s not that big of a deal. What if you were unable to go and your SO wanted to bring a friend/non-invited family/friend? Not inviting you at ALL when they know you''ve been with your SO for 9+ years would be rude but simply referring to you as his guest probably wouldn''t have evoked such "venting" if you were not a LIW. Also, because it is your SO''s cousin who is in no way related to you (yet), I would cut him/her some slack...sounds like they have enough to stress over with a formal wedding in the works without worrying about who they will unintentionally offend with their wedding invitations who will be seen by no one but the invitee.

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 4:00:06 PM
Author: IndyGirl22

Date: 7/2/2008 3:42:06 PM

Author: ash313

Date: 7/2/2008 3:28:09 PM

Author: purrfectpear

Sounds like some of this angst is misplaced anger?



If you are living together isn''t it your SO who has put you in the position of not being Mrs. or FI?

I can see where you might think that, but I would have to respectfully disagree. To your first point, I am not ''angry'' with anyone, nor am I experiencing angst. Just excited for the day when I won''t be an ''and guest.'' When you know your relationship is so strong and committed (to you) and you as a couple recognize it as such, and the family has known you for nearly 10 years and you have been present at every holiday, funeral, function, etc. and then are reminded by an ''and guest'' designation that your relationship is not always recognized by others as such, it is sometimes hard.


To your second point, SO has not ''put'' me in any situation that I haven''t chosen to be in,

or rather, that we haven''t chosen as a couple. We are very clear about our intentions with each other. Which are: totally committed to each other and ready to be married, and wanting the proposal to be a special surprise.


Thanks for your reply, I appreciate your willingness to read between the lines and search for insight.

To be fair, you did say you were here ''venting'' so that''s probably why she, upon reading your OP, thought you were upset about something. I think you answered your own concerns in the above post...perhaps you are more frustrated at still being an ''and guest'' instead of a FI/DW & because the invitation reminded you of it you felt a bit heated at the invitor. Honestly, I don''t understand why people even care how they are referred to in other people''s invitations unless it is clearly disrespectful. It''s not that big of a deal. What if you were unable to go and your SO wanted to bring a friend/non-invited family/friend? Not inviting you at ALL when they know you''ve been with your SO for 9+ years would be rude but simply referring to you as his guest probably wouldn''t have evoked such ''venting'' if you were not a LIW. Also, because it is your SO''s cousin who is in no way related to you (yet), I would cut him/her some slack...sounds like they have enough to stress over with a formal wedding in the works without worrying about who they will unintentionally offend with their wedding invitations who will be seen by no one but the invitee.

You''re absolutely right, thank you for clearing up that I was, in fact, venting. Of course I am not mad at his family, and even said that in my OP, that I don''t blame them at all.

It was simply a reminder that I am not, in fact, a part of his family, and am so excited and anxious for when I will be. A simple case of cognitive dissonance (recognizing that I am not yet where I will be). That''s all!

Being a LIW is a precarious time in one''s life, and reactions to situations like this are not always completely proper, ethical, morally correct, etc. But that''s the whole point of this forum, that we share our lived experiences AS WE LIVE THEM, and not as they "should" be. So I posted to say: "hey all, here''s what I experienced, here was my reaction, do others ever feel the same way?" NOT to say: "Here''s what happened, please tell me how I ''should'' react or what I ''should'' feel."

So, while you may not "understand why people even care" or it may not be "that big of a deal" to you, at that exact moment, it was to me, and I cared.

Also, sorry if I get a bit defensive. I am still new to the forum world, so my description of why I posted was mine, and may not be the definition of this community. Still learning...

Thanks for responding! I appreciate the opportunity to share our experiences together

 

[fieryred33143]

Ash--I wouldn''t apologize for getting defensive.

A lot of times people come on to the LIW forum and pick apart relationships. Your vents turn into misplaced anger, they ask you to seek out the "true" reason why you are upset. Truth is that sometimes a vent is just a vent. And for some ladies that are already married or engaged or who did not have to wait as long as others have, they forget that they were once a LIW as well. It isn''t fair that posts turn into something where we are defending ourselves, our future spouses, or our future in-laws.

It was merely venting over something that could have been fixed if this person would have practiced some common courtesy...not a secret read between the lines testament to how you feel about the relationship.

I don''t thin there is anyone that wouldn''t get defensive when someone is questioning their relationship. I know I have and I will every time. It''s human nature

 

[ash313]

Date: 7/2/2008 4:27:34 PM
Author: fieryred33143
Ash--I wouldn''t apologize for getting defensive.


A lot of times people come on to the LIW forum and pick apart relationships. Your vents turn into misplaced anger, they ask you to seek out the ''true'' reason why you are upset. Truth is that sometimes a vent is just a vent. And for some ladies that are already married or engaged or who did not have to wait as long as others have, they forget that they were once a LIW as well. It isn''t fair that posts turn into something where we are defending ourselves, our future spouses, or our future in-laws.


It was merely venting over something that could have been fixed if this person would have practiced some common courtesy...not a secret read between the lines testament to how you feel about the relationship.


I don''t thin there is anyone that wouldn''t get defensive when someone is questioning their relationship. I know I have and I will every time. It''s human nature

You are amazing, and totally get me

Thanks for your kindness! I was glad you shared your story about the dog - I have had similar comments from girls married to SO''s cousins....and I have known their husbands far longer than they have, lol!

I will resist the need to defend in the future, I think. Getting into that sort of a conversation is not what I joined the forum for, really. Just support from others in the unique situation we are in! Thanks again!

 

[tessari]

One of my friends sent an invitation to me and "guest" even tho she had known my BF for years. I was upset that she did not acknowledge my boyfriend--so I know what you mean. For the longest time my out of town friends would not "validate" our relationship--they would always ask "So, are you still with the BF?" and I always got the feeling they thought we wouldn''t last. It''s pretty annoying.

 

[bee*]

Date: 7/2/2008 11:49:54 AM
Author: robbie3982
Wow, that''s really rude of them! Especially since you''ve been dating for 9 years!

ditto!

 

[Deelight]

Date: 7/2/2008 3:16:21 PM
Author: Blair138
Ash-I TOTALLY RELATE!!! My (now) FI''s cousin got married in March-I went to the bridal shower and have been in the family as long as her-I believe my name was on the invite BUT my name was spelled wrong on my placecard-it irked me so much to know she didn''t care to even double check-and it''s not like my name is hard to spell.


The invite thing has happened SO MANY TIMES I cannot even count anymore-I used to get really upset and would tell my BF ''guess I''m not family'' or ''who you gonna take?''-I eventually got over it but it sucks big time-hang in there

FF''s extended family mis-spell my name ALL THE TIME, it is funny after 10 years ya thunk they would have got it already

, I always get interesting variations as well.

I actually find it a little amusing and think of it as a game, how have they butchered my name this time LOL.

 

[katamari]

Wow! I am so sorry to hear about all of the LIWs whose BFs families do not recognize their relationships and do such nasty things because they are not married. It wouldn''t make me in any rush to join the family, honestly. Hugs, gals