Cut score on Enchanted Diamonds website

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Not determined to have the last word - determined to have the truth brought to light.

I do understand what the ACA is, its a brand marketed to consumers. You can try to make it more than it is - but its just a registered trademark.

Also - I would say you're not being transparent in your post processing answer.

How do your diamond images have a gradient and reflect on the surface if this is not done with post processing?



AGS is using computer generated ASETs - you are using photo captured ASETs? What does that have to do with black and white backgrounds and post processing?

 

[Ella]

Gentlemen, if you want to continue this conversation please cut out the name calling. Not appropriate or professional.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Not determined to have the last word - determined to have the truth brought to light.

I do understand what the ACA is, its a brand marketed to consumers. You can try to make it more than it is - but its just a registered trademark.

Also - I would say you're not being transparent in your post processing answer.

How do your diamond images have a gradient and reflect on the surface if this is not done with post processing?



AGS is using computer generated ASETs - you are using photo captured ASETs? What does that have to do with black and white backgrounds and post processing?

Its admirable of you to be determined to bring the truth to light. But I think you need to do a little homework before annointing yourself as the torch bearer. Many of your statements show a lack of understanding of pretty fundamental things.

I'm not the one here calling names or casting aspersions. I am the one attempting to answer your questions. But something tells me a search for the truth this is not.

 

[Rockdiamond]

HI Joshua,
Again, I commend you for sticking around to defend(?) your position. If nothing else that takes guts considering the weakness of that position..
The discussion about cut scores may prompt some important discussion. Also an interesting discussion of virtual versus real inventory.

Having said that, you're taking a very bad tact for yourself.
WF is a very well respected company- they have earned that here and in a broader sense.
Neil has also earned respect here over the course of many years.
Paul is widely acknowledged as one of the top cutters in the field. With good cause.


Instead of baseless attacks on others, you could be using this as an opportunity to learn how to improve your standing here, as well as your site, if that is your goal.

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Hi Gents,

Im not defending anything - Im pointing out what might not be obvious to average folks who are shopping for diamonds day to day.

It seems like everyone from the trade is upset of me pointing out inherent flaws in their business models, their ethos and practices.

What position have I taken RockDiamond? That holding inventory is an inherently flawed business model that is not pro-consumer?

Yes I defend that position.

WF - from what I know was started by Brian Gavin - a man I admire very much - surely his impact will be lasting on the company.

Neil - I just asked questions about his relationship with PDA, B2C, WhiteFlash - and remaining an independent appraiser.

Paul - Im sure he is but, he keeps bringing up the fact that diamonds hes bought are in my database - so I asked - how could that be if indeed you are cutting your own diamonds. It sounds like some recutting is being done in that case?

I asked questions - I posed ideas - I offered challenges.

Ive spoken to at least 2 dozen folks in the last 48 hours who whole heartedly thanked me for standing up here (in PS) and protecting the interest of consumers and not giving into any of the bashing or bullying.

Like I said - I only bend my knee for consumers.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Not determined to have the last word - determined to have the truth brought to light.

I do understand what the ACA is, its a brand marketed to consumers. You can try to make it more than it is - but its just a registered trademark.

Also - I would say you're not being transparent in your post processing answer.

How do your diamond images have a gradient and reflect on the surface if this is not done with post processing?



AGS is using computer generated ASETs - you are using photo captured ASETs? What does that have to do with black and white backgrounds and post processing?

I am staying out of this bait and switch and cut grading debate, but for the record WF have bought some products for photography and video that I have been part of the development team.
The post production reflection is added automatically by software developed by very smart engineers. There is no operator decisions and the tools are designed to show diamonds for what they are.
http://www.lexusindia.in/products/gb-dibox.aspx
http://www.lexusindia.in/products/gb-ViBOX.aspx

 

[Laila619]

As a consumer, good value for me is the bottom line. I do not need to buy a diamond from a company who owns all their inventory and has their own branded cuts. That is fine if you are a diamond novice and you don't know what a crown angle or a pavilion angle is and so you want to just pick any branded stone and know it will be pretty. But for people who actually understand diamond cut and understand nuances/"flavors" of diamonds, and how a diamond with a pavilion angle of 41.2 will differ from a stone with a pav of 40.7--they can shop and choose from virtual inventory, get a beautiful stone, and save a LOT of money in the process. Branded cuts aren't necessary when you know what you're doing and know what to buy. If I buy a virtual stone with a GIA ex or AGS ideal cut, Table 56, Crown 34.8, Pav 40.7, Depth 61.9, virtually no one will be able to distinguish it from an ACA/BGD/CBI etc. on my hand. So I appreciate places that only have a virtual inventory and can offer me better pricing.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I'd prefer buying from an "in-house vendor" b/c most of them do offer a better upgrade policy compared to virtual vendors, Butttt I have yet to upgrade a stone...

 

[Dancing Fire]

Also Im really looking forward to the "Times Square Challenge" - Im really hoping CBI, WhiteFlash, B2C and other sponsors who are touting their high performance/aca/perfection diamonds/other branded premium priced cuts - will come together and compete - Im not sure why this always gets ignored.

If Time Square is inconvenient we can manage to find another location - I offered to do this last year at the Las Vegas show. We can agree to hold the competition there if you like. If anyone wants to take me up on this challenge do let me know so we can select a venue and organize permits and security.

Should I book a flight to NYC?...

 

[denverappraiser]

Neil - I just asked questions about his relationship with PDA, B2C, WhiteFlash - and remaining an independent appraiser.

True enough. That's what you did. That is, in fact, your first and only response, even though it has nothing whatever to do with the subject at hand. But just to make sure it's been answered clearly (again), PDA is a client. I have no business relationship whatever with B2C, Whiteflash or for that matter, either Pricescope or Enchanted.

 

[Rockdiamond]

As a consumer, good value for me is the bottom line. I do not need to buy a diamond from a company who owns all their inventory and has their own branded cuts. That is fine if you are a diamond novice and you don't know what a crown angle or a pavilion angle is and so you want to just pick any branded stone and know it will be pretty. But for people who actually understand diamond cut and understand nuances/"flavors" of diamonds, and how a diamond with a pavilion angle of 41.2 will differ from a stone with a pav of 40.7--they can shop and choose from virtual inventory, get a beautiful stone, and save a LOT of money in the process. Branded cuts aren't necessary when you know what you're doing and know what to buy. If I buy a virtual stone with a GIA ex or AGS ideal cut, Table 56, Crown 34.8, Pav 40.7, Depth 61.9, virtually no one will be able to distinguish it from an ACA/BGD/CBI etc. on my hand. So I appreciate places that only have a virtual inventory and can offer me better pricing.

You make very solid points Laila- in fact this aspect has made round diamonds almost a "commodity".
Of course reading here on PS you'll find disputes about which exact set of specs is "best"- but in general, most consumers can use GIA or AGSL cut grading to get a great Round Brilliant Cut Diamond comfortably- which lessens the value a dealer can add- not negates, but lessens. There's still value as in DF's point about trade up, and the fact the clearly a subset of folks truly care about the extra care put into a CBI/ACA etc.
What about fancy shapes- ANY fancy shape?

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Should I book a flight to NYC?...

I hope so - Im still waiting for my challenge to be accepted by the competition... Always get radio silence on this topic though...

**edited by moderator, no competition bashing please**

How is any of this consumer oriented or friendly - logistically speaking its not very easy to insure and return a diamond AND THEY (the vendors) KNOW THIS.

Laila - I think most folks (women and men) are with you on this - as am I. I think offering both is great (virtual and in-house). I know our clients appreciate the ability to have some in-office selections (which are still in fact virtual) that they can see in person and others know they can get amazing values by cutting out middlemen.

The cut score is all about empowering consumers. Which Im sure keeps the competition up at night. That is why the resort to scare tactics of yesteryears... **edited by moderator, no competition bashing please**

RockDiamond - with fancy shapes and fancy colors can't consumers use ASET's, specs and facet arrangements and then see the diamonds in person and decide? Certainly if the vendor they are purchasing from offers free return shipping? You speak of value adds - but at what cost? Why resort to scare tactics?

Silver surfers and millennials alike don't take well to it - because they just dont buy it - education and the internet has taken its grasp on the diamond industry and will not let go.

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Neil - I just asked questions about his relationship with PDA, B2C, WhiteFlash - and remaining an independent appraiser.

True enough. That's what you did. That is, in fact, your first and only response, even though it has nothing whatever to do with the subject at hand. But just to make sure it's been answered clearly (again), PDA is a client. I have no business relationship whatever with B2C, Whiteflash or for that matter, either Pricescope or Enchanted.

Neil, while I appreciate you drawing a line between yourself and PDA and its selection of vendors - the content on the site suggests otherwise:

Our PDA Experts are foremost diamond authorities and leading contributors to public advice websites. They are unrivaled in gemology and diamond cut-quality assessment, and intrinsically motivated to assist you.
Our Approved Vendors have met the PDA’s criteria for superior diamond information, customer service, products and craftsmanship, as well as generous policies, benefits and long-term client care.
Our Selectivity Criteria means your PDA expert has the information needed to make the best diamond judgments for your benefit.
The PDA is even a free service when you claim your PDA Credit with any of our Vendors.

Your clarification reads more like circumvention. Taken from the FAQ:

The PDA receives participation fees from our Approved Vendors on a uniform and equal schedule. Your PDA Expert receives a flat-fee, whether you purchase or not. No worries.

Another expert is John Pollard of CBI (who works for/with Paul-Antwerp) - who if I understand correctly is the brother of Brian Pollard - of B2CJewels.com.

Consumers likely dont know any of this but it all seems incestuous. And while you may want to remain an independent appraiser - its difficult without the proper disclosures IMO.

The reason I brought any of this up is in response to your post about Enchanted - if you remained independent and objective you wouldn't have said what you said or participated in the thread at all.

 

[John P]

... Another expert is John Pollard of CBI (who works for/with Paul-Antwerp) - who if I understand correctly is the brother of Brian Pollard - of B2CJewels.com. Consumers likely dont know any of this but it all seems incestuous. ...

Hi Joshua,

Correct. I’m the United States Director for Crafted by Infinity. It's my primary duty. I'm also a consultant for several industry entities, a presenter at trade conferences and an advisor in other educational endeavors.

Regarding B2C Jewels: They had a bumpy first-entry into Pricescope years ago. The principals asked PS Admin how to better-serve the community and they wound up contacting me. They’re good people and I was happy to give advice. Gaining traction, they asked me to suggest someone to represent them on the forum. My brother Brian was interested, so I put them together and bowed out. I’m proud of his contributions (and jealous of his hair). [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/scenes-from-jck-2014.202525/page-3#post-3686194#p3686194']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/scenes-from-jck-2014.202525/page-3#post-3686194#p3686194[/URL]

Regarding the PDA: It was launched as a resource for consumers who prefer not to post on public forums. The flat-fee concept (rather than commission) was to set the PDA apart from other "diamond advice" sites steering consumers to whatever seller offers most commission or makes some undisclosed backdoor deal. Neil and I both gave advice in the setup of the site. That being said, the PDA has been a labor of love. My time is donated. I have not made a penny. When consumer Qs arrive they are pointed to possible options with PDA approved sellers, when such options exist. Follow-up is in the consumer’s hands.

The intent of the projects above has been to facilitate and grow the esprit de corps of Pricescope, in which I strongly believe.

Regarding "Incestuous": Fair enough. My professional jewelry journey began on this site. Many heroes post here. Many consumer regulars have my respect and admiration. Many trade members have become friends and resources. And yes, I collaborate with a number of these people - including some you might see as my "competition." I consider them equals. We don’t always see eye to eye but that’s ok. In the end I believe there's room for everyone to be successful.

 

[Modified Brilliant]

To quote Shakespeare:

"For Joshua, Neil, Bryan, John, Paul, David, and others are ALL honorable men.
So are they all, all honorable men.
Come I to speak in Pricescope forum."

 

[nojs]

Following this debate has been more useful than I would have thought. I have a much better understanding about the nature of the trade than before, so thank you all!

My sympathies go to Joshua, who seems to be a bit of an underdog in this debate. I'm not at all convinced of the cut score on Enchanted diamonds' website, but I would be - strangely enough - more inclined to buy from them than before, given the right diamond.

As an attorney, I would advise you all to build your "case" to its own merits and forget about belittling others.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Following this debate has been more useful than I would have thought. I have a much better understanding about the nature of the trade than before, so thank you all!

My sympathies go to Joshua, who seems to be a bit of an underdog in this debate. I'm not at all convinced of the cut score on Enchanted diamonds' website, but I would be - strangely enough - more inclined to buy from them than before, given the right diamond.

As an attorney, I would advise you all to build your "case" to its own merits and forget about belittling others.

Interesting perspective!
Just curious, but what did you learn from this thread that would make you more inclined to buy from Enchanted?

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Following this debate has been more useful than I would have thought. I have a much better understanding about the nature of the trade than before, so thank you all!

My sympathies go to Joshua, who seems to be a bit of an underdog in this debate. I'm not at all convinced of the cut score on Enchanted diamonds' website, but I would be - strangely enough - more inclined to buy from them than before, given the right diamond.

As an attorney, I would advise you all to build your "case" to its own merits and forget about belittling others.

As a lawyer - you would understand the desire/need and actually a duty to my company to protect our intellectual property and our "magic black box" - which my competitors are upset over the fact that I wont tell them how it works.

My CTO actually wanted to come up and post here and I stopped him as I felt it would disclose far too much IP.

Pointing out my competitors shortcomings or flaws is just a defense to their meritless and baseless attacks - it feels like Im in a schoolyard in kindergarten and being bullied by my peers. Who love to say, Im not as "cool" as them and that their widget is better than my widget and actually Im not a human, Im an alien my parents found out in a field - and I cant sit with them.

There is plenty more I could point out about the vendors here (and their practices), the people behind the vendors, but I keep my mouth closed for two reasons. 1. Because I'd like to be let out of time out and be allowed to advertise on PriceScope. 2. I am not held to the same standards - the vendors are all violating the forum rules by even commenting on this thread. No matter what I do, it feels like Ill always be treated as a leper here.

Also, I appreciate your sympathy but I don't feel its necessary as I feel that my thoughts and process resonate with the majority -

To correct a misconception: we dont even advocate that you shop solely by our cut score - you can talk to us, look at ASET images, IdealScope images, H&A images etc **edited by moderator, no promoting** If you check our cut score info page it says:

We always recommend speaking with one of our experts to help weigh your own set of unique preferences. We also encourage taking advantage of any additional information that may be available for a diamond that may better help you make a confident and educated buying decision. These include but are not limited to ASET, IdealScope, and Hearts & Arrows images.

A link was posted to the cut score calculator page but not its information page so if anyone reads that page they would get a general explanation and understanding for how it works and our philosophy behind it.

 

[Dancing Fire]

[quote="JoshuaNiamehr|

To correct a misconception: we dont even advocate that you shop solely by our cut score - you can talk to us, look at ASET images, IdealScope images, H&A images etc **edited by moderator, no promoting** If you check our cut score info page it says:

We always recommend speaking with one of our experts to help weigh your own set of unique preferences. We also encourage taking advantage of any additional information that may be available for a diamond that may better help you make a confident and educated buying decision. These include but are not limited to ASET, IdealScope, and Hearts & Arrows images.

I can't view any GIA report w/o creating an account on your website?...

 

[Serg]

Following this debate has been more useful than I would have thought. I have a much better understanding about the nature of the trade than before, so thank you all!

My sympathies go to Joshua, who seems to be a bit of an underdog in this debate. I'm not at all convinced of the cut score on Enchanted diamonds' website, but I would be - strangely enough - more inclined to buy from them than before, given the right diamond.

As an attorney, I would advise you all to build your "case" to its own merits and forget about belittling others.

As a lawyer - you would understand the desire/need and actually a duty to my company to protect our intellectual property and our "magic black box" - which my competitors are upset over the fact that I wont tell them how it works.

My CTO actually wanted to come up and post here and I stopped him as I felt it would disclose far too much IP.

Pointing out my competitors shortcomings or flaws is just a defense to their meritless and baseless attacks - it feels like Im in a schoolyard in kindergarten and being bullied by my peers. Who love to say, Im not as "cool" as them and that their widget is better than my widget and actually Im not a human, Im an alien my parents found out in a field - and I cant sit with them.

There is plenty more I could point out about the vendors here (and their practices), the people behind the vendors, but I keep my mouth closed for two reasons. 1. Because I'd like to be let out of time out and be allowed to advertise on PriceScope. 2. I am not held to the same standards - the vendors are all violating the forum rules by even commenting on this thread. No matter what I do, it feels like Ill always be treated as a leper here.

Also, I appreciate your sympathy but I don't feel its necessary as I feel that my thoughts and process resonate with the majority -

To correct a misconception: we dont even advocate that you shop solely by our cut score - you can talk to us, look at ASET images, IdealScope images, H&A images etc **edited by moderator, no promoting** If you check our cut score info page it says:

We always recommend speaking with one of our experts to help weigh your own set of unique preferences. We also encourage taking advantage of any additional information that may be available for a diamond that may better help you make a confident and educated buying decision. These include but are not limited to ASET, IdealScope, and Hearts & Arrows images.

A link was posted to the cut score calculator page but not its information page so if anyone reads that page they would get a general explanation and understanding for how it works and our philosophy behind it.

{quote}

As a lawyer - you would understand the desire/need and actually a duty to my company to protect our intellectual property and our "magic black box" - which my competitors are upset over the fact that I wont tell them how it works.

{quote}

Please give any name of your competitor had been upset by your "Magic black box".
My opinion that the ""Magic black box"" gives score far away from real diamond performance . I can not understand how your competitors would be upset. they have to be happy to see it. they would be upset by your prices but not by your "Magic black box".

 

[Serg]

Hi "Emilly" ,
Nice to hear You again on PS.
one more bellicose question : Have all these diamonds similar Optical Performance for You?

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Although I hesitate to re-enter this thread due to the acrimonious turn of the discussion, I did want to make good on a promise to report back on the issue of star ratings showing on our Virtual Selection category listings. We reviewed it as a management team and concluded that it could be misleading in that, due to the nature of virtual listings, Whiteflash had not physically evaluated the stones- so rating them is a questionable undertaking.

We have therefore removed them from our diamond detail pages.

We do listen attentively to the pricescope community and we appreciate constructive criticism. Where we see improvements are possible we will do our best to make them.

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Serg,

Have you been reading this thread and up to date on this conversation? A competitor called it a magic black box... Not I. So any competitor who participated, I would count as being upset - they've made it pretty clear.

Also remember - we have plenty of ASET/IdealScope data and dimension data for fancy shapes. Many of which display diamonds using Octonus products. Which supports the accuracy of the cut score in fact.

Hi "Emilly" ,
Nice to hear You again on PS.
one more bellicose question : Have all these diamonds similar Optical Performance for You?

Who is "Emilly" that prompted you to post a screen shot - I dont see a quote or a reply or an original post?

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Although I hesitate to re-enter this thread due to the acrimonious turn of the discussion, I did want to make good on a promise to report back on the issue of star ratings showing on our Virtual Selection category listings. We reviewed it as a management team and concluded that it could be misleading in that, due to the nature of virtual listings, Whiteflash had not physically evaluated the stones- so rating them is a questionable undertaking.

We have therefore removed them from our diamond detail pages.

We do listen attentively to the pricescope community and we appreciate constructive criticism. Where we see improvements are possible we will do our best to make them.

Bryan,

I took another look with Google's Structured Data Tool. It seems as though the problem has not been solved across the board.

The microdata you are supposed to pass for a product is supposed to be actual product reviews of a specific product by clients. Not randomized data to boost reviews.

You are still passing a review rating of 5 (with 4 reviews) of ACA diamonds:

Same goes for rings - which seems to have a blend of real reviews and randomized reviews or no reviews at all but still all having 5 stars:

Id have the engineering team take another look at this if it were me.

 

[Serg]

Serg,

Have you been reading this thread and up to date on this conversation? A competitor called it a magic black box... Not I. So any competitor who participated, I would count as being upset - they've made it pretty clear.

Also remember - we have plenty of ASET/IdealScope data and dimension data for fancy shapes. Many of which display diamonds using Octonus products. Which supports the accuracy of the cut score in fact.

Joshua,

May I ask You to stop use Octonus name in attempt to validate "accuracy" your cut score?
there is not any connection between accuracy Octonus products and accuracy you cut score.

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Hi Serg,

Sure if the mod's would please remove the name - as I cant edit it.

All I meant by that statement was that we internally audit our cut score and its accuracy based on your products. This does not infer any relationship between Enchanted or your company to clarify. I should have been more concise with that.

I also do recommend your product to our suppliers on a regular basis its a great way to merchandise diamonds online.

 

[teobdl]

Speaking as a consumer:
1) ED listing diamonds that it has no ability to sell is more of a problem for ED than the other party. It frustrates a consumer who wants to purchase it. But the problem seems overblown. How many customers cross-search inventories for the exact same diamond? If anything, the biggest problem is simply "misrepresenting" the amount of inventory available to their customers; everyone does this to an extent with revolving inventories.
2) WF didn't believe in their rating system. Good on them to begin the process of removing it.
3) ED does believe in their rating algorithm. Good on them to keep it. Everyone is looking for differentiation, and frankly, it comes across as more scientific than others. For rounds, it seems to work pretty well given my limited to fair amount of knowledge of cut.
4) I'm looking forward to a trip to Times Square
5) I don't understand the relationship btw PDA and John and Niel and how it impacts what's happening on PS. Doesn't seem like an issue.

 

[Queenie60]

Speaking as a consumer:
1) ED listing diamonds that it has no ability to sell is more of a problem for ED than the other party. It frustrates a consumer who wants to purchase it. But the problem seems overblown. How many customers cross-search inventories for the exact same diamond? If anything, the biggest problem is simply "misrepresenting" the amount of inventory available to their customers; everyone does this to an extent with revolving inventories.
2) WF didn't believe in their rating system. Good on them to begin the process of removing it.
3) ED does believe in their rating algorithm. Good on them to keep it. Everyone is looking for differentiation, and frankly, it comes across as more scientific than others. For rounds, it seems to work pretty well given my limited to fair amount of knowledge of cut.
4) I'm looking forward to a trip to Times Square
5) I don't understand the relationship btw PDA and John and Niel and how it impacts what's happening on PS. Doesn't seem like an issue.

I say this!!!

All of you are good at what you do - you should just agree to disagree and cut the bs. Just my opinion.

 

[JoshuaNiamehr]

Speaking as a consumer:
1) ED listing diamonds that it has no ability to sell is more of a problem for ED than the other party. It frustrates a consumer who wants to purchase it. But the problem seems overblown. How many customers cross-search inventories for the exact same diamond? If anything, the biggest problem is simply "misrepresenting" the amount of inventory available to their customers; everyone does this to an extent with revolving inventories.
2) WF didn't believe in their rating system. Good on them to begin the process of removing it.
3) ED does believe in their rating algorithm. Good on them to keep it. Everyone is looking for differentiation, and frankly, it comes across as more scientific than others. For rounds, it seems to work pretty well given my limited to fair amount of knowledge of cut.
4) I'm looking forward to a trip to Times Square
5) I don't understand the relationship btw PDA and John and Niel and how it impacts what's happening on PS. Doesn't seem like an issue.

1. What diamonds do we list that we dont have the ability to sell? Im not sure where/how the information is being conveyed to you - but that is simply not the case. Diamonds may go on hold/out of stock while you are searching but the diamonds we list are updated every morning and then continuously throughout the day. The only misrepresentation being made is that we are misrepresenting. If you could elaborate on this I would greatly appreciate it - its certainly an issue Id like to nip in the butt, if it is in fact an issue.

2. I dont think its all said and done as I pointed in the post above.

3/4. Id love for a Time Square meet up but so far only two consumers have RSVP'd - no vendors to date. Any takers?

5. The relationship between PDA was only brought up because of the fact that these trade members participated in a thread once upon a time that said assigning GIA diamonds (fancy shapes and rounds) Ideal for rounds and any cut grade for fancy GIA shapes is disingenuous. We immediatly responded to the community, including trade members by updating our site and removing this. But a site these experts recommends continues this practice. Which is the pot calling the kettle black, certainly when you begin to participate in this specific thread and make assertions and claims that are false.

They recommend a site that does something you harshly criticized a company (ours) for openly.

 

[Paul-Antwerp]

Joshua,

You have used three pages now, attempting to confuse the issue I brought up about your cut-score, while totally ignoring the issue I brought up. In your last post, you are now frankly declaring that my observations are false. This obviously has me coming back with the original remark, which yoiu conveniently avoided addressing for three pages.

It is a fact that the 'freely available' cut-score of ED directs to the same diamond in their listings. While I see this as a violation of long-established trade-rules, it goes further than this.

Over the past months, I have been alerted to, checked and confirmed with the owner of the stone, that ED was listing stones they had absolutely no access to. These were never cases of an error or a delay in removing a stone from the listing. In each case, it was a blatant misrepresentation. Seeing such stones listed by ED at an incredibly low price, I can only conclude that they serve as bait in order to prove a competitive edge, while the intention is to switch to another stone to be sold.

Other than that disingenious use of the cut-score, the score as such does not interest me. Anybody doing the slightest bit of research knows that it cannot be very informational.

As for the Times Square-challenge, our B&M-retailers organize such challenges constantly. There is no need for you to ask for it as if it is new and revolutionary.

Live long,