Dilemma - I don''''t want kids and he does

[Maisie]

Date: 7/1/2009 12:52:25 PM
Author: purrfectpear
If you just don''t want kiddos that''s fine. Perfectly OK and a sound decision.


However, if you are OK with kids (your statement about adoption) and are just afraid of the birth part (your statement about tearing and ''putting your body through that''), then yes, sorry, you are a coward. A great big screaming coward.

There, I said it, now no one else will have to do the dirty work.

Grow up, get over it, your body isn''t some precious ming vase that has to be kept in pristine condition. Better hope life doesn''t hand you any other nasty surprises as there are plenty out there

. I had a miserable birth and I got over it. Several million women a year go through this experience. If you''ve decided you just aren''t that brave, then just put a big C on your chest and give your boyfriend the good news.

Wow PP. That was a bit harsh. I am scared of a lot of things. Its ok to be afraid, especially of something as unpredictable as giving birth.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 7/1/2009 4:40:40 PM
Author: Maisie

Date: 7/1/2009 12:52:25 PM
Author: purrfectpear
If you just don''t want kiddos that''s fine. Perfectly OK and a sound decision.


However, if you are OK with kids (your statement about adoption) and are just afraid of the birth part (your statement about tearing and ''putting your body through that''), then yes, sorry, you are a coward. A great big screaming coward.

There, I said it, now no one else will have to do the dirty work.

Grow up, get over it, your body isn''t some precious ming vase that has to be kept in pristine condition. Better hope life doesn''t hand you any other nasty surprises as there are plenty out there

. I had a miserable birth and I got over it. Several million women a year go through this experience. If you''ve decided you just aren''t that brave, then just put a big C on your chest and give your boyfriend the good news.

Wow PP. That was a bit harsh. I am scared of a lot of things. Its ok to be afraid, especially of something as unpredictable as giving birth.

I think she said it a little tongue in cheek, at least that''s how I read it.

I actually agree, though would have said it a little differently

Its totally okay to feel fear, but in my book you should never let your fears stop you from doing normal, healthy, positive things that you want to do -- like birthing a baby!

Celine, if you really don''t want kids, you need to tell your SO and end things... you can''t stay with him on the *possibility* that you may change your mind. It isn''t fair. But if it is just because you are afraid, well try to get over it, perhaps by talking to more women who have been through birth, by joining a women''s group, or through therapy. The femal body is made to give birth! Yup, there''s a possibility it will be difficult and maybe even traumatic for you. But there is actually a much much *greater* possibility that it will all be fine, you will heal well, and wonder what all the fuss was about! Yup, it is true -- far more labours and births are perfectly safe and normal than are dangerous and terrible!

 

[Maisie]

The rolling eyes and the annoyed face at the end don''t say to me that its tongue in cheek. Of course I could be misreading her. Its definitely possible. Its not like she is usually snarky or anything.

 

[purrfectpear]

Heck no I wasn''t kidding. Seriously? Seriously?

Someone is going to tell the man they love that they would rather adopt (super expensive, denying own child for nothing more than vanity and irrational fear) than bear a child. If that''s what OP really is saying, then yes my answer to her question of "am I a coward?" is you betcha babe.

There are a lot of reasonable reasons not to have a child.

Fear of "tearing down there" is not one of them in my book. Don''t you think a rational person would make some attempt to deal with an obviously abnormal fear through therapy before they''d tell the guy they were going to marry "sorry bub, my body parts aren''t going to stretch out for a baby, you just have to deal"?

Not to put too fine of a point on it, but that''s cowardice in my book.

The rest of you feel free to enable and sugar coat. You''re doing a fine job of it (now that was tongue in cheek)

 

[Dreamer_D]

PP I meant you were being purposely extreme to make your point, tongue in cheek in that sense, not that you didn't mean what you said. But in future I will be sure to simply let your comments stand on their own! ETA Hyperbole! That was the word I was looking for. The fine art of exaggeration to make a point. When I read your posts I feel like you are very deft at this style of argument, so my comment was meant as a compliment. But if you mean everything literally, well I can read it that way too, though it will be much less interesting.

 

[mausketeer]

I need a bit more information here. I'd be interested to know: How old are you? Your fiance? How long have you been together? How long engaged? Did you discuss children before you decided to get married? Like, REALLY discuss it? I'm a bit confused because your title says you DON'T want kids but then the body says you are "willing to adopt". Is the reason you say you don't want kids because of your fear of the physical trauma of giving birth? (hey, some people have phobias about things) If it's just the whole physical thing about the birth, then yes, I think you're being a little bit paranoid about it. To not have kids JUST because you're afraid when you're physically able to and your future husband wants biological children (and again, he is physically able to) seems kind of crazy to me. This is why I asked your age (I have a hunch you may be rather young). Or do you REALLY not want kids at ALL but you would be willing to "appease him" (and keep him?) by adopting? If it is the latter - DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN! You cannot in all good conscience marry someone who wants children and then have kids with them if you don't actually WANT them. That's just SO wrong! And totally unfair to your future husband, the future children, and yes, unfair to yourself too. You do not want to be five years into this marriage, holding a screaming baby and thinking to yourself "what have I done?" and RESENTING your life!

 

[trillionaire]

Celine,

Either way, you are going to deal with the unknown. Either the unknown of pregnancy, or the unknown of being single all over again and finding another great guy.

Have you thought of what you will do in the case of an unplanned pregnancy? It might be good to consider that, in your current situation.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

I''ve been back and forth on the adoption thing. My fiance was internationally adopted, and is a perfectly adjusted and smart and successful guy, never tried to even look for his biological parents. He says he thought adoption was perfectly normal as a kid and nothing unusual (he has another adopted sibling, and a few more siblings that were biologically born to his parents), and he never felt any angst or had any identity issues about it.

I haven''t done enough research to really make a decision about adopting, but I definitely want to look into it. I want biological children as well, but my fiance is a great example that you can adopt and biologically have kids if you''re committed to it. My biggest hurdle is my concern about my side of the family, my parents have openly admitted that they could never see an adopted child as "theirs", and my parents would be a big part of my children''s lives.

 

[roppongi]

Hi Celine....

Regarding your arm, have you thought about working with a physical therapist? They would definitely be able to help you, as there are exercises to faciliate movement.

If you are Catholic, the Church requires Pre-Cana prior to your wedding. These mariage preparation classes are very helpful and the questions that are asked are eye opening to say the least. It''s something that you should definitely look into with your FI.

I thought I would share with you my story.

I have two boys that are 6 years apart. During my emergency c-section with my fiirst, my doctor cut something that should not have been cut and having another child "naturally" was going to be difficult. When we decided to expand our family we looked into the adoption process and filled out the application, I also started the IVF process. When IVF worked 3 years later, we put a hold on the adoption proces (we are not ruling it out).

After my first labor and delivery I was a little scared, but it was passing. I asked not to go into labor the second time and was given a scheduled C-Section which was great. My section scar is so low, and so thin, I can still wear the smallest two piece and no one would ever know. That scar also represents my two biggest accomplishments and I would never give it up.

I am 5''0, my pre-preganancy weight was 96 pounds, I gained 70 pounds with each child. Twelve years later, I am still 5''0 tall, no longer 96 pounds, but a very healthy and happy 105. The weight comes off, your body changes, it''s a beautiful process.

Take your time, and don''t rush to the alter until you and your FI have hammered this out.

Roppongi

 

[upgrade]

Without reading through all the responses, I''d have to say if you don''t agree on this, don''t get married. You''re going to end up miserable if you disagree on something so enormous. It would be a deal breaker for me. One or both of you is going to end up resentful and angry and it could be too late to do anything about it by then. Having children (or adopting, or not having children) is probably the single most important, life altering decision you will ever make so you have to be in complete agreement on what to do.

 

[iwannaprettyone]

Date: 7/1/2009 9:36:20 AM
Author: NakedFinger
I have to agree with whitby. Adopting a child just because you ''dont like what carrying a child does to your body'' is not a good reason. Im sorry, but I think not having a child just because you dont want stretch marks, weight gain, a c-section scar (if needed) etc is selfish. If you dont want to have any kids, then that is your perogative, and you need to let your FI know that before you get married. However, if you are willing to adopt, then you are obviously willing to raise a child, so I dont think that is the issue.

I dont think a single woman can say she wasnt a little freaked out the first time getting pregnant and the whole process. You''ve never done it before, dont know what to expect, etc. Almost everyone I know what a little worried/uneasy/or plain FREAKED OUT, but its worth it, and we do it.

I am one of 6 kids, and my mom had to have a c-section ALL 6 TIMES! Thats six surgeries, 6 recoveries, and 6 scars. But she wouldnt have done it if the result wasnt the joy that it is.

Completely disagree- I think it is hasty to discount the physical toll it can put on a body. Some women never really recover from muscle weakness, bladder issues, etc.

I drive past an orphanage on my way home every day and DH and I have often discussed adopting versus having our own. I am not worried about the havok on my body as much as he is, we just realize that there are thousands of kids out there that need a mommy and daddy of their own and I know that many people feel they have the capacity to take that on.

 

[iwannaprettyone]

Oh and just to add... totally don''t think your a coward. I am glad you are addressing this now rather than later. PLUS- if your biological clock ever starts ticking I don''t think you will be caring about a few old dings in that body.

 

[cara]

Date: 7/2/2009 1:45:50 PM
Author: iwannaprettyone

Date: 7/1/2009 9:36:20 AM

Author: NakedFinger

I have to agree with whitby. Adopting a child just because you 'dont like what carrying a child does to your body' is not a good reason. Im sorry, but I think not having a child just because you dont want stretch marks, weight gain, a c-section scar (if needed) etc is selfish. If you dont want to have any kids, then that is your perogative, and you need to let your FI know that before you get married. However, if you are willing to adopt, then you are obviously willing to raise a child, so I dont think that is the issue.

Completely disagree- I think it is hasty to discount the physical toll it can put on a body. Some women never really recover from muscle weakness, bladder issues, etc.

If the only physical concerns are stretch marks, scars, and temporary weight gain, then yes those are selfish reasons to not want to be a parent. But two things:

1) Its totally OK to be "selfish" and not want to be a parent. I happen to think its also selfish to *want* to be a parent, its just that the person that wants to be a parent values the positives of being a parent more than the positives of remaining child-free, and is willing to pay the associated costs (or fails to fully consider the costs before bringing a child into their lives.) People should have kids because they *want them* and think that kids will bring joy and fulfillment to their own lives - not out of some desire to go through selfless sacrifices of physical pain, financial outlays and serious time investments. If one personally doesn't value the positives of having and raising a child enough to make the sacrifices worth it, then calling the person "selfish" doesn't really change the calculus. A willing parent is still selfish, they just have different things they value and want in their own life. And in a lot of nitty-gritty day-to-day choices, the parents have to put their kids first but are doing so for their own long-term reward of doing a good job raising children.

2) The OP actually had more serious fears about the physical effects than just cosmetic or temporary problems. Her fears may not be in proportion to their actual risk, and plenty of women get over similar fears, but this particular woman hasn't yet and may not and it doesn't help to minimize or trivialize her fears. She is afraid of major abdominal surgery - sounds reasonable, even if many people come out just fine on the other side. She is afraid of trauma to her neither regions - aren't we all? I mean, if before sending his child home from the hospital, the average guy was told that they were going to bash his family jewels until bloody, sit on his bladder until seriously bruised, and then put some small precautionary slits in his perenium, tear them a little further, and then stitch them back up and don't worry - it'll all be back to normal in 6 weeks or 6 month or um, opps, never quite back to normal, how many guys would be a little more interested in adoption?

Back to the OP: I think other people have covered this pretty well, but you owe it to your guy to figure out if you really want to raise kids. That is the huge issue - is that something you want as part of your life and will value as its a huge commitment and a dealbreaker for so many. If you decide you want kids (not just 'willing' to adopt) then you owe it to him and yourself to research childbirth and pregnancy issues and address your fears. I actually know someone who didn't want kids for this reason and I think, as long as you have done your homework and due diligence, and considered your husband's position and desires as well, then you can look at other ways to be a parent besides the usual route. There are always foster kids, surrogate moms, and adoption. Plenty of ways to become a parent, if that is your passion. If not, you owe it to your guy and potential future kids to discuss this sooner rather than later.

 

[rockpaperscissors67]

Back in 1988, when I was 20, I told my mother I never wanted to have kids. Three months later, I was pregnant with my oldest and scared beyond belief (but also pretty darn excited!). Twenty-one years later, I''m now 41 and pregnant with #6. I don''t love being pregnant, but I absolutely love raising kids (mine are now 20, 15, 14, 9 and 2).

I don''t think there''s anything wrong with simply not wanting kids. Parenting isn''t for everyone. If fear of childbirth is the only thing holding you back, perhaps educating yourself would help? There are a lot of great books about pregnancy available (and a lot of not great books!).

Some women love to scare other women with their horror stories. "I was in labor for 350 hours and finally, I just grabbed a steak knife and did the c-section myself!" Yeah, not everyone has an experience like that. Your friend''s experience of tearing is not necessarily going to be YOUR experience.

I don''t think there''s anything wrong with you for being fearful of childbirth since it''s a complete unknown. Every woman deals with that fear, no matter if it''s her first pregnancy or she''s done it a bunch of times. I''m planning another homebirth and I''m afraid that something will go wrong and I''ll end up in the hospital with a c-section.

I doubt this is something that you and your FI are going to solve yourselves because neither of you have experience in this area. You''re just both going on your gut instincts. Maybe you could agree to table the decision until you have both learned more about pregnancy and childbirth? I''d recommend seeing if there''s a midwife in your area that you could go talk to.

The reason I recommend a midwife is that most of them have a positive view of childbirth, but not all OBs do. Midwives believe in womens'' bodies abilities and they see childbirth as a normal, wonderful part of life -- not something to be dreaded, something just to get through, something to endure for the sake of having a baby.

I know you''re in a tough place.

 

[Mara]

celine, you sound incredibly young. if that is the case...then you may not really know what you want to do just yet. you may think you do, but it CAN change. i know a lot of women who didn''t want to have kids or weren''t sure and they stayed that way for YEARS. but later in life you might decide differently. i would venture to say you are not quite sure just yet...not quite like some women who say no i know for sure i will never want children. usually those women don''t want kids for many other reasons than possible trauma to your body.

honestly when it comes to you and your fiance, i would be honest with him. say i am not sure i will ever be ready to have a child of our own. is this a deal breaker? you should be honest and up front and in the end that is all you can do. for some men that would be a deal breaker, luckily for me, i was not sure and my husband was not quite sure so we both were not quite sure so we were at least on the same page about that!

carrying a child IS scary to think about. the things it does to your body, the loss of control you have over something previously ''yours''. i have heard some horror stories about women who were damaged beyond belief when it comes to delivering the child. but in reality those cases are most likely far and few between. might it take a while to heal? probably. some heal faster than others. i have a friend who was in labor for 15 hours then had to have an emergency C section and she was up and at ''em within a week, when some people stay down far longer. everyone is going to be different. but think about how many years women have been having children and how many kids are born...bodies are made to do it.

also you talk about this recent surgery you have, and how it''s taking longer to heal and you aren''t sure you will be the same. might you be projecting some of the feelings you have about this surgery onto any future childbirth you might have? it sounds like it.

bottom line for me is be honest with your fiance and tell him how you are feeling, but also look within yourself to think about is this really how you feel or are recent events just affecting what you are thinking right now and you could possibly feel differently in 2, 5, 10 years? you should be honest about that too. good luck.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Sorry, I haven't read all the posts. . .but, wanted to say that it drives me nuts when people think that a pregnant woman can chose to have a c/s. That is NOT the case. C-sections cost a ton of money and are serious surgery. You cannot simply ask a doctor to give you one because you do not want to go through labor. Insurance companies would never cover that. . .I did have a c/s with both kids and each was $15K. The first was because I pushed my son for THREE hours without him budging. Like Mara's friend, within a week of my operation, I was up and about again.

Big tip -> develop a regular exercise routine before becoming pregnant and keep that up while pregnant. That way, you'll have more endurance during labor AND will recover more quickly.

Embrace modern medicine. Just get an epidural.

 

[rockpaperscissors67]

Date: 7/2/2009 8:43:51 PM
Author: MC
Sorry, I haven''t read all the posts. . .but, wanted to say that it drives me nuts when people think that a pregnant woman can chose to have a c/s. That is NOT the case. C-sections cost a ton of money and are serious surgery. You cannot simply ask a doctor to give you one because you do not want to go through labor. Insurance companies would never cover that. . .I did have a c/s with both kids and each was $15K. The first was because I pushed my son for THREE hours without him budging. Like Mara''s friend, within a week of my operation, I was up and about again.

Big tip -> develop a regular exercise routine before becoming pregnant and keep that up while pregnant. That way, you''ll have more endurance during labor AND will recover more quickly.

Embrace modern medicine. Just get an epidural.

An ex-friend of mine DID have an elective c-section with her first child! The doctor agreed to it when she was like 4 months pregnant and insurance covered it.

Frankly, it was one of the final straws in our friendship. I lean toward the crunchier side -- 2 kids were born in the hospital with no pain relief, 1 was born in a hospital with stadol in my IV (hated it), 1 was born in the hospital with an epidural (hated it) and the last was born at home with no pain relief. I''m planning another homebirth.

I recognize that c-sections can be necessary, but cannot understand why someone would choose to have major abdominal surgery that is riskier for herself and her baby.

An hour after the baby was born, she called me to tell me how the c-section was a total breeze -- and then had to excuse herself to vomit once again. By contrast, an hour after my son was born, I was in my kitchen making coffee for the midwife and myself.

Her baby spent a couple of days in the ICU with breathing difficulties. My son was with us full time from his first minutes and slept in our bed with us the first night of his life.

It might have worked for her, but I can''t imagine choosing to do it that way.

 

[cara]

You can get an elective c-section if you have money or a cooperative doctor. A particularly difficult insurance company might balk, but with all things OB the risk of getting sued influences their decisions and you might not need horrible complications to get a planned section.

While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend''s completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.

As for the added risk of a c-section, there is some for both mother and baby, but remember that planned c-sections under a controlled environment have better outcomes than emergency ones, so its not a horrible added risk to have an elective c-section. Most people wouldn''t want the added risk, but most women have at most a healthy fear of giving birth rather than a paralyzing one. You can certainly come up with stories of bad outcomes from vaginal births if you try. As for what happens to the mother, the line my doctor friends have said is that recovery from an easy vaginal delivery is better than from an easy c-section. But a bad vaginal delivery can be much worse than an easy c-section, and planned sections are *usually* easy.

Don''t get me wrong, I am in favor of lowering unnecessary surgeries and having the healthiest mothers and babies come out of birth. But it just seems with a lot things related to birth and childrearing that ideology sometimes causes exaggerations. Like breastmilk may be better, may be much better in a 100 different ways, but formula isn''t poison. Women who can''t or choose not to breastfeed aren''t automatically bad parents...

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PM
Author: cara
...
While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend''s completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.

...

Good lord, that is horrendous! What do people do, take out loans or put the rest on credit cards??

PS: lest people think I am mental, I am not American and so had no idea that insurance wouldn''t cover birth.

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 7/2/2009 10:09:54 PM
Author: dreamer_dachsie

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PM

Author: cara

...

While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend''s completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.


...

Good lord, that is horrendous! What do people do, take out loans or put the rest on credit cards??

PS: lest people think I am mental, I am not American and so had no idea that insurance wouldn''t cover birth.

Many insurance plans do cover births at a much higher percent than that-I didn''t pay a cent for any of my care or the births of my babies. But it totally depends on your insurance...

 

[hlmr]

purrfectpear, how can you discount celine''s doubts and fears, when you stated in the horrible/hysterical pregnancy thread "There''s a reason why my son is an only child."?????

Celine, it is okay to be scared. Child birth is not easy, and it does change your body in many ways, but after you have your baby, it really isn''t that big of a deal anymore. We all mutter about certain body changes/issues, but they certainly will never trump having a child, if that is what you want.

 

[Logan Sapphire]

Date: 7/2/2009 10:16:23 PM
Author: neatfreak

Date: 7/2/2009 10:09:54 PM

Author: dreamer_dachsie

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PM


Author: cara


...


While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend''s completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.



...

Good lord, that is horrendous! What do people do, take out loans or put the rest on credit cards??

PS: lest people think I am mental, I am not American and so had no idea that insurance wouldn''t cover birth.

Many insurance plans do cover births at a much higher percent than that-I didn''t pay a cent for any of my care or the births of my babies. But it totally depends on your insurance...

And this illustrates my point that adoption (if you truly are interested in that route, etc, etc) isn''t always more expensive than childbirth. Yes, some countries are more expensive but other countries are much less so, as well as many domestic adoptions.

 

[cara]

Date: 7/2/2009 10:16:23 PM
Author: neatfreak

Date: 7/2/2009 10:09:54 PM

Author: dreamer_dachsie

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PMAuthor: cara...
While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend''s completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.
...

Good lord, that is horrendous! What do people do, take out loans or put the rest on credit cards??

PS: lest people think I am mental, I am not American and so had no idea that insurance wouldn''t cover birth.

Many insurance plans do cover births at a much higher percent than that-I didn''t pay a cent for any of my care or the births of my babies. But it totally depends on your insurance...

Oh I should have been more clear for those not familiar with the f''d up American system - my friend was not liable for the difference between what her insurance paid and what the hospital charged. The hospital never got paid that $20k. Basically there is the game played where the care provider''s "normal" fees are huge mark-ups so that they then give what looks like big discounts when insurance companies negotiate contracts with them. The contract then specifies that the agreed amount is all the compensation that the care provider gets, and the patient is only liable for their copays or percentages according to their insurance contract. My friend''s out-of-pocket health care costs were actually quite good for pregnancy through delivery. Not until her baby turned a month old and was ineligible for our health plan did the costs go way up!

But if a pregnant woman walks in off the street to deliver either uninsured or with crummy insurance that doesn''t have a contract with the hospital or otherwise limit their out-of-pocket costs, then the $30k bill is what they would be charged. If the woman is both savvy and deserving of financial aid, she will try to negotiate a reduction directly from the hospital as well as a payment plan. The hospital then gets to write off any reduction they give her as "charity" care, and usually the woman still ends up owing well more than an insurance company would have for her care because she is simply not in a strong negotiating position. This is why so many Americans end up in bankruptcy because of medical costs. And put off needed care until they have no choice.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Date: 7/2/2009 10:09:54 PM
Author: dreamer_dachsie

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PM
Author: cara
...
While I am all for risk analysis and cost savings, lets be realistic and accurate about those risks and costs. The hospital bill for my friend's completely normal vaginal birth was $30k. She did have an epi, and we are in a high-rent district. I believe insurance only payed a bit under $10k, and a c-section surely would have been more, but birth and hospitals and health care in this country is expensive.

...

Good lord, that is horrendous! What do people do, take out loans or put the rest on credit cards??

PS: lest people think I am mental, I am not American and so had no idea that insurance wouldn't cover birth.

My insurance covered 80% of each birth.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Date: 7/2/2009 9:51:19 PM
Author: cara
You can get an elective c-section if you have money or a cooperative doctor. A particularly difficult insurance company might balk, but with all things OB the risk of getting sued influences their decisions and you might not need horrible complications to get a planned section. As for the added risk of a c-section, there is some for both mother and baby, but remember that planned c-sections under a controlled environment have better outcomes than emergency ones, so its not a horrible added risk to have an elective c-section. Most people wouldn't want the added risk, but most women have at most a healthy fear of giving birth rather than a paralyzing one. You can certainly come up with stories of bad outcomes from vaginal births if you try. As for what happens to the mother, the line my doctor friends have said is that recovery from an easy vaginal delivery is better than from an easy c-section. But a bad vaginal delivery can be much worse than an easy c-section, and planned sections are *usually* easy.

Don't get me wrong, I am in favor of lowering unnecessary surgeries and having the healthiest mothers and babies come out of birth. But it just seems with a lot things related to birth and childrearing that ideology sometimes causes exaggerations. Like breastmilk may be better, may be much better in a 100 different ways, but formula isn't poison. Women who can't or choose not to breastfeed aren't automatically bad parents...

For my second son, I did have the option for a repeat c/s and chose to do so (as some consider a VBAC risky), and I do agree with you that under a "controlled environment" outcomes should be optimistic. When you know you're going to have a c/s, it's easier to mentally prepared AND physically prepare.

Still, I've not hear do doctors giving out elective c/s here in the US. It may be Brazil that I heard of where affluent women regularily chose that option.

If, here in the US, that option was available, I do not see any big deal in a woman choosing that route. I will not judge because I know the fear of childbirth and the whole experience should be as positive as possible. It'd be nice if insurance covered 100% of every situation!

For my husband and me, we found $6K in medical bills in our mailbox ($30K, 80% covered). Luckily we DID have insurance.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 7/1/2009 6:17:55 PM
Author: purrfectpear
Heck no I wasn''t kidding. Seriously? Seriously?

Someone is going to tell the man they love that they would rather adopt (super expensive, denying own child for nothing more than vanity and irrational fear) than bear a child. If that''s what OP really is saying, then yes my answer to her question of ''am I a coward?'' is you betcha babe.

There are a lot of reasonable reasons not to have a child.

Fear of ''tearing down there'' is not one of them in my book. Don''t you think a rational person would make some attempt to deal with an obviously abnormal fear through therapy before they''d tell the guy they were going to marry ''sorry bub, my body parts aren''t going to stretch out for a baby, you just have to deal''?

Not to put too fine of a point on it, but that''s cowardice in my book.

The rest of you feel free to enable and sugar coat. You''re doing a fine job of it (now that was tongue in cheek)

 

[zhuzhu]

Date: 7/1/2009 12:52:25 PM
Author: purrfectpear
If you just don''t want kiddos that''s fine. Perfectly OK and a sound decision.



However, if you are OK with kids (your statement about adoption) and are just afraid of the birth part (your statement about tearing and ''putting your body through that''), then yes, sorry, you are a coward. A great big screaming coward.


There, I said it, now no one else will have to do the dirty work.


Grow up, get over it, your body isn''t some precious ming vase that has to be kept in pristine condition. Better hope life doesn''t hand you any other nasty surprises as there are plenty out there

. I had a miserable birth and I got over it. Several million women a year go through this experience. If you''ve decided you just aren''t that brave, then just put a big C on your chest and give your boyfriend the good news.

PP, I don''t know what your problem is. Neither do I find anything constructive from your reply.
Moreover, I find nothing cowardly about Celine voicing her fear about pain and pregnancy-related complications. Please don''t assume your attitude remotely reflects that of others.

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 7/2/2009 9:25:22 PM
Author: rockpaperscissors67

Date: 7/2/2009 8:43:51 PM
Author: MC
Sorry, I haven''t read all the posts. . .but, wanted to say that it drives me nuts when people think that a pregnant woman can chose to have a c/s. That is NOT the case. C-sections cost a ton of money and are serious surgery. You cannot simply ask a doctor to give you one because you do not want to go through labor. Insurance companies would never cover that. . .I did have a c/s with both kids and each was $15K. The first was because I pushed my son for THREE hours without him budging. Like Mara''s friend, within a week of my operation, I was up and about again.

Big tip -> develop a regular exercise routine before becoming pregnant and keep that up while pregnant. That way, you''ll have more endurance during labor AND will recover more quickly.

Embrace modern medicine. Just get an epidural.

An ex-friend of mine DID have an elective c-section with her first child! The doctor agreed to it when she was like 4 months pregnant and insurance covered it.

Frankly, it was one of the final straws in our friendship. I lean toward the crunchier side -- 2 kids were born in the hospital with no pain relief, 1 was born in a hospital with stadol in my IV (hated it), 1 was born in the hospital with an epidural (hated it) and the last was born at home with no pain relief. I''m planning another homebirth.

I recognize that c-sections can be necessary, but cannot understand why someone would choose to have major abdominal surgery that is riskier for herself and her baby.

An hour after the baby was born, she called me to tell me how the c-section was a total breeze -- and then had to excuse herself to vomit once again. By contrast, an hour after my son was born, I was in my kitchen making coffee for the midwife and myself.

Her baby spent a couple of days in the ICU with breathing difficulties. My son was with us full time from his first minutes and slept in our bed with us the first night of his life.

It might have worked for her, but I can''t imagine choosing to do it that way.

Every Csection is different. Mine was an emergency C after 20 hours of labor, and I was shocked at how easy it all was. It just felt like I did a few thousand sit ups. I thought they were giving me pain meds through an IV but apparently they did not (I asked them what the wonderful painkiller they were giving me was and the nurse told me I wasn''t on any.) Once I realized I wasn''t on painkillers and I was fine, I opted not to take even a motrin for it. After I passed gas (which was the scariest part), I was off and running. Literally, in a week, I was off and talking long walks with the kid in my BOB stroller, and obviously from this thread, that isn''t unheard of.

The kid was fine. Yes, liquid in the lungs but nothing worse than that. Yes, I am still an advocate for vaginal brith and really would tell woman to research thoroughly if they wanted an elective C-section (if insurance even paid for it), but think CHOICE is a wonderful thing. The anxiety some women face about childbirth is overwhelming, and I really have a hard time judging that.

 

[Londongirl1]

Date: 7/3/2009 2:42:34 AM
Author: zhuzhu

Date: 7/1/2009 12:52:25 PM
Author: purrfectpear
If you just don''t want kiddos that''s fine. Perfectly OK and a sound decision.



However, if you are OK with kids (your statement about adoption) and are just afraid of the birth part (your statement about tearing and ''putting your body through that''), then yes, sorry, you are a coward. A great big screaming coward.


There, I said it, now no one else will have to do the dirty work.


Grow up, get over it, your body isn''t some precious ming vase that has to be kept in pristine condition. Better hope life doesn''t hand you any other nasty surprises as there are plenty out there

. I had a miserable birth and I got over it. Several million women a year go through this experience. If you''ve decided you just aren''t that brave, then just put a big C on your chest and give your boyfriend the good news.

PP, I don''t know what your problem is. Neither do I find anything constructive from your reply.
Moreover, I find nothing cowardly about Celine voicing her fear about pain and pregnancy-related complications. Please don''t assume your attitude remotely reflects that of others.

DITTO

 

[purrfectpear]

Date: 7/2/2009 10:49:38 PM
Author: hlmr
purrfectpear, how can you discount celine''s doubts and fears, when you stated in the horrible/hysterical pregnancy thread ''There''s a reason why my son is an only child.''?????

Celine, it is okay to be scared. Child birth is not easy, and it does change your body in many ways, but after you have your baby, it really isn''t that big of a deal anymore. We all mutter about certain body changes/issues, but they certainly will never trump having a child, if that is what you want.

Duh, I was joking. He''s an only child because he was a surprise. One was plenty. I''m not discounting "doubts and fears". I''m answering her question of "am I a coward" when she plainly stated that she was prepared to tell the man she loves that she would rather force him into adopting a child rather than "risk tearing down there"

Maybe you don''t think that''s shallow, but I do.