Effectively Managing Your Male...

[Mara]

dl i agree on the guys who feel forced or pushed into it...i have a close male friend who has been with his gf for 2.5 years now and she is itching to move fwd and move in together and he has been balking for a year now. they broke up and got back together but we all know that this is not the right relationship for them! but he is 34 and he wants to have a family at some point so he is thinking of just settling for her. which is pretty sad for both of them, because we can all see they are not right for each other but both of them are way too lazy to get off their butts, break up and find someone who is really right for them. so all around them, our friends have paired up, gotten engaged, or some are well on their way there. and they are just kind of floating in place. the girlfriend seems like she is always making bitter comments that everyone else is moving fwd and they are stuck in place, but he is happy with how things are...he said recently he thought he''d have to live with her to know for sure but he has balked each time she has tried to do that. anyway, one of our friends just got engaged and also 2 more couples in our group are very close (one has just started looking at diamonds)...so we just know she is going to LOSE IT when the other couples get to engagement and she is still waiting around, so maybe that will be the wake up call that HELLO he does not know about you and he is waiting around hoping one day he wakes up and somehow you have become ''the one''....but that would be distastrous for them. he is just hoping that will happen because it would be ''easiest'' to stay with her and make a life together, forget that is not what he (or probably she!) really wants.

anyway she is trying as hard as she can to push him and manage him into being ready but that would be the worst decision either of them could make. i think actually if they lived together that would be the end of the relationship, they are SO different, as in night and day, she is a total Type A overachiever and he is a total ''stuck in my 20''s'' gamer personality.

 

[diamondlove]

Mara, exactly! I understand the ones who just need a nudge but it''s the ones who are like your friend''s gf (I have a few of those) who just need to realize that they need to go find ''the one'' rather than push this ''sorta kinda one'' into marriage bc it''d be disastrous for both of them.

It just makes me cringe when I see that bc you don''t want that type of situation for someone yet you know they don''t want to hear it because they are just dying to get married and don''t want to start over with someone new. Sorry, it''s a big pet peeve of mine-- no relationship is perfect and we all have enough problems so why start off a marriage with a big NEGATIVE.

Some guys really are so lazy and nonconfrontational that they will get bullied into a marriage just because they don''t want to deal with the stress of the breakup/girl freaking out, etc but not because they are crazy in love. Sad bc then those end up in marriage with the ones who manipulate and bully their men into marriage. Worst is after 2 kids and lots of fights later they finally divorce and the kids suffer.

 

[ammayernyc]

I have a friend who was being pushed by his gf and he actually said to me ''well, I have to figure out whether I want to marry her or break up with her...'' So, he decided he didn''t want to be without her (different from marrying her) and proposed. They were SUPPOSED to be married last Saturday. Needless to say, one of them realized it wasn''t right.

 

[Fancy605]

Wow, amandapanda,...Marry her or break up with her---those two extreems just don't seem like they go together do they. Call me crazy/young and silly, but if breaking up is an alternative to marrying someone, then I don't see how that someone can be "the one." It's a good thing they figured it out before they were married.

I don't even want to nudge my b/f because he is the type of person where anything that can be precieved as pressure/pusshy behavior is bad. He's got his mind made up about what he wants to do, so I am just going to see what happens. I have had my input already, and I'm sure he took what he has discussed with me into consideration.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 7/19/2006 11:51:26 AM
Author: Fancy605

Wow, amandapanda,...Marry her or break up with her---those two extreems just don''t seem like they go together do they. Call me crazy/young and silly, but if breaking up is an alternative to marrying someone, then I don''t see how that someone can be ''the one.''

That''s exactly the point, though. At some point in the relationship, you have to make a choice. Yes, this is the person I want to spend my life with or no, it''s not.

If you do want it, then it''s time to act on it and marry. And if you don''t want it, then why stick around investing more time in a relationship that you already know isn''t "the one"?

Of course, the timing of when you reach that decision point is different for everyone. But once you''ve arrived there, I think the ONLY choices are marry or move on (unless, of course, neither desires marriage and both are happy living indefinitely as BF/GF.....in which case, more power to them).

*************

Regarding the whole "managing" concept: I''m fortunate. My hubby and I didn''t go through this. We both stated pretty clearly that we were marriage-inclined pretty early on. His feeling was to spend a year or so together to feel confident that our communication styles would work well....totally fine by me. My caveat: I''m not going to press you to propose; but I can assure you that I won''t stay on stand-by indefinitely, either. We''ve both said we want it, so it''s up to you to make it be. I''m not putting you on a timeline....if this is really what you want, too, there should be no reason to drag your feet. At the end of the year''s time, he was in the midst of paying out a huge downpayment on his car, but clearly told me that a ring was his next priority....and it was. Followed two months later.

My whole point here? Being candid is about good communication. It isn''t about ultimatums or coercing someone into something he *doesn''t* want. It''s not even about telling him when he has to be ready. It''s being honest and communicating about what you need and what you want. What he does with that is up to him.

I think the "managing" aspect that Mara mentioned.....it plays more to the realization that men are deadline driven. It''s how many of them prioritize. If they know they have a month left to shop for a birthday gift, they typically will get it done in the 48 hours prior to the last day possible. My husband is famous for buying a card for me for our anniversary *on the way* to wherever we are going to celebrate.....often while I wait in the car.

He does this with EVERYTHING......worries about not having his fishing glasses on the way out the door to go fishing; not 2 days before. He''s not a planner, I am.

So, if you''re candid and say "this is where I''m at - ready to marry, know you''re the one for me, and I''m willing to see what the next six months brings in terms of your proximity to being ready/decision", that lets him know that he has to prioritize considering it. It''s not an ultimatum; it''s saying "I am willing to see where this is going, but not indefinitely." The truth is, if he''s ready, he''s ready, and if he isn''t, nothing is gonna make him ready.

 

[IrishAngel7982]

I've been reading this post but I haven't replied because I had a hard time with the concept of "managing" someone into engagement. I know it's not what Mara meant, but I kept thinking about girls who give ultimatums, demand proposals, etc... I do however, think sometimes there needs to be a discussion about where the relationship is headed. Just so both parties are on the same page. That way, hopefully hearts won't be as broken as when someone gets so emotionally invested only to find the relationship isn't going any farther.
I hope I don't have to "manage" my sweetie into our engagement. We can't logically become officially engaged for at least another year (we're not a couple for long engagements) and both of us are very excited about what the future holds. Actually, he brings it up more than I do sometimes. I love it!!! After this thread started I got to thinking, so I half-jokingly asked him if he would feel the same eagerness in a year when we have all of our ducks in a row and are ready to go down that road. He said 'of course' and that's all I needed to hear.
Anyway, it's sad to think that some relationships end because of no proposal. It's even more sad to think that some end in divorce because the couple was pushed into marriage (I can't help but think of my friend's upcoming wedding...many people including myself will have a hard time objecting to that one). That must be so difficult. I guess I just consider myself incredibly lucky (knock on wood!)

 

[Allisonfaye]

Great thread. I can relate to so many of your stories.

Count me in with the managers. lol

I think there are a lot of variables here.

In our case, I was 37 when I met DH and he was 36. I had dated a LOT and so had he. I had lived with three guys and broken up with all of them. So I knew he was something special.

First I want to tell you about my hero, Marsha. On her first date with her now DH, he said ''I don''t see myself ever getting married''. She said ''well, then there is no point in us dating because I do''. That took a lot of courage for someone who was like 25 to say. They were married a couple of years later.

When we had dated a year, neither DH or I had said the "L'' word. Finally, I just got frustrated once and said "Do you love me''? and he didn''t hesitate a second before saying ''yes, very much''.

So, I didn''t say anything about marriage yet. But a couple of months later, he got very distant. He finally told me his ex GF had contacted him after moving away and had moved back and wanted to get back together. He was upset (even crying and if you knew my DH, you would know how rare that is) and said he didn''t want to hurt me but he was thinking about proposing and he felt he should see her just to ''make sure''. I said that''s fine. I don''t want you to make that decision without feeling it is right. I was upset but in a way, I felt relieved. So, after I said ok, he could do it, he decided he didn''t really want to after all. In fact, I think he was quite surprised at my reaction.

So then he wanted to talk about us getting married. I said ok. Then he freaked out. Then his dad got sicker (had been terminally ill for a long time at age 75). So, he put us on the back burner. My concern was he was going to turn out to be one of those guys who just let it drag on and on. So, every so many months, I would have a talk with him. He would say stuff like ''by the end of the year'' and this went on for a while. So we got engaged, but I always felt he wasn''t into it.
We were not going to live together but he talked me into moving in one month before the wedding so I didn''t have to move in the cold weather. One week before the wedding, he freaked out. He wasn''t sure...yada, yada. I said fine. We can call it off but since the majority of people coming are YOUR family, you can call all of them. I was ready to walk away. Not to push him, but to protect me.

I went to take a shower and after I was done he came up and said he wanted to get married but change is hard for him. It was a tough road but I know now that change IS hard for him. The same thing happened when I wanted to try to have a baby. He wanted to wait a year after we got married. I said no way. First of all , we talked about this BEFORE we got married. So he and I compromised on 6 months. And I got pregnant right away. And he loves our daughter more than anything. And I wanted to move to the suburbs...and he didn''t. But we did and he LOVES where we live now. He acts like it was his idea to move here in the first place. So, the moral is, some people do need to be pushed. I honestly would have been more patient with all of it (although my friend thought I was a patient saint) if I hadn''t been 37 when it all started. It turned out alright and I know DH is very happy now. I have learned where and how to give him his space but when it comes to making big life changes, he needs to be led. But if I thought he didn''t want to be married to me, I wouldn''t push.

But there is now way I would let it drag on for years and years, unless I was really young.

 

[fire&ice]

Women are natural managers when they are in most situations. In fact, most of my friends are the managing partner in their marriages. Yep, I managed our engagement. Seems to have worked.

I would be inclined to even say that if you can not manage your man then maybe there is lack of style meshing or communication issues. Marriage is one LONG journey of negotiation. One has to be able to manage the negotiation in order to have resolve on any issue. I''m not talking about "controlling managing" - just simple managing - know where your at - knowing what you want - knowing how to make it happen so that both are happy.

From this old married broad, romance isn''t flower petals on the bed. Romance is recognizing each others space and place - and making that space and place happier/easier/more fun/pleasant - or at the very least O.K.

Interesting way of looking at it Mara - never thought about verbalizing in this way.

 

[Mara]

Date: 7/20/2006 4:29:42 PM
Author: fire&ice
Women are natural managers when they are in most situations. In fact, most of my friends are the managing partner in their marriages. Yep, I managed our engagement. Seems to have worked.

I would be inclined to even say that if you can not manage your man then maybe there is lack of style meshing or communication issues. Marriage is one LONG journey of negotiation. One has to be able to manage the negotiation in order to have resolve on any issue. I''m not talking about ''controlling managing'' - just simple managing - know where your at - knowing what you want - knowing how to make it happen so that both are happy.

From this old married broad, romance isn''t flower petals on the bed. Romance is recognizing each others space and place - and making that space and place happier/easier/more fun/pleasant - or at the very least O.K.

Interesting way of looking at it Mara - never thought about verbalizing in this way.

I totally agree F&I.

Allison it''s funny you mention what I alluded to up above which is when WE know what they really want.... when THEY don''t even know they want it yet.

That is what we did with our current home...I was like ''okay we have to buy a house...now is the time.'' And Greg humored me, went to look at places....groused and moaned and ''its expensive'' and this and that and ''why now'' etc etc. But in the end we found something we both loved and took the plunge, and now a few years later he jokes around and says stuff like ''Boy aren''t you glad *I* found this place for us and *MADE* us buy it?'' with an evil smile...because when we were shopping/buying I was like ''TRUST ME you will thank me later''. So he always makes a big joke out of stuff like that when I push for something for us to do or similar, and afterwards he is always ''boy that was a great idea...i''m so glad *I* thought of it!''...hee hee. Sometimes I wonder what men would literally DO without women!!

 

[orangegeek]

I agree with those the statement that marriage is about negotiation and managing is just an aspect of that. My bf talked of wanting to wait until after he got his masters to get engaged, so I just put the info in front of him for the accelerated 10-month program at National University. He promptly signed up and will be done in February. We had a talk where I explained to him that I don''t want to wait forever because we want to have kids together and for me there''s a health concern the older I get. He was totally okay with that and understood my point.

Plus, I get "managed" just as much as he does. I know that I have moods and can get oversensitive about things and my bf knows just how to work around that and get me back to being level-headed and non-mopey.

I recently started hiding pics of the rings styles I like around the apartment. He told me to hide pics of the ones I especially want. He even told me to go try on rings but not to tell him, but just leave the pics. He''s concerned that things won''t be romantic if I know too much, but he also respects my need for input. We''re both dancing a little dance and managing the other''s needs and balancing it with our own. I want sparklies and input, while he wants romance and surprise. We both nudge a little here, talk a little there, and voila!

Don''t get me wrong, though, we sit down and talk regularly about big issues. In fact, I bought the Dr. Robin book on marriage and we sit and answer a section of questions at a time. He''ll even tell me when it''s time to learn some more about each other.

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 7/21/2006 3:28:53 AM
Author: orangegeek

Plus, I get ''managed'' just as much as he does. I know that I have moods and can get oversensitive about things and my bf knows just how to work around that and get me back to being level-headed and non-mopey.

Haven''t responded to this thread yet... but I like Orange''s point. I think in some situations (Allison''s, for example) it really IS necessary to do a little "guiding". Not in a manipulative, conniving way... just an up-front "here''s what I want, if you don''t want that too, I need to know" kind of way. But ideally, that''s all part of the balance Orange is describing.

My FI and I met in our early-mid 20s and he was always very open about his desire to get married and have children someday. He had been in several long-term relationships in the past, so commitment wasn''t an issue either. Both of these things were part of the reason he appealed to me in the first place... he came across right away as a mature, well-rounded, stable guy... and I''d known far too many guys that weren''t!

When we''d been together for about a year, we both knew with about 95% certainty that we wanted to spend our lives together... but he was finishing up grad school, I was figuring out what I wanted to do career-wise... so no rush. Well, a year or so after THAT... I started to get a little itchy about moving things along. And our personalities began to clash. His mentality was "What''s the problem? We''ve got a good thing right now, we know we''re getting married someday, so why the hurry?" My mentality was "People/relationships need to keep growing, moving, evolving... you can''t just pick a good point and linger there indefinitely. We know we''re getting married someday, so why not start the process now??"

For me, it was control... not of him, but of my own future... I needed to have a sense of timeline, how thing''s were going to play out in our life together. For him, it was about rules... he hated the marriage "expectations" imposed by our friends/families as soon as we hit that 1.5-2 year mark in our relationship. So he fought it by digging in his heels. It was a frustrating struggle for both of us, and lasted about a year.

Did I manage him into marriage? No, he already knew he wanted that, sooner rather than later... in fact, he talked several times about wanting kids before he was 30, and he''s 28 now! But did I make my opinions on the matter very, very clear? Um, yes. And I think our relationship is better because of it... we definitely understand a little more about each other''s personalities now! And that''s never a bad thing.

 

[sumbride]

Date: 7/21/2006 8:15:48 AM
Author: ephemery1

For me, it was control... not of him, but of my own future... I needed to have a sense of timeline, how thing''s were going to play out in our life together. For him, it was about rules... he hated the marriage ''expectations'' imposed by our friends/families as soon as we hit that 1.5-2 year mark in our relationship. So he fought it by digging in his heels. It was a frustrating struggle for both of us, and lasted about a year.

Oh this is so spot on for me too. I have told him repeatedly that I get very emotional when I don''t feel in control of my future. I just NEED TO KNOW. I''ve used the story about sobbing uncontrollably senior year in high school because I didn''t know which college I was going to 6 months later. That was the "My life is so up in the air" moment that really resonates to me when I feel out of control because it did resolve itself shortly thereafter and it did work out right but oh, I was so upset. He hears me but I don''t think he gets it. I think this is a common trait in women, we just feel the need to have a timeline, a map if you will, whereas some men just fly by the seat of their pants. Drives me crazy, but that''s where you get a bit of excitement. My M was very adamant that it had to be our timeline, not anybody else''s so having people ask us when just sort of made him dig his heels in. I''m glad that I haven''t had to push him, that he finally came to realize himself that he wanted to marry me, rather than me pushing him.

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 7/21/2006 4:50:42 PM
Author: sumbride

Oh this is so spot on for me too. I have told him repeatedly that I get very emotional when I don''t feel in control of my future. I just NEED TO KNOW. I''ve used the story about sobbing uncontrollably senior year in high school because I didn''t know which college I was going to 6 months later. That was the ''My life is so up in the air'' moment that really resonates to me when I feel out of control because it did resolve itself shortly thereafter and it did work out right but oh, I was so upset.

Oh, Sum... if ANYONE who knew me in high school came on here and read your post... they would think it was me writing it.

I was a WRECK my senior year of high school... convinced my world was ending because I wasn''t the kind of person who could just leave the life I knew and loved and move on to something brand-new and still be happy. Obviously I proved myself wrong eventually... and it turned into a big "a-ha!" moment for me too. Even recently, I was trying to work out my internship for the fall and having a tough time finding something "right"... my friend pointed out gently "Remember when you thought there was no way you would ever make the right college decision? And then you LOVED your college?? Things do work out if you just let them!"

 

[KristyDarling]

I haven't read any of the posts in this thread except for Mara's initial one so here's my take.......

Some men need that nudge because they're afraid of change. Some need to be scared into taking you off the market otherwise risk the heartache of losing you to someone else. Some want to marry you but that last vestige of bachelorhood freedom is just too attractive to let go. My DH was all 3. But, we both knew that after 2 years of dating and learning A LOT about each other and ourselves, going through tons of ups and downs and even breaking up a half dozen times, we knew that this was it. We both talked about the future in the "we" sense and would mention things like "our future kids" and "when we're old and gnarly" etc etc etc. But the actual talk about GETTING MARRIED never came up. So I basically told him 2 years into the relationship that I wasn't in it for kicks and giggles, and that if we weren't on the same track, i.e. road to marriage, then we should think about moving on separately. It wasn't an ultimatum, but more like a "Can you see yourself marrying me?" So as soon as he said yes, then for all intents and purposes, in my mind we were engaged. The actual ring/proposal came a year later but that was almost inconsequential compared to the talk we had at our 2-year mark.

I do consider this effective male management. If I hadn't brought it up, the topic would've hovered in the air between us and made things awkward at times. I would've felt like an eternal LIW who is essentially at the mercy of her boyfriend. I felt the need to stand up for my own interests and I loved him enough to make myself totally vulnerable and ask him point-blank if he wanted to be with me for life. Talk about putting it all out there! I just didn't want to be waiting around forever, wondering, wondering, wondering and essentially putting my fate in the hands of a guy who can barely decide what to order for dinner at a restaurant!!!

 

[bobacha]

what a great discussion

i haven''t finished reading all the posts yet.. read the first page, and decided I want to share my $.02 on this.

I am one of those few who were 95% involved with the ring picking (the other 5% is him dealing with the store

). So I know exactly what I''m gonna get ( tomorrow! - Yes I now it''s gonna happen tomorrow - is it weird ? ). Well I haven''t seen it yet so maybe not exactly, but we discussed every single detail together. He had his preferences and I had mine and we ended up in the middle.

We first talked about getting engaged at the end of last year.. engagement this year and wedding next year. But a couple of months into the new year, he didn''t do anything at all....I first asked him to set a "deadline". He said July. So I bought him a book on diamonds (he''s a book nerd, and enjoy reading books than spending time on the internet).. and then I found PS and informed him. I sent him links to WF, GOG, etc. Sent him tons of setting pictures. I taught him about H&A, and pretty much everything I learned. so I did a lot of homework for him... and finally last month when he''s ready to purchase it took us only 3 days (we''re in LDR btw, so we only about 1/2-1 hr every day) to decide on the setting and the rock. From there he took over, and made the purchase in the same week!

And he''s coming over here tomorrow for the weekend

Yes Yes Yes so I know for sure he''ll give me the ring tomorrow...

Now if I hadn''t "managed" him as I did for the past few months, hmm he''s probably still finishing up that book I bought him in January.

I have told a few close girlfriends about what I did and that I know he''s coming with the ring tomorrow, and they all think I''m crazy for being OK with this One of them even said, "Oh, how sad" .. but really, I''m not sad ! Don''t feel sorry for me !

 

[robbie3982]

Date: 8/3/2006 11:23:36 PM
Author: bobacha

And he''s coming over here tomorrow for the weekend

Yes Yes Yes so I know for sure he''ll give me the ring tomorrow...

Now if I hadn''t ''managed'' him as I did for the past few months, hmm he''s probably still finishing up that book I bought him in January.

I have told a few close girlfriends about what I did and that I know he''s coming with the ring tomorrow, and they all think I''m crazy for being OK with this One of them even said, ''Oh, how sad'' .. but really, I''m not sad ! Don''t feel sorry for me !

I don''t feel sorry for you at all

. I''m excited! I can''t wait to see pics of the ring and hear how he proposes. Even though you know it''s coming, you don''t know how he''ll do it. Yay!

 

[SeattleSparkle]

bobacha!! Today!?? That is so exciting!! Remember to let us know the fantabulous proposal story!! It''s like waiting for Christmas x 1,000,000!!! Best of luck to you!!

 

[Becky P]

OK, so, I know this topic has been dead for a while, but I just have to ask.... many of you ladies stated that, yes, you did manage your man (not manipulate, but manage) into a proposal. So, how did you do it? Give us the details... How did you phrase things so you made him think that it was his idea? Tell us all so that we can learn from your keen abilities....

 

[monarch64]

Date: 9/7/2006 9:29:28 PM
Author: Becky P
OK, so, I know this topic has been dead for a while, but I just have to ask.... many of you ladies stated that, yes, you did manage your man (not manipulate, but manage) into a proposal. So, how did you do it? Give us the details... How did you phrase things so you made him think that it was his idea? Tell us all so that we can learn from your keen abilities....

I don''t think I had any "keen ability" at age 24 at "effectively managing my male," but I had a lease expiration on my side...we had rented an apartment together with every intention of it being a forever thing, and almost a year later, right before Christmas, I was fed up with his sweet letters of "I love you so much, can''t wait to put a gorgeous ring on your finger and spend the rest of my life with you," etc. So in November, 4 years ago, I gave him the (

) ultimatum: when the lease expires in 3 months, if I don''t have a ring on my finger, I''m out.

I had a ring on my happy little finger a month later, Dec. 14th, 2002. We were married September 21st, 2003, 9 months later.

I honestly never did anything to "manipulate" him into marrying me. I moved from Indianapolis to Chicago to be with him, ended up moving in with him (signed a lease under my name only), mainly because he had declared his intentions to myself and my parents way before that. I could sort of compare it to someone taking out a loan from you when you know they''re "good for it." If I hadn''t been so sure I would never have taken such a big step as I did. BUT, when the timing began to try my patience, I had no problem saying "take it or leave it, buddy." One of my favorite sayings is "give them an inch and they''ll take a mile." My mother always used to say, "the lady sets the pace in the relationship." I personally think truer words have never been spoken. I think a man of true intentions will step up to the plate when he''s called, and in my case I called him and he stepped up with a home run. I have to add, though, that while I was only 24-25 during our "living together" stage, he was 32-33 and most of his friends were getting married that same year, so IMO, that had a lot to do with it as well. I think it''s all circumstancial, as are many things in life. NO need to despair over not getting engaged--you just have to think about your own priorities and decide if you are willing to put someone else''s timing needs before your own. (well, in MY nutshell, anyway).

 

[diamondfan]

nudging someone who ultimately and certainly wants to marry you but is pokey in moving the process along is fine. some men are deliberators and "guy time" is inexplicable to women sometimes. also, one would hope that if a man wants to marry you he would know what you like, and I think men are very clever and creative when trying to suss things out...let''s give the male sex some credit! I moved in with my fiance but refused to do so without a date and the ring. Just worked better for me, I was 24 and just wanted to think about each step. I knew I was someone who wanted marriage and kids so there were no issues there for me. Some guys, as we have read, are just not wanting to get married. It is not the person they are with, they just do not want it. Some do change their minds, some don''t, and I think the worst thing is to be with someone who clearly states this while thinking you will change it. I just think it is sad to be at cross purposes with someone. If it is meant to be, it will happen, and if it is not happening in a timeframe that works for you, talk it out. You can leave if you think there is no forward movement. There are certainly guys who are living with a woman and are happy with the status quo, and are not opposed to stringing the girl along to buy time. Other guys truly want to get married and want to save the money for the ring, house, honeymoon etc...admirable, but a conversation might yield information like, give me the ring you can afford now, let''s not worry about that...anyway, I just think you can impact an outcome but should not change destiny if at all possible.

 

[~*Alexis*~]

IMo when it comes to "managing" your male, I think it has alot to do with the comunication. I think the more that you communicate with the other the better the outcome will be. If you are wanted to get engaged or get on the same page, then TALK! I hear alot of people (not just here) that are talking about their boyfriends stalling about the ring and whatnot, but they never bring it up. TALK it up. That the only thing that will move things along. IMO.............

 

[Mara]

i agree alexis...

in terms of 'how it's done'....well that's such a personal thing really!!! no one knows your mate better than you. i think after some time together you probably know things to not say or things to say kind of thing. does humor work for you two? or does he get mad thinking you are making light of something important? humor won't work for everyone. it's just really so personal.

for me, my husband is very similar in personality to my father (funny huh, don't they say you end up looking for someone like your father or something like that?)....and i have seen how my mom deals with my dad over many years. he takes a LONG TIME to think about things. you have to 'plant the seed'. my mom will plant a seed that may sound outrageous at first to my father, aka lets all take a big family vacation to hawaii next year. he's like 'yeah right, we have other priorities next year' kind of thing. she doesn't say anything else. then in another month or so...she may tell a story about a coworker or something who went to hawaii and had a fabulous time with her kids or something. then just over time my dad starts to think about how much fun it would be or how cool it would be and by the next year he's like yeah we should do that trip thing. greg is pretty much the same way. he likes to think things over for a while and see how it'd be. so by just dropping hints or saying 'wow wouldn't that shirt be great to wear in hawaii?!' or something like that....it goes a long way with many 'mullers'...hehee. part of it also IS making what you want to be known. they can't read your mind any better than we can read theirs. so communicating in the 'best way' possible for you is the key IMO.