Head going to explode...

[ammayernyc]

Okay, usual vent, but still!!!

Why, why, why??!!

Another friend got engaged this weekend. He''s been dating his now fiance for about the same time I''ve been dating my boyfriend. Our anniversary is in December and we will have been dating for four years. That''s a long time, isn''t it? We''re both 30, are financially stable, live together, plan vacations together, my family likes him, his family likes me...

So, why won''t he propose. He says that while he can see me in his future, marriage is a very big step that he''s not positive he''s ready to take. Why not?! When will he be?! Seriously, I don''t understand. What is the problem?! When I''ve asked him these questions, he doens''t have answers.

I''ve given him plenty of opportunities for him to back out of our relationship if he wanted to, and he has always assured me that I am who he wants. But then, why won''t he propose? He can afford a ring. We can afford to pay for a wedding. I told him I would go to City Hall if that''s what he wants. I just don''t understand and I''m getting more frustrated and insecure by the second.

Aaaarrrggghhh!!!

 

[aphisiglovessae]

Don''t keep up with the Jones''! Relax and enjoy your life and don''t worry about what everyone else is doing.

 

[appletini]

I think we have the same BF. No wonder he's hesitating, he knows we are both perfect and can't choose!

In reality, I totally feel your frustration. Next weekend we are going to a wedding for one of his friends...my BF was talking to marriage to me before they were even officially BF & GF. Oh well I guess he's saving the best for last.

I was thinking of going for a ring that would be about $1-2k less, but then I thought, he's made me wait this long, all that interest adds up, I'm not cutting him any slack. I'm worth every penny + a Right Hand Ring in the future.

ETA: Last week he said that I should stop talking about, because its not going to make things happen any sooner and that he has a plan. His "plan" better be good, b/c right now I think it really sucks.

 

[Buena Girl]

geez, I wish I knew! Wasn't your b/f the one that took you ring shopping like a year ago? I don't understand why he would initiate it and then back off. Guys are so confusing sometimes

I hope he gets back on task pronto!! We want to see more gorgeous NYC diamond rings. Tell him it's urgent

BTW, if one more newly engaged couple comes up to me and shares their good news, and follows it with, "Gee, haven't you and your boyfriend been dating longer than us?..teehee...", I think my head might explode, too.

I think my b/f's roommate may be close. He's been dating this girl for less than a year, but they already have a whole future painted including how many kids and what their names will be.

 

[pebbles]

OK, I''m probably going to get a lot of crap for saying this but I''m going to anyway....

You two have been together 4 years and live together. What incentive does he have to get married? I have unfortunately seen this time and time again when people live together without having a formal committment, like an engagement. He has everything he needs right now -- you there living with him, yet he still has an "out" since you''re not married.

I''m not trying to sound like a jerk or be insensitive. I have seen your exact situation with a couple of my girlfriends. Unfortunately the outcome was never good.

You would think a 30 year old guy would be ready to get married. Do you still really want to marry him? If he doesn''t have the answers to when he will be ready, then I think it''s time for you to be true to yourself and decide what YOU want.

 

[ammayernyc]

Date: 10/11/2005 5:16:40 PM
Author: pebbles
OK, I''m probably going to get a lot of crap for saying this but I''m going to anyway....

You two have been together 4 years and live together. What incentive does he have to get married? I have unfortunately seen this time and time again when people live together without having a formal committment, like an engagement. He has everything he needs right now -- you there living with him, yet he still has an ''out'' since you''re not married.

I''m not trying to sound like a jerk or be insensitive. I have seen your exact situation with a couple of my girlfriends. Unfortunately the outcome was never good.

You would think a 30 year old guy would be ready to get married. Do you still really want to marry him? If he doesn''t have the answers to when he will be ready, then I think it''s time for you to be true to yourself and decide what YOU want.

Trust me, I''ve thought about this a lot. Although it''s a possiblity, I would like to think it''s not. My bf viewed living together as a huge step. It took two tries (long story) for it to actually happen. So, I know that his level of committment to me is high, it''s just that he views marriage as this end-all to perfection in his life. And as every single person I know tells me, a marriage is a beginning, not an ending. We plan things in our future together, so I know that he wants one with me in it. I think he, as am I am, is nervous about change.

 

[WTNLVR]

Does he/you want kids? What about giving him the biological clock speech? I had a friend in your situation and she wasn''t going to wait forever cause she wanted kids. She said give me a ring or I''m out of here. He wouldn''t (they had even just moved in together, he bought the house they were living in) so she left him and a 2 years later married someone else who wasn''t so gun shy. Good luck.

 

[nytemist]

This is far too common a frustration. I think most of us LIW are dating essentially the same guy. We have all heard the "by so-and-so date we''ll be engaged/married" or "I just want to be sure" or "what''s the rush to change things" or any of the other lame and aggravating excuses we have heard. Last weekend was my BF''s sister''s YEAR anniversary. When BF talked to her, of course she asked "so, what plans had we made for our wedding?" Who knows what his answer was. When I saw him over the weekend, he made some other vague marriage reference and I told him that I don''t want to hear about it unless you are ready to propose. No point in making plans if we aren''t engaged. He is really upset about that. I don''t care at this point. As of now, we have been together for 4 years and 8 months. All year he has been saying we are getting engaged this year. I''ll believe it when I see it. Yes, I realize that there are 2 and half months left of the year and a miracle may happen. What works for me is to try and trust his word, but not hold my breath and continue concentrating on my future.

After four years, someone should know if their SO is the One. If you have asked him these pretty basic questions and he has no answers for you, unfortunately I have to lean towards what Pebbles said, what I''ve seen happen to countless friends of mine as well... he already has what he wants. He can play the role of partner without it being ''too serious'' or too close'' or the ultimate commitment''. It doesn''t feel good, I know, but it''s high time that he didn''t have all the power.

Let him know that you would like to progress further, but if that''s not where he is (now or anytime soon) stop wasting your time. I don''t mean to soud like a downer and I realize that I don''t know you both. But what have you to lose by asking him why he can''t seem to commit to this relationship?

 

[Mara]

I kind of agree with pebbles on some of this stuff. I know that each relationship is different but from my previous experience, living with someone with no real committment other than how to split the bills is not necessarily the BEST recipe for ending up married. Both Greg and I did that previously with ex's and the reltionships just didn't work out. This time we both decided not to live together until we were sure we were going to be married/engaged fairly soon. I also put my foot down and gave him a timeline ... nothing unreasonable but I was not going to wait around.

I told Greg that I wanted to know by 2 years of being together if I was the ONE for him. I didn't think I was being unreasonable. I said after 2 years what more do you really need to know? Am I going to grow horns after we get engaged? (I already had them...more wouldn't grow! tee hee). And seriously if after 2 years of being together all the time, they can't say yes or no...then for me it was time to move on. I have alot of self-esteem and respect for myself and knew that I did not want to be frittering away time hanging around HOPING that the man I loved would ask me to marry him and feel the same way. I'd rather have ended up alone. Thank goodness it did not turn out that way but I really believe that people should value themselves and their happiness and peace of mind enough to put your foot down and state what is right for YOU rather than hanging around hoping against hope and being miserable about how you are on different wavelengths. I don't know how anyone can be in such an agitated state about your life for so long. It's kind of like hating your job situation. If I had a friend who was complaining about her job all the time and how her boss treated her, I'd be like 'well find a new job or make the one you have work and be happy there with it's good and it's bads". I mean if someone, anyone is unhappy with their life situation or an issue, then FIND A WAY to change it and make it better or just move on. That's the way life is! I know it's HARD in terms of relationships but what is better in the end for you? Sometimes people don't think about themselves at all but you really have to consider yourself and long-term happiness.

It's YOUR LIFE, no one else's, so live it the best way you know how and be happy. Life is too short to be hoping and wondering if the man you love is going to come to his senses and ask you to marry him. Sometimes I think you have to force the issue.

Just my two cents...

 

[goldengirl]

Date: 10/11/2005 7:43:03 PM
Author: Mara
I also put my foot down and gave him a timeline ... nothing unreasonable but I was not going to wait around. I told Greg that I wanted to know by 2 years of being together if I was the ONE for him. I didn''t think I was being unreasonable. I said after 2 years what more do you really need to know? [...] And seriously if after 2 years of being together all the time, they can''t say yes or no...then for me it was time to move on. I have alot of self-esteem and respect for myself and knew that I did not want to be frittering away time hanging around HOPING that the man I loved would ask me to marry him and feel the same way. I''d rather have ended up alone.

ITA, Mara, and I gave Kyle a timeline on our first date. I''m still pretty young though, so I said three years.

Seriously, ''Manda, while I don''t think the issue has anything to do with "free milk," per se, I do think it''s time you let him know HOW important this is to you. Of course, that means taking a little introspection. At this point, you need to ask yourself: Do you love this man enough to stay with him even if you never get married? I suspect not (heck, I don''t!) and you need to communicate that to him. Tell him, seriously, that this is very important to you and you deserve to know where you stand with him. Maybe give him a timeline, tell him he has until X date to make up his mind. And then absolutely shut up about it, give him until that time. If that date comes with no ring or no absolute promise of commitment, walk out. Nobody''s saying it''s an easy thing to do, but you need to respect yourself/your needs and if it takes you leaving for him to realize you''re serious, so be it. If you leave and he doesn''t want you enough to come after you, then you know he never intended to follow though at all.

My friend did that; December 03 she told him (bf of 4+ years) he had until the next November. 2004 came and went and nothing, so in December she left him. When she told him it was over and why, he gave some lame line about how he was "right about" to propose... but he didn''t make any attempt to prevent her from leaving. If you''re really "right about" to propose, you don''t just let that person walk out of your life.

I feel no shame in saying I want a marriage and a family. That''s important to me and I''m not willing to give that up, even for him. What about you?

 

[appletini]

My favorite quote is from Samantha on Sex & The City... "I love you, but I love myself more." I have given my BF the time frame, which is year end and he knows I''m not bluffing.

 

[cinnabar]

I waited NINE years for a proposal that never came. Fortunately for me, I was never about having babies so the passage of time didn''t ruin my life. They were nine good years. We broke up over the lack of wedding plans and I married someone else two and a half years later. My commitmentphobe ex got married this year, so he did have it in him. Sometimes "I''m not ready for marriage" means "I''m not ready for marriage to you, but in the meantime this is better than being single".

He was my second commitmentphobe. I pressured the first one into marriage, which he resented and it ended in divorce.

I never game this second ex an ultimatum because I didn''t want him to have any excuse for resentment. The proposal had to be from his heart, of his own volition, or not at all. Since that wasn''t happening, I lost patience (and at nine years, that''s quite a lot of patience).

He was a really nice guy, not a jerk at all. We''re still friends. But we weren''t destined for marriage to each other.

I was beginning to think that either there was something wrong with me, that I kept picking commitmentphobes like other women pick bad boys. When I found my now-husband, I knew he was the One by our third date. He thought the same about me. Commitment was suddenly no problem.

From my own experience, I''m deeply suspicious that any man who makes excuses after, say, two years, is never, ever going to propose (or is going to make a lousy husband because he never wanted to get married really).

That''s not to say that there aren''t long-term dating relationships that are rock-solid and do end in happy marriage: I know such folk do exist. I ain''t one of ''em though.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/11/2005 8:09:40 PM
Author: goldengirl

My friend did that; December 03 she told him (bf of 4+ years) he had until the next November. 2004 came and went and nothing, so in December she left him. When she told him it was over and why, he gave some lame line about how he was 'right about' to propose... but he didn't make any attempt to prevent her from leaving.

If he was really "right about" to propose, and his mate has said "I'm walking if there is no proposal by November", then why wouldn't a "right about to propose" person ask by the last week in October? I mean, really......two weeks more is really gonna make him *more* ready???? I don't think so.

I really am a firm believer in deadlines. Deadlines aren't ultimatums, per se....they don't tell a person "YOU have to do THIS or else." No, instead you simply tell someone else what *you* are going to do.

"We've been in this relationship for 4 years, and I feel we pretty much know most of what there is to know about each other at this point. It's hard to imagine something major cropping up out of nowhere this late in the game. I love you very much and I know I want to spend my life with you, but I can't make you be ready, too. I have to be candid and tell you that I want a marriage, a husband, a permanent partner. These things are deeply important to me. If you aren't able or ready to be those things to me, then I need to accept that and move on....to spend my time looking for someone who IS ready. I want to give you time to digest what I'm saying--to think about how you really feel and what you want, so I'm going to give this another six months. If we still aren't in the same place then, I'm going to move on."

 

[Matata]

Date: 10/11/2005 10:08:12 PM
Author: aljdewey

I really am a firm believer in deadlines. Deadlines aren''t ultimatums, per se....they don''t tell a person ''YOU have to do THIS or else.'' No, instead you simply tell someone else what *you* are going to do.

''We''ve been in this relationship for 4 years, and I feel we pretty much know most of what there is to know about each other at this point. It''s hard to imagine something major cropping up out of nowhere this late in the game. I love you very much and I know I want to spend my life with you, but I can''t make you be ready, too. I have to be candid and tell you that I want a marriage, a husband, a permanent partner. These things are deeply important to me. If you aren''t able or ready to be those things to me, then I need to accept that and move on....to spend my time looking for someone who IS ready. I want to give you time to digest what I''m saying--to think about how you really feel and what you want, so I''m going to give this another six months. If we still aren''t in the same place then, I''m going to move on.''

Wow. You stole my speech. I had this chat with FI almost 3 years ago and I moved out. He had a life altering epiphany at that point and asked for another chance. We''ll be married in 2007. I made him wait quite a long time before I said yes to the proposal because I wanted to be sure that he really wanted to be married and married to me and didn''t ask because it was easier than entering the dating game again. Sometimes you have to lose something before you realize how precious it is. Sometimes you lose it forever and other times you''re lucky enough to get it back. It hurts either way but staying true to yourself and not settling for less than you need makes for a healthier and happier life.

 

[goldengirl]

Date: 10/11/2005 8:20:00 PM
Author: appletini
My favorite quote is from Samantha on Sex & The City... ''I love you, but I love myself more.'' I have given my BF the time frame, which is year end and he knows I''m not bluffing.

Apple, so what if he proposes on NYE? Will you be happy he proposed at such a romantic time? Or will you be peevish that he barely slipped it in "under the wire"?

(Cuz I tell you what, I''d be the latter.)

 

[Mara]

Date: 10/11/2005 10:45:58 PM
Author: Matata

Date: 10/11/2005 10:08:12 PM
Author: aljdewey

I really am a firm believer in deadlines. Deadlines aren't ultimatums, per se....they don't tell a person 'YOU have to do THIS or else.' No, instead you simply tell someone else what *you* are going to do.

'We've been in this relationship for 4 years, and I feel we pretty much know most of what there is to know about each other at this point. It's hard to imagine something major cropping up out of nowhere this late in the game. I love you very much and I know I want to spend my life with you, but I can't make you be ready, too. I have to be candid and tell you that I want a marriage, a husband, a permanent partner. These things are deeply important to me. If you aren't able or ready to be those things to me, then I need to accept that and move on....to spend my time looking for someone who IS ready. I want to give you time to digest what I'm saying--to think about how you really feel and what you want, so I'm going to give this another six months. If we still aren't in the same place then, I'm going to move on.'

Wow. You stole my speech. I had this chat with FI almost 3 years ago and I moved out. He had a life altering epiphany at that point and asked for another chance. We'll be married in 2007. I made him wait quite a long time before I said yes to the proposal because I wanted to be sure that he really wanted to be married and married to me and didn't ask because it was easier than entering the dating game again. Sometimes you have to lose something before you realize how precious it is. Sometimes you lose it forever and other times you're lucky enough to get it back. It hurts either way but staying true to yourself and not settling for less than you need makes for a healthier and happier life.

This is so true...part of why I knew that Greg was the one for me was because we had had a horrible break up 1 year into the relationship and after that had managed to find our way back to each other afterwards...realized that we both were lacking in communication and that we both had done things we were very sorry for. The fact that we got back together after having such a horrible time apart--and then after getting back together having it be so wonderful as we applied everything we had learned while apart (aka how to really appreciate the other)...it really showed me that I wanted to be with him forever and that he was the one I wanted to grow old with. So that is why after another 6 months together after getting back together, I told him...look we know that we didn't want to be apart, that was blatantly obvious to us..and we have been very happy for the last six months. I need to know within the next 6 months if you feel like you see yourself with me 5/10/20/50 years down the line. Because if not, I will need to move on because I don't plan to hang around waiting and hoping that you feel the same, it would be too painful and I respect myself too much. It wasn't that I told him he had to propose in 6 months, but rather just be able to tell me YES I feel like you are the one for me and let's take steps towards our future together on a timetable we both feel comfortable with.

I know I have told this story before but it really strikes me as an important experience, because it would have been devastating for me to have to make good on leaving him, BUT I also knew that if after 2 years of being with me and us going through the ups and downs that we did and then being so happy together, if that was not enough for him to know, then it would NEVER be enough for him to know, and I did not want to torture myself by hanging around hoping. To me that's like dying a slow death.

Lo and behold, within 5 months he had been thinking about our convo and he told me after too much wine that he was way more ready to get engaged than I thought and I should just take him to look at rings. Well next weekend he got his wish, I found PS, and the rest is history.

I also firmly believe that sometimes timing is everything and sometimes someone is ready but the other is not, and then when one moves on, the other finds happiness and gets married, etc...sometimes it's even the one who was balking or 'not ready' in the first place. I think that the right person at the right time really makes all the difference...you can have two right people who find each other at the wrong time and it just cannot work.

 

[goldengirl]

Yep... you gotta find a guy with his "light on".

 

[appletini]

Date: 10/11/2005 11:09:14 PM
Author: goldengirl

Date: 10/11/2005 8:20:00 PM
Author: appletini
My favorite quote is from Samantha on Sex & The City... ''I love you, but I love myself more.'' I have given my BF the time frame, which is year end and he knows I''m not bluffing.

Apple, so what if he proposes on NYE? Will you be happy he proposed at such a romantic time? Or will you be peevish that he barely slipped it in ''under the wire''?

(Cuz I tell you what, I''d be the latter.)

NYE would be the worst proposal if its anything like last NYE (actually we looked at rings that day). Last year his friends had a party (and yes they were all married or engaged), and all the boys started playing cards, and as the night went on the girls slowly fell asleep, at 4am I took his car and went home.

If he doesn''t start the ring process in the next few weeks, I won''t even wait until NYE. He''s made me wait so long, and dissapointed me so many times in that dept already, I''m so afraid that when he does ask (if he does) that I''m just going to say "Finally!" instead of Yes, and crying, and being so excited. He''s been so sweet lately, he always is, but extra sweet, so I don''t know if he has something up his sleeve, or he''s just hoping I won''t break up with him. Not to mention I so don''t want to go to the wedding next weekend...I''m trying to think of every excuse possible to get out of it. If it were in town I wouldn''t care, but its out of town, so that means Thursday-Sunday of torture.

 

[rae]

Date: 10/11/2005 11:21:57 PM
Author: Mara

This is so true...part of why I knew that Greg was the one for me was because we had had a horrible break up 1 year into the relationship and after that had managed to find our way back to each other afterwards...realized that we both were lacking in communication and that we both had done things we were very sorry for. The fact that we got back together after having such a horrible time apart--and then after getting back together having it be so wonderful as we applied everything we had learned while apart (aka how to really appreciate the other)...it really showed me that I wanted to be with him forever and that he was the one I wanted to grow old with.

Mara, wow, I never realised how similar that part of our ''stories'' were. +1 and I also had a difficult patch/breakup a bit over a year after we first started going out,,, but we realised that we did indeed want to spend our lives together so we worked it out...

We have been together (properly - post-hiccup) for just over 3 years, and although we are not yet engaged, that is mostly because of logistics (long-distance relationship).... we have discussed it and we are both on the same page - it will happen when it is right, we both know this and neither of us are rushing. (My god, for once does boy-soon = girl-soon...??!! This may come back to bite me in the future....)

So I think the key point is not so much how long people have been together per se, but whether they have communicated their own time frames (either general or specific) to each other.... AP, has your bf given you SOME idea of how much time he thinks he might need before he is "ready"....?

 

[ammayernyc]

Well, I gave him a semi-timeline. I told that I want to be married next year. I''m not sure what that means about proposing though.

The thing is, I don''t want to leave him to find someone else to marry. I''m not about just getting married. I want to get married to him. So, I don''t want to leave him because I''m wasting my time waiting. I don''t feel that way.

I''m just anxious because I''m about to make a big step with my life by (most probably) leaving my job. I don''t know what I want to do next. Thankfully, I''m financially stable so I don''t need to worry about getting a new job right away, but all this uncertainty is really upsetting. So, I want something stable... and living with my boyfriend is certainly stable, but marriage is more. And I also have all these parent-like people telling me that it''s time. So, I''m going a little crazy because of that.

I truly feel that this relationship won''t end until he says that I am not the one he wants to marry. And I don''t think that will happen. I think he just needs to be nudged in the right direction.

 

[Angel7]

I''m sorry you are feeling so sad. I''m sure it will all work out.

But, in my experience, when you have to push someone to do something. Usually means they just don''t want to do it. At least not at that moment.

(I push my bf to clean up the house and he hates me for it!(Especially since I dont live there and have no say!)
He says he wants to do it when he is good and ready to do it. I just call him lazy!

)

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 10/12/2005 10:58:25 AM
Author: AmandaPanda
Well, I gave him a semi-timeline. I told that I want to be married next year. I''m not sure what that means about proposing though.

The thing is, I don''t want to leave him to find someone else to marry. I''m not about just getting married. I want to get married to him. So, I don''t want to leave him because I''m wasting my time waiting. I don''t feel that way.

I''m just anxious because I''m about to make a big step with my life by (most probably) leaving my job. I don''t know what I want to do next. Thankfully, I''m financially stable so I don''t need to worry about getting a new job right away, but all this uncertainty is really upsetting. So, I want something stable... and living with my boyfriend is certainly stable, but marriage is more. And I also have all these parent-like people telling me that it''s time. So, I''m going a little crazy because of that.

I truly feel that this relationship won''t end until he says that I am not the one he wants to marry. And I don''t think that will happen. I think he just needs to be nudged in the right direction.

Are you happy, AP? Because you don''t sound happy, and you deserve to be happy. Does it make you happy to feel frustrated so often? Does it make you happy to feel insecure all the time? Does it make you happy that he can''t even tell you *WHY* he doesn''t feel ready? I don''t think you are happy with it.....if you were, there wouldn''t be a need to vent, but there is. If you were really happy with things as they are, you wouldn''t be frustrated with what isn''t there.

At what point will you demand a change? What if it''s still like this 1 year from now? 3 years from now? 10 years from now? Because it could be. What then? What if he says "I never want to get married"....what then? Are you going to stay with him then, or will you move on? What happens if he never says "you are not the one I want to marry"?. but he also never asks. Because he may never say that either. These are things to think about.

Of course you want to marry him.....but you can''t make him want to marry you, and unless he wants to marry you, it''s not gonna happen. He has assured you that you are what he wants. There is a difference between "You are who I want" and "you are who I want to marry".

Only you can decide what you are willing to put up with and how you are willing to let someone treat you.

This is going to sound harsh, and I really don''t mean it to be. I know this is difficult to hear.

People do the things they want to do. If he wanted to marry you, he would ask. You asked "why won''t he propose"....the answer, it seems, is "because he doesn''t want to, and because he doesn''t have to."

"He doesn''t want to" could mean a few things. It could mean he doesn''t want to marry at all; it could mean he doesn''t want to marry *now*; it could mean he doesn''t want to marry you. In any case, the net result is he doesn''t want to, and if he doesn''t want to, it won''t happen.

"He doesn''t have to" means that he already has what he wants...he has you now, and he doesn''t have to marry to have you. As long as he can remain unmarried and still have you, there is no reason for him to marry. You say you''ve told him you want to marry next year. What if he doesn''t? Then what?

If you are going to stay no matter what, then it would be best for your sanity to simply accept that you two will never marry. Stop angsting about it, stop hoping about it, and stop expecting it. Then you won''t be disappointed if it doesn''t happen, and you can be happy with the way things are.

 

[pebbles]

I think Aljdewey said so eloquently what I was thinking in my post. She has that way about her.

I was talking to my husband about relationships and I asked him when he realized he was going to marry me. He said the night that we met he knew I would be his wife. We got married almost 3 years after we met, but he said most guys know when they meet "The One" and usually don''t waste any time wanting to make that formal committment.

Two of my friends went through situations you are in, one was a girl and one was a guy.

"Kate" lived with her boyfriend for a little over 3 years. They constantly talked about getting married; he assured her over and over that she was The One but he always put off getting engaged b/c he wasn''t "ready". After a while of her getting frustrated they finally had a serious talk. He said he wants to be with her but he doesn''t know if he will ever feel ready to get married. At that point she was willing to accept that (it was probably the 5 year mark in their relationship). At least she knew where she stood. So they continued to live together. As the months went by, she realized that being just a girlfriend wasn''t enough to satisfy her. She loved him and wanted to marry him but it was obvious he didn''t feel that way about her. One day she had another big talk with him. She said that this arrangement wasn''t providing her with what she needed. He still didn''t want to get married so she broke it off with him. At that time she said she felt good b/c now she could get on with her life. About a year later she ran into her old boyfriend at McDonald''s. They chit-chatted for a while when he dropped the bomb on her -- he was getting married. Katie was floored. She asked why he didn''t want to marry her and he said he just knew in his heart it wasn''t right, that when he met his fiance, he knew was he was missing all along. Katie of course blammed herself for not being good enough to marry, but it wasn''t it - -they just weren''t right for each other. A few months later Katie met the man she married last fall. She said the feelings were so different than they were with her old boyfriend. She new the first week they were dating that they would get married because he reciprocated those feelings.

I have known my friend "Joe" since high school. When we were all single we used to hang out together. Joe started dating a girl named "Jen". She was so sweet and funny. She wasn''t jealous of any of us (Joe''s female friends) and we got along great. He dated her about a year when people starting asking when they were getting married. Joe always told us they would but he wasn''t ready yet. Then another year went by, and Jen started getting a little anxious. His family loved her, Joe''s friends loved her, so what was the problem? One day one of my other guy friends had a heart to heart with Joe. Joe admitted that he loved her and that she was a great person, but he just couldn''t see them getting married. There was nothing wrong with her or nothing specific he could put his finger on, he just didn''t want to marry her. Joe broke it off with her a few weeks later b/c he didn''t want to string her along any longer. I think we were all sadder than Joe for the break up. We certainly felt bad for Jen, but at the same time were glad that Joe acknowledged his feelings. A couple of years later Joe met all of us at a bar with his new girlfriend. One of my friends leaned over to me and said "Joe''s going to marry that girl". He looked at her in a way we had never seen him look at anyone else before. Joe, who normally was a type A personality with a quick temper, was much more mellow and took things in stride like he never had before. He was a completely different person. He was so happy. And about 18 months later, he did marry her.

I''m not telling this in order to make you feel bad. Just to say that there is someone out there for everyone, and that just being with someone for a long time doesn''t automatically make them the best person for you.

I agree with Alj -- you don''t sound happy. If I remember correctly, you have posted about your situation before. Your feelings don''t sound like they''re being reciprocated. It doesn''t sound like you would be happy just being someone''s girlfriend - -and I wouldn''t either. Please, please, look at things. Maybe some time away from him will let you know whether you want to continue on like this. From what he''s saying, it doesn''t sound like a proposal is coming soon.

I''m not trying to be mean, just realistic.

 

[Evie75]

I feel your frustration.. im very frustrated my self.. Ive been dating my BF for almost 2 years and for the past few months.. ALL he talks about is getting married to me.. having a house making babies .. planning the wedding blah blah.... his family refers to me as *in law* with cute winks.. okay i think its wonderful that you wanna marry and that your family is excited too. but come on already stop teasing me and ask me already.... its killing me

 

[jaysonsmom]

I''m afraid I have to agree with Aljdewey and Pebbles. I was in your boat 7 years ago. I finally decided I wasn''t happy being the girlfriend, and left the ex. I started dating my husband 3 months later, and within the first 6 months of dating he proposed, and it just felt right because all my feelings were reciprocated. I have never felt any insecurity with my husband. I have never felt any doubt, and I have never questioned his love for me. I have also never asked myself "what is wrong with me". I have never been as happy and fulfilled ever since I''ve been with mu husband....that''s how I know I''m with "the one". Take it from an experienced woman....I went through all the agony that you''re going through, and you definitely don''t sound happy. YYou''ll feel as if the weight has been lifted off your shoulders when you meet "the one".

PS: My ex is stringing along another woman right now, the last I heard, she rally wants to get married, and he''s happy living wth her and her 2 kids!

 

[lilyinct]

AP- I''ve read some of your posts before about you and your boyfriend, and I can feel your pain, kid....I''ve been in those shoes before...dated for 3 years, wanted a commitment but he "wasn''t ready", not to mention really stubborn.

So I started thinking about spending the rest of my life with someone who pretty much disregarded my feelings as he just keeps to his own timeline....did I really want to struggle with him for every decision in our future? Is that how I wanted to spend my life, begging him for everything, bringing myself to tears at every turn?

No way. Told him my exact feelings, and though he told me he would try to change, I just didn''t believe him (heard it too many times before). Relationships are not supposed to be stressful and so complicated. Left him and it was the best thing I had done.

Met my now husband 2 months to the day....good luck

 

[Mara]

Well, I gave him a semi-timeline. I told that I want to be married next year. I''m not sure what that means about proposing though.

--Personally if he is a bit skittish, I think telling him you want to be MARRIED next year is a big jump from just getting engaged. I found that while Greg was a bit skittish about getting engaged, once we were engaged, he was totally gung-ho about marriage. It was like once he took that FIRST step it was a tidal wave of surety. Maybe take smaller steps?
The thing is, I don''t want to leave him to find someone else to marry. I''m not about just getting married. I want to get married to him. So, I don''t want to leave him because I''m wasting my time waiting. I don''t feel that way.

--Of course you want to get married to him, it''s not about just finding anyone!! You know that you want to be married to him. But does he want to get married to you? I know he SAYS he does, but for me actions speak louder than words, and this is also what I told Greg way back when. Sure you say you have been waiting for me all your life but how does that translate into action.
I''m just anxious because I''m about to make a big step with my life by (most probably) leaving my job. I don''t know what I want to do next. Thankfully, I''m financially stable so I don''t need to worry about getting a new job right away, but all this uncertainty is really upsetting. So, I want something stable... and living with my boyfriend is certainly stable, but marriage is more. And I also have all these parent-like people telling me that it''s time. So, I''m going a little crazy because of that.

--That one line about wanting something stable, aka marriage strikes me as a bit odd, is that the biggest reason to want to get married? Otherwise would you just be fine with living together?
I truly feel that this relationship won''t end until he says that I am not the one he wants to marry. And I don''t think that will happen. I think he just needs to be nudged in the right direction.

--I agree with the others in that what if he never says that? EVER? What if he thinks he wants to marry you but just can''t get the action going. What does that say? What if another 6 months go by and you are still as miserable as before? Will you still stick around hoping? You may not regret that time now, but you may 2-3 years from now. It''s just food for thought, no one is saying your BF does not love you or want to marry you but seriously, alot of life experience from others can go a long way in at least listening.

--I would really try to determine if it''s worth being this upset all the time about where your life is not going. And try to make a change, whether it is to be happy with what you have and to hell with the ring and marriage, or to say yanno what, this is not for me. Take charge of your life..it is yours!

 

[Hamster]

Date: 10/12/2005 1:24:06 PM
Author: Angel7

But, in my experience, when you have to push someone to do something. Usually means they just don''t want to do it. At least not at that moment.

I think that sometimes you HAVE to push people to make a decision though. I think that men just don''t like to make these kinds of decisions and they procrastinate. I think it is totally reasonable to ask for someone to make a decision (rather than asking them for a proposal).

My boyfriend was one that needed some pushing. We dated for a few years long distance (Can/US) because we both had established careers that were important to us and neither of us wanted to sacrifice that. After a while though, it just got to be emotionally draining (on both of us, but I think I took it especially hard), because there is a certain amount of stress involved in being in a committed relationship with someone that you only see once every 6-8 weeks. Earlier this year we started talking about it and his solution to the problem was for me to move to Canada, BUT WITH NO ENGAGEMENT COMMITMENT from him. I told him "no way!", especially since he was asking me to move to another country and leave my career behind. I asked him if he would be willing to move to the US, and he said "no". Apparently, that would have interfered with his career plan and did not sound like a "rational" decision to him. At that point, I told him that I was getting too old to pick up and move to another country, leave my life behind, and NOT have any guarantees that he was committed to the relationship 100% - it just didn''t seem fair to me, especially since he was expecting me to bear all the inconvenience. I said that I''d be willing to move if he was willing to make a commitment, but that if he couldn''t make a commitment soon, we''d have to end the relationship because it was too stressful for me. We kind of went on in this limbo state for a few months with him constantly saying "I just need some time to figure things out" every time I brought up the commitment issue and me refusing to move everytime he asked me to go up there.

Finally, I snapped and told him that I absolutely could not deal with it anymore and that I didn''t need a ring, but I needed a decision and that I wanted to move to Canada to be with him, but only if he showed me that it would be to spend the rest of my life with him. Otherwise it would be the last time that he would see me because I couldn''t keep doing this. I think he could tell that time that I really meant business because all of the sudden we started shopping for rings.

He needed that push to to make a decision, otherwise we''d be in limbo forever or I''d be living with him and not married for the next 10 years. I think guys will assume that if you put up with it, it is ok, so you need to show them that you won''t put up with it.

 

[caligal]

I''m so sorry what you are going through! I once read something from the Mars/Venus book selection I will be using myself if coming summer I''m not engaged.... a quote for you to use "since you aren''t where I am in the relationship it makes me doubt in our relationship. I''m going to move out and take some time to think- and give you the room to do the same." You know the saying, " you don''t know what you''ve got til it''s gone? This would really make a guy think wouldn''t it? This isn''t an empty threat to "scare him" into marriage- but truly should be used for you both to think about the relationship. Don''t you want to know if he''s going to come to this commitment by now? Most of us tend to take our relationship for granted unless one of us is hurt, sick, or away from us for a while. I''ll be implementing this technique myself come summer if he hasn''t proposed- just a thought for you! That being said- you know your situation better than I do, and know what will work best for you. I wish you much luck!

 

[goldengirl]

I nominate alj for the best post of the year.

Exceptionally well-said and everything we were all trying to get across.

I wish we were never presented with these situations.