How do you feel about this teen's faked pregnancy?

[suchende]

I think she probably taught her classmates an important lesson in judgment and social politics. I volunteer at a summer camp for teen leaders and for one of the exercises, we blindfold the campers and sit them down together to chat with someone anonymously. Does everyone already know we prejudice people on looks? Of course. Is it still a powerful lessons for teens on how they perceive others for things that are irrelevant to that person's value as a friend/employee/etc? I think so (and so do my campers). It was creative and thought provoking. If it didn't cover lots of new intellectual ground... What, another report on Peru would have??

 

[zoebartlett]

JulieN --- Like Circe, I don't understand why you're comparing obesity and teen pregnancy.

 

[Maria D]

I think she probably taught her classmates an important lesson in judgment and social politics. I volunteer at a summer camp for teen leaders and for one of the exercises, we blindfold the campers and sit them down together to chat with someone anonymously. Does everyone already know we prejudice people on looks? Of course. Is it still a powerful lessons for teens on how they perceive others for things that are irrelevant to that person's value as a friend/employee/etc? I think so (and so do my campers). It was creative and thought provoking. If it didn't cover lots of new intellectual ground... What, another report on Peru would have??

While I agree that whether or not a teen is expecting a child is irrelevant to that person's *value* it is not irrelevant to his or her fit into the social norm of his/her peer group. Having a child carries adult responsibilities and should be undertaken by adults only. It's unseemly to not want to be friends with someone in high school because their hair is frizzy and they have acne. It is not unseemly to not want to befriend a pregnant girl (or the guy who knocked her up). Or to not want to continue to be the close friend of someone who finds themselves in this situation. A teen may want to have friends that are involved in things a teen should be involved in, and this does not include starting a family. What's wrong with that?

 

[iLander]

If I were a close member of her family I would be incredibly insulted for being lied to on such an important issue. You don't keep secrets from your family. That's just wrong, IMHO. If her boyfriend were my son, and she had put me through the stress of thinking my son was going to be a father at an early age, I think I would be royally pissed.

Pretty self-centered to think of her "project" first, and the feelings of family members second.

I couldn't trust someone that could lie so much, for so long, to people whom she supposedly loves.

Ticks me off . . .

 

[suchende]

I think she probably taught her classmates an important lesson in judgment and social politics. I volunteer at a summer camp for teen leaders and for one of the exercises, we blindfold the campers and sit them down together to chat with someone anonymously. Does everyone already know we prejudice people on looks? Of course. Is it still a powerful lessons for teens on how they perceive others for things that are irrelevant to that person's value as a friend/employee/etc? I think so (and so do my campers). It was creative and thought provoking. If it didn't cover lots of new intellectual ground... What, another report on Peru would have??

While I agree that whether or not a teen is expecting a child is irrelevant to that person's *value* it is not irrelevant to his or her fit into the social norm of his/her peer group. Having a child carries adult responsibilities and should be undertaken by adults only. It's unseemly to not want to be friends with someone in high school because their hair is frizzy and they have acne. It is not unseemly to not want to befriend a pregnant girl (or the guy who knocked her up). Or to not want to continue to be the close friend of someone who finds themselves in this situation. A teen may want to have friends that are involved in things a teen should be involved in, and this does not include starting a family. What's wrong with that?

All I am saying is, she forced her friends to evaluate the motivations for their behaviors. If they feel as self-righteous as ever, fine. I am just saying the scope of the project and its potential value might not be what people in this thread assume. If all she accomplished was a little self reflection in teens' own value systems, it has some value.

 

[swingirl]

If I were a close member of her family I would be incredibly insulted for being lied to on such an important issue. You don't keep secrets from your family. That's just wrong, IMHO. If her boyfriend were my son, and she had put me through the stress of thinking my son was going to be a father at an early age, I think I would be royally pissed.

Pretty self-centered to think of her "project" first, and the feelings of family members second.

I couldn't trust someone that could lie so much, for so long, to people whom she supposedly loves.

Ticks me off . . .

This situation could do terrible damage to the boy's relationship with his own family. There doesn't seem to anything beneficial to him or his parents. It wasn't HIS school project. Is this slander or defamation? And if she was treated differently, wouldn't he be as well? As the boy's parent I'd be livid! I would not want any of them as my in-laws.

 

[iLander]

If I were a close member of her family I would be incredibly insulted for being lied to on such an important issue. You don't keep secrets from your family. That's just wrong, IMHO. If her boyfriend were my son, and she had put me through the stress of thinking my son was going to be a father at an early age, I think I would be royally pissed.

Pretty self-centered to think of her "project" first, and the feelings of family members second.

I couldn't trust someone that could lie so much, for so long, to people whom she supposedly loves.

Ticks me off . . .

This situation could do terrible damage to the boy's relationship with his own family. There doesn't seem to anything beneficial to him or his parents. It wasn't HIS school project. Is this slander or defamation? And if she was treated differently, wouldn't he be as well? As the boy's parent I'd be livid/

Absolutely!

She's being divisive, asking a son to lie to his parents.

 

[Maria D]

Self-righteousness?

Some kids don't want to hang out with kids who are involved in activities that they SHOULDN'T be involved in. Might be promiscuity, might be drug use, might be pregnancy and child-rearing. This is not the same as reflecting on your motivation for not wanting the goofy kid with thick glasses to sit at your table in the lunch room.

My daughter attends the same high school I teach in. I would be mortified and asking myself what I did wrong if she in any way harmed any of the pregnant girls/moms at our school. But I'm really not worried about the fact that she doesn't want to hang out with them, that she privately rolls her eyes at the kids who pay undue to attention to it, that she finds the whole thing a huge distraction to the learning environment. Because that's what it is.

 

[JewelFreak]

I would be mortified and asking myself what I did wrong if she in any way harmed any of the pregnant girls/moms at our school. But I'm really not worried about the fact that she doesn't want to hang out with them, that she privately rolls her eyes at the kids who pay undue to attention to it, that she finds the whole thing a huge distraction to the learning environment. Because that's what it is.

+1

I can't buy moral relativity. EVERYTHING isn't ok if a nice person does it. Nor if saying so will hurt somebody's self-esteem. A dose of injured self-esteem is good for everyone at times in their lives -- makes them try to do better. Getting pregnant in high school is morally wrong 1) because it's so easily prevented, and 2) because the outlook for the child (and mother) is poor, unless the mother can afford to take care of a child well physically & has someone to help provide for its emotional growth. A teenager has not lived enough life yet to be able to do the latter, is still growing herself. To me, it's a selfish short-sighted act. And unintelligent.

Before anyone fans up flames, once in a while it works, usually it fails sadly. Yes, in the "old days" couples married & had families in their teens -- the married part helps from economic, emotional & stability viewpoints, and communities & families were tight-knit then, children cared for on a number of levels by relatives & close friends. That's not taking drugs, etc., into the equation, either. Very different scene now.

--- Laurie

 

[suchende]

Self-righteousness?

Some kids don't want to hang out with kids who are involved in activities that they SHOULDN'T be involved in. Might be promiscuity, might be drug use, might be pregnancy and child-rearing. This is not the same as reflecting on your motivation for not wanting the goofy kid with thick glasses to sit at your table in the lunch room.

My daughter attends the same high school I teach in. I would be mortified and asking myself what I did wrong if she in any way harmed any of the pregnant girls/moms at our school. But I'm really not worried about the fact that she doesn't want to hang out with them, that she privately rolls her eyes at the kids who pay undue to attention to it, that she finds the whole thing a huge distraction to the learning environment. Because that's what it is.

Any teen who has sex might become a pregnant teen. They might decide to give it up for adoption (like the birth mother of my baby brother) or they might decide to get an abortion (like my best friend in high school) or they might decide to raise it. Anyone who had sex in high school and didn't get pregnant had some measure of luck. To distance yourself from someone who was your friend beforehand for what is bad luck is cruel. If that is what was happening to this girl over the course of her experiment (sounds like that is the case) and she wasn't representing herself as having gotten pregnant recklessly and intentionally, pointing out her friends' and classmates' cruelty seems like a worthwhile exercise.

 

[ksinger]

I would be mortified and asking myself what I did wrong if she in any way harmed any of the pregnant girls/moms at our school. But I'm really not worried about the fact that she doesn't want to hang out with them, that she privately rolls her eyes at the kids who pay undue to attention to it, that she finds the whole thing a huge distraction to the learning environment. Because that's what it is.

+1

I can't buy moral relativity. EVERYTHING isn't ok if a nice person does it. Nor if saying so will hurt somebody's self-esteem. A dose of injured self-esteem is good for everyone at times in their lives -- makes them try to do better. Getting pregnant in high school is morally wrong 1) because it's so easily prevented, and 2) because the outlook for the child (and mother) is poor, unless the mother can afford to take care of a child well physically & has someone to help provide for its emotional growth. A teenager has not lived enough life yet to be able to do the latter, is still growing herself. To me, it's a selfish short-sighted act. And unintelligent.

Before anyone fans up flames, once in a while it works, usually it fails sadly. Yes, in the "old days" couples married & had families in their teens -- the married part helps from economic, emotional & stability viewpoints, and communities & families were tight-knit then, children cared for on a number of levels by relatives & close friends. That's not taking drugs, etc., into the equation, either. Very different scene now.

--- Laurie

No flames here. Thank you Maria and JewelFreak!! I'm deadly tired of this idea that we mustn't ever "hurt anyone's feelings" by "judging" them. We judge situations and people every single day, and to do any LESS, is morally cowardly and is in fact, Amoral in every sense of the word. Again, getting pregnant as a teen in NOT a morally neutral thing. It is costly to the individuals involved and to society, and in that sense, society has a right and an obligation, to call it detrimental. Praising kids for doing this - and yes, that IS happening, at least by their peers in some places - or telling them that it's OK that they should focus on the negative reactions of others as "unfair" (which I'm fairly sure this girl will be doing), when THEY are the ones who've screwed up big time, is not going to improve the situation we now find ourselves in. Social pressure works, especially during the teen years - positive reinforcement works, and so does negative. It's just that we're all a bunch of wussies anymore and never want anyone to feel any psychic pain from their actions. The one thing we SHOULD be telling our kids instead, is that you do something like that, people WILL judge you, and that's just the way life works, and if they wish to avoid harsh judgement, then they should think twice.

Personal anecdote - like most teens I had a few opportunties to have sex before I was 18, and like most teens I was sorely tempted. You know what kept me from doing it? (Yes, I waited until college) I didn't want to distress or SHAME my mother, or endure the shame of having to admit it to anyone. I was deterred by knowledge of negative social and familial reactions. Go figure.

 

[jstarfireb]

I definitely agree that teen pregnancy is not something we should sit idly by and accept, but something we should work to prevent through comprehensive sex education and wider access to condoms and birth control. The birth control issue is tough because almost all teens are on their parents' health insurance plans and probably don't want their parents to know they're having sex, but at least condoms should be promoted.

I don't agree with the argument that pregnant teens should be socially ostracized as a form of punishment. If she chooses to continue the pregnancy, a pregnant teen is already going through enough punishment without even considering the social issues...nine months of pregnancy with its nausea and bodily changes and whatnot, followed by a variable number of hours in painful labor, followed by whatever happens after that (having to take care of a baby without much money or support vs. the emotional pain of being separated from her baby if she gives it up for adoption). The last thing these girls need is to be shunned by their peers. They need all the support they can get.

So in that sense, I applaud this girl for getting her classmates to think about how they treat their peers. No, pregnancy isn't the same as being short or fat or having thick glasses or whatever. Yes, it's a direct consequence of a choice she (and he) made. But does that mean we should withdraw our support once the die is cast and deal another blow to their already low self-esteem?

 

[Maria D]

Any teen who has sex might become a pregnant teen. They might decide to give it up for adoption (like the birth mother of my baby brother) or they might decide to get an abortion (like my best friend in high school) or they might decide to raise it. Anyone who had sex in high school and didn't get pregnant had some measure of luck. To distance yourself from someone who was your friend beforehand for what is bad luck is cruel. If that is what was happening to this girl over the course of her experiment (sounds like that is the case) and she wasn't representing herself as having gotten pregnant recklessly and intentionally, pointing out her friends' and classmates' cruelty seems like a worthwhile exercise.

Anyone, teen or not, who has sex might become pregnant or cause pregnancy. In my book, you are mature enough to engage in sexual intercourse when you have thought through this possibility. What will you do? What will your partner want to do? If you are in high school and you are against adoption or having an abortion, then (again in my book) you absolutely should NOT be having sexual intercourse, even with birth control because even the most effective methods are too risky for a young couple who cannot welcome a child. There are other ways for couples to get sexual gratification that won't result in pregnancy. Bad luck, seriously??? How about self-control and/or getting creative and intelligent to avoid pregnancy? Having intercourse without a plan for pregnancy is reckless, no matter what age you are.

I don't agree with you at all that distancing from a friend who has decided to take a path that no longer has commonality to yours is cruel. Jeesh, in my twenties I found myself putting some distance between me and friends who were getting married and having children right away. I wasn't being cruel to them, nor they to me as they gravitated toward friends who had more in common. With teens friendship is even more fluid.

 

[suchende]

Any teen who has sex might become a pregnant teen. They might decide to give it up for adoption (like the birth mother of my baby brother) or they might decide to get an abortion (like my best friend in high school) or they might decide to raise it. Anyone who had sex in high school and didn't get pregnant had some measure of luck. To distance yourself from someone who was your friend beforehand for what is bad luck is cruel. If that is what was happening to this girl over the course of her experiment (sounds like that is the case) and she wasn't representing herself as having gotten pregnant recklessly and intentionally, pointing out her friends' and classmates' cruelty seems like a worthwhile exercise.

Anyone, teen or not, who has sex might become pregnant or cause pregnancy. In my book, you are mature enough to engage in sexual intercourse when you have thought through this possibility. What will you do? What will your partner want to do? If you are in high school and you are against adoption or having an abortion, then (again in my book) you absolutely should NOT be having sexual intercourse, even with birth control because even the most effective methods are too risky for a young couple who cannot welcome a child. There are other ways for couples to get sexual gratification that won't result in pregnancy. Bad luck, seriously??? How about self-control and/or getting creative and intelligent to avoid pregnancy? Having intercourse without a plan for pregnancy is reckless, no matter what age you are.

I don't agree with you at all that distancing from a friend who has decided to take a path that no longer has commonality to yours is cruel. Jeesh, in my twenties I found myself putting some distance between me and friends who were getting married and having children right away. I wasn't being cruel to them, nor they to me as they gravitated toward friends who had more in common. With teens friendship is even more fluid.

We don't know that she wasn't telling everyone she wasn't planning to give it up for adoption or that she was "against adoption." She could have started an interesting dialogue about compassion and judgment of one's peers, and that is more powerful than the majority of senior projects.

For what it's worth, I didn't have sex in high school. I also didn't comport myself with as much compassion as I could have. Getting people to think about the way they treat each other isn't necessarily condoning any particular behavior.

 

[Maria D]

You're right, we don't know anything about what she told people or how she was actually treated. All that's been reported so far is that only a few people knew it was a ruse and many people whose life would have been affected by this pregnancy were lied to. We also know that her friend's remark, wondering if the girl was "annoying because of the pregnancy or had always been this annoying," was read aloud at the assembly. Amazing to me that a girl who wanted others to show compassion for her (faked) mistake wasn't being too compassionate to her friend, siblings and boyfriend's family!

I guess I don't get why other KIDS need to be supportive and compassionate about it. They shouldn't mock or bully but if they choose not to be friends with the person, what's wrong with that? Why can't we all be compassionate and supportive about kids that want their friendship choices respected?

I've been trying to figure out why I'm so bothered by this girl's stunt and I think it's because, as a teacher, I am so fed up with all the interruptions and distractions to the actual raison d'etre of high school: teaching and learning. It's hard enough to deal with the distractions of the *real* pregnancies and parenthoods going on in school without having someone FAKE a pregnancy. We don't know what this girl went through because she's not saying until she can fully milk her 15 minutes but I can tell you that the distractions in my school do not come from the lack of compassion and support. Quite the opposite, actually. Guidance counselors and social workers are stretched thin, which takes time away from students with other pressing problems. Pregnant girls tend to miss a lot of class time, so they need extra help after school hours from teachers. (Moms tend to miss even more class.) Their friends get into "playing grown-up" about it and want to hold showers and pass around ultra-sound pictures. Not exactly the teaching and learning environment that MOST kids sign up for in high school -- let's have some compassion for them.

 

[suchende]

Remember, she wasn't actually pregnant! She wanted to take advantage of an opportunity to design and execute an experiment. Now, it does have rather the tone of a publicity stunt, and fine, it wasn't the best designed study I have ever seen, but I don't get the criticism in this thread. She was trying to do something interesting, to learn about a perspective that wasn't actually her reality, to challenge assumptions: all great. Just because it wasn't the most productive thing, and maybe had some collateral damage (stressed parents of a 20 year old who are likely very relieved now) I mean, I see a young student who will probably use the lessons learned here to do more ambitious and compelling research in the future. As far as getting her 15 minutes goes, you really think she anticipated anyone outside her own community would care?

 

[suchende]

Also, a lot of the discussion in this thread about distinguishing between prejudice (say, of obese people) and judgment of teens who made poor choices may be among her ultimate lessons (maybe in her "findings" now or something that occurs to her later). I don't think the possibility that negative social pressure could have socially productive outcomes is really a challenge to the usefulness of this particular project.

 

[ksinger]

You're right, we don't know anything about what she told people or how she was actually treated. All that's been reported so far is that only a few people knew it was a ruse and many people whose life would have been affected by this pregnancy were lied to. We also know that her friend's remark, wondering if the girl was "annoying because of the pregnancy or had always been this annoying," was read aloud at the assembly. Amazing to me that a girl who wanted others to show compassion for her (faked) mistake wasn't being too compassionate to her friend, siblings and boyfriend's family!

I guess I don't get why other KIDS need to be supportive and compassionate about it. They shouldn't mock or bully but if they choose not to be friends with the person, what's wrong with that? Why can't we all be compassionate and supportive about kids that want their friendship choices respected?

I've been trying to figure out why I'm so bothered by this girl's stunt and I think it's because, as a teacher, I am so fed up with all the interruptions and distractions to the actual raison d'etre of high school: teaching and learning. It's hard enough to deal with the distractions of the *real* pregnancies and parenthoods going on in school without having someone FAKE a pregnancy. We don't know what this girl went through because she's not saying until she can fully milk her 15 minutes but I can tell you that the distractions in my school do not come from the lack of compassion and support. Quite the opposite, actually. Guidance counselors and social workers are stretched thin, which takes time away from students with other pressing problems. Pregnant girls tend to miss a lot of class time, so they need extra help after school hours from teachers. (Moms tend to miss even more class.) Their friends get into "playing grown-up" about it and want to hold showers and pass around ultra-sound pictures. Not exactly the teaching and learning environment that MOST kids sign up for in high school -- let's have some compassion for them.

Ultra super mega word to this - all of it. You're channelling my husband. He comes home so pissed and/or dejected as this or that girl with such promise, shows up pregnant. He and other teachers there I've talked with, estimate a double-digit rate of kids - either male or female - with children of their own, and some are working on their SECOND. BEFORE graduation. So yeah, what she thought to accomplish with this -(especially when she could simply have interviewed the REAL pregnant teens), I cannot fathom, but I suspect that in the end, it won't contribute to anything very useful, except maybe for herself.

 

[suchende]

Ksinger, I think if you substituted pregnant teen for some other analogous group you would see why interviews wouldn't have the same value for her in terms of personal growth or overall. I am still baffled as to why you think, for a senior project, this is so objectionable. Because she is advocating for a group you think should be treated worse, to be treated better? That sounds like you just disagree with her politics. I do think it was brave of her to subject herself to judgment and scorn, to find out what it would be like to live the life of someone who has it worse than her.

What if she had spent 6 months in juvenile detention pretending to be a juvenile offender?

 

[packrat]

I don't know how to say what I want to say w/out coming across like a big ole witch so..I'll just agree w/Ksinger and Maria.

 

[JewelFreak]

Ksinger, I think if you substituted pregnant teen for some other analogous group you would see why interviews wouldn't have the same value for her in terms of personal growth or overall. I am still baffled as to why you think, for a senior project, this is so objectionable. I do think it was brave of her to subject herself to judgment and scorn, to find out what it would be like to live the life of someone who has it worse than her.

What if she had spent 6 months in juvenile detention pretending to be a juvenile offender?

She would have learned a great deal more -- such as how so many children of teenage mothers (or the mothers themselves) end up, her companions in juvie.

What personal growth did this stunt provide her? Some of the kids thought she was a jerk -- big surprise. Some got into it -- also big surprise. Remember, this was for a biology class. Did she learn a damn thing new about biology? How much did all the rigmarole surrounding her interfere with learning in all classes?

The only lesson I see here is for her schoolmates: that they will be publicly ridiculed for expressing disapproval in a private conversation. The chilling thing is that if she had pretended to have robbed a store, I doubt the attitude would have been any different -- don't ostracize her because "she made a bad choice." Namby pamby nicey nicey & both "choices" are simply wrong and harmful.

--- Laurie

 

[iLander]

[quote="JewelFreak|1303656447The only lesson I see here is for her schoolmates: that they will be publicly ridiculed for expressing disapproval in a private conversation. The chilling thing is that if she had pretended to have robbed a store, I doubt the attitude would have been any different -- don't ostracize her because "she made a bad choice." Namby pamby nicey nicey & both "choices" are simply wrong and harmful.

--- Laurie[/quote]

With you 200% on this.

I also believe that condoms should be handed out to anyone that wants them. If I were a school guidance counselor I would have a giant bowl of them on my desk, along with brochures about abstinence to appease the parents.

Ostracism plays a role in society; it punishes people for unacceptable behavior. I can only imagine the agony of being a drug addict, but my reflex is not sympathy and it shouldn't be.

 

[VapidLapid]

Ususally I am known as a heretic who espouses radical ideas long before they become socially viable or popular. I place a high value on empirical investigation and encourage the development of that faculty. This one, however, was poorly chosen and poorly designed. Firstly this has nothing to do with the teaching of or learning of biology. This is a sociologic topic. The Bio teacher who signed off on this should be censured. Then too, even as a sociology project, there should have been a time limit on the deception of no more than two weeks, not six months. This engendered a debris field of lies on top of the thesis in the daily praxis of their lives and the lives of everyone in her family, friends and school. It is also, I think, psychologically damaging to have a teenager, which is to say a developing personality and ethical being, live out a complex lie to show others the harm and narrowness of their preconceptions. The issue of teenage pregnancy is mocked and then totally eclipsed by the issues of the irrelevancy, exploitation, implicit air of moral superiority, deception, and loss of trust that are the direct effects of this "project"

 

[suchende]

It was not for biology class, it was a senior project. The requirements at her school are outlined in the materials below.

http://www.toppenish.wednet.edu/hs/senior_project_guidebook_2011.pdf

 

[VapidLapid]

It was not for biology class, it was a senior project. The requirements at her school are outlined in the materials below.

http://www.toppenish.wednet.edu/hs/senior_project_guidebook_2011.pdf

It seems we are splitting hares here. No matter what discipline this project was intended to fall under, the ends in no way justified the means because the means are not justifiable.

 

[suchende]

It was not for biology class, it was a senior project. The requirements at her school are outlined in the materials below.

http://www.toppenish.wednet.edu/hs/senior_project_guidebook_2011.pdf

It seems we are splitting hares here. No matter what discipline this project was intended to fall under, the ends in no way justified the means because the means are not justifiable.

It better frames the subject matter of her project (about how people treat each other, not biology) and explains the assembly/self promotion (those were requirements). Also, if we are going to condemn the adults involved, don't forget the prinicpal himself, who also knew and approved.

 

[iLander]

Ususally I am known as a heretic who espouses radical ideas long before they become socially viable or popular. I place a high value on empirical investigation and encourage the development of that faculty. This one, however, was poorly chosen and poorly designed. Firstly this has nothing to do with the teaching of or learning of biology. This is a sociologic topic. The Bio teacher who signed off on this should be censured. Then too, even as a sociology project, there should have been a time limit on the deception of no more than two weeks, not six months. This engendered a debris field of lies on top of the thesis in the daily praxis of their lives and the lives of everyone in her family, friends and school. It is also, I think, psychologically damaging to have a teenager, which is to say a developing personality and ethical being, live out a complex lie to show others the harm and narrowness of their preconceptions. The issue of teenage pregnancy is mocked and then totally eclipsed by the issues of the irrelevancy, exploitation, implicit air of moral superiority, deception, and loss of trust that are the direct effects of this "project"

+1

I think the only thing she learned from this whole exercise is that her needs are more important than anyone else's. Her desire to complete this project was more important than the feelings of anguish that she imparted on most of her family, her friends, her boyfriend's family, her teachers, etc., etc.

If I were her cousin, or aunt or whatever, I would have to decide that if she can lie this much, then who knows what else she would lie about? I would never trust her again.

That's just what we need in this world; another self-centered person that is rewarded for their behavior.

 

[suchende]

And if we are going to decide what means are justifiable for a social experiment, I am guessing "Black Like Me" is on her sources cited page.

 

[ksinger]

Ksinger, I think if you substituted pregnant teen for some other analogous group you would see why interviews wouldn't have the same value for her in terms of personal growth or overall. I am still baffled as to why you think, for a senior project, this is so objectionable. Because she is advocating for a group you think should be treated worse, to be treated better? That sounds like you just disagree with her politics. I do think it was brave of her to subject herself to judgment and scorn, to find out what it would be like to live the life of someone who has it worse than her.

What if she had spent 6 months in juvenile detention pretending to be a juvenile offender?

Please please don't try to make this about politics. The article was very unclear what this girl's hypothesis was, or what her ultimate goal was, so everything here about her motives, is pretty much speculation, yes?

Not that I particularly CARE - if I did I wouldn't post as I do - that so many here think I'm a big meanie, but for the record, I don't advocate that pregnant teens be treated "worse". But I DO object to the mindset that she needs to be respected for her mistake, that SHE'S the victim here - that this is about how OTHER PEOPLE SHOULD ACT. As always, too much focus on what other people are doing, and not enough emphasis on working on one's self. Or the idea, as we see at my husband's (and apparently Maria's) school, that congrats are in order. And yes, this whole thing seemed self-referent and a school-wide distraction. I don't think she was brave, I think she was wrapped up in herself. She undoubtedly caused quite a lot of that psychic pain to others in what I suspect was her quest to point out how cruel OTHERS are. Irony much? Pregnant teens, with some exceptions of course, are not victims, they are people who made a mistake that other people will get to pay for. The schools and ultimately YOUR kids get to pay too, since these poor victim students now take more limited resources and time from others.

You're also going on the assumption that all of these girls feel a baseline of shame for this outcome, or even acknowledge that they MADE a mistake. Nope. More than a few of them are pretty nonchalant about it, blatantly stating that it's no big deal, because their families have to take care of them. As I said, more than one of these girls is working on baby #2. And we're supposed to celebrate this? Soft-pedal this and tippy-toe around it and say, "Oh, that's OK honey, no social consequence for your action."? By highschool, there ought to be some clue that reality doesn't always include puppy farts and rainbows, and people WILL react negatively, whether they "should" or not. Mistakes that negatively impact your life, a child's life, and your parents' lives, should not be given a pass or celebrated. But they are. Unmarried teen pregnancy is normalized every day in our schools when we tell them that no one should judge them for it.

And if she spent 6 months in juvenile detention? Well, she'd find out the world can be tough for people who make big mistakes. I guaran-damn-tee she wouldn't be changing the politeness levels of the people there.

ETA - oh yeah...here's one. Overheard by one of my husband's colleagues - two girls talking: the gist, but if you get pregnant NOW, mom/autie/family must take care of you, and you get finished raising the kid in time to still have fun and party.

 

[iLander]

And if we are going to decide what means are justifiable for a social experiment, I am guessing "Black Like Me" is on her sources cited page.

Not the same at all.

Someone who pretends to be black does not create these feelings; Boyfriend's parents; How is this going to affect our son's college plans? How will our lives be changed forever because of this baby? And then: Why did our son lie to us for so many months just for this girl?

The black like me experiment may have affected the opinion of people who were new acquaintances of John Griffin, but it was certainly not an affront to his own family.