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Is whiteflash a cut above all that? second option...

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bkd8590

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 6, 2021
Messages
16
The diamond you found with a GIA report is a very good GIA3EX in terms of the measurements. ACA and other Premium cut diamonds are intentionally cut with a high level of consistency and care that is intentionally not used when cutting GIA 3EX diamonds. This extra effort is not shown on AGS reports, but it is there, in the cutting details of the diamond. Saving time and skill results in lower costs for GIA3EX diamonds. A willingness in the market to pay a premium price for AGS000 at retail exists and there are valid reasons why this is the case.

Is a Premium cut worth it? The answer is very personal. It has to do with the level of your perception of the visual attributes of diamonds. It also has to do with the intangible way you feel about how perfect you want the diamond to be in terms of light behavior. Many owners of Premium cuts feel very good and confident about the diamond they are wearing as they appreciate the story and the perfection of cutting. I would think some of them feel they can see the difference from GIA3EX diamonds their friends may be wearing. Possibly, they can see such a difference, but probably it is a mind game for many other owners who don't look so closely or really don't put that much mental effort into the process.

An ACA or equivalent is worth more to those who wish to pay for what has been done to market a top quality cut diamond. Such diamonds are overpriced to those who feel content with what they find with GIA3EX grading. Asking for advice will get you both points of view, but no one can prove they have the solution for your question. That answer is already in your mind. Just let your own logic and viewpoint guide you to make a great personal choice. Don't get too confused by opinions of others since they won't be making the purchase or wearing the diamond.
 
That is a sample image of a stone on rockher...they dont have a real image of the stone much less an aset, idealscope, H&A and videos. I personally would never buy a stone that didn't have an image (and recommend that you don't either).

The numbers on that stone do not fit in the Super Ideal range. Does that mean its going to be a dude? No, it doesn't but
without the images need to evaluate the stone its impossible to tell. Most of us are willing to pay the premium to get a superior
cut stone that Super Ideals provide. Only you can decide over the life of the stone (your ownership of it) whether the premium is
worth it to you. Another bonus is the fact that our Super Ideal vendors stand behind their stones with an excellent trade-in policy.

Let us know if you need help finding a stone!
 
I would echo the comments above. I would not buy a stone without actual pictures of the stone. A stock image or a stock video is not helpful at all.

In terms of advanced imaging to assess performance, they don't have that either.

Also was a side note, I absolutely hate the name. I don't know, it's just offensive. RockHer. Like put a rock on her? That's very unappealing to me as a woman that buys her own jewelry. Like I need a man to buy it for me and put that rock on me. Just no.
 
Whiteflash ACA is a premium, branded stone and many PSers will tell you it's worth it. You can feel good about it being the best of the best. They are a trusted vendor with a great return and generous upgrade policy.

There are other ideal, premium cut vendors that you can look into as well. It is also possible to find amazing stones that are not ACA, but it will just take significantly more time and effort to vet photos, videos, advanced images, spec ranges, etc.
 
For myself, besides the beauty of an Ideal cut, is the upgrade program WF offers, which I've used a few times.

You only have to spend $1 more to upgrade your stone. So if you are at all interested in having that option sometime down line, IMO, all things being equal (which they are not in this case!), the upgrade program WF offers is a significant benefit to consider. I didn't see anything re Upgrade Program on Rockher's website.

Future upgrades, actual images, customer service, stone performance, plentiful selection...you really can't go wrong with a WF purchase. You just have to decide what vender offerings are most important to you, as a consumer.
 
David gave extremely wise advice above. It's a personal choice whether it's "worth it" or not, and everyone will differ. However, the stones are more expensive for a reason, and to many of us on PS that difference is "worth it".
 
all responses are dually noted, I guess for me, the problem is having no major stores anywhere near my physical locality. I can say with almost 100% certainty that I've never seen an ideal cut in person. I'm sure what I've been told is ideal is "very good", but it seems general consensus is that the normal guy can tell a difference. So thanks for all the advice guys and gals, sounds like wf it is.
 
lovedogs said:
David gave extremely wise advice above. It's a personal choice whether it's "worth it" or not, and everyone will differ. However, the stones are more expensive for a reason, and to many of us on PS that difference is "worth it".
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Agree with all of you. Unless you can't afford it then you focus on 3XGIA....
 
There is nothing wrong with buying a GIA stone if you can get all images of the actual stone.
 
elizat said:
Also was a side note, I absolutely hate the name. I don't know, it's just offensive. RockHer. Like put a rock on her? That's very unappealing to me as a woman that buys her own jewelry. Like I need a man to buy it for me and put that rock on me. Just no.
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Totally agree! I figured it was just me that thought this!
 
I don't disagree with you guys, just found it and was within my budget to get a little more bang for my buck. However I think since I'm spending x amount, what's another 5-10% so since I'm not that knowledgeable, wf sounds like it minimizes my risk
 
bkd8590 said:
I don't disagree with you guys, just found it and was within my budget to get a little more bang for my buck. However I think since I'm spending x amount, what's another 5-10% so since I'm not that knowledgeable, wf sounds like it minimizes my risk
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I think 'minimizing risk' is an excellent perspective to take.

I helped my best friend's fiancé choose an ideal cut diamond for her engagement ring.

At the same time, I also offered to help my niece buy her engagement ring. As it turned out, she and her fiancé wandered into a jewelry store one day, saw something they loved and bought it on the spot.

Fast forward two months, and both best friend and niece are visiting me. They discuss weddings, realize they've never shown each other their rings, and stick out their hands. I was on the other side of the room as I turned around and saw this happen.

You know those scenes in movies or TV shows and you see something happen, and someone on the screen knows it's going to be a disaster, and the whole things goes slow-mo and they leap forward, trying to intervene on the upcoming catastrophe, as a voice, very deep, as voices are in slow-mo, says "Nooooooooooo....."

Well, this was that. Before I could intervene, they'd stuck their hands out next to each other, the super ideal cut diamond right next to the GIA triple Ex.

Oh lordy.

Both were HUGELY embarrassed, and for a full three seconds nobody said anything as their respective hands were stuck out next to each other, frozen in mid air. Then, her face flushed with embarrassment, my niece whipped her hand away and mumbled..."Mine needs cleaning...."

The difference between the rings was STARK. But more obvious was her embarrassment. I felt dreadful for both of them and my niece never saw her ring in the same positive way again.

I would HIGHLY recommend going with WF. There are definitely equally beautiful diamonds out there that are GIA triple Exs. But if you don't know how to find one, the risk of NOT finding one just isn't worth it.

I would strongly recommend White Flash and their ACA line.
 
bkd8590 said:
I don't disagree with you guys, just found it and was within my budget to get a little more bang for my buck. However I think since I'm spending x amount, what's another 5-10% so since I'm not that knowledgeable, wf sounds like it minimizes my risk
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Very simple and very wise way to look at it. Looks like you can cut through all the noise and identify the crucial issues. Smart decision. Wish I figured this out many years and many dollars ago. Can't wait to see your ring.
 
@mrs-b omg though it describes an awkward moment that comparison to the slow motion “noooooooo” had me cracking up :lol-2: . I live in South TX most of the year and after reading about ACAs am determined to visit WF sometime to see these sparklers in person!
 
mrs-b said:
I think 'minimizing risk' is an excellent perspective to take.

I helped my best friend's fiancé choose an ideal cut diamond for her engagement ring.

At the same time, I also offered to help my niece buy her engagement ring. As it turned out, she and her fiancé wandered into a jewelry store one day, saw something they loved and bought it on the spot.

Fast forward two months, and both best friend and niece are visiting me. They discuss weddings, realize they've never shown each other their rings, and stick out their hands. I was on the other side of the room as I turned around and saw this happen.

You know those scenes in movies or TV shows and you see something happen, and someone on the screen knows it's going to be a disaster, and the whole things goes slow-mo and they leap forward, trying to intervene on the upcoming catastrophe, as a voice, very deep, as voices are in slow-mo, says "Nooooooooooo....."

Well, this was that. Before I could intervene, they'd stuck their hands out next to each other, the super ideal cut diamond right next to the GIA triple Ex.

Oh lordy.

Both were HUGELY embarrassed, and for a full three seconds nobody said anything as their respective hands were stuck out next to each other, frozen in mid air. Then, her face flushed with embarrassment, my niece whipped her hand away and mumbled..."Mine needs cleaning...."

The difference between the rings was STARK. But more obvious was her embarrassment. I felt dreadful for both of them and my niece never saw her ring in the same positive way again.

I would HIGHLY recommend going with WF. There are definitely equally beautiful diamonds out there that are GIA triple Exs. But if you don't know how to find one, the risk of NOT finding one just isn't worth it.

I would strongly recommend White Flash and their ACA line.
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And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones .
its great that you are able to afford and personally prefer WF ACA to GIA 3x. However it is not really right to make us feel slighted because we have chosen to purchase GIA 3x stones. The story you just told is so subjective. Especially after the experts chimed in above. Your entitled to your opinon that you prefer the WF but don't make the rest of us feel that GIA 3x is sub par. Coke or Pepsi its all in your perception.
 
heididdl said:
And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones .
its great that you are able to afford and personally prefer WF ACA to GIA 3x. However it is not really right to make us feel slighted because we have chosen to purchase GIA 3x stones. The story you just told is so subjective. Especially after the experts chimed in above. Your entitled to your opinon that you prefer the WF but don't make the rest of us feel that GIA 3x is sub par. Coke or Pepsi its all in your perception.
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I'm pretty sure the point WASNT to disparage GIAXXX, but rather to point out that if you wander into a random store without knowledge of stones you will likely end up with something bad. Like a random I1 with zero report or an untrustworthy report saying a stone is "excellent". So her story isnt designed to say that GIA xxx is bad or that you cant find amazing GIA stones (you can and many people here have). But if you buy without researching at all, the likelihood of happening upon a stone that holds up to a super ideal or a gia xxx that is cut to exacting proportions is slim at best.
 
heididdl said:
And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones .
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Geez Louise! Most budgets will allow for a (true) ideal cut - from said vendor, or another that offers them. No one needs to subsidize buyers; rather the 4Cs just have to be adjusted to accommodate the budget.

Having seen many diamonds of a variety of ilk (including a GIA Excellent and WF ACAs), I would personally be happy to adjust down in carat size and color to get an ACA (or an Expert Selection) over a non-AGS ideal diamond within my budget. I prioritize performance, and from what I have seen I agree that ACAs outperform others quite noticeably. That's the whole point of this thread: the OP is asking specifically if ACAs are worth it. @mrs-b is saying yes they are, and offering anecdotal evidence to support her view. My experience supports the same perspective.
 
heididdl said:
And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones .
its great that you are able to afford and personally prefer WF ACA to GIA 3x. However it is not really right to make us feel slighted because we have chosen to purchase GIA 3x stones. The story you just told is so subjective. Especially after the experts chimed in above. Your entitled to your opinon that you prefer the WF but don't make the rest of us feel that GIA 3x is sub par. Coke or Pepsi its all in your perception.
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This sounds defensive and I don't know why. Maybe I missed something but OP didn't give us a budget. Yes, looking for more "bang for buck" but I think wanted to know what the "bang" might be. Advice was that an ACA might do that. Maybe not if OP only cares about size or color. Most here would suggest better cut over size. But not disparaging anyone who chooses it the other way around. I think you jumped down @mrs-b and I'm not sure why. She gave her opinion, as we all do. You should give yours without being so defensive. All opinions are valid. Its not black and white. I have studs that are ACA's but I've also purchased stones that are not for a variety of reasons. I always try to buy stones that are within the parameters suggested because, yes, they seem to perform better. But they don't always have to be ACA's. OP can do the same.
 
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heididdl said:
And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones .
its great that you are able to afford and personally prefer WF ACA to GIA 3x. However it is not really right to make us feel slighted because we have chosen to purchase GIA 3x stones. The story you just told is so subjective. Especially after the experts chimed in above. Your entitled to your opinon that you prefer the WF but don't make the rest of us feel that GIA 3x is sub par. Coke or Pepsi its all in your perception.
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I'm sorry you feel that way, Heididi. But you're feeling that way because of something going on in your head - not mine. As for 'subjective' - your response to my comment was about as subjective as it's possible to be.

If you knew my history or had read many of my posts, you'd know that the first true hearts and arrows diamond I owned was, indeed, a GIA triple Ex, NOT an ACA. That diamond is posted all over Pricescope, along with photos and the story of finding it on Blue Nile - which is where I buy most of my diamonds and always have. I've been a HUGE supporter of Blue Nile for over a decade, and they are ALWAYS my first port of call - which you obviously don't know. I found it (along with the roughly 6 dozen other GIA triple EX diamonds I've bought from Blue Nile over the years) after trawling the site for a good long while, and it was a stunning cut. Which is why I said - you CAN find GIA triple EX stones which are as good as ACAs, but you need to know what to look for and how to find them. And I didn't just say "beautiful", I said EQUALLY beautiful - because I've had more than one.

Please be more careful and accurate before you quote me back to me, Heididi. I say what I say because I've thought it through - not because I'm blindly disparaging an enormous group of diamonds.

And just by the way - I didn't use the phrase "better company stones" - so when you say something like this "And will you be paying difference in the stone for all of us That can't afford what you call the better company stones" - you're just flat out wrong.

Below is a photo of the paperwork for a small sample of the many GIA triple Ex diamonds I've bought from Blue Nile. This is not my first rodeo.

Blue Nile paperwork collection.JPG
 
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Just curious @mrs-b - when you do your own legwork to find GIAs that are as good as ACAs, are they less costly since ACA is branded? Or would you say they are similar in cost since the quality/fire/sparkle is comparable?
 
My wife's stone is graded GIA XX before GIA assigned a cut grade. I have no doubt her stone will make XXX if it were sent in for a regrade today. Again, nothing wrong with buying a GIA stone if you have all the information and images.
 

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Mreader said:
Just curious @mrs-b - when you do your own legwork to find GIAs that are as good as ACAs, are they less costly since ACA is branded? Or would you say they are similar in cost since the quality/fire/sparkle is comparable?
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Yes, they are cheaper. Which is why I NEVER recommend branded cuts to newbies who come on to PS and whose budget is tight for whatever style of diamond they want. I think there's 3 things that set WF above a business like Blue Nile:

1) Their customer service

2) Their upgrade policy

3) Their 100% reliability that you'll get a stunning, no-issues diamond

IF, however, budget is your number 1 priority - and, frankly, even if it isn't, I tend to recommend BN as my first port of call, and always have. I DO know how to find a great diamond in a large pool, and I'm also not someone who is tortured by the whole 'mind clean' thing. I don't believe the average person can see minute differences, nor would they care if they could.

However, if you take the AVERAGE GIA triple Ex and compare it to the AVERAGE ACA - can your regular Joe Public see a difference? Oh yes! And that was my experience.

But if you know what you're doing, you can find stunning diamonds in the GIA triple ex pool - just as good as AGS triple zero. Being GIA triple ex doesn't mean your diamond is automatically less good - it's just a much wider pool, so you need to filter out a lot more diamonds to find 'that special one' - and most people don't know how to do that.

But that's what PriceScope is for, in my opinion. Bring your parameters, and we'll find you something stunning. That's the Whole. Point.
 
mrs-b said:
Yes, they are cheaper. Which is why I NEVER recommend branded cuts to newbies who come on to PS and whose budget is tight for whatever style of diamond they want. I think there's 3 things that set WF above a business like Blue Nile:

1) Their customer service

2) Their upgrade policy

3) Their 100% reliability that you'll get a stunning, no-issues diamond

IF, however, budget is your number 1 priority - and, frankly, even if it isn't, I tend to recommend BN as my first port of call, and always have. I DO know how to find a great diamond in a large pool, and I'm also not someone who is tortured by the whole 'mind clean' thing. I don't believe the average person can see minute differences, nor would they care if they could.

However, if you take the AVERAGE GIA triple Ex and compare it to the AVERAGE ACA - can your regular Joe Public see a difference? Oh yes! And that was my experience.

But if you know what you're doing, you can find stunning diamonds in the GIA triple ex pool - just as good as AGS triple zero. Being GIA triple ex doesn't mean your diamond is automatically less good - it's just a much wider pool, so you need to filter out a lot more diamonds to find 'that special one' - and most people don't know how to do that.

But that's what PriceScope is for, in my opinion. Bring your parameters, and we'll find you something stunning. That's the Whole. Point.
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Love this @mrs-b ! Wonderful explanation. ❤️
 
@mrs-b thank you! I will solicit PS help if I ever upgrade my stud earrings (bought pre-PS). :)
 
I guess I just have to apologize. I can't afford ACA and I have been actively looking for 2 months (actually for ever myself) for 3.0 3x h-I 3x GIA stones for studs. I have a hard stop budget of $17,000 and I'm just frustrated. Sorry it may be a little late to apologize but
Ive been burned and I guess I was taking it out on you "price scope community ". NOT the OG
 
heididdl said:
I guess I just have to apologize. I can't afford ACA and I have been actively looking for 2 months (actually for ever myself) for 3.0 3x h-I 3x GIA stones for studs. I have a hard stop budget of $17,000 and I'm just frustrated. Sorry it may be a little late to apologize but
Ive been burned and I guess I was taking it out on you "price scope community ". NOT the OG
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I thought you were working with ID jewelry. Were they not able to find something in your budget? This is the company I went with for my studs and I contacted them directly to avoid taxes and eBay fees. The picture is just a stock photo so they can help you choose but they have pairs within your budget. That is about what I paid for mine and mine are triple x so even though the listing shows some certs that isn’t necessarily what you are hebolden to. Just a suggestion bc like I said this was before my PS days. So my stones probably aren’t PS standards. But on a lark when I looked up ACAs for the size I have the least expensive was 30k. But the ACAs listed were all VS and higher.

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