My stone's cut is Fair, not Ideal- opinions please

[Anonymous6]

Is it a round cut?

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=AGS-1040397620036


I would drop in clarity and make sure the diamond is eye clean... that can save LOTS of money without sacrificing in other categories...

 

[MarkBroumand]

Just take it back and compare to some GIA excellent cut with similar proportions. if you want to upgrade at that point then do so. If not, thank your hubby for dropping $25K on ya

I think this is your best option right now. Look & compare stones in person and see how you feel from there.

 

[LGK]

Just take it back and compare to some GIA excellent cut with similar proportions. if you want to upgrade at that point then do so. If not, thank your hubby for dropping $25K on ya

I think this is your best option right now. Look & compare stones in person and see how you feel from there.

Ditto. You may find that IRL, to your eye, the fair cut stone is a decent performer. Or you may be horrified, who knows. Just make sure your diamond is well cleaned!

 

[IceExplorer]

I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler...... my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase....

Maybe your husband was going off your reaction?

If you just don't like the cert that came with it, it would be hard for your hubs to know the cert was more important.


Also, from what I've heard (around my circle) most women tend to discuss size over the other 4 c's when talking about diamonds.
That may have contributed to his purchase. Just a thought.

EG:
I want AT LEAST at 1 carat diamond.

I've never heard a woman say:
I don't care the size, I want an ideal cut stone that is at least VS2.

Mind you, I don't have any real life friends on Pricescope

 

[Anon-E-Mouse]

Is it fair (no pun intended) to say that we could probably find a 2 carat, F Color, VS2 clarity, ideal cut for a similar price as the current 2.05, E, VS2, fair? Would I notice a big difference?

It depends upon who's calling it "fair" and who's calling it "ideal". Bottom line, when you compare the two what do you think?

 

[Gypsy]

I can't tell you how many times I have been browsing in a jewelry store and heard misinformation being given to prospective diamond buyers, male and female, or how many times I've seen someone just being led into a bad decision. Sometimes there appears to be a little 'con' going on... but the VAST majority of times the people doing the selling are really just ignorant themselves. It's not like jewelers are required to hold licenses (or have their sales people hold them) that attest to their knowledge or like they are required by law to take continuing jewelry education courses so that they can be up to date on the newest and best terminologies, processes, and information.

The point of what I am saying is this: 1 in every 10 jewelry sales clerks and jewelers I have seen truly DO NOT KNOW that ideal cut is worth the money, or the time to track down, wouldn't know the parameters of an ideal cut, or the value of an AGS certificate if it bit them. And if the people in the business don't know... your husband I think can given a pass and a lesson learned kiss on the cheek.

Also, if you polled the vast majority of PSers you will find that our spouses generally do NOT buy us jewelry. Or if they do they will only buy from certain vendors we've approved of who know what it means to be a Pricescoper (even if they don't know of the site) and when they call to order they always preface things by saying something like "My spouse is a Pricescoper" to ensure that the expectation for quality is understood from the get go (my husband does this as well).

If you have certain expectations and are going to be severly disappointed if they are not met when it comes to purchases, it is best to make the purchase for yourself from your husband, or to make sure you have communicated to your husband what the important characteristics are to you.

I think if you dropped to a G-H SI you might be able to get what you want. BUT you may not have to if your husband paid for the stone from a jeweler with higher pricing than some of our online dealers. We would need more information on budget (as others have said) before we could help you further.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I would say that men are clueless about diamonds...don't be angry with your husband: he surely did his best (he went to a "reputable" jeweler and gave him a lot of money for a small useless carbon stone...isn't it love?).

I guess you can have a bunch of options within your budget...but can you have the money back?

 

[Venice]

I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler...... my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase....

Maybe your husband was going off your reaction?

If you just don't like the cert that came with it, it would be hard for your hubs to know the cert was more important.


Also, from what I've heard (around my circle) most women tend to discuss size over the other 4 c's when talking about diamonds.
That may have contributed to his purchase. Just a thought.

EG:
I want AT LEAST at 1 carat diamond.

I've never heard a woman say:
I don't care the size, I want an ideal cut stone that is at least VS2.

Mind you, I don't have any real life friends on Pricescope

I am a woman and I did say this!

 

[IceExplorer]

I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler...... my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase....

Maybe your husband was going off your reaction?

If you just don't like the cert that came with it, it would be hard for your hubs to know the cert was more important.


Also, from what I've heard (around my circle) most women tend to discuss size over the other 4 c's when talking about diamonds.
That may have contributed to his purchase. Just a thought.

EG:
I want AT LEAST at 1 carat diamond.

I've never heard a woman say:
I don't care the size, I want an ideal cut stone that is at least VS2.

Mind you, I don't have any real life friends on Pricescope

I am a woman and I did say this!

Minor thread jack here...

Did you get what you asked for?

As I've said, I've never heard it. You are definitely unique or...a pricescoper

 

[Venice]

IceExplorer, I have a VS2, E, 1.52. My husband wanted a 2 ct. for me. He likes diamonds, too!

 

[shihtzulover]

I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler...... my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase....

Maybe your husband was going off your reaction?

If you just don't like the cert that came with it, it would be hard for your hubs to know the cert was more important.


Also, from what I've heard (around my circle) most women tend to discuss size over the other 4 c's when talking about diamonds.
That may have contributed to his purchase. Just a thought.

EG:
I want AT LEAST at 1 carat diamond.

I've never heard a woman say:
I don't care the size, I want an ideal cut stone that is at least VS2.

Mind you, I don't have any real life friends on Pricescope

I agree, and it's so odd to me that so many people that I know don't even notice the cut/sparkle differences! The ladies that I work with only talk about size. For example, one of them has a large, round stone that she and her husband purchased while on a cruise (I imagine that it's not lab-graded). It has a cloudy appearance and it doesn't sparkle much, but everyone just constantly talk about how huge it is, They don't ever seem to notice the differences in the amounts of sparkle and fire.

 

[slg47]

I agree, and it's so odd to me that so many people that I know don't even notice the cut/sparkle differences! The ladies that I work with only talk about size. For example, one of them has a large, round stone that she and her husband purchased while on a cruise (I imagine that it's not lab-graded). It has a cloudy appearance and it doesn't sparkle much, but everyone just constantly talk about how huge it is, They don't ever seem to notice the differences in the amounts of sparkle and fire.

I think people do notice the sparkle difference. Several people have commented to me that they have never seen a diamond sparkle as much as mine does

 

[Amys Bling]

I would agree that literature would support that, but I think a lot of times vendors push higher color and clarity as being more valuable and desirable (also they are more expensive).

+1 MM....

If it weren't for PS, and some research, I would have done the EXACT same thing.. And I also do research on just about any purchase I make over a few $100.

Just ask my wife the research I did when I bought my $4000 bicycle

I also say the best you can do right now, is go and compare your fair cut to a few excellent cuts and make your decision from there.

agreed! Compare your stone visually to ideal-excellent stone. Keep in mind that you may or may not be able to achieve the 2ct mark if you go up to ideal cut. you may need to make some compromises by lower color or clarity a few grades if you want a 2ct Ideal cut stone for the same money.


I think that many people dont' realize the importance of cut- and the carat or color are more important to those. Glad- AC75 that education and research have changed your perspective and helped you to understand your priorities.

 

[Amys Bling]

My stone is not ideal- it is excellent-VG on the different factors- Many people compliment the sparkles it sends off! After having my stone and living with the sparkle, I must admit that when looking at others diamonds I do compare the sparkle and find that so many others seem lifeless in comparision- and many of those are similar in size to mine or bigger. I think cut is huge- and I love the sparkle factor. Others dont take stock in cut liek they do in size and I think its a mistake.

to each his own I guess.

 

[Venice]

I think it's a beautiful stone but I had a bad feeling about the jeweler...... my husband clearly didn't educate himself well enough before making a purchase....

Maybe your husband was going off your reaction?

If you just don't like the cert that came with it, it would be hard for your hubs to know the cert was more important.


Also, from what I've heard (around my circle) most women tend to discuss size over the other 4 c's when talking about diamonds.
That may have contributed to his purchase. Just a thought.

EG:
I want AT LEAST at 1 carat diamond.

I've never heard a woman say:
I don't care the size, I want an ideal cut stone that is at least VS2.

Mind you, I don't have any real life friends on Pricescope

I agree, and it's so odd to me that so many people that I know don't even notice the cut/sparkle differences! The ladies that I work with only talk about size. For example, one of them has a large, round stone that she and her husband purchased while on a cruise (I imagine that it's not lab-graded). It has a cloudy appearance and it doesn't sparkle much, but everyone just constantly talk about how huge it is, They don't ever seem to notice the differences in the amounts of sparkle and fire.

I think they DO notice and that's why they comment only on the size - because they are trying to be polite. If it were sparkly AND huge, they would say, "sparkly and huge."

I was sitting next to a woman at a Christmas party last night. She had a 2.50-3.00 stone. Not one time did it sparkle. Not once.

 

[purplesilk]

Hey ladies, I was quoting most men's opinion about diamonds when I said " useless carbon stone"... I didn't mean to offend diamonds and I didn't surely mean to hurt PSers' feelings.

 

[ac75]

Hey ladies, I was quoting most men's opinion about diamonds when I said " useless carbon stone"... I didn't mean to offend diamonds and I didn't surely mean to hurt PSers' feelings.

Eh, no offense here, and I mean really, it is pretty true.

A lot of meaning, yes, but what practical use does a diamond or big diamond have?

 

[Kathryn007]

Thanks for all the helpful advice! I think I'm going to have to do some comparing. My diamond does indeed sparkle- I would never call it dull- but I'll have to see how it compares to an excellent cut.

I believe our jeweler did tell my husband that a fair cut would not sparkle as much as a better cut stone and even had him compare but my husband said he couldn't tell the difference! I'm sure he wouldn't be able to tell the difference between and E and G color either. At the end of the day, I think he just wanted a bigger stone and didn't really care where he compromised.

He did ask me what I wanted in a diamond before he went shopping and I said "A reasonable balance between all 4 C's." I thought he would do proper research. I was wrong.

 

[risingsun]

When my DH picked out my original engagement ring, he admits he had no idea what he was doing. We had planned to become engaged during the summer and he, rather suddenly, wanted to become engaged on Easter. He went out to a catalog store, which sold diamonds, picked one that seemed to be ok, took me out to dinner and proposed. I had no idea the proposal was coming and was overjoyed! As I got to know my ring, I realized that something wasn't quite right. I knew almost nothing about diamonds, myself, at that time, but saw some black "dots" in the stone. That led to upgrade number one. We had talked about another upgrade on our tenth anniversary. I still didn't know much about diamonds, but I was determined to become educated. I found PS and was very surprised to learn about the importance of cut. My wedding set was very pretty and I did receive compliments on it. We decided to get a larger center stone for my set. My e-ring had four 20 point diamonds and my w-ring had five 20 point diamonds. We bought an AGS 0 H&A diamond to replace the center stone. When it arrived, we went to the jeweler to have it set. Much to our surprise, the new diamond put the old wedding set in a new light. It couldn't hold a candle to the new stone. It didn't have the life, the sparkle and the fire of the new diamond. We made a decision, on the spot, to trade in my wedding set and get a new one that would work with the new center stone. We have since made another upgrade, using all AGS 0 H&A diamonds.

My response from others is that they have never seen a diamond sparkle the way that mine does. This ring has its own little fan club. I love this stone and the new setting. Well, both new settings. I couldn't bring myself to trade the prior upgrade and have found another use for it!

All I can say, and I did say it before, is to look at diamonds that are top tier cuts. For me, that is AGS 0 H&A, AGS 0 and GIA Excellent [being mindful of the parameters]. I am a very well educated person, but I wasn't informed about diamonds until I took the time to learn about them What I have chosen as my preferred cut, may not be the same for others. You may very well prefer a different cut. I am just suggesting that you get out there and have a look and be able to make an informed choice.

 

[kenny]

It's perfectly okay to be a brat, as you put it.

Get a diamond that makes you Happy!!!

 

[Kathryn007]

Here is the info from the GIA report, as requested. Please let me know your thoughts.

ROUND BRILLIANT

Measurements: 7.82 - 7.91 x 5.26 mm
Carat Weight: 2.05 carat
Color Grade: E
Clarity Grade: VS2
Cut Grade: Fair
PROPORTIONS:

Depth: 66.9%
Table: 53%
Crown Angle: 37.5°
Crown Height: 18.0%
Pavilion Angle: 41.4°
Pavilion Depth: 44.0%
Star length: 50%
Lower Half: 80%
Girdle: Slightly Thick to Thick, Faceted
Culet: None
FINISH:

Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: Medium Blue

 

[Gypsy]

WOW look at that depth. It was cut to retain the carat weight to hit 2 carats. That is one SUPER deep round brilliant.

 

[Kathryn007]

so basically, my husband wanted a 2 carat diamond but it doesn't even face up as a 2 carat due to the fair cut. am i correct in saying that?

 

[kenny]

so basically, my husband wanted a 2 carat diamond but it doesn't even face up as a 2 carat due to the fair cut. am i correct in saying that?

Well not necessarily due to the fair cut , rather due to being too deep. (A round at 70% ? )
Too deep or too shallow can be why a diamond gets only fair cut grade.

Too deep will face up small for the weight.
Too shallow will face up large for the weight.
Neither will have the light performance of a better cut.

 

[Lula]

so basically, my husband wanted a 2 carat diamond but it doesn't even face up as a 2 carat due to the fair cut. am i correct in saying that?

Yes, a well-cut 2 carat diamond should be @ 8mm in diameter. Your diamond is known around here as a "steep-deep" cut, cut to retain weight instead of to maximize light return. I've seen a lot of them -- they are very common in jewelry stores that focus on clarity-color-carat over cut.

But don't be too hard on your husband. He no doubt told the jeweler that he wanted a balance of the four C's, as you mentioned, which meant he didn't emphasize cut, and traditional jewelers focus on color and clarity. Many traditional jewelers don't even carry GIA ExExEX or AGS O diamonds.

Even though my husband researches every home appliance/car purchase to death, I knew there is no way in he** that my husband was going to research diamonds. So I did it myself. Lots of women on here do their own diamond research. I think you should let him know that you did some research, and not to insult his efforts, but that your research showed that you could get better "value" (a happy word for my husband) with what you know, and that you'd like his blessing to exchange the stone. If you don't want to deal with this jeweler again, ask for a refund and start over with our help. If you do want to work with the jeweler, we can help you find some stones on what's known as the "virtual listings" that are well-cut, and you can work with your jeweler to get those diamonds called in for your inspection.

ETA: My husband just beams when someone compliments my anniversary ring, and I just smile and say, "yes, he went all out on this ring." It's a little joke between us, but it saves his pride.

 

[Gypsy]

so basically, my husband wanted a 2 carat diamond but it doesn't even face up as a 2 carat due to the fair cut. am i correct in saying that?

You really do seem to want to blame him or be able to say he failed you or whatever. It happens. All the time. And for many jewelers this is SINCERE 'balance' of the 4 C's

YOU don't want a balance of the four C's Kathryn. What you asked for was inaccurate. You wanted an ideal or near ideal cut. That's not balanced. That's a tipped scale. Stop blaming him and the jeweler completely for a miscommunication that you had a part in.

I'm really starting to feel for your husband.

 

[Lula]

Here is the info from the GIA report, as requested. Please let me know your thoughts.

ROUND BRILLIANT

Measurements: 7.82 - 7.91 x 5.26 mm
Carat Weight: 2.05 carat
Color Grade: E
Clarity Grade: VS2
Cut Grade: Fair
PROPORTIONS:

Depth: 66.9%
Table: 53%
Crown Angle: 37.5°
Crown Height: 18.0%
Pavilion Angle: 41.4°
Pavilion Depth: 44.0%
Star length: 50%
Lower Half: 80%
Girdle: Slightly Thick to Thick, Faceted
Culet: None
FINISH:

Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: Medium Blue

As an educational exercise, would somebody be willing to use a computer program to do a simulation of this stone, please? I'm curious how it can have such a high crown angle, such a small table, and yet such a low crown height (18%). I would expect it to have a much larger table????

 

[Kathryn007]

gypsy, perhaps i'm being too hard on him.

 

[kenny]

I was curious how such a deep stone would score on the HCA:

 

[Dreamer_D]

Kathryn unless your husband isa diamond expert, then he is like most men and probably trusted the information he was given by his jeweler, and his jewler was probably chosen because he is a friend of a friend or otherwise highly recommended. And I am willing to bet that the jeweler did not mention cut quality or downplayed it, because that is what most jewlers I have encountered do. I also bet that if your husband did compare your diamond to another, that he could not tell the difference. Why? Because jewelery store lighting is the great equalizer for cut quality -- there is a reason for that If he has looked at the diamonds in many different environments he might have seen the difference. The better cut stone was also probably 10k more, or smaller, and your hubby wanted to make you happy and make a good purchase. So stop being so mad at him Cut him some slack. He fell prey to the most common issues in the jewelry industry, issues that 99.9% of buyers fall prey to -- misinformation, misleading lighting, lack of prexisting knowledge. How can we blame him?

But I have seen a lot of diamonds and can attest that an Ex cut or even a VG cut will look much better than a Fair. You can easily get a 1.75ct that will face up the same size as your present super-deep cut stone, so that will save a pretty penny.