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robert08

Rough_Rock
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Dec 22, 2008
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Hi everyone. Been looking for a stone now and have done some moderate research to get to this point. A local jeweler has shown me both of these stones. They are both GIA certified and both seem to be eye-clean from when me and my grilfriend have seen them. I''m not sure if I''m getting a good deal or if these truly are the best that I can get with my money. I''ve read many other threads here suggesting GOG and WF and I haven''t ruled out those options just yet. I''ve also gone to Tiffany''s and although it is much more pricey it kind of puts me at ease. Not that the jeweler I''m dealing with has done anything to not put me at ease. I''m just a bit paranoid and feel like alot of these guys can be shady. My goal is to truly get something that she loves and something that makes me feel like I spent my money on quality. Here are the specs on both rings. My budget would be no more than 10-10,500. These prices don''t include the setting which should be $500-650 on top of this from what the jeweler has told me. Any help would be greatly appreciated thanks!!!

Option 1 - $8,700

Measurements: 7.51 - 7.59 x 4.39 mm
Carat Weight: 1.51
Color Grade: H
Clarity Grade: SI1
Cut Grade: Very Good

Depth: 58.1 %
Table: 59 %
Crown Angle: 33°
Crown Height: 13 %
Pavilion Angle: 40.4°
Pavilion Depth: 42 %
Girdle: Thin to Medium, Faceted
Culet: None

Finish:
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: None


Option 2 - $7,600

Measurements: 6.92 - 6.98 x 4.33 mm
Carat Weight: 1.30 carat
Color Grade: D
Clarity Grade: SI1
Cut Grade: Excellent

Depth: 62.3%
Table: 57%
Crown Angle: 35.5°
Crown Height: 15.5%
Pavilion Angle: 40.6°
Pavilion Depth: 42.5%
Girdle: Medium to Slightly Thick, Faceted
Culet: None

Finish:
Polish: Very Good
Symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: Medium Blue
 
#1 is too shallow, will make a great pendant stone, but iffy for a ring stone.

#2 looks great from the numbers.

Have you seen them personally?
 
Yes. I''ve seen both of them. The 1.3 has some carbon inclusions but they arent in the middle. To my eye it looked alright. I''m going again to see them and some settings on Tuesday I believe.
 
Welcome!

Number 2 looks good, I would pass on the first stone. I would ask to check the second diamond out away from the store lightst to give it a good test run and to make sure you like how it behaves in normal lighting.
 
Check how they perform outside of store lighting.

On #1, check to make sure there is no significant decrease in light return when you look at it closer, like between 6 to 12 inches away.
 
Like I mentioned before my budget can go up to 10,000-10,500. These are just the options this jeweler has showed me to save me some money.
 
Date: 12/22/2008 2:56:43 PM
Author: robert08
Like I mentioned before my budget can go up to 10,000-10,500. These are just the options this jeweler has showed me to save me some money.
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The second diamond is definitely worth consideration. What is your main priority, the largest diamond you can find for your money with a nice cut, a diamond with a top notch cut, do you prefer the higher colour grades and is a slightly lower clarity ok?
 
Both stones are with the same store jeweler. Would going to an F color and going VS2 be a better option?
 
Date: 12/22/2008 2:59:16 PM
Author: robert08
Both stones are with the same store jeweler. Would going to an F color and going VS2 be a better option?
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GIA/ AGS F VS2 or F SI or GIA or AGS G colour will still look very white. The cut is all important for a pretty stone, but it depends to what standard of cut you are looking for. There are various degrees of cut quality and you don't have to have a top make cut to have a lovely stone, a diamond of proven proportions which isn't cut to the tightest degree can also be a good choice.
 
As far as preference, I would prefer a better cut and overall quality over size. I know she likes size, but to me having an overall better diamond for my money is better. I don''t want to go too small either. So I think 1.20-1.35 is just the right size. I know the diamond can look bigger or smaller depending on the way it''s cut. So I think we would both be happy with that.
 
I was also looking at this http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/5237/
Although it''s over my budget I''m not completely against going that high if I''m truly getting something great. I know she really likes the H&A. So I supposed it wouldnt hurt to consider something like this.
 
Date: 12/22/2008 3:06:08 PM
Author: robert08
As far as preference, I would prefer a better cut and overall quality over size. I know she likes size, but to me having an overall better diamond for my money is better. I don't want to go too small either. So I think 1.20-1.35 is just the right size. I know the diamond can look bigger or smaller depending on the way it's cut. So I think we would both be happy with that.
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You should be able to find some diamonds which will fit the bill in that case for the budget. Maybe consider F or G VS2 as this can be a sweet spot for some in order to have a nice balance of quality for colour and clarity with a great cut.

The second diamond you posted is well cut and hence worthy of consideration, if you want to look online there should be plenty out there which might suit you.

Alternatively if you want to continue looking in stores, then see if you can view some AGS0 ( Jareds sell them) or Hearts on Fire in order to get an idea of diamonds of known cut quality, then consider for purchase AGS0 or some GIA Excellent cut grade. GIA's cut grade range is broad but and it may take a bit more work to find the better cut diamonds, but you can use the HCA to assist you to eliminate the lesser performers, or report back here with the proportions and we can help from there.
 
Yeah, I used the HCA for both of these and they got pretty good scores. Under a 2 would be what to look for right? Also the 1.3 has medium fluorescence, should I be worried at all about that? I had seen some HOF when we first started shopping, but the prices were quite expensive.
 
Date: 12/22/2008 3:19:43 PM
Author: robert08
Yeah, I used the HCA for both of these and they got pretty good scores. Under a 2 would be what to look for right? Also the 1.3 has medium fluorescence, should I be worried at all about that? I had seen some HOF when we first started shopping, but the prices were quite expensive.
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The HCA is used for elimination, the aim is to score 2 or below in most cases then evaluate from there. The first diamond is a shallow combo, particularly with the pavilion angle, you can do better to get a more balanced stone as in the second one. Medium fluorescence is not a problem or an issue, might get a small discount in a D colour.

If you liked the HoF, then Whiteflash do branded A Cut Above hearts and arrows stones which you could consider, and Good Old Gold also do h&a so you could check those out -

www.whiteflash.com

www.goodoldgold.com

www.winkjones.com Wink sells Cut by Infinity H&A brand.
 
In terms of table size %, and depth %, is there anything I should look for in particular?Same for crown and pavillion. Are there specific numbers I should look for? Or should I just get the info and use it to get the HCA? Thanks again
 
Date: 12/22/2008 3:41:10 PM
Author: robert08
In terms of table size %, and depth %, is there anything I should look for in particular?Same for crown and pavillion. Are there specific numbers I should look for? Or should I just get the info and use it to get the HCA? Thanks again
Click to expand...




I will post some for you to use as a guide. The numbers given should help you find a well cut round diamond, you can also run the numbers of a diamond through the HCA to check any combos which fall outside these ranges especially, as there are some configurations which can still harmonize particularly with the angles. The HCA will eliminate those which aren't a good combination.

depth - 60 - 62% - although my personal preference is to allow up to 62.4%
table - 54- 57%
crown angle - 34- 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6- 41 degrees
girdle - avoid extremes, look for thin to slightly thick, thin to medium etc
polish and symmetry - very good and above



note - with crown and pavilion angles at the shallower ends ( CA 34- PA 40.6) and steeper ( CA 35- PA 41) check to make sure these angles complement in that particular diamond - eyeballs, Idealscope, trusted vendor input - check as appropriate.

And from expert John Pollard.

"As the above implies, configurations depend on each other. A little give here can still work with a little take there.


With that said, here's a "Cliff's Notes" for staying near Tolkowsky/ideal angles with GIA reports (their numbers are rounded): A crown angle of 34.0, 34.5 or 35.0 is usually safe with a 40.8 pavilion angle. If pavilion angle = 40.6 lean toward a 34.5-35.0 crown. If pavilion angle = 41 lean toward a 34.0-34.5 crown.




GIA "EX" in cut is great at its heart, but it ranges a bit wider than some people prefer, particularly in deep combinations (pavilion > 41 with crown > 35)."
 
Thanks, I will continue my search using the info you guys have provided. I reall appreciate it. Thanks!
 
Date: 12/22/2008 4:05:13 PM
Author: robert08
Thanks, I will continue my search using the info you guys have provided. I reall appreciate it. Thanks!
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I am very glad to help!
35.gif
 
Decided to go with this http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/Whiteflash-ACA-cut-diamond-1466954.htm
After further research and revaluating my budget. Smaller stone, lesser in color but much better in clarity which was something that bothered me about the SI1. I love the H&A, and I know she will too because she really liked the HOF when we saw them earlier this year. All in all I''m pretty satisfied and I have peace of mind.

Getting it set on a Legato sleek lines setting.
 
Any time you go with an ACA you know you are getting a good diamond. Congrats on your purchase!
 
Date: 12/23/2008 2:35:36 PM
Author: robert08
Decided to go with this http://www.whiteflash.com/hearts_arrows/Whiteflash-ACA-cut-diamond-1466954.htm
After further research and revaluating my budget. Smaller stone, lesser in color but much better in clarity which was something that bothered me about the SI1. I love the H&A, and I know she will too because she really liked the HOF when we saw them earlier this year. All in all I''m pretty satisfied and I have peace of mind.

Getting it set on a Legato sleek lines setting.
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Beautiful choice congrats!!!
 
Date: 12/22/2008 2:56:27 PM
Author: Lorelei
Welcome!

Number 2 looks good, I would pass on the first stone. I would ask to check the second diamond out away from the store lightst to give it a good test run and to make sure you like how it behaves in normal lighting.
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I was going to say the same (I''ve been ditto-ing you quite a bit lately, lorelei!).

You made a good choice, robert08!
 
Date: 12/23/2008 4:40:42 PM
Author: musey

Date: 12/22/2008 2:56:27 PM
Author: Lorelei
Welcome!

Number 2 looks good, I would pass on the first stone. I would ask to check the second diamond out away from the store lightst to give it a good test run and to make sure you like how it behaves in normal lighting.
Click to expand...
I was going to say the same (I''ve been ditto-ing you quite a bit lately, lorelei!).

You made a good choice, robert08!
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LOL!!
35.gif
 
Thanks everyone! Also, I''ve been reading about apraisals, and I''m unsure if I should take the ring in for independent appraisal once i receive or if the letter of verifcation that they send over is good enough. Suggestions?
 
Date: 12/23/2008 5:03:34 PM
Author: robert08
Thanks everyone! Also, I've been reading about apraisals, and I'm unsure if I should take the ring in for independent appraisal once i receive or if the letter of verifcation that they send over is good enough. Suggestions?
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If you buy it from a trusted vendor or seller that you feel confident with, then you can use their appraisal if provided, they often include an appraisal you can use for insurance purposes if you wish. However you can get an independant appraisal if you want an unbiased expert opinion on your diamond, here is an appraisers list.

https://www.pricescope.com/appr_list.aspx
 
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