Recuts - How much size are you willing to lose??

[kenny]

Wow... we are very different folks, Kenny. LOL

That's fine.

 

[sledge]

Just a thought, fellow size ho. I looked at a stone at wf that was a higher clarity 9.6mm and I could easily see a difference in my 9.7mm stone. No way, not going down in size. Don't do it!

You have eagle eyes or this is a mind clean issue.

A 0.10mm difference is the thickness of a sheet of copy paper. Could you tell side by side, maybe. Would you even notice if someone didn't tell you or you had 24 hours between viewings? Very doubtful. It's not a "OMG, it's so much bigger" experience.

0.10mm = 1 / 256th of an inch

Most rulers go down to 1/16th, maybe 1/32nd if you are lucky. We are talking fractions of an inch.

 

[Gussie]

You have eagle eyes or this is a mind clean issue.

A 0.10mm difference is the thickness of a sheet of copy paper. Could you tell side by side, maybe. Would you even notice if someone didn't tell you or you had 24 hours between viewings? Very doubtful. It's not a "OMG, it's so much bigger" experience.

0.10mm = 1 / 256th of an inch

Most rulers go down to 1/16th, maybe 1/32nd if you are lucky. We are talking fractions of an inch.

I am aware of how small a difference it is. And to be fair, if I had traded for the 9.6mm, I probably wouldn't have noticed on my finger but right next to each other, it was readily apparent. So yeah, it is kind of a mind thing but kind of not too.

Lol, it's good that I can at least see something. I can't see color AT ALL or inclusions either. But maybe that's a good thing!

 

[SimoneDi]

@sledge I realize that you don’t wear a diamond (I think) that you stare into all the time, all the day, so I don’t really expect for you to get it. You can analyse it all day long and come with a 1000 hypothetical calculations, but what @Gussie said is 100% true for many of us. I changed my diamond about a year ago and the new one is less than 0.1mm smaller, I see the difference sometimes. I am very happy, but the difference is there.

 

[MissGotRocks]

Your current diamond is very pretty but if you ever decide to change things up a bit, I think I would try to sell it and just start again. A recut for your stone would net more loss than I think you are willing to deal with. Strange as it sounds, you might tolerate a new diamond at a lesser carat weight than recutting the one you have to a lesser carat weight - know what I mean? And if you go with a great vendor, you can upgrade through the years - that's always something exciting to look forward to as funds or occasions come along!

 

[MissGotRocks]

@sledge I realize that you don’t wear a diamond (I think) that you stare into all the time, all the day, so I don’t really expect for you to get it. You can analyse it all day long and come with a 1000 hypothetical calculations, but what @Gussie said is 100% true for many of us. I changed my diamond about a year ago and the new one is less than 0.1mm smaller, I see the difference sometimes. I am very happy, but the difference is there.

Ooooh, have we seen this new beauty?? I would love to!

 

[MissGotRocks]

When you wear a diamond ring, you know exactly where that diamond lays on your finger... because you have spent hours staring at it! When I initially traded with WF, I went from a 2.22 to a 2.19 - .10 less in diameter. At first, it was OK but as time went on, I missed the difference in size. I know it sounds crazy but I totally believe it because I experienced it. So I upgraded again!

 

[headlight]

I think you've hit the nail on the head... I'm very happy with my stone, but then there's the thought, "...hmmm, what if I had a super ideal cut stone?? Wouldn't that be cool?!" And then the wheels start a-turnin'! LOL Thanks for the added perspective!

This forum is like any other addiction... so bad for you but it's just too hard to give up

 

[headlight]

Your current diamond is very pretty but if you ever decide to change things up a bit, I think I would try to sell it and just start again. A recut for your stone would net more loss than I think you are willing to deal with. Strange as it sounds, you might tolerate a new diamond at a lesser carat weight than recutting the one you have to a lesser carat weight - know what I mean? And if you go with a great vendor, you can upgrade through the years - that's always something exciting to look forward to as funds or occasions come along!

As always, @MissGotRocks knows exactly the right words to say

 

[msop04]

Bwahahaha....ummm, "who is Sir Mix-a-Lot, Baby Got Back for $1 million".

On a more serious note, I am not certain this will be more cost effective than trading in for a different stone. Given the proportions of the existing stone, I think you will lose quite a bit of carat weight which will reduce net worth of the stone, after the re-cut. Not to mention the cost of the re-cut and risk associated with it.

Before I made a decision I would talk with both BGD and CBI and learn about the re-cutting costs, and also what they anticipate the final weight to be. Then I'd go price a XXX in that size range with ideal proportions to see the price. Then use the formula below (with made-up numbers for reference) to tally your total loss:

• ($25k initial purchase - $15k new purchase of smaller stone) = $10k loss + $3k recut = $13k loss total
• $13k loss / $25k initial purchase = 0.52, or 52% loss of initial value

In this example, if you were able to sell your stone for 48% of the initial purchase price, you'd end up at the same spot:

• $25k initial purchase * 0.48 = $12k available to buy a new stone

But if you were patient, and waited for the right buyer, maybe you could yield 75% instead:

• $25k initial purchase * 0.75 = $18.75k

Again, the numbers above are made-up. I don't know what you paid, but you can run the math and figure out where the equilibrium is for making such a decision. I'm sure at some point it makes sense, but I could see you easily creeping to a point where it doesn't make sense.

It wouldn't be less for me to trade up, as I'd have to do so with Diamonds Direct... finding this one took some time, and they let me know in no uncertain terms that UNTIL I have about $8-10K to spend, don't bother. I guess they have to make money too, but dang! The cost of the recut would be approximately $500/ct.

My whole thought process was, "...oh, cool! For $1700, I can have a super ideal cut stone that's close to the same size as mine now!!"

Edit: "until" I have $8-10K...

 

[headlight]

It wouldn't be less for me to trade up, as I'd have to do so with Diamonds Direct... finding this one took some time, and they let me know in no uncertain terms that as soon as I have about $8-10K to spend, don't bother. I guess they have to make money too, but dang! The cost of the recut would be approximately $500/ct.

My whole thought process was, "...oh, cool! For $1700, I can have a super ideal cut stone that's close to the same size as mine now!!"

This is what I'm saying...!

 

[msop04]

This forum is like any other addiction... so bad for you but it's just too hard to give up

 

[msop04]

This is what I'm saying...!

See what I mean??!! Ugh!

 

[msop04]

@sledge I realize that you don’t wear a diamond (I think) that you stare into all the time, all the day, so I don’t really expect for you to get it. You can analyse it all day long and come with a 1000 hypothetical calculations, but what @Gussie said is 100% true for many of us. I changed my diamond about a year ago and the new one is less than 0.1mm smaller, I see the difference sometimes. I am very happy, but the difference is there.

This is so true...

 

[msop04]

Your current diamond is very pretty but if you ever decide to change things up a bit, I think I would try to sell it and just start again. A recut for your stone would net more loss than I think you are willing to deal with. Strange as it sounds, you might tolerate a new diamond at a lesser carat weight than recutting the one you have to a lesser carat weight - know what I mean? And if you go with a great vendor, you can upgrade through the years - that's always something exciting to look forward to as funds or occasions come along!

I thought of this, but if I sell it, I'll likely only get 60% of what I paid... then I'd have to spend A LOT more to buy a new one. I agree that a recut may not be worth the loss in size. If I had it to do over again, I would've gone with CBI or WF... but as they say, hindsight is 20/20. That said, I feel very fortunate to have found a 3.33 ct that faces up like a 3.6-3.7 ct... is a "high" I... and eye clean at SI2, which obviously saved me a good bit of money. I don't want to go bigger, but I certainly don't want to go more than about 0.15-0.20 mm smaller. Weird how our minds work. LOL

 

[headlight]

So maybe then, there's your answer: The size is more important that the perfection of the cut. I went from a 3.29ct., 9.59mm down to a 2.01ct, 8.01mm for a MUCH nicer diamond and I have not looked back. Do I notice it is smaller, yes, but every time I look down at it or it catches my eye in a mirror reflection I'm super happy I did it. So I sort of feel for you it could be the best of both worlds. I saw your comment re trade in... but you don't have to be beholden to the vendor you purchased from... you can go to another vendor and see what they will give you for your stone that you can use on a SI and, with a great upgrade policy, you could work your way back up to what you want your ultimate goal to be. Here's the good news: You have OPTIONS... including the one of just keeping the stone you have of which I don't know anyone who wouldn't love to have it

 

[OdetteOdile]

That's a very good question... I feel like I would likely have to get Caysie to make a new setting.

Then consider the cost of a new setting in this equation as well. Have you seen a super ideal diamond side by side with your diamond? I guess that is the best way to gauge if the change in light return will be noticeable and worth it. The other thing is - what if during the recut they do not quite get it to super ideal - would that bother you?

 

[sledge]

It wouldn't be less for me to trade up, as I'd have to do so with Diamonds Direct... finding this one took some time, and they let me know in no uncertain terms that as soon as I have about $8-10K to spend, don't bother. I guess they have to make money too, but dang! The cost of the recut would be approximately $500/ct.

My whole thought process was, "...oh, cool! For $1700, I can have a super ideal cut stone that's close to the same size as mine now!!"

I don't want to discourage you or anyone, rather that means banging out the most size or recutting for max beauty.

Just remember, the cost for the recut isn't just $1,700. You also have to factor in the loss of value because of the reduction of carat weight.

For reference, a supa dupa idea and triple X with ideal proportions (although the 35/40.8 makes me nervous)...

Diamond | 3.183 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4129363

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 3.183 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4129363

www.whiteflash.com

3.12 Carat I VS2 Round Brilliant Natural Diamond GIA Certified Affinity Cut - D43376456

www.adiamor.com

And @SimoneDi, you are correct I don't wear a diamond every day. I am sure I'd be picky too if I did. Sorry if my comments to you or @Gussie came out as offensive, they were not meant that way. Just such a small sliver seems to not be memorable.

 

[OdetteOdile]

So maybe then, there's your answer: The size is more important that the perfection of the cut. I went from a 3.29ct., 9.59mm down to a 2.01ct, 8.01mm for a MUCH nicer diamond and I have not looked back. Do I notice it is smaller, yes, but every time I look down at it or it catches my eye in a mirror reflection I'm super happy I did it. So I sort of feel for you it could be the best of both worlds. I saw your comment re trade in... but you don't have to be beholden to the vendor you purchased from... you can go to another vendor and see what they will give you for your stone that you can use on a SI and, with a great upgrade policy, you could work your way back up to what you want your ultimate goal to be. Here's the good news: You have OPTIONS... including the one of just keeping the stone you have of which I don't know anyone who wouldn't love to have it

That is a great idea! Msop, could you approach the super ideal vendors and see if they have interest in your diamond for trade in?

 

[Gussie]

@sledge, not offensive at all, lol. Who would have ever thought that 0.1mm would be a big deal!

 

[SimoneDi]

Ooooh, have we seen this new beauty?? I would love to!

MGR, I don’t want to hijack, but it’s literally the same ring, just a different center stone. My current is a 2.1 I VS2.

 

[msop04]

Then consider the cost of a new setting in this equation as well. Have you seen a super ideal diamond side by side with your diamond? I guess that is the best way to gauge if the change in light return will be noticeable and worth it. The other thing is - what if during the recut they do not quite get it to super ideal - would that bother you?

I have not compared them, no... and, no, it wouldn't bother me if it wasn't super ideal.

 

[msop04]

MGR, I don’t want to hijack, but it’s literally the same ring, just a different center stone. My current is a 2.1 I VS2.

Ooooohhhhhh, that's pretty!!!

 

[sledge]

That is a great idea! Msop, could you approach the super ideal vendors and see if they have interest in your diamond for trade in?

Great point. Awhile back I had talked to Wink about taking my wife's BGD in on trade. Then we had an unexpected death in the family that sucked up the upgrade money. Since then, the wife can't decide if she wants to part with the original stone or not. So we've put upgrading on pause indefinitely.

 

[msop04]

I don't want to discourage you or anyone, rather that means banging out the most size or recutting for max beauty.

Just remember, the cost for the recut isn't just $1,700. You also have to factor in the loss of value because of the reduction of carat weight.

For reference, a supa dupa idea and triple X with ideal proportions (although the 35/40.8 makes me nervous)...

Diamond | 3.183 ct I SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond AGS Certified | 4129363

This Whiteflash A CUT ABOVE® super ideal cut hearts and arrows 3.183 carat I color SI1 clarity loose diamond is graded by the American Gem Society (AGS) Laboratories. | 4129363

www.whiteflash.com

3.12 Carat I VS2 Round Brilliant Natural Diamond GIA Certified Affinity Cut - D43376456

www.adiamor.com

And @SimoneDi, you are correct I don't wear a diamond every day. I am sure I'd be picky too if I did. Sorry if my comments to you or @Gussie came out as offensive, they were not meant that way. Just such a small sliver seems to not be memorable.

Here's the thing. I think my diamond is beautiful... this is just one of those "extra extras" that I've cooked up. LOL I'm not interested in the loss of value, as I don't plan to sell it. Any trade would have to be through DD... and I'm pretty sure a recut would void that program.

Also... both of those diamonds listed are much smaller than mine.

 

[msop04]

Great point. Awhile back I had talked to Wink about taking my wife's BGD in on trade. Then we had an unexpected death in the family that sucked up the upgrade money. Since then, the wife can't decide if she wants to part with the original stone or not. So we've put upgrading on pause indefinitely.

@OdetteOdile
I have reached out to WF... they politely declined. LOL

 

[SimoneDi]

It wouldn't be less for me to trade up, as I'd have to do so with Diamonds Direct... finding this one took some time, and they let me know in no uncertain terms that UNTIL I have about $8-10K to spend, don't bother. I guess they have to make money too, but dang! The cost of the recut would be approximately $500/ct.

My whole thought process was, "...oh, cool! For $1700, I can have a super ideal cut stone that's close to the same size as mine now!!"

Edit: "until" I have $8-10K...

Just a quick note re the cost, you are forgetting the re-grading report which then will likely be AGS and those go for a little less than $300, also add insured shipping and you will be looking at $2k +/- I’d personally invest the difference into some nice side stones, if a 3 stone is something you still might want to entertain. I know that PS can be so addictive and “super-ideal” diamonds sound so special and enticing. They are pretty, no doubt, but so is yours. If you can compare a smaller sized super-ideal with similar specs to yours and then you know that you much prefer it over what you have, only then is when I will support a recut. Otherwise, you are really going into this blind and maybe setting yourself up for a disappointment. That’s just my 2c.

 

[msop04]

Just a quick note re the cost, you are forgetting the re-grading report which then will likely be AGS and those go for a little less than $300, also add insured shipping and you will be looking at $2k +/- I’d personally invest the difference into some nice side stones, if a 3 stone is something you still might want to entertain. I know that PS can be so addictive and “super-ideal” diamonds sound so special and enticing. They are pretty, no doubt, but so is yours. If you can compare a smaller sized super-ideal with similar specs to yours and then you know that you much prefer it over what you have, only then is when I will support a recut. Otherwise, you are really going into this blind and maybe setting yourself up for a disappointment. That’s just my 2c.

Another good point... I had not considered the regrading. I may just go to the local HOF dealer and do that. I think I know what I'm going to do, but I really need to nip this in the bud, once and for all. Thanks!

 

[msop04]

So maybe then, there's your answer: The size is more important that the perfection of the cut. I went from a 3.29ct., 9.59mm down to a 2.01ct, 8.01mm for a MUCH nicer diamond and I have not looked back. Do I notice it is smaller, yes, but every time I look down at it or it catches my eye in a mirror reflection I'm super happy I did it. So I sort of feel for you it could be the best of both worlds. I saw your comment re trade in... but you don't have to be beholden to the vendor you purchased from... you can go to another vendor and see what they will give you for your stone that you can use on a SI and, with a great upgrade policy, you could work your way back up to what you want your ultimate goal to be. Here's the good news: You have OPTIONS... including the one of just keeping the stone you have of which I don't know anyone who wouldn't love to have it

Yep... that's the answer for me. However, I'm not sure I'd see it as a "much" better cut - at least not to warrant the loss of size. I'm still going to go to the HOF dealer, ya know... just to ease my mind. I have been to a few dealers in town, but they offered PENNIES for it. It was pretty freaking insulting, really.

 

[distracts]

I am having an OEC tweaked currently - just a small tweak, and shouldn't lose too much size. Still, the facets under the table turned off and on all at once and were usually off, so even changing a small amount will I hope make it much sparklier. So I will get back to you on how perceptible the difference is when I get the diamond back! The cutter said what I wanted was so small they ordinarily would not do it, except they had spoken to me in person. I was on the fence about it until I spoke to them too but ultimately decided for what I wanted it was the best thing to try.

Personally for your stone, I wouldn't recut... to me the risk of going down in size from 9.8 to 9.4 would be unacceptable. I can see a .1 mm difference in size, despite the common perception on here that that difference is too small to be seen, so .4 would be obvious.

I think you are being sucked into what I consider to be the downside of PS... if your stone isn't the "model" version of the recommended ranges, one has a case of "proportion envy" lol! Just because it might not fall into what is espoused here to ring shoppers, doesn't mean it isn't a pretty stone. Remember what the GIA taught us (lol!): Many different combinations yield attractive diamonds.

This is what I think is happening. Is it possible for you to arrange to see a superideal of around 9.4 mm next to your stone? Is there anywhere that carries them near you that you could visit, to see if you can tell a difference? I think the best way to know what you will be happy with is direct comparison to the sort of thing you might get, which it seems you have not yet done. Of course make sure your diamond is super clean first, so you aren't tricked by just dirt!

The cost of the recut would be approximately $500/ct.

That sounds expensive for a recut - is it because it's going to a superideal?