shocking.

[TooPatient]

Date: 10/30/2009 4:24:21 PM
Author: absolut_blonde

Date: 10/30/2009 1:52:46 PM
Author: frenchfries
Typing this on my bb so I apologize in advance for spelling or grammatical errors.

So the first thing-the younger brother is a healthy man. I don''t even think he was born with so much as a birthmark. He is smart, great at sports, can without question wipe.

As far as my fiance goes, he is the more attached one. I learned that his parents have tried to isolate him from his brither and create animosity between them. I had a long talk with him. Still convinced he was not abused in the same way as his brother,but he was def abused by the lap thing, etc. He started to defend it by saying his relationship w his mom is diff from my rel w my mom. UhH YEAH. So I had a meltdown and told him hat when we have kids it will be his duty to protect them from sickos like his mom. He also tried to convince me that the wiping did not continue w his brother past 6-then I explained that 6 is still way too old and explained that it had to be way past that bc the mom sent the younger son away to a 3 day camp (someone as possessive as she is would never send a 6 yo away so he must have been older) and he had to come home early bc he was constipated and could not go wo having her there (not going into all the details but her wiping has really affected him). That is one of the biggest indicators to me that its abuse. But back to my fiance-i brought up lots of examples, told him the sick behavior had to stop and that if the family still lived next door (they moved away but still visit) that I would report her. So here is what I know: he doesn''t want to think his mom is sick but he''s starting to get it, laying in her lap is OVER, he is starting to have an actual relationship with his brother thanks to his gf and me, and he agreed that we would spend xmas with my fam this year instead of his (you have no idea what a HUGE improvement this is).
Hamburger; sounds like great progress on your end too. I might go boxer shopping for replacements this weekend come to think of it .

Sorry for the big chunky paragraph. Thanks again for the support!

Personally... I stick with my previous comment. I wouldn''t marry a man in this situation. I am not saying I wouldn''t marry him EVER but certainly not right now.

He is deeply in denial. And further, clearly conflicted about his mother''s behaviour. Trying to defend her behaviour is downright alarming.

To me, this wouldn''t just be an issue of protecting my future children from this woman. This would be an issue of removing this sick woman from our lives altogether. In no way, shape, or form would this woman even KNOW my children.

I would strongly recommend couples counseling with someone experienced in handling these issues.

Ditto to this.

It is great progress that he is starting to see her behavior as not normal or acceptable. Glad to hear you''ll be with your family for the holidays. Should be less stressful for both of you.

He should see a good psychologist before you get married, if possible. Even if he didn''t go through some of the stuff his brother did there is still stuff he needs to deel with (the lap thing, etc.). It must have been hard for him growing up. It also sounds like there may be some behaviors that he doesn''t recognize as wrong because he grew up with them as part of his life. Those need to be addressed so he can work past them.

Couple counseling would be great. Would your FI be comfortable talking about everything in front of you? It may be a very hard subject for him and he might be more comfortable talking to someone alone a couple of times and then going as a couple.

 

[exoticisabella]

Date: 10/27/2009 1:53:50 PM
Author: TooPatient
If I was in this situation (and I am to a lesser degree -- long story), I would move away from these women and end all contact. (and I did)

It is a bad situation. It won''t get better. (look at the family tradition in Hamburger''s case)
If you have kids, how do you explain that it is okay to be with grandma when other people are around but NEVER alone? How do you explain to them that grandma lives down the street but they aren''t allowed to spend the night with her (at the age when all the other kids get to)?


This whole thing bothered me so much last night that I talked to B about it. He says to end the relationship. Get out of it and never look back. If your FI can''t see that this is not normal or right, then you are in a situation where this behavior will continue with your own kids (either by him or FMIL).
B says that even IF your FI knows it is wrong, you should still get away from him. I guess it is common for the abused to become an abuser. (he said they go one of two ways. The first is to reject the whole thing and not do that kind of thing. The other is to become the abuser and be in control of the situation.)

I don''t entirely agree with him. If your FI thinks it is okay, then forget him and move on. If he knows it is wrong and wants away from it then a good psychologist would probably be the way to go.


Either way:
GET AWAY FROM THESE SICK WOMEN

Help the neighbor kids & younger siblings if you can. But get away. Don''t look back. You and FI and future kids deserve to have a safe & happy life. These women are NOT safe.

Frenchfries and Hamburger, this is very true! My mother grew up in a household where she and her siblings were both physically and emotionally abused. If she did anything her dad didn''t like he would pull out the belt and beat her. Vowing that she would never do that to her own child she sought help and thought that she had overcome this. Sadly, my mother has low self esteem and a very skewed view of the world. She was very verbally abusive to me my entire life always telling me how I was too fat, too stupid or how I didn''t need friends because nobody like me anyway (and keep in mind that these comment were MILD). Finally, she walked out on my father and I when I was 12 years old after stating that I was just too much to handle and I had broken her marriage up. I am so thankful that I had the most amazing father and psychologist (thanks Karen!) in the world. I''m happy to say that as a whole, I have come out of this bad situation with confidence, happiness, my rock of a dad who will always be there for me and more emotional intelligence than I ever may need!

Even so, (I''m 23) this doesn''t go away forever. There have been times that I''ve snapped in front of DH because I thought he was attacking me and trying to put me down (he wasn''t). I still have issues of trust every once in a while when it comes to DH. I know that he''d never cheat on me BUT does DH *really* know what love is, or is he *really* being nice to me because he wants to or because he wants something.

My own 2cents (and point) to this is that unless your ready for a long, emotionally consuming and potentially very difficult life I would consider moving on. I also would, without a doubt, go to premarital counseling. Hamburger, your FI might be a step ahead as he does realize that what is happening is not normal and not right.

Good luck gals and remember that your *heart* always knows what to do

 

[oddoneout]

Frenchfries and Hamburger, this is very true! My mother grew up in a household where she and her siblings were both physically and emotionally abused. If she did anything her dad didn''t like he would pull out the belt and beat her. Vowing that she would never do that to her own child she sought help and thought that she had overcome this. Sadly, my mother has low self esteem and a very skewed view of the world. She was very verbally abusive to me my entire life always telling me how I was too fat, too stupid or how I didn''t need friends because nobody like me anyway (and keep in mind that these comment were MILD). Finally, she walked out on my father and I when I was 12 years old after stating that I was just too much to handle and I had broken her marriage up. I am so thankful that I had the most amazing father and psychologist (thanks Karen!) in the world. I''m happy to say that as a whole, I have come out of this bad situation with confidence, happiness, my rock of a dad who will always be there for me and more emotional intelligence than I ever may need!

Even so, (I''m 23) this doesn''t go away forever. There have been times that I''ve snapped in front of DH because I thought he was attacking me and trying to put me down (he wasn''t). I still have issues of trust every once in a while when it comes to DH. I know that he''d never cheat on me BUT does DH *really* know what love is, or is he *really* being nice to me because he wants to or because he wants something.


My own 2cents (and point) to this is that unless your ready for a long, emotionally consuming and potentially very difficult life I would consider moving on. I also would, without a doubt, go to premarital counseling. Hamburger, your FI might be a step ahead as he does realize that what is happening is not normal and not right.


Good luck gals and remember that your *heart* always knows what to do

[/quote]

I''m very glad you recognized the problems and worked through them.

 

[makemepretty]

While she seems very controlling and has boundary issues, I don''t understand why ANYONE would suggest you end your relationship over this. I don''t consider anything she''s done as abuse. I think for some people, your child is a helpless child no matter how old/big they get. In her eyes, he''ll never grow up. Until he tells her where the boundaries are, she won''t change. There''s nothing sexual about anything you posted. He''s a grown up and doesn''t have to live with mommy and follow her rules, so what exactly is the problem?

Wiping a 10-12 year old is not something I''d want to do and maybe you''re not getting the whole story, especially since your husband said that didn''t happen to him. My 7 year old niece asked me to "check" her after she wiped her bottom, I told her I''m sure she did just fine but maybe not every parent has that confidence. I have a 12 year old boy, they can be quite lack in hygiene but I just encourage more baths

What you are implying sometimes, is MORE hurtful.