When enough is enough - mental illness

[chemgirl]

Ugh got a text from guy "I'm sorry I decorated your chair"

Decorated!!!!

I want to hide. Awkward enough facing dude, but everyone else seems to know about it. Can't wait for 4:00.

Did you show this to HR?

He needs a med adjustment.

+1
Sorry you're having to deal with this Chemgirl.

HR person is out today (we only have one) so I showed our boss. Then I emailed boss about it and cc'd HR person.

Today is a major deadline and guy is in charge of the project so I think upper management are ignoring until Monday.

 

[AdaBeta27]

People re-homing their mentally ill children should immediately change the locks and get a security system with recording cameras if you don't already have one. Might want to consider steel security doors, window grills, or other measures. You never know what will happen if they get resentful.

 

[kmarla]

Still thinking of you Queenie60 and hope the talk and transition goes well

Chemgirl, Housecat, natyLad etc, thinking of all of you as well and sending hugs. I apologize if I've missed anyone.

We're still getting texts from our daughter. She has her new phone now. We got a text this morning asking us to bring her her mail, take her on errands etc. I shut that down, but very nicely. She seemed to understand our message that we aren't a taxi service and she is making arrangements to come get her things by bus. She's learning that life is tougher being independent, not as many privileges, but she's also learning new skills, which is good!

 

[Queenie60]

Kmarla: Glad it's going well with your daughter. We hope to do the talk this week. Haven't been able to pin him down. He left for work this morning and I am not sure what time he will come in. He didn't come in until 1 am this morning. We hope to get this done sometime this week as the apartment is ready and waiting. Can't wait to get this huge burden off of my back. Will keep you posted with updates. Thank you for reaching out, much appreciated. And yes, we intend to redo alarm system codes and have locks changed immediately upon his leaving. Already thought about security - we already have great security systems in place.

 

[Queenie60]

Okay - here's my update. The battle begins. I told my son yesterday and this morning that he's moving out to another place. He refuses. He's literally holding my husband and I hostage in our own home. He's vile, vulgar, threatening and just plane old nasty. So now, I am giving him until Friday to move his things to the new place, if he refuses I have decided to have the locks changed so that he has no more entry to our home. This is going to get very ugly. Please send your positive thoughts my way during these trying times.

 

[AdaBeta27]

Good luck, sincerely, not sarcastically. Can you tell law enforcement what's going on, just for your safety?

 

[azstonie]

Okay - here's my update. The battle begins. I told my son yesterday and this morning that he's moving out to another place. He refuses. He's literally holding my husband and I hostage in our own home. He's vile, vulgar, threatening and just plane old nasty. So now, I am giving him until Friday to move his things to the new place, if he refuses I have decided to have the locks changed so that he has no more entry to our home. This is going to get very ugly. Please send your positive thoughts my way during these trying times.

I'm sorry its going this way. This is so hard.

One suggestion maybe, regarding his things if those are at issue here: Gather *all* his things including clothes, medication if those are still at your place, etc. Take them to a storage unit for which you pay the rent for say 60 days (that should be enough time for him to collect them)---place the business card of the place, the number or letters of the unit itself, and the key or code in an envelope with your DS's name on it---either tape it to the door or hand it to him if that is how this happens. Most definitely have your locks changed, not only because he's not in a good place himself, but any friends of his who might think they should get involved. Suggest a digital door lock---the good ones also have a keyed portion in case of battery malfunction---and you can program codes into it for specific people/occasions btw, like a 1-time use, etc.

 

[Loves Vintage]

Queenie - Is there anyone in the community who could help you? Remind me if your son is seeing a counselor or doctor? Is he currently medicated? Sorry, I should probably just re-read the thread. I'm wondering if there is some social services intervention that could assist?

 

[kmarla]

Queenie, I've been thinking of you a lot and I'm sorry things haven't gone more smoothly for you and your son. I know it puts an extra burden on you, but could you and your husband pack up your sons belongings and take them over to the apartment? That way it's a done deal with no room for negotiating or manipulating. Seeing his old room empty will help send that message.

Edited to add that once we packed up our daughters things and put them in storage it really helped my husband and I cope better. Literally, I felt like I could finally breathe. It was a powerful statement that we are moving forward and things will eventually be better for all of us.

It will take your son some time to process his new reality. I know it's hard to imagine right now, but things will eventually settle down somewhat as he accepts his new situation. Don't forget I'm about a month ahead of you in the process, and very aware of how much stress you must be feeling right now. I'm sending you and your family hugs as you go through this.

 

[december-fire]

Queenie60,

I've been thinking about you and wondering how things were going. I'm sorry to hear your son's reaction. Perhaps its to be expected given that he isn't in control of the situation. You've received very good advice from those who have already replied. It seems wise to give the police a call and inform them about what's going on.

I hope your son will come to realize that living separately is best for him as well as you and your husband, and that love and support for him doesn't end when he is no longer under your roof.

Sending you positive thoughts and continued strength though this very difficult step.

Hugs

 

[kmarla]

A quick update on our situation. Our daughter is no longer staying with the person she was with originally. There was some sort of falling out and we don't know the details. She is now staying with a friend who is still a stranger to us. When her belongings were put in storage, I had included a letter to our daughter with contact information for different agencies that could help her, and she did contact them. They are sending her referrals to apartments etc. She has been going to look at several showings, but so far doesn't have anything settled. She told us she is looking to live with three other people who are friends of friends. I'm sure it would be easier if she was just looking for a bachelor apartment for herself. She is going to work and seems to be taking her meds. She has a new tongue piercing and dyed her hair. We saw her briefly Sunday when she came to pick up some paperwork. She only stayed a few minutes and never left the front hall. She looked tidy and well kept, so that's good. She was polite but all business and had a friend with her. She has started to send little e-mails asking how we are and sharing little bits of her life, so we feel that overall things are moving in a positive direction.

 

[december-fire]

kmarla,

Just saw your update. I think that's very positive news about your daughter! I'm glad she reached out to the agencies you listed for her, and that she's sending emails asking about you and sharing some information with you!

You're demonstrating your love and support for your daughter by having provided the agencies' information, and she's showing her love and trust in you through her emails.

I realize its still a very stressful situation for you, but things seem hopeful.

Sending positive thoughts to you and your family.

 

[Queenie60]

Update: Bob and I have an emergency appointment with counselor. Don't know what good this will do. Our son has been sending threatening text messages to my husband this afternoon. Very threatening. He's making it easy for me to throw him out and there's no California legal issue at all when you're being threatened. I spoke with an eviction attorney this morning and have the paperwork to do an "at will" eviction. However don't think that will apply at this point when we are being threatened in our own home. Will let you all know what advise I receive from the therapist. Thank you for all of your concern and support.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Update: Bob and I have an emergency appointment with counselor. Don't know what good this will do. Our son has been sending threatening text messages to my husband this afternoon. Very threatening. He's making it easy for me to throw him out and there's no California legal issue at all when you're being threatened. I spoke with an eviction attorney this morning and have the paperwork to do an "at will" eviction. However don't think that will apply at this point when we are being threatened in our own home. Will let you all know what advise I receive from the therapist. Thank you for all of your concern and support.

If he is a danger to himself or others than you can have him committed to a psych facility on an emergency detention.

 

[House Cat]

Update: Bob and I have an emergency appointment with counselor. Don't know what good this will do. Our son has been sending threatening text messages to my husband this afternoon. Very threatening. He's making it easy for me to throw him out and there's no California legal issue at all when you're being threatened. I spoke with an eviction attorney this morning and have the paperwork to do an "at will" eviction. However don't think that will apply at this point when we are being threatened in our own home. Will let you all know what advise I receive from the therapist. Thank you for all of your concern and support.

I am so sorry for all of you. I hope the therapy session goes well and that you get some answers that bring you to a peaceful solution.

Keep us posted when you can.

 

[Natylad]

Okay - here's my update. The battle begins. I told my son yesterday and this morning that he's moving out to another place. He refuses. He's literally holding my husband and I hostage in our own home. He's vile, vulgar, threatening and just plane old nasty. So now, I am giving him until Friday to move his things to the new place, if he refuses I have decided to have the locks changed so that he has no more entry to our home. This is going to get very ugly. Please send your positive thoughts my way during these trying times.

Queenie, I just want to say that I'm very sorry that you have to go through this. I'm sending you positive thoughts and I really hope that everything will work out very well for you and your family

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Gosh, Queenie, just wanted to send my deepest sympathy for what you are going through. I hope the counselor can help.

I will say that for our son, ANY change is extremely anxiety producing for him. We'd have to introduce him to the idea, gradually work up to a visit, then gradually make the move. That is just the way it is when autism or Asperger's is concerned. He goes into panic mode if things have an abrupt change.

 

[Queenie60]

Thank you all - he is being somewhat civil today however is refusing to leave. It's strange that he doesn't like either one of us and makes that very clear but wants to remain here. I feel that he's afraid to leave. The advise that DS gave, too much too soon may be a bit scary for him. Counselor did not offer too much support. His psychiatrist refuses to work with us as his allegiance is to my son. Our hands are tied. Bob and I will be putting our heads together this evening to try and come up with a plan. It may resort to having locks changed while he's at work and having police here to escort him off of our property. This is very tough. I will let you know how it all turns out. Wish me luck - and many thanks to each of you for your support and concerns.

 

[kmarla]

kmarla,

Just saw your update. I think that's very positive news about your daughter! I'm glad she reached out to the agencies you listed for her, and that she's sending emails asking about you and sharing some information with you!

You're demonstrating your love and support for your daughter by having provided the agencies' information, and she's showing her love and trust in you through her emails.

I realize its still a very stressful situation for you, but things seem hopeful.

Sending positive thoughts to you and your family.

Thank you December-fire

 

[kmarla]

Thank you all - he is being somewhat civil today however is refusing to leave. It's strange that he doesn't like either one of us and makes that very clear but wants to remain here. I feel that he's afraid to leave. The advise that DS gave, too much too soon may be a bit scary for him. Counselor did not offer too much support. His psychiatrist refuses to work with us as his allegiance is to my son. Our hands are tied. Bob and I will be putting our heads together this evening to try and come up with a plan. It may resort to having locks changed while he's at work and having police here to escort him off of our property. This is very tough. I will let you know how it all turns out. Wish me luck - and many thanks to each of you for your support and concerns.

Thinking of your family Queenie60 and sending lots of support!

 

[chemgirl]

Update: Dude was fired. He was originally given a slap on the wrist and work was rugsweeping everything. That was until yesterday morning when I noticed something in my coffee mug. Security reviewed the footage and yep, he "decorated" my coffee mug.

Management reviewed the video footage and fired him on the spot. My boss looked like he was going to puke.

So yeah, that's upsetting. Now to get a restraining order and find a new gym.

 

[december-fire]

Update: Dude was fired. He was originally given a slap on the wrist and work was rugsweeping everything. That was until yesterday morning when I noticed something in my coffee mug. Security reviewed the footage and yep, he "decorated" my coffee mug.

Management reviewed the video footage and fired him on the spot. My boss looked like he was going to puke.

So yeah, that's upsetting. Now to get a restraining order and find a new gym.

Chemgirl,

Thank goodness he was fired! I'm so sorry you had to deal with this horrible situation. Obviously, this individual does not understand boundaries, right from wrong, and what's appropriate versus what's not. Therefore, who knows how his behaviour would have progressed. Very scary and upsetting.

You're wise to get a restraining order and alter your routine by getting a new gym. Unfortunately, you can't assume that he's out of your life just because he's been fired.

In an earlier post, you mentioned that you know his wife. I wonder what he's told his wife about the reasons behind his job loss. I wouldn't be surprised if he's given his wife a line about being laid-off or something. I wonder if she knows the truth about her spouse.

Again, I'm so sorry you're in this situation. Stay safe.

 

[chemgirl]

Update: Dude was fired. He was originally given a slap on the wrist and work was rugsweeping everything. That was until yesterday morning when I noticed something in my coffee mug. Security reviewed the footage and yep, he "decorated" my coffee mug.

Management reviewed the video footage and fired him on the spot. My boss looked like he was going to puke.

So yeah, that's upsetting. Now to get a restraining order and find a new gym.

Chemgirl,

Thank goodness he was fired! I'm so sorry you had to deal with this horrible situation. Obviously, this individual does not understand boundaries, right from wrong, and what's appropriate versus what's not. Therefore, who knows how his behaviour would have progressed. Very scary and upsetting.

You're wise to get a restraining order and alter your routine by getting a new gym. Unfortunately, you can't assume that he's out of your life just because he's been fired.

In an earlier post, you mentioned that you know his wife. I wonder what he's told his wife about the reasons behind his job loss. I wouldn't be surprised if he's given his wife a line about being laid-off or something. I wonder if she knows the truth about her spouse.

Again, I'm so sorry you're in this situation. Stay safe.

Yes I know his wife. Him and I went to University together a little over 10 years ago. There was some chemistry, but he had a girlfriend so nothing came of it. Eventually he and girlfriend were married and we all became friends. Her and I go to the same gym, hence finding a new gym. I have no idea what he told her, but a layoff would make no sense with how the company is structured. Not to mention he has been there for 8 years and would receive compensation if he were let go without fault.

There was interest on my part when we first met, before finding out about the girlfriend, now wife. Because of that he somehow thinks I am into all of the creepy stuff he's doing.

In the past he has made the odd flirtatious comment that always coincides with him needing a med adjustment. They were always borderline so I just ignored. Apparently in his mind I'm playing along.

 

[AGBF]

As for parental obligation, it stops at 18, and anything after that is optional. And your daughter is well beyond 18.

There is a lot I would like to say in response to several people who posted in this thread, not just Jambalaya. I am on an ancient computer in my Virginia home, however, and may get thrown off at any moment, so I want to be quick.

To Jambalaya: parental obligation did not stop for me when my daughter turned 18. It didn't matter what the law said. I could not simply switch off being a mother. Even though my daughter had, when she became mentally ill, also lost her empathy and begun to act in some sociopathic ways, I could not forget what she was like as a child. She was a peach as a child. She was an angelic baby and a wonderful child before she became ill. She never gave me any problems. She was courteous and never got in trouble at school. She played the cello in the school orchestra at the same time that she played the clarinet in the band. She earned straight A's and took ballet. She went quietly to her bedroom and did her homework without being asked when she came in from school. Then my affectionate, cuddly child turned into a raging, angry, promiscuous teenager who battered me.

I am not saying other women should not save themselves. I am saying that for me parental obligation could not be shut off like a faucet when a calendar page turned.

Deb

 

[Jambalaya]

Deb, I can't remember who I was addressing and am not going to re-read the whole thread right now. Some parents have expressed absolutely horrific stress and fear, while dealing with their own health problems, too. I feel that life is short and I wrote to Kmarla I think something along the lines of, "When does it stop? When you're 70? 80? When you drop dead from the stress of it all?"

My point was not that parents should flip the calendar page and go off hooting and screaming with joy on the next cruise leaving for the Bahamas. My point was that if one cannot cope, there is an end in sight should they choose to step back. Given the horrendous things that have been discussed on this thread, I meant to say that there is a choice about how involved to be, once a child turns 18. Of course, 18 is still very young indeed. But my friend's son is 28, addicted to cocaine and heroin, and was arrested last year. Instead of jailing him, the judge sent him to a longterm residential rehab, all paid for by the state. Sadly he wasn't able to complete the program, and he left. He wanted to spend Christmas Day with his family. She thinks he has hurt them all enough (long story) and said no. Parents have options to save their own sanity should they need to/choose to - the legal burden is lifted at 18, if not the emotional one. I would find that thought a huge comfort, I think, if it was me - that I don't have to keep putting myself through this, if I come to the very end of my tether. I was saying that stepping back is an option as long as your child is over 18, as many parents in this situation ultimately choose to do.

I'm very sorry about your daughter. It sounds heartbreaking, what you described about her changing so much.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

(((hugs))) Deb. When I do family therapy sessions with (young adult) patients and their parents they often ask me what they should do. I always tell them that I don't have to live in their shoes and they have to decide what they are willing and not willing to do. It is heartbreaking to see the fear and sadness in their eyes. Most times parents cry as I am guessing our sessions are the first time someone asked how *they* were doing. I know parents that have been willing to let their child go homeless, some have not. I do not judge. Being a parent certainly does not end at 18. I agree that YOU need to be safe however. I hope you are.

 

[Jambalaya]

(((hugs))) Deb. When I do family therapy sessions with (young adult) patients and their parents they often ask me what they should do. I always tell them that I don't have to live in their shoes and they have to decide what they are willing and not willing to do. It is heartbreaking to see the fear and sadness in their eyes. Most times parents cry as I am guessing our sessions are the first time someone asked how *they* were doing. I know parents that have been willing to let their child go homeless, some have not. I do not judge. Being a parent certainly does not end at 18. I agree that YOU need to be safe however. I hope you are.

But the legal obligation ends at 18. That's what I said, not that parenting stops at 18. Although now we're on the topic of when parenting stops, for some, parenting does stop at 18. I know parents who stepped right back at 18 and even charged their kids a nightly rate to visit their former childhood home - extreme case and that was one parent. So for some parents, 18 is indeed a magic number! I think the adult children discussed in this thread are fortunate beyond words to have such understanding parents.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

There have been moments over the years the thought of detaching came to my mind, but honestly, as a mother, I don't think I could ever just give up on trying to help my child. I definitely think when there is danger, precautions must be taken. If there is addiction, it must be addressed. I don't have the answers to all of it by any means.

Queenie, is there any chance you could just take this a little slower? Like tell him he doesn't have to move yet, but you'd like to all just go visit the place? Maybe he needs time to adjust to the idea? I just am saying this because that is how my son is and if we escalate things emotionally (such as yelling or anger), he absolutely cannot handle it. Of course, I am only suggesting it if he is relatively calm otherwise. Does he respond at all to loving expressions of caring or concern?

 

[Queenie60]

diamondseeker2006 - your advise is very well taken and I thank you. Yes, my husband and I talked about this extensively last night and came to the conclusion that this is the best way to handle this. He does have autism spectrum disorder as part of his diagnosis and we feel that gradually approaching the situation may be the best way. Only time will tell. Thank you for your suggestion - well taken.

 

[AGBF]

Being a parent certainly does not end at 18. I agree that YOU need to be safe however. I hope you are.

Thank you, Tacori.

This is not me versus them. Someone who allows the child to stay versus someone who puts the child out. I refuse to be unsafe again. I have always called the police if I needed help...ever since I realized that was what worked! Even though I spent a huge amount of time in the court system for a while when my daughter was younger (before her brain matured and her impulses were less strong) and that was tedious. As I have discussed with friends off Pricescope who have children in similar situations to mine, it is a real pain to call the police because once you have had your kid arrested and there is one case against him, the next arrest means you will be in court ten times more often. But I did it. Mine hasn't been arrested in years, though.

Every time I see a horror story by another mother, I feel for her. I have walked in her shoes. I send her my utmost love and compassion. I totally understand why she has to do what she is doing in order to survive and i know she is being ripped apart by it.

But that was my point. I know she is being ripped apart by it. She doesn't feel OK about putting her child out. If she did, she wouldn't be posting here. This is traumatic stuff. It doesn't matter what the law says. Parenthood is about more than laws.

I have watched the movie, "Parenthood" with Steve Martin more times than I can count. I find it incredibly moving. The theme is really that a parent is a parent forever, no matter what kind of mess the child gets into, no matter how old he gets. And that parenthood continues. And boy, does that movie ever explore the extremes of behavior!!!

I often think I will have to evict my daughter. And I may have to do so. My comment was not based on whether I could live with her or not. Some situations are intolerable. Something about the remark that the obligation ended at 18 hurt my heart as a mother. I am sorry if I appear to be criticizing you, Jambalaya, and nitpicking. I find you so kind and thoughtful. I didn't mean to pick on you. I just needed to say this about my daughter because I saw her before she became ill. She wasn't some "thing" to be thrown out when the law allowed me to do so. And I feel myself being offensive to you again. That isn't my intent. You are a wonderful woman. I just can't seem to wrap my mind around what I need to say.

If I have been offensive, please forgive me, Jambie. I think of you as a lovely, caring woman.

Deb