Would you say something???

[PurplePassion]

Wow!! Given the new events, aljdewey is on point with the advice!!!

 

[decodelighted]

I only hope if she DOES find out, he doesn''t somehow smarm his way out of the gravity of his deception.

a) playing dumb. "I got taken!"
b) playing sad sack "I wanted to get you something great but couldn''t afford it"
c) involving her in the ruse "No one will know. I''ll replace it someday!"
d) turning it on her "If you weren''t so SELFISH I wouldn''t have had to lie"
e) making it no big deal "Don''t worry baby, I''ll get you a good ring this time."

AIIGH. I hate manipulators & hate to see people taken in by them (low self esteem, embarrasment, naivite). When caught in a lie these guys cry, whine, plead, turn in on the other person, or lash out.

What a terrible situation! Good for you Squeaks for keeping an eye on it, even though you never meant to be in the middle!

 

[researcher]

Date: 1/11/2006 10:25:54 AM
Author: squeaksluv
Thank you everyone for some excelllent advice, it sounds like it''s 50/50 on whether or not to say anything, exactly how I''m feeling right now.


Last night I was talking to her on the phone and told her the jeweler had a setting he thought she might be interested in. She laughed and said considering how much her fiance'' already spent it might be too much to ask for a new setting. It doesn''t look fake but then I don''t know if I would really be able to tell. Any advice on to what I should look for?


I did ask her when she was going to have it insured and appraised and guess what? Supposedly Mr. Loser already had it done. AND, what''s even more interesting is that the papers are locked up in his safety deposit box at the bank. I found that quite revealing in itself.


After discussing all your advice and my feelings with my bf I decided that my bf is going to have to go out with Mr. Loser to have some beers and watch some sports (this guy is a total sports addict). My bf is then going to pretend he needs advice on a ring for me (I''d like to think he already has a ring but wishful thinking I know!) and ask him questions about his jeweler and such. Poor bf, he wasn''t too excited about this plan but I figure if Mr. Loser gives him information on his jeweler readily he probably thinks the rock is real?


Although it would be nice to think my friend is more ''diamond savvy'' than thinking her fiance can afford a 4.5 carat clean ''F'' diamond but I really don''t think she has any clue. He does make good money but I seriously doubt that much. She really is a sweetheart and always goes out of her way for friends and family. Sometimes I thnk she''s a little too naive though.


I really don''t know if she realizes many people can''t stand her fiance''. I''ve never said anything but I don''t exactly go out of my way to be nice to him. He just can be so rude and obnoxious but at the same time he always buys her little gifts like flowers and sweets and such. It''s weird, sometimes he''s a contradiction in terms.


I''ll keep you updated. More than anything I wish that jeweler had never send anything.

First, I have to say that my hubby got my ring appraised without me to save me the hassle, and he put the papers away in our safety deposit box right away as well. So, that alone is not incriminating evidence (oh, and my ring is 3+ cts). What is weird, however, is there was no mention of WHERE he purchased the ring. Wouldn''t she have that information if nothing else?

Second, you are friends, right? Be honest with her. I would NEVER resort to "playing games" to see if the ring is real. I would tell her that your jeweler mentioned that her ring was a CZ, and just ask her if it is. She may know it is, but feel silly because she''s said she would choose a diamond chip over a CZ in the past. Give her a chance to confess if that''s the case.

Third, I was recently in a Tiffany''s store where one of the salespeople asked me if the reason I was looking at diamonds was because I wanted to replace my CZ with a real stone. When I told him mine was real, he said "but princess cut stones don''t have that much brilliance". He was shocked to discover upon closer examination that my stone was, indeed, real. Is it possible that the person who cleaned her stone just saw how white and clean it was and assumed it was a good fake (e.g., Asha)? I know this is highly unlikely, but let''s give your friend''s SO the benefit of the doubt.

Finally, keep in mind that it''s how you approach your friend that will determine in large part her reaction. If you tell her that your jeweler said he thought her ring was fake, your friend may:

1. Act offended and deny it.
2. Confess that she knows it''s a fake.
3. Freak out, cry, and scream at you.
4. Laugh, say the jeweler is an idiot, and leave it at that.

But most likely she will:

5. Deny it/question the jeweler, but then think about it and have it checked out.

If she''s a good friend she will thank you if she finds out her man was deceitful or will fess up to knowing her stone is a fake. In the best scenario it will turn out the jeweler was wrong, and that it''s just an impressive stone!

 

[researcher]

Oops! Guess I should have read more BEFORE posting! I think you made the right decision--let us know what the outcome is!

 

[princessv]

Uhh researcher did you want to slap the Tiffany''s associate? I would have..how rude. But on the other hand it is a compliment in a way...sheesh Tiffany''s should have given you something for free.

We can wish can''t we?

 

[squeaksluv]

A watched phone never rings! Well, no news is good news right? Didn''t hear from her last night so I''m not really sure what to assume. She usually emails me in the morning since on Thursday nights a group of us get together for a sort of happy hour of sorts after work and we need to figure out where to meet up. I''m scared for her because she is so nice and it will be awful to have her be hurt so much.

I have to be honest and say that if it is fake, and she finds out, that she moves on. Most of her friends have been almost waiting for something to happen between them that would break them up....does that make sense? We have never said anything because we don''t want her to be upset thinking we all can''t stand him, but we just can''t see her marrying this guy. Although he does seem to love her and buys her little gifts all of the time it just doesn''t seem like the real him you know? It''s almost as if we''re waiting for the awful him to reveal itself. He just seems shady. One time I walked into a bar with some friends and there he was with this really big chested blonde dressed kinda slutty. They weren''t doing anything but talking but the way they were talking made me suspicious. I walked over and he was really cool to me introducing the girl as his assistant Tina. I was like okayyyy. Jenna knows his assistant but doesn''t seem to think anything about it. Makes me wonder though. He even invited me to sit down and join them for a drink but I felt like they were hiding something.
I''ll certainly keep you guys posted.

Researcher, sometimes I wonder how much those Tiffany''s sales people really know. I had a friend who actually has an Asha for an engagement ring, I think it''s 2.5 cts, and the Tiffany person kept saying how beautiful her diamond was and it must of come from Tiffany''s!

 

[indecisive]

Ugh, it is so horrible when really sweet girls end up with jerks! I hope everything turns out for the best. My friends is in a similar situation but the guy doesn''t treat her great or does anything to show us he is in love with her

. I know what you must want to do to that guy

!!

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 1/12/2006 8:58:44 AM
Author: squeaksluv

Most of her friends have been almost waiting for something to happen between them that would break them up....does that make sense? We have never said anything because we don''t want her to be upset thinking we all can''t stand him, but we just can''t see her marrying this guy.

I find this part really interesting.

I think you made the right choice in not saying anything about the ring. Having said that, I have to wonder why you felt compelled to speak up when you were trying to protect her from a liar, but not to protect her from marrying someone that you all think isn''t a good fit? I''m not sure I understand why you see them differently. (Don''t take this question to be critical; I''m really curious to understand it.)

In my world pre-Rich, I had 3-4 VERY intimate close friends.....we''re akin to the Ya-Ya sisters. Have all the dirt on each other; know each others'' strengths and quirks; blah blah. If they had all thought "can''t see her marrying this guy", I''d be surprised if they didn''t at least have a heart-to-heart about their reservations.....knowing that it was ultimately my decision, of course, but wanting to tell me what THEY see from the outside. Knowing how well they really do know me, it would certainly make me at least consider their concerns.

 

[squeaksluv]

Date: 1/12/2006 2:49:53 PM
Author: aljdewey

Date: 1/12/2006 8:58:44 AM
Author: squeaksluv

Most of her friends have been almost waiting for something to happen between them that would break them up....does that make sense? We have never said anything because we don''t want her to be upset thinking we all can''t stand him, but we just can''t see her marrying this guy.

I find this part really interesting.

I think you made the right choice in not saying anything about the ring. Having said that, I have to wonder why you felt compelled to speak up when you were trying to protect her from a liar, but not to protect her from marrying someone that you all think isn''t a good fit? I''m not sure I understand why you see them differently. (Don''t take this question to be critical; I''m really curious to understand it.)

In my world pre-Rich, I had 3-4 VERY intimate close friends.....we''re akin to the Ya-Ya sisters. Have all the dirt on each other; know each others'' strengths and quirks; blah blah. If they had all thought ''can''t see her marrying this guy'', I''d be surprised if they didn''t at least have a heart-to-heart about their reservations.....knowing that it was ultimately my decision, of course, but wanting to tell me what THEY see from the outside. Knowing how well they really do know me, it would certainly make me at least consider their concerns.

No offense taken at all!

I guess it''s because none of us know how to tell her that we think she''s marrying the wrong guy. We''ve tried to bring it up but how do you start saying something? I can''t start out saying, well about John, we think he''s an a** and you shouldn''t marry him, that wouldn''t go over very well! I''ve spoken to her about ''relationships'' in general but when it comes to the way John treats her we can''t deny that he treats her very nicely. He is always taking her out for dinner, buying her flowers, little gifts, everything. BUT there is just something about him that we just don''t trust or like....but how do you tell someone that?

Like you, I have other 4 friends that I would tell anything, say anything and know that they would listen and understand, even if I was telling them that I had reservations about their bf''s or husbands, we''re that close. But with Jenna, I don''t feel that close to that I could say something like that. I wish I could say something but I just don''t know what to say.

Oh and I haven''t heard from her all day and nothing even about happy hour....makes me wonder that something happened...

 

[Mara]

I was actually thinking maybe the jeweler did say something to her about the ring being fake and her BF said no way etc or said the jeweler was on crack and she hasn't given it another thought? Not necessarily good news. Or if she did freak out and have it out and maybe Mr. L admitted it, you really think she'd rush to call you and admit she'd been a patsy? Maybe that's why she has not surfaced to email you as she typically would.

I'd be really embarassed if I found out something like that and didn't know it because I'm pretty private about feelings and I would feel stupid that I didn't know (even if I shouldn't have known...I mean why should she doubt her beloved bf?)...think about all the ravings I'd done about the stone and ring to everyone, did they know too, etc. Just alot of emotion and doubt, I could see happening. So maybe the jeweler did say something but she is figuring out her feelings or still having it out with her bf or unsure on how to proceed ETC ETC.

Tough to say!! I think you did the right thing personally by kind of passing her off to the jeweler, the messenger ALWAYS gets it and even if you are the best of friends, no one wants to deliver that kind of possible bad news. Interested to hear what happens next.

 

[CourtHorn]

Any update yet? I was just thinking how embarrassed I would be if I were her. What if she stays with the guy, but she demands that he buys her a real ring? How do you go from a 4.5 carat to something more reasonable (1-2), without it being super obvious? I am sure she doesn''t want to tell people, "Well, my a$$hole bf gave me a fake one before, but when i found out I got this one."

I too have a friend who is dating the wrong guy, he is such a douchbag and I was scared for her, so I told her my feelings. We didn''t talk for 6 months, and 2 years later they are still together.... I hope it works out for your friend.

 

[squeaksluv]

Finally, an ending to the story....

Last night Jenna called and apologized for not letting me know about happy hour. She told me that her and John had a fight and had decided to postpone the wedding for now. She said that things that happened yesterday made her feel that she couldn''t trust him and for her trust was the most important thing. We ended up meeting for a drink at a local bar because she didn''t want to go into details on the phone. She said they had a huge fight when she asked him to go to the jewelers with her and he ended up by telling her that the stone was not real but was a very high quality cz. He told her he felt pressured to propose before the end of the year but couldn''t afford yet the diamond he wanted to purchase so he looked into these special cz''s after a friend told him about them. He was originally planning on getting her a 3 carat cushion which was the size of the diamond he had been researching but when he saw how reasonably priced the cz''s were and all the different sizes available he got carried away. He was going to tell her that night but when he saw the look on her face when she opened the box that he thought he could just wait and maybe switch it out later before she knew it (although how he thought he could afford the sized diamond he would replace it with is beyond me).
According to her they decided that maybe it was best to postpone the wedding until they could figure some things out. She says that the ring had nothing to do with it but the fact that he couldn''t tell her the truth prompted her decision. She said that this was merely one more thing to question and when she brought up other instances I figured that she had been thinking about this for quite sometime.

So the saga ends and even though this might just be for the best, it''s still so sad to see a friend get hurt. It did get me mad when she said that he tried to turn it around and blame it on her, saying she put pressure on him to propose and felt that he had little choice. According to her she did neither as she was having doubts about things long before he proposed but she felt she could give it a chance.

She just called and said she''s planning a trip to South Beach Miami with a group of friends and did I want to go...she has to ask?????!!!!

 

[appletini]

I''m very glad to read that everything is out in the open and that you could be there for her to talk with. If she''s been having doubts about him, then he is definitely not the one, and she should have never said yes. The girls trip sounds very fun, and I think it will be a good opportunity for her to move forward and to know that she can always count on her close friends to be there for her. I''m also very glad that your friendship was not damaged in the process because right now what she needs more than anything is a friend like you.

 

[widget]

Interesting...he does sound like a snake...

Curious...did you mention to her that you''d had some concerns about the authenticity of that "diamond" but had been struggling about whether or not to mention it? If so...what did she say?

Actually the question "Would you say something?" might be an interesting topic of conversation among the girls when you''re in Miami!

widget

 

[moon river]

I''m glad she''s rethinking marrying this guy. Enjoy the beach!!!

 

[squeaksluv]

Date: 1/13/2006 11:45:02 AM
Author: widget
Interesting...he does sound like a snake...

Curious...did you mention to her that you''d had some concerns about the authenticity of that ''diamond'' but had been struggling about whether or not to mention it? If so...what did she say?

Actually the question ''Would you say something?'' might be an interesting topic of conversation among the girls when you''re in Miami!

widget

I never said anything because I feel so responsible and guilty over this. When she was telling me this last night it was hard to not blurt out that I knew everything. Even though he was the jerk that lied to her about a lot of things, I would of rather her found out on her own..without me ''suggesting'' she go visit the jeweler. Although I''m sure it would of come out eventually.

 

[JDgirl]

I''m so glad she found out one way or another. If he really thought he could replace a stone that large, he''s got to be kidding himself. He sounds like a jerk. I''m glad she''s reevaluating things.

 

[fire&ice]

Date: 1/13/2006 11:19:31 AM
Author: squeaksluv
Finally, an ending to the story....

. He was going to tell her that night but when he saw the look on her face when she opened the box that he thought he could just wait and maybe switch it out later before she knew it (although how he thought he could afford the sized diamond he would replace it with is beyond me).

This is plausible - but then to go on and on with the specs of the stone, etc. -that''s pschyo. So easy the lie rolls of his tongue.

I hope she leaves him permanently.

 

[Mara]

Oh I''m so glad to hear the ending was not as bad as it could have been, loser BF came clean and they had it out in private rather than an ''oh my god'' moment in front of the jeweler or anyone else etc. I also would not say that you knew, why add to her negative feelings right now? I also would not tell any of your friends about this, if there is one thing I know about groups of friends is that you tell one person something and eventually EVERYONE knows, there are not alot of secrets in larger groups of friends. Some thing are best just never discussed with a 3rd party. Us not included of course!!

I''m also glad she is revisiting her doubts and thoughts about the future. Sounds like she''s not quite blind to all his tricks, but love can make you wear those shades! As for his story, PLEASE...he was going to get her a 3c cushion (still quite expensive!) but then got carried away with a FAKE 4.5? Please! I guess I could buy that if he was going to get her a 1.5c cushion and could get a 4.5 fake for the same price but to go from ''hmm let''s get a 3c REAL one'' to a ''lets get a 4.5 fake one'' doesn''t make sense to me. If he had the $40-50k for the 3c one then why spend $10k or whatever on a fake one if other than you think she won''t find out or notice. Jeez. Trust issues, definitely!

 

[aphisiglovessae]

I''m so glad she''s rethinking her relationship with him. If he''s going to lie about something like that, who knows what else he may lie about! Trust is one of the most important aspects of a relationship and he''s already violated it. I hope she thinks long and hard about that and comes to the right decision.

I think it''s very mean of him to put blame on her for "pressuring" him and all that crap. Yes, some girls are really anxious for it and some may irritate the stew out of their boyfriends about it, but he shouldn''t have said that to her! It was his decision to give in to that pressure (if in fact she did bug him about it) and it was his decision to betray her trust, not hers. Besides, if you''re going to get a fake that you hope to switch out later, get a believable one!

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 1/11/2006 8:27:39 PM
Author: decodelighted
I only hope if she DOES find out, he doesn''t somehow smarm his way out of the gravity of his deception.

a) playing dumb. ''I got taken!''
b) playing sad sack ''I wanted to get you something great but couldn''t afford it''
c) involving her in the ruse ''No one will know. I''ll replace it someday!''
d) turning it on her ''If you weren''t so SELFISH I wouldn''t have had to lie''
e) making it no big deal ''Don''t worry baby, I''ll get you a good ring this time.''

As I feared ... looks like he picked B & D from the Liars Handbook. Glad she found out now, before the wedding though!! Interesting that she already "had a clue" about him and this was just the proverbial straw/camel''s back.

Have fun in Miami!!!

 

[Erin]

looks like he picked B & D from the Liars Handbook

The Liars Handbook - That''s Awesome!!!

His excuse isn''t worth the air he used up to utter it. If he planned on playing sneaky-sneak, and he really did want to buy a real 3ct cushion, then the fake should have been a 3ct cushion. AND he was going to tell her that night but he didn''t realize she would be excited and in awe over a proposal......with a 4.5?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Idiot.

 

[Caribou]

UGH!

I''m very happy to hear that she didn''t get sucked into his excuses. It probably helps that she was having doubts as it was.

What I don''t get is, if he couldn''t afford a 3ct cushion, why didn''t he just downgrade the size? From the way you discribe your, she doesn''t seem like a person who would really about the size....she''d love a 1ct or a 3ct. Because of that I really believe he was making up excuses after getting caught with the fake.

Well good luck to your friend. And have fun in Miami!!!!!!

 

[Mimikins24]

Well, I am glad to hear that your friend is wise to her BF's ugly ways --- and that you didn't have to get tangled up in it for her to find out.

I don't really believe his story that he intended to tell her, but got all caught up in her excitment and didn't want to disappoint her. It seems like he already had the lie fully cooked (like he told her the colour and clarity of the "diamond", that the papers were already tucked away, that he already had it appraised, etc.). In addition, if he intended to get her a real diamond to replace the CZ, he should have just told her that and got a CZ of the cut and size of diamond that he was going to get for her. This would have allowed them to tell people about it or to just wear it and replace it in private. The fact that he got "carried away" when he saw the price of synthetics seems sketchy. If he was really planning to buy the real diamond anyway, I would think he would want to be saving his pennies for it and not spending more on this CZ. Besides wouldn't it look strange to replace your 4.5 carat, D, IF diamond with a 3 carat diamond of (likely) lower colour and clarity?

Overall, I think he was caught in a lie, so he decided to lie some more and deflect the blame to your friend in order to try and get out of it. Basically, not very admirable qualities in a life partner!!!

I can only hope that through some soul searching and some support from wonderful friends (like you) she can come to terms with his deceitfulness and make the best decision for herself and her future.

Good luck on the trip and have a wonderful time!!!

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 1/13/2006 3:04:54 PM
Author: Caribou
What I don''t get is, if he couldn''t afford a 3ct cushion, why didn''t he just downgrade the size?

Hee hee ... see that''s what logical, HONEST folks would do! She already mentioned that this guy was a huge bragger. Most liars only do so to make themselves feel better comparatively to other people. He wanted to "show off" with the ring without paying the piper! (Regardless of whether his gal was materialisic, or would prefer a "real" chip, or THAT IT WAS ALL TOTAL BULLSH*T)

I have a stinkin'' feeling this guy couldn''t afford anywhere CLOSE to a 3ct stone, but was trying to "save face" to smooth over the SIZE of his lie, and puff up his image with her ("I really can afford a HUGE, HUGE stone, really I CAN!!") This loser can''t "come clean" at a turbo-charged car wash. Good riddance!

 

[princessv]

This guy has some serious insecurity issues. I am so glad he got busted. Your poor friend. My fiance has been asking me about this story too and he usually has his eyes glazed over when I talk about my PS ''obsession''. He feels really bad for your friend.

BTW Deco ROFL at the "Liars Handbook"!

 

[Shawna13]

Hey girl... even though this is really crappy for your friend (and you too... you don''t want to see her hurting) I''m glad the truth came out.

It''s like when a husband cheats on his wife (or vice versa). The wife usually says that it''s not the cheating that is the hardest part to deal with, but the deception of the whole situation. e.g. the lies are what hurts the most.

Honesty is so important in a relationship... whether it''s a relationship with a friend, bf/fiance/husband, or family member. If your friend hadn''t found out on her own or by someone talking to her fiance, then it would have definitely been your duty as a friend to be honest with her. I mean... if this hadn''t come out into the open and she found out later on that you knew something was wrong and didn''t tell her... well.. it seems to be better to hurt someone''s feelings by being honest than to lie or keep the truth from someone.

You are a good friend to this girl and I''m sure you''ll be there for her to get through the situation.

 

[marvel]

Date: 1/13/2006 1:09:04 PM
Author: Mara
I''m also glad she is revisiting her doubts and thoughts about the future. Sounds like she''s not quite blind to all his tricks, but love can make you wear those shades! As for his story, PLEASE...he was going to get her a 3c cushion (still quite expensive!) but then got carried away with a FAKE 4.5? Please! I guess I could buy that if he was going to get her a 1.5c cushion and could get a 4.5 fake for the same price but to go from ''hmm let''s get a 3c REAL one'' to a ''lets get a 4.5 fake one'' doesn''t make sense to me. If he had the $40-50k for the 3c one then why spend $10k or whatever on a fake one if other than you think she won''t find out or notice. Jeez. Trust issues, definitely!

It costs that much for a CZ

My gawd...what a loser! This dude should have just got the real deal! I hope she dumps his a$$

 

[icekid]

well, I''m glad she found out from the jerk himself! What a crazy crazy psycho... I truly hope she rethinks this marriage REALLY hard and gets rid of his sorry ass, NOW!

 

[Mara]

Marvel I am just assuming (not thinking it''s EXACTLY 10k but maybe around there?) because it sounds like it''s some sort of special branded CZ from what he said ''aka checking into that particular style of CZ or cut or whatever''...but who knows maybe he made that up too!!!