Advice regarding what to do with a natural Alexandrite

[LD]

I am sorry if my use of the word " sparkle " is misleading, it sounded right when I typed it OK lets try again When sunlight hits the stone it bounces green flashes back as you tilt it, indoors this changes to a violet colour flash. Does that sound better to you ( still struggling for the right words ) Obviously not the same as a diamond, but to me as a layman it was very unusual. The safeguard " safemark " was applied without my request or permission which is also part of my disappointment with that side of the company. They damaged my property and refused to accept this fact. Your probably wondering if I have any more bizarre episodes to add to this story, well lets wait till the stone comes back before I answer that 1

This is a good thing; it totally eliminates it as a diamond and possibly eliminates it as a colour change sapphire too (those tend to be blue to purple). I am curious as to the findings and hope you'll continue to update us.

Sorry to correct you Chrono but it doesn't eliminate colour change sapphire as you can get green to red ones (although they are very rare). You're correct though that it eliminates a diamond (but then I'm not sure any of us thought that was a possibility). I do wonder if it could be a garnet - the RI would potentially fit as well. I'm SO impatient, I just want to find out what it is

 

[chrono]

LD,
That's why I used the word "possibly". The chances that it is a cc sapphire is very slim because those (green to violet) are actually quite rare.

 

[LD]

LD,
That's why I used the word "possibly". The chances that it is a cc sapphire is very slim because those (green to violet) are actually quite rare.

lol sorry Chrono - missed that! Been flitting in and out today so only did some speed reading!

 

[needfullshinythings]

Hi LD & Chrono, as soon as I get the results I will post them for you all to see. Fingers crossed time I suppose. I have been trying to piece together the info that I have into 1 package, maybe this will help ( or hinder ) The Safeguard appraisal states " moderate colour change " Both appraisals indicate " natural " The " loose stone " appraisal gives it a RI of 1.76. As you said LD the experts there are very experienced and you would trust this opinion. As both appraisals indicate a Natural stone, am I safe in assuming that is so ? The RI reading I will leave to you My assumption would be ( as a layman ) that I have a colour change/shift natural stone that could be either Alex/Sapphire. How does that sound to you ?

 

[Marlow]

@Chrono


by Chrono » 17 Jun 2014 08:10
LD,
That's why I used the word "possibly". The chances that it is a cc sapphire is very slim because those (green to violet) are actually quite rare.

-----------

Hello Chrono,

CC Sapphire with a change from "green" to "red" are not really rare - Uli Zeisberg bought some rough Sapphire from East africa.
A lot of them have this color change. But honestly not very attractive colors - esp. the daylight color (army olive green). They are really cheap. And untreated!!! Nobody would produce such ugly colors. This material is used for beryllium treatment.

 

[LD]

Hi LD & Chrono, as soon as I get the results I will post them for you all to see. Fingers crossed time I suppose. I have been trying to piece together the info that I have into 1 package, maybe this will help ( or hinder ) The Safeguard appraisal states " moderate colour change " Both appraisals indicate " natural " The " loose stone " appraisal gives it a RI of 1.76. As you said LD the experts there are very experienced and you would trust this opinion. As both appraisals indicate a Natural stone, am I safe in assuming that is so ? The RI reading I will leave to you My assumption would be ( as a layman ) that I have a colour change/shift natural stone that could be either Alex/Sapphire. How does that sound to you ?

Honestly? Without lab testing the appraisals so far COULD be wrong. For example, it seems inconceivable that somebody would give the RI reading of 1.76 for an alex. Alex is doubly refractive and therefore it is much more normal to state the range. The RI is more indicative of a garnet (and the photos and your description fit that as well) and if somebody thought it was a diamond this may be because of the single refractivity. However that's an enormous guess and about 5 leaps too far!

BTW Safeguard use "moderate colour change" for what I would consider to be a weak colour change (that's not being disrespectful to them because they put it on one of mine also which had a very weak change). Colour change is actually quite difficult to define because most of the assessing is done during daylight hours!

Is it a natural stone? Due to all the conflicting evidence I would say possibly but not definitely. Don't forget I had a synthetic Alex that had the correct RI for a natural Alex. Anything, I'm afraid, is possible.

All you know for definite at the moment is that the ring is Platinum!

 

[needfullshinythings]

I think you misread my post LD. The stone was appraised loose when it was given its RI reading of 1.76, its in the pictures of the appraisals for you and he didn't call it an Alex as you can see ( this appraisal started this whole process ) My point with the Safeguard appraisal saying " moderate colour change " was not to do with defining levels of change, just confirmation that there must be some change/shift for him to state it. I Honestly think a few wires have got crossed here

 

[LD]

I think you misread my post LD. The stone was appraised loose when it was given its RI reading of 1.76, its in the pictures of the appraisals for you and he didn't call it an Alex as you can see ( this appraisal started this whole process ) My point with the Safeguard appraisal saying " moderate colour change " was not to do with defining levels of change, just confirmation that there must be some change/shift for him to state it. I Honestly think a few wires have got crossed here

You asked whether you could assume the stone was "natural" and whether it was safe to assume it was an Alex or a Sapphire? That's what I was answering (albeit in a roundabout wordy way). The answer is not necessarily to both questions! It's been a long day for me

 

[chrono]

Hello Chrono,
CC Sapphire with a change from "green" to "red" are not really rare - Uli Zeisberg bought some rough Sapphire from East africa.
A lot of them have this color change. But honestly not very attractive colors - esp. the daylight color (army olive green). They are really cheap. And untreated!!! Nobody would produce such ugly colors. This material is used for beryllium treatment.

I guess I should rephrase my sentence to "good looking cc red/green sapphires are rare".

 

[needfullshinythings]

Hi all, thought I'd post some pics of a cats eye my dearest mother brought home from her travels some years ago ( along with several star sapphires ) It was 1 of a pair but she lost the other, and this 1 has a fracture at 1 end so probably no value but a nice thing to look at. It is only a teeny 0.70ct, but I do like the colours. Just trying to keep my mind off the other stone whilst its away

 

[Marlow]

@ Chrono

I have never seen a beautiful cc sapphire (green-red) - so they are ABSOLUTELY rare!!!!

 

[needfullshinythings]

Woooooo, I finally have the stone back. With some interesting results to boot. The reason it has taken so long is my jeweller had a bereavement in the family and shut up shop for a fortnight and when he returned to process the delayed stock he mistakenly sent it off to the wrong side of the company it goes to. Valuation side instead of the laboratory, this has thrown up an interesting question regarding the company used as I now have 2 appraisals from the same company with totally different results. Looks like I have a sapphire after all, or do I ? The jeweller hasn't charged me because of his error & has offered to submit it to the lab side free of charge, fair offer all things considered. What do you think of this assessment ?

 

[Marlow]

So finally a sapphire!!!

Thank you for this info...

But - is there a color change or not???

 

[needfullshinythings]

Hi Marlow, good question. The first assessment said it has a moderate colour change, the 2nd fails to mention this !!! The first assessment was done when the stone was still in its setting & this new 1 is for a loose stone. Does the RI reading and double refraction details make sense to you ? The colour of the stone also isn't what I would associate with a sapphire, but this could just be a lack of knowledge ( probably )

 

[Marlow]

Yes - Sapphire - the result are def. sapphire.

There are sapphire with a change similar to alexandrite but not with "nice" colors IMO - If you have a good alex, a CCG ( color change garnet) and a good cc-sapphire you will see the difference!!!

You have a dark greenish-blue sapphire. Look at the color in a dark room with some candles or a torch.
If you see red flashes - this is NOT a color change - they are part of the dispersion ( the dark body color "eliminate" blue, green yellow and orange - often seen in cobalt spinel, alexandrite, cr-turmaline and CCG).

A color change means that the body color changes.

 

[needfullshinythings]

Thx for your posts Marlow, i clearly don't have a colour change stone as stated in the 1st assessment, however there is a slight colour shift in different light conditions but this probably wouldn't be more than a couple of segments on the wheel of colour change. Looks like i have a Sapphire with a very slight colour shift, little value & basically an education stone !!! Oh well life goes on, the best thing to come out of this is the unbelievable inconsistency's of the SAFEGUARD appraisals i have in front of me !!!!! I questioned the 1st assessment based on the lack of info & the fact they would place a value on an item with so little factual information , this didn't go well because these muppets don't like having their word questioned, looks like i need to get in touch with the new RATNERS of the UK Thx again for your input.

 

[chrono]

It is normal for almost all coloured stones to shift a little (and some, a lot) under different lighting conditions. My take on Safeguard isn't that they aren't knowledgeable, but there IS a difference when evaluating a loose stone versus a set stone. A loose stone allows more types of testing with more accurate results. I think the initial evaluation was with a set stone, correct?

 

[Marlow]

I agree with Chrono - color shift is seen in many stones.

The value - it is not a bad stone - good shape and size - the dark color is unique - maybe a good ring for a men??

Again my advice if you still want to buy more - there are useful tools and filter sets - learn to use them!! It's easier as you think now.

And avoid this lab - set stone or not - an experienced GG needs a few minutes to know what it is.

( For the single result for RI in one "certificate" - maybe they use a gemeter - you get only one result. Measurement of RI.

It is useful for gems above 1,89 course this is the limit for a refractometer But I would prefer the refractometer course you get two lines and more information.

 

[pregcurious]

Hi all, thought I'd post some pics of a cats eye my dearest mother brought home from her travels some years ago ( along with several star sapphires ) It was 1 of a pair but she lost the other, and this 1 has a fracture at 1 end so probably no value but a nice thing to look at. It is only a teeny 0.70ct, but I do like the colours. Just trying to keep my mind off the other stone whilst its away

If the fracture is only on one side, can you get it recut? The looks pretty.

 

[needfullshinythings]

Hi Chrono, Marlow, Preg, Yes Chrono the 1st appraisal was when set which is why I contacted them to ask how they came to that conclusion & how the value was determined, all I got back was a lot of abuse regarding their expertise & experience vs my lack of knowledge of the industry regulations !!! The final e-mail came from a Company Director which I still have and will dig out for you later stating that the item is as described etc etc based on their professional opinion. I didn't get a response to my next e-mail that mentioned she wasn't qualified to undertake customer service work as this was clearly beyond her skill set ( yes I was pi**ed off ) Thx again for your input Marlow, I certainly am learning all the time. Maybe one day I will do something with it, don't know what but until then it will go in the gem box. I need to forget about it for a while Hello Pregcurious, thx for not mentioning the sapphire The stone seems too small for a recut but I suppose anything is possible nowadays, it runs at a 45 degree angle and enters the eye which might not allow a recut. I will take a couple more pictures to see if I can capture it for you. Many thx Preg for taking me off on this tangent & to Marlow,Chrono for all your input, greatly appreciated.