Anyone watching H&M (lol)

[Daisys and Diamonds]

I think the problem was that Harry didn’t have a day job to provide income, and they wanted all the perks of being members of the RF, like the security etc., but didn’t want to live in the country that would be paying for it. Not much of a deal for the UK is it?

two things i think about

#1 i kept thinking he should have stayed in the army
he seemed really happy in the army
but he left the army to help out the family so Prince Philip could retire, which seemed the right thing to do at the time because Prince Philip had well and truly earned his retirement

#2 and when M said she couldnt beleave she wasnt getting paid for this (The walk about in Sydney)
she didnt realize that well actually, she was getting paid for that as a working royal
that was part of the job of representing the Queen
but i also dont think she grasped the idea that the actual job was representing the Queen, and the honour that that was, as the Queen is our head of state

IMOH monarchy is so much more than celebrity but M craved what she saw as the celebrity elements / Disney princess moments

Look at Sophie Wessex
despite a long courtship with Prince Edward she still did not have an easy start, but she worked hard and overcame past mistake, the royal family had seemed to have learnt from the failings on both sides of Diana and Fergie and really supported Sophie - the Queen grew so close to Sophie
yet M wasn't interested in Sophie's help or no doubt friendship

the thing i most love about Sophie is right from the beginning she made sure her two children spent regular quality time with their grandparents, i view this as especially poingnant as they are the youngest of the grandchildren by quite a few years

and quite honestly so what if Catherine didnt give her a hug
i dont hug
hugging is not a thing where im from either
and short of some sort of national catastrophy of cataclismic proportions, involving acual life and death im not into hugging someone i only just meet

and while im at it
my mother (and my father) would have given me a good clip around the ears for wearing ripped jeans (regardless of the fashion) when the future (king and) queen was coming to dinner -at my house or not and especially as this was the first time they had met

 

[Beagles]

Haven't watched and don't plan to. I have lost interest in the British royals after Queen Elizabeth II passed away.

 

[GliderPoss]

Ahhh the Ginger & the Whinger....

I'm curious but refuse to watch on principle. Newspapers report on it blow by blow anyway so just read that.

 

[Tartansparkles]

I've watched and enjoyed the first three episodes. I didn't experience any if it as whining. The behaviour of the British tabloid press leaves at lot to be desired.

 

[Rhea]

I have no real opinion about H&M. I’m only surprised that they couldn’t work and still be in. The spares of the DRF have day jobs and do the occasional events. Why is that not an option for the spares of the BRF?

I've often wondered that as well. It seems like an ideal solution.

By all accounts it's down to safety, the interest is too great and too much would be required to keep them safe.

Two things I recall.
I remember the front page photo of Catherine sitting on a bus before she and William got married. I think she was on her way to work but much was made over her resting face, what it all meant, and conversely, how the photographers basically chased her and she couldn't have a normal life.
Harry was very happily in the army for a few years but when it was made public he had to quit because of kidnapping and safety fears. Though @Daisys and Diamonds recalls this differently, down to a family member's retirement and the need for Harry to help more. I'm not sure which is accurate, maybe both, but I don't follow the BRF.

Does the DRF have restrictions on what type of work they can do? I assume certain aspects of speaking to the press are a no-no and certain safety conditions must be met.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

I've often wondered that as well. It seems like an ideal solution.

By all accounts it's down to safety, the interest is too great and too much would be required to keep them safe.

Two things I recall.
I remember the front page photo of Catherine sitting on a bus before she and William got married. I think she was on her way to work but much was made over her resting face, what it all meant, and conversely, how the photographers basically chased her and she couldn't have a normal life.
Harry was very happily in the army for a few years but when it was made public he had to quit because of kidnapping and safety fears. Though @Daisys and Diamonds recalls this differently, down to a family member's retirement and the need for Harry to help more. I'm not sure which is accurate, maybe both, but I don't follow the BRF.

Does the DRF have restrictions on what type of work they can do? I assume certain aspects of speaking to the press are a no-no and certain safety conditions must be met.

i think both is true
i must admit ive had an enjoyable half hour reading recent history
Harry retired from the army in 2015 and Prince Philip retired in 2017
it was very very bad when the press blew the story when he was in Afghanistan back in 2007 so irresponsible
the British press had actually known about his deployment for two weeks and had a deal to keep quiet but it was blown by an American site, a really awful Aussie woman's mag and a German newspaper
i am still so angry over this
it was so dangerouse and not just for Harry but for those serving alongside him as he now had a big target on his back

How the Prince Harry in Afghanistan story was kept secret

UK media have only just run the story about Prince Harry in Afghanistan despite having known for two months that he was on frontline duty. By Mark Sweney

www.theguardian.com

now because every thread needs pictures ....

2015 Prince Harry joined the High Commissioners for Australia and New Zealand, veterans, and expatriate and visiting New Zealanders and Australians, to mark the 100th anniversary of the first Anzac Day, 101 years on from the landing at Gallipoli.
notice Prince Harry in civilian clothes at the service in london
(George V attended the first ANZAC day back in 1916)
ANZAC day in is April



after Harry left the army in 2015 he came down under where he spent time at Army Barracks in Darwin, Perth and Sydney where he took part in a range of unit-based activities, training exercises and domestic deployments.




then he undertook a Royal Visit of to New Zealand in 2015. The nine-day visit in May to New Zealand ) covered six centres: Wellington, Stewart Island, Christchurch, Linton (army camp) Whanganui and Auckland.

i cannot stress enough how popular Prince Harry was here
he was the people's prince
this is him meeting the governmer general (a former career solider who rose through the ranks to become head of the NZ defence force)
it was a very good tour

Prince Harry - 2015 - Monarchy New Zealand

Overview: Prince Harry set to visit New Zealand and Australia: Prince Harry will spend four weeks in April and May seconded to the Australian Defence Force, where he will be attached to various units to gain an appreciation of the Australian Army’s domestic operating environment and...

monarchy.org.nz

a few years latter i remember reading something that he really wanted to get marreid and settle down ( he seemed to really enjoy being part of WIll's ad Kate's family back then) he was looking for a potential lady while on this tour
alas the right girl didnt come along

here he is learning the NZ army's haka 2015

it seemed as if the whole country was in love with Prince Harry




the other day i took the bus to work and we went past a war memorial
it big letters it said service before self
this Harry understood that
where has that Harry gone ?
i read about how he enjoyed the army, doing well on his own merits not because of who he and his family were

but now his celebrity is sill tied to being a prince

H&M visited NZ in 2018 at the end of a Pacific tour and they were tired
but wildly popular


Note no brooch



i just find it so deeply offensive if it is true that M hated every second of it

here is the Sydney walk about M thought she should be being paid for
how could they turn their back on the commonwealth ?
so many missed opertunities because she wanted to be a Hollywood princess

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Ahhh the Ginger & the Whinger....

I'm curious but refuse to watch on principle. Newspapers report on it blow by blow anyway so just read that.

 

[GliderPoss]

i just find it so deeply offensive if it is true that M hated every second of it

here is the Sydney walk about M thought she should be being paid for
how could they turn their back on the commonwealth ?
so many missed opportunities because she wanted to be a Hollywood princess

I couldn't agree with this more - it's deeply hurtful to us Aussie who have embraced the junior Royals as such an important part of us as a Commonwealth country. Was it truly so awful to endure having Australia roll out the red carpet for you?

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

I couldn't agree with this more - it's deeply hurtful to us Aussie who have embraced the junior Royals as such an important part of us as a Commonwealth country. Was it truly so awful to endure having Australia roll out the red carpet for you?

he could have found a nice lady down in Tasmania like Crown Prince Frederick did

 

[DutchJackie]

I've often wondered that as well. It seems like an ideal solution.

By all accounts it's down to safety, the interest is too great and too much would be required to keep them safe.

Does the DRF have restrictions on what type of work they can do? I assume certain aspects of speaking to the press are a no-no and certain safety conditions must be met.

safety is a real concern… PAmalia, the Princess of Orange has a thing now

I don’t know the jobs by all the spares, but I would say it’s corporate or non-profit and some are entrepreneurs.

The Dutch press code is also different. The spares pretend to be boring people and the press mostly leaves them alone.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

safety is a real concern… PAmalia, the Princess of Orange has a thing now

I don’t know the jobs by all the spares, but I would say it’s corporate or non-profit and some are entrepreneurs.

The Dutch press code is also different. The spares pretend to be boring people and the press mostly leaves them alone.

i felt so sorry for Princes Catharina-Amalia when she couldnt stay in her university accomidation and had to come home to the palace back with mum and dad

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

complaing that the house they were gifted was too small
how do they think other people live ?
how big was M's house when she was growing up ?
tone deaf if you ask me
a lot of people are really strugling right now
so many people dont even own their own homes

Meghan and Harry blasted as 'ungrateful' for Nottingham Cottage remark

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry have been criticised by viewers of the Netflix series Harry & Meghan following the final three instalments of the highly-anticipated series.

www.express.co.uk

Meghan and Harry slam 'small' cottage they had to live in as it wasn't a palace

Prince Harry and Meghan Markle have blasted the living conditions they had to endure after getting married - claiming the prince kept hitting his head on the low ceilings and Oprah Winfrey was shocked

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[Mreader]

I’m on episode four. I never really paid that much attention to the Royals so I’m only getting one side I suppose but I’m really a bit surprised by all the venom toward Meghan and Harry. I find them eminently likable! And they do seem madly in love, so this sexist trope of her “ getting her claws into him” seems unfounded. She also isn’t saying that she disliked her wedding or that she dislikes going to Australia or New Zealand @Daisys and Diamonds - she actually talks about them being amazing experiences. As for the articles that you linked (because I believe you said you were not watching, but just reading about it) it was taken out of context in my opinion. They were just saying that the public probably had this impression that they’re living in a giant palace when in fact they’re living in a cottage. When you see it in the photographs, it’s incredibly modest. They were not saying that they were too good to be in a place that small; just that some people probably had the impression that they were in some mansion. Anyway, I have noticed that the British seem to have a very negative opinion and Americans don’t seem that phased. Interesting.

ETA - I admire her work toward women empowerment.

Also how crazy that royal women are expected to parade their baby they day they give birth. Just wow. I could barely stand after I had my baby.

 

[Tartansparkles]

I have watched episode 4. I think they deserve 10/10 for effort. Everybody makes mistakes and they have made their share but the biggest mistake they appear to have made is outshining the higher ups. I have no interest in the royal family, I'd disband the institution if I could. But the pictures of Megan and the Queen were heart-warming, I haven't seen many pictures of the Queen where she appeared to be genuinely happy.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

oh dear

excuse how my quotting is
im having trouble here

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

oh Mreader please excuse how this is quoting

im trying to fix it

excuse my bad spelling and typing

and i dont know why my writting looks like Mreader's quote

my thoughts (me Daisy. not Mreader) are all over the place

i feel sad for all the family
i was one of her biggest defenders for two years

i blamed the press, i did not like the way it was the press who did the Kate Vs M thing the way they had done that with Di and Fergie and tried to do with Sophie and (a by then dead) Diana, i still dont like it, i only go to the gutter press for the photos of the jewles !



but CHarles is not just the Dad he is king and the king is the boss of the armed forces, H is being very disloyal by attacing the king so publically when only 5 years ago he was saying what a good dad he is



and we know that the cottage is small by palace standards

we always knew it was a cottage in the grounds of - not part of Kensington palace

my thoughts (me Daisy. not Mreader) are all over the place

i feel sad for all the family
i was one of her biggest defenders for two years

i blamed the press, i did not like the way it was the press who did the Kate Vs M thing the way they had done that with Di and Fergie and tried to do with Sophie and (a by then dead) Diana, i still dont like it, i only go to the gutter press for the photos of the jewles !



but CHarles is not just the Dad he is king and the king is the boss of the armed forces, H is being very disloyal by attacing the king so publically when only 5 years ago he was saying what a good dad he is



and we know that the cottage is small by palace standards

we always knew it was a cottage in the grounds of - not part of Kensington palace

but constantly trashing the family and upstaging the others at every operrtunity is bad manners

like Kate's carrol service was booked in months ago but they chose the same day for netflex



many many families were lossing people to covid, millions proabably at that time ,and they whine their house isnt big enough

do you remember the Dutch royals getting in trouble for going on holiday durring the pandemic ? It was a major PR disaster but HM apoligised to his people and the family returned home



obveosuly in the 21st centuary a 2 bedroomed house is too small for a growing family, rich or poor, but if you have
been gifted it by granny you dont moan about it being too small in public, especially not with so many people homeless this christmas

but constantly trashing the family and upstaging the others at every operrtunity is bad manners

like Kate's carrol service was booked in months ago but they chose the same day for netflex



many many families were lossing people to covid, millions proabably at that time ,and they whine their house isnt big enough

do you remember the Dutch royals getting in trouble for going on holiday durring the pandemic ? It was a major PR disaster but HM apoligised to his people and the family returned home



obveosuly in the 21st centuary a 2 bedroomed house is too small for a growing family, rich or poor, but if you have
been gifted it by granny you dont moan about it being too small in public, especially not with so many people homeless this christmas

succesful royality has to be awear of whats going on with their people
H&M are coming over as spoilt
and both the left and right wing British media and the media down here seem to agree
speaking of the media, Harry is asking for trouble when he lumps the royal accretied press pack in with the paparazzi
without the press the good deads and charities that the royal family support would miss out on much needed public exposure

a really sad example of how sad the whole thing is
is my Gary just said he is just so dissapointed in H, the way he has gone about things
Gary is not a royalis, he pays royal happenings not much attention, but really liked Harry

there has much been said in the media here about why British and American people may see this whole thing differently

i have no desire to get into an international incident when i like and respect both countries and their people
but for those of us who live under a constituional monarchy system of government, monarchy is not celebrity to us and i try to be unjudgemental of why some Americans may find that difficult to comprehend - i say this generally and not directed at any one person or maybe i mean it towards M ?


sorry this is a mess
i give up

 

[MissGotRocks]

@Daisys and Diamonds i will always give deference to the citizens of the country rather than those of us who watch it on television! I personally don’t find M sincere but if you listen to her, she seems that way. Reminds me of the old saying ‘don’t listen to what they say, watch what they do.’ At any rate, it is interesting to read all the varied opinions!

 

[monarch64]

**edited by moderator, criticism of someone's mental health state will not be tolerated here**

Wow. Regardless of who she is and what your opinion is of her as a person, to say you’re not buying her suicide “story” is just cruel and sends the message to others reading that they may not be believed if or when they need help. WTF.

 

[Tartansparkles]

Of course monarchy is celebrity, it performs no other reasonable function - they are there for the tourists and as we have seen from this sad situation, to sell newspapers. Even the work they do for charity is based on their celebrity status because that in turn determines how much front page coverage they (and their charity) gets.

 

[Rhea]

I haven't read or seen anything about the suicide story. I, and most other Brits from what I can tell, just don't really care about the lot of them.

I find it easy to believe though. I'm an immigrant from the US. Moving to another country is no joke. Two countries separated by a common language. There's an assumption that since you speak the same language, you'll settle in just fine, but everything is different: driving, cooking, opening a bank account, buying a house, how you greet people, when you make eye contact, gestures and non-verbal communications, how you access mental and physical doctors appointments and even what's acceptable as far as asking for assistance. It's f-ing difficult. And it's isolating, depressing and bewildering. My friends and family either expected me to be thrilled - I was living the dream in London! - or told me that I could just move back. My British partner was a bit confused, unsure what to do and how to help, I was running into problems he'd never even considered.

Sure, money makes some of that easier, but Meghan also changed her job, her role with her family (girlfriend to wife), and had offspring. Those are major changes all happening at once when everyone expects you to smile and look like you're nothing but happy. I heard that she was offered help with settling into her role within the royal family but didn't take it. That wouldn't have fixed it all, but I think it would have done a bit. The flip side to that is that if she was truly offered assistance in training for her role and didn't take it, Harry probably had some say in that (meaning that partners consult one another). He's never been keen on the limelight, always wanted out. I could see him telling her that she didn't need it, himself not realising how much of a change everything was. There's no way my brand new, fresh faced, wide eyed husband would have thought moving to a country I visited, loved and was looking forward to after studying abroad here and dating for 3 years would nearly break me.

I can absolutely and completely believe she was suicidal. When I say I'll never move to another country again, not even back to my home country (reverse cultural shock is real, I get it just visiting there), I'm bloody serious.

 

[rainydaze]

I haven't read or seen anything about the suicide story. I, and most other Brits from what I can tell, just don't really care about the lot of them.

I find it easy to believe though. I'm an immigrant from the US. Moving to another country is no joke. Two countries separated by a common language. There's an assumption that since you speak the same language, you'll settle in just fine, but everything is different: driving, cooking, opening a bank account, buying a house, how you greet people, when you make eye contact, gestures and non-verbal communications, how you access mental and physical doctors appointments and even what's acceptable as far as asking for assistance. It's f-ing difficult. And it's isolating, depressing and bewildering. My friends and family either expected me to be thrilled - I was living the dream in London! - or told me that I could just move back. My British partner was a bit confused, unsure what to do and how to help, I was running into problems he'd never even considered.

Sure, money makes some of that easier, but Meghan also changed her job, her role with her family (girlfriend to wife), and had offspring. Those are major changes all happening at once when everyone expects you to smile and look like you're nothing but happy. I heard that she was offered help with settling into her role within the royal family but didn't take it. That wouldn't have fixed it all, but I think it would have done a bit. The flip side to that is that if she was truly offered assistance in training for her role and didn't take it, Harry probably had some say in that (meaning that partners consult one another). He's never been keen on the limelight, always wanted out. I could see him telling her that she didn't need it, himself not realising how much of a change everything was. There's no way my brand new, fresh faced, wide eyed husband would have thought moving to a country I visited, loved and was looking forward to after studying abroad here and dating for 3 years would nearly break me.

I can absolutely and completely believe she was suicidal. When I say I'll never move to another country again, not even back to my home country (reverse cultural shock is real, I get it just visiting there), I'm bloody serious.

@Rhea I really appreciate your compassionate, thoughtful post. It was touching to read something that was honest, kind, considerate, and heartfelt. It feels like there is less of that these days.

 

[monarch64]

I haven't read or seen anything about the suicide story. I, and most other Brits from what I can tell, just don't really care about the lot of them.

I find it easy to believe though. I'm an immigrant from the US. Moving to another country is no joke. Two countries separated by a common language. There's an assumption that since you speak the same language, you'll settle in just fine, but everything is different: driving, cooking, opening a bank account, buying a house, how you greet people, when you make eye contact, gestures and non-verbal communications, how you access mental and physical doctors appointments and even what's acceptable as far as asking for assistance. It's f-ing difficult. And it's isolating, depressing and bewildering. My friends and family either expected me to be thrilled - I was living the dream in London! - or told me that I could just move back. My British partner was a bit confused, unsure what to do and how to help, I was running into problems he'd never even considered.

Sure, money makes some of that easier, but Meghan also changed her job, her role with her family (girlfriend to wife), and had offspring. Those are major changes all happening at once when everyone expects you to smile and look like you're nothing but happy. I heard that she was offered help with settling into her role within the royal family but didn't take it. That wouldn't have fixed it all, but I think it would have done a bit. The flip side to that is that if she was truly offered assistance in training for her role and didn't take it, Harry probably had some say in that (meaning that partners consult one another). He's never been keen on the limelight, always wanted out. I could see him telling her that she didn't need it, himself not realising how much of a change everything was. There's no way my brand new, fresh faced, wide eyed husband would have thought moving to a country I visited, loved and was looking forward to after studying abroad here and dating for 3 years would nearly break me.

I can absolutely and completely believe she was suicidal. When I say I'll never move to another country again, not even back to my home country (reverse cultural shock is real, I get it just visiting there), I'm bloody serious.

Thank you for sharing this! I can relate—after college I moved to Chicago from a very small town, and the culture shock was intense. So intense that I went to a doctor and asked to be evaluated for depression and was given meds. I went home and told my fiancé (who became my first husband that I later divorced) and he said “no wife of mine will ever be on pills, there’s nothing wrong with you.”

Seeing someone discount completely that someone’s retelling of their suicidal ideations is just a story they’re not buying and don’t believe is atrocious and I am blocking the person who did that in this thread. That is over the top out of pocket nasty behavior.

 

[Mreader]

Thank you for sharing this! I can relate—after college I moved to Chicago from a very small town, and the culture shock was intense. So intense that I went to a doctor and asked to be evaluated for depression and was given meds. I went home and told my fiancé (who became my first husband that I later divorced) and he said “no wife of mine will ever be on pills, there’s nothing wrong with you.”

Seeing someone discount completely that someone’s retelling of their suicidal ideations is just a story they’re not buying and don’t believe is atrocious and I am blocking the person who did that in this thread. That is over the top out of pocket nasty behavior.

I know that when I had my child, for many months I wasn’t suicidal per se but I genuinely did not care if I lived or died and thought it would be better if I didn’t wake up the next morning. I had NEVER been like that before. It took over a year before à compassionate doc finally diagnosed me with PPD.

 

[Ella]

Folks, we're not going to judge someone's personal mental health status, full stop. Please consider this your one and only warning and keep this thread on topics that do not involve judging someone's health status. Posts that violated this have been removed.

 

[Daisys and Diamonds]

Of course monarchy is celebrity, it performs no other reasonable function - they are there for the tourists and as we have seen from this sad situation, to sell newspapers. Even the work they do for charity is based on their celebrity status because that in turn determines how much front page coverage they (and their charity) gets.

no, the soverign is head of state, not a celberity

 

[finerthings]

I have not watched the TV series, but I have had enough of them in the evening news. So they left the monarchy for private lives, yet they promote themselves and details of their lives with their TV specials. You can't have it both ways! They are basically selling their stories for finanical gain and public sympathy. Sick and not right.

 

[Petalouda]

I have not watched the TV series and won’t. I was neutral for a long time and I won’t say much except for it’s painful to see two brothers fall out so publicly and so quickly. Not sure if there were major issues beforehand but it’s tragic to see, especially given the difficult childhood they shared. I was hoping Harry and William would have an unbreakable bond. Hopefully they can find their way back to each other (barring abuse).

 

[Rhea]

I don't mind that they left. I don't feel any way about it, really. Or maybe I'm happy for them because I do think the monarchy should be slimmed down and I'd like them to set the path - though that didn't go well! Charlotte and the little one - Lois? - will probably leave the life of working royals behind them to at least some degree.

The public discourse I can do without. Sure, tell alls are fun for the drama. Ultimately though this is a real family with real feelings. Discussing everything, and in this case very publicly, would be an inadvisable course of action. They're doing it for reasons known only to themselves, but I can't see what they think this would bring or what the end game is. At the moment they get to share and they'll make money off it and garner sympathy, but at what cost?

They allegedly want to be left alone - don't sell your story, other wealthy and famous people do just fine staying off the radar.
They allegedly want people to know what happened - why? Sympathy, a want to be right, a need to protect others who plan into the monarchy, celebrity?

This won't bring down the royal family (if they collapse I'll blame Andrew) who will just ignore, not release press statements and quietly move on. The monarchy side simply won't speak and will "go high". Maybe in a few years Harry and Meghan will be happy without a family they consider toxic. But if not they've sure as hell made it difficult to find any path at all back other than to treated like other government officials or celebrities when they visit with formal photo ops.

In my opinion, the monarchy will protect themselves from being sold to the press so forget Harry and Meghan being invited to that casual family lunch when a niece graduates, finding out first when someone dies, etc. The plan will be made, agreed, presented and best faces forward among the royals - and then Harry will be informed once all the plans have been made. Harry and Meghan will continue to consider that bad treatment by family while the monarchy will consider that protecting themselves from potential leaks and press intrusion. It will just cause further hurt and division within the family. But I also don't see how it could be any different now that they are known for selling their side of the story.

 

[icy_jade]

At this point they have been whining about the BRF longer than she was part of it. I find the idea of spending 30 million on a wedding and 1 million in one year on clothes and then complaining about that and their free accommodation ungrateful and out of touch.

Am not racist about her, just think that she is an awful and self centred person.

 

[tyty333]

Another thing I dont understand with the mental health issue is that Prince William is a proponent of supporting
mental health issues. He (and I think Harry) were trying to take away the stigma and bring it out to the forefront. I dont
know who H&M talked to about getting her help but it seems like they should have kept going up the line until
someone got her help. IMO, they shouldn't have stopped trying and if it came down to it they should have gotten
a flight back to the states to get her help (this was during covid so not sure what was going on aviation-wise at this point).
Couldnt she have gotten help via Zoom if they didn't want someone showing up at the front door of the castle? Anyway,
I don't think they should have taken No for an answer. Harry failed her IMO.