Are you worried about the Coronavirus?

[ksinger]

k

Count me in now as concerned. By the numbers, the genie is out of the bottle. This will not be contained. The infection rate is significantly higher than the flu. The percent needing hospital intervention is also significantly higher. We (us healthcare system) simply does not have enough beds to take care of all the people needing help. The percent who need hospital intervention who don't get it are much more likely to die. Fir example my sister does not have insurance. She is the kind of person who doesn't seek medical help, because she wants to avoid the big bills. And she works with the public. We are going to see alot of people die in the next year. Https://medium.com/@amwren/forget-a...be-worried-about-the-coronavirus-890fbf9c4de6

Yes, I read the Atlantic piece last week, the one they reference in your link, with the epidemiologist estimating between 40-70 of people will contract the virus. I thought it sounded likely even then, and more so now. Considering the estimates that 1/3 of the world population got the 1918 flu, and that this coronavirus has a higher rate of transmission, those numbers seem reasonable. So reading this or that epidemiologist say "you're going to know people who die of this", isn't alarmist, although admittedly alarmING. I think that anyone downplaying the seriousness of this situation now just because she is in an age group with a lower mortality rate, or who is downplaying to self-soothe, is whistling past the graveyard.

The thing to remember, for me at least, is you can do as much as you can reasonably do, and then the rest really is a crap shoot. Uncertainly rules. You'd think after the last 3 years we'd be getting used to it. It's hard though, isn't it?

 

[Arcadian]

It’s hard to know what to do...I just ordered $500 worth of food for my dog to bring to my other house in Maryland this weekend. I’m heading to the Costco here in Pa to get coffee and other things to bring there on Friday. I already bought a lot of food to stock my house in Maryland. My husband refuses to stay isolated if it gets bad..He knows I will go to Maryland and stay there until I think we’re safe to come home. I told him we are in the high risk category being over 60..My mom is 94...I will also take my adult son with special needs.
Next weekend we’re going to DC for my grandson’s third birthday party. There will be twenty children with parents attending who travel all over for business internationally..I think it’s a matter of time before DC gets hit..I’m not missing his birthday party but that’s the last group event we‘re going to. My husband is another story. He’s planning on carrying on as normal. If I feel he’s putting us at risk..I’m packing everyone up and heading to Maryland. He understands my concern and is helping me get the stuff there. He doesn’t do well without me....He gets homesick when I’m not with him...I hoped that would sway him to retire early...He is so important to his job he just feels he can’t leave...I have two other sons and a daughter-in-law who is pregnant. Thankfully they are in the low risk group..I do worry about the middle son because he also travels and works in the DC area. He’s the one that has a wife that’s pregnant and my almost three year old grandson...The other son doesn’t travel and is in the low risk group so he should be okay. I‘m pretty nervous but staying calm and preparing..

Maybe you should ask your husband what they're going to do if he's dead? Because they'll likely mourn a little, then find someone (or someone's) to replace him. I'm a workaholic myself, but even I know when its time to concentrate on family. My grandmother would say "A hard head makes a soft tail." I honestly hope he's not that hard headed.

I love you, take care of yourself ma'am.

 

[MamaBee]

Maybe you should ask your husband what they're going to do if he's dead? Because they'll likely mourn a little, then find someone (or someone's) to replace him. I'm a workaholic myself, but even I know when its time to concentrate on family. My grandmother would say "A hard head makes a soft tail." I honestly hope he's not that hard headed.

I love you, take care of yourself ma'am.

@Arcadian Yes he is THAT hard headed. Love you back..xxoo

 

[HS4S_2]

My son went back to University yesterday after a long weekend. He sent this over from his alert system.

 

[Gussie]

My MIL has requested that we cancel our trip to visit them for FIL's birthday this coming weekend. We were driving but others in the family were flying. I understand her fear since he is already fragile with heart failure. Our fear is that we will miss his last birthday regardless of coronavirus.

@Mamabean my husband is the same as yours! He grew up with a actuaries and always analyzes risk assessment without fear. Lol, I am definitely going to my cabin in remote Arkansas when s@#$ hits the fan!

 

[TooPatient]

We are up to 8 schools in our area closed. One had a parent test positive. One had a student test positive. The rest are due to known exposure or parents/students/staff with flu-like symptoms.

One entire school district will be closed tomorrow so that teachers can be trained on how to conduct online classes rather than in person.

 

[MamaBee]

My MIL has requested that we cancel our trip to visit them for FIL's birthday this coming weekend. We were driving but others in the family were flying. I understand her fear since he is already fragile with heart failure. Our fear is that we will miss his last birthday regardless of coronavirus.

@Mamabean my husband is the same as yours! He grew up with a actuaries and always analyzes risk assessment without fear. Lol, I am definitely going to my cabin in remote Arkansas when s@#$ hits the fan!

Exactly! They must have been brothers in another life...It’s frustrating!
I’m sorry you won’t be able to see your father-in-law for his birthday. I do think it’s smart to protect him from your other family members who are flying though..It’s a hard decision..

 

[Tekate]

We are supposed to go to Seattle April 10th for a wedding, we were planning to return to TX on the 12th as it's our granddaughter's 1st birthday, we are seriously considering not going and are trying to talk our son's out of going too. One son lives in Brooklyn and goes into the city everyday for his job so when and IF it hits the big apple he's a prime candidate for getting the virus but he's also 28, never smoked, thin, healthy so I'm not sure how bad he would be if he get's it. My other son, DIL and GD are all here in the Austin area so far nothing is being reported in Austin, San Antonio has a case but I believe it was someone returning from the Princess Cruise Line debacle. Husband and I are in our late 60s, we are prime candidates to die! especially me as I smoked for 20 years and quit 32 years ago, the virus seemed to affect smokers in China of all ages the most and of course the aged and ill and babies. We are scheduled to go to France in early October for another nephew's wedding, so far we've not even booked that one, hopefully it will be over by then.

Not that I am looking to wear a mask, but we bought the best kind of masks during the SARs epidemic several years ago, never used them and they are in a box somewhere in this rental home's garage, my younger NYC son said one cannot get masks, hand cleanser, or latex gloves at any drugstore near him, he's in the Clinton HIll area of Brooklyn. We will find them and send them to him if it is advised he wear a mask.

I am on the fence still on how serious this will be. Does our government have really good plans in place or since Trump has cut a CDC grant program for state and local public health emergency preparedness — the front lines in detecting and battling new disease. Lucky us, Congress over-rode Trumps cuts to the CDC but at the state level it's worrisome, but before I panic I try to read all I can and be fair and well informed.

 

[telephone89]

My company just cancelled any/all plane travel, incl domestic within Canada.

I have a personal trip planned to the US at the end of April with a ton of pre-paid stuff and I'm not sure if we'll get any money back if we end up cancelling I'm really hoping we don't have to because I was very much looking forward to it! Right now we are going to wait and see.

 

[the_mother_thing]

@Gussie I’m sorry your family’s plans are being thwarted, but hopefully you all can come together and find another way to celebrate his birthday in a meaningful way.

@Tekate It doesn’t help anyone to politicize the issue with confusing statements & misinformation about national/state preparedness.

AP FACT CHECK: Democrats distort coronavirus readiness

WASHINGTON (AP) — Democratic presidential contenders are describing the federal infectious-disease bureaucracy as rudderless and ill-prepared for the coronavirus threat because of budget cuts and ham-handed leadership by President Donald Trump.

apnews.com

Some public health experts say a bigger concern than White House budgets is the steady erosion of a CDC grant program for state and local public health emergency preparedness — the front lines in detecting and battling new disease. But that decline was set in motion by a congressional budget measure that predates Trump.
...
The public health system has a playbook to follow for pandemic preparation — regardless of who’s president or whether specific instructions are coming from the White House. Those plans were put into place in anticipation of another flu pandemic, but are designed to work for any respiratory-borne disease.

 

[TooPatient]

@Tekate keep an eye on the news and I will update here as much as I can remember. Seattle area is getting a lot of activity with the virus right now. Too early to say what April will look like around here.

 

[lyra]

My daughter cancelled plans for her Italy honeymoon in September. She's just going to do something within driving distance, and hopefully make the trip next year instead.

Costco is selling out of things. Never thought I'd see the day here. Went to get TP, which is where we always buy it, and it was sold out. Also a line-up out the door. Never seen anything like this before. Technically I didn't see it. DH went, I stayed home. I'm fine with staying home, but he's still travelling every week, so I think it's all pointless anyway.

 

[AGBF]

Yesterday our local grocery store still had toilet paper; paper towels; some Lysol disinfectant that had bleach left although a lot was sold out. I didn't even try to find hand sanitizer or items that would have been in higher demand. There were empty spaces on the shelves where, I would guess, very high value items had been stocked. I am worried more about exposure though a member of the family who has to go out into the community even if we should be quarantined. My main decisions will be whether to go to see doctors, to go for lab tests, and to go to pharmacies. Pharmacies and doctors' waiting rooms are probably great places to get sick, but should I cancel appointments out of an excess of caution? I don't plan to cancel routine visits I have this week.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

I work in a hospital emergency room and my partner works with the homeless population so I think we're just going to assume if there's wide spread in our area that we will get it eventually. Going to hope youth, good health, and good access to care and information will get us through. (No judgement on being homeless, it's just pragmatically difficult to quarantine yourself or be vigilant with hygiene when you don't have a home or reliable access to things needed for hygiene like soap and plumbing)

 

[whitewave]

New Hampsire has a case now:

1st Confirmed Case of Coronavirus in NH

State health officials announced the first case of coronavirus in New Hampshire on Monday morning. Dr. Benjamin Chan, New Hampshire state epidemiologist, said at a press conference that one of the four people being tested for coronavirus came back positive. That person had recently traveled to...

www.nbcboston.com

 

[Begonia]

I work in the public at a ferry terminal which is a connector to our international airport.
Yay for me.

Stocked up today on disinfectant wipes, alcohol and aloe gel (no sani left), teas of all kinds, coconut water, hydration powder, cold meds, Advil, Tylenol, Emergen-C powders, soups, lozenges, and am slowly getting ‘sick’ food: apple sauce, soups, ensure type drinks. I reckon one of us will get it, or the seasonal flu and will need to be nursed at home. I usually do all this in September but didn’t this year. Gosh that was spenzy!

 

[MamaBee]

I just stocked up on more stuff at Costco in Pa. It doesn’t look like much but there’s more stuff in the back..$414 and it barely fills up the back. That’s almost
a $1,000 in supplies in the last few days.
Now we wait..

 

[MakingTheGrade]

I just stocked up on more stuff at Costco in Pa. It doesn’t look like much but there’s more stuff in the back..$414 and it barely fills up the back. That’s almost
a $1,000 in supplies in the last few days.
Now we wait..

Oh hey I’m in PA too.

 

[voce]

Yikes, if this isn't alarmist, I don't know what is!

"Expect people you know to die."

Okay, I would like to know why she is saying that. Look at China. About 80,000 cases, death toll under 3000. It's is unlikely that out of 1.5 billion people that most of them know one of the 3k who have died, and that should remain the case if the death toll stays around 2% of those infected. What I've read on the CDC site indicates they think it will spread, but I don't consider what they are saying now as alarmist.

By no means do I mean to dismiss the possibility of the seriousness of the situation for people who have weak immune systems, poor health care, etc. that could result in serious illness or death. But again, in a country like China where there is poorer health care and very bad pollution in areas, we are not still not seeing an exponentially increasing death toll at this point as recoveries are higher than new cases. You must be expecting this to be much worse in the US than China. Thus far, I am sure the flu/pneumonia death toll is far higher there and here every year. Yet I don't personally know any elderly person who has died this winter (or the last 10) of pneumonia. So that's why I totally disagree with the prediction that we will virtually all know people who die from this virus. I sincerely hope I am the one that's right this time. If I am not, then yeah, life as we know it may not be the same for a very long time.

(I think there are likely thousands of undiagnosed cases here already. Most are likely mild and people don't usually go to doctors for mild illnesses, not to mention doctor's offices wouldn't have the tests anyway.)

diamondseeker2006, I take issue with things you've said. The 2% rate is if you count all people who currently have the disease, and nobody in the early stages will die. It's only useful to compare the number of deaths to the overall number of closed cases, and as of the time I'm writing this (Mar 3), it's more like 6%. More telling than the death rate is the number of "serious, critical" cases, which is about 9%. So almost 1 in 10 people will have a serious enough case to the point where they need to be hospitalized, and whether or not they die, their families are already impacted by the disease, and due to the fact that A) immune system strength is partially genetic and B) infection comes through close contact and care for the patient, the stories I'm hearing coming out of China, there are entire families who have been wiped out by the disease.

We are not talking about treating this disease in rural parts of China. In the Chinese cities, healthcare is at par or *better* than US healthcare, UNLESS you're comparing to care for the top 1% who pay out of pocket to be treated at experimental hospitals by leading doctors. My dad is a radiologist, and having received orthopedic surgery in both countries (in a second-tier city in China no less), says the surgeons he had in China are much better. They provide more timely and cheaper care and do not make you sign away your right to sue if they screw up your surgery. In terms of coronavirus treatment, I would rather be treated in China than in the US, if I contract the disease and had that choice, because now China has more *experience* with the virus, and US facilities do not yet have that expertise. I believe the WHO is at the forefront, not the CDC, because the Chinese authorities are willing to work with (and give data to) the WHO but not the CDC, which is a branch of the US government.

@Mamabean I do not recommend stocking up on any more yogurt. Yogurt has a very limited shelf life , and if there is a power outtage, even more so.

 

[AGBF]

"Amid coronavirus fears, Trump doesn’t see rallies as a risk"
by Peter Baker in "The New York Times" one hour ago

"President Trump said on Monday that it remained 'very safe' for him and his Democratic opponents to hold large campaign rallies like the one he had scheduled for North Carolina later in the day even as businesses and nonprofit groups are canceling large conventions out of concern over coronavirus.

Speaking with reporters in Washington before a planned flight to Charlotte for an evening rally there, Mr. Trump expressed no concern over holding campaign events that fill stadiums with thousands of people as the election season heats up.

'They’re all having rallies, that’s what they’re doing, they’re campaigning,' he said of his Democratic rivals, adding, 'I think it’s very safe.'"

 

[TooPatient]

We just had three more deaths announced locally. Specific details are not available. Sounds like all were at the hospital in Kirkland (WA) and had pre existing health conditions.

 

[MamaBee]

Oh hey I’m in PA too.

I’m older so in the high risk category..I’ll be hightailing out of here if it comes to us....

 

[MamaBee]

diamondseeker2006, I take issue with things you've said. The 2% rate is if you count all people who currently have the disease, and nobody in the early stages will die. It's only useful to compare the number of deaths to the overall number of closed cases, and as of the time I'm writing this (Mar 3), it's more like 6%. More telling than the death rate is the number of "serious, critical" cases, which is about 9%. So almost 1 in 10 people will have a serious enough case to the point where they need to be hospitalized, and whether or not they die, their families are already impacted by the disease, and due to the fact that A) immune system strength is partially genetic and B) infection comes through close contact and care for the patient, the stories I'm hearing coming out of China, there are entire families who have been wiped out by the disease.

We are not talking about treating this disease in rural parts of China. In the Chinese cities, healthcare is at par or *better* than US healthcare, UNLESS you're comparing to care for the top 1% who pay out of pocket to be treated at experimental hospitals by leading doctors. My dad is a radiologist, and having received orthopedic surgery in both countries (in a second-tier city in China no less), says the surgeons he had in China are much better. They provide more timely and cheaper care and do not make you sign away your right to sue if they screw up your surgery. In terms of coronavirus treatment, I would rather be treated in China than in the US, if I contract the disease and had that choice, because now China has more *experience* with the virus, and US facilities do not yet have that expertise. I believe the WHO is at the forefront, not the CDC, because the Chinese authorities are willing to work with (and give data to) the WHO but not the CDC, which is a branch of the US government.

@Mamabean I do not recommend stocking up on any more yogurt. Yogurt has a very limited shelf life , and if there is a power outtage, even more so.

Haha! That’s for my son now...I don’t expect that we would lose power though, right?
The Stagg Chili is my husband’s..yuck..haha He doesn’t cook so he can open a can when he gets home from work. I’ll be outta here..

 

[Bron357]

I think we all have to assume that people we know, if not ourselves, will get the virus. It is apparently easily spread and the complication, pneumonia/ respiratory distress, generally requires medical support and there’s an associated fatality rate because of this.
If you or a loved one is elderly, very young or immune compromised you are in the high risk group for an adverse outcome.
Not good.
And it will spread. It’s all well and good to say “self isolate for 2 weeks if you become ill” but there will be plenty of people who dont, can’t or won’t. Many don’t have sick leave, don’t have a job that lets them take 2 weeks off and still get paid and they need to get paid to afford rent, food etc.
I fear that the biggest issue is that there will be an inability for everyone affected to receive appropriate medical care if they need it.
And I don’t think stockpiling food etc is going to help. Its not as if everyone in the world can or will stay in complete isolation for a month or more to stop the virus spread and it only takes 1 infected person to start it up again.
We need a vaccine. That will take time. Until then wear bling.

 

[MakingTheGrade]

"We need a vaccine. That will take time. Until then wear bling. "

Amen to that

 

[chemgirl]

So this is probably going to come across wrong, but on other platforms I’m seeing a lot of “don’t worry it’s only bad for the elderly or those with pre-existing conditions”. There are even jokes about thinning out numbers before the next election.

Doesn’t the US have a lot of diabetes and heart disease? I thought there was an obesity epidemic.

These are pre-existing conditions last time I checked...

Homelessness and drug use are huge problems that make the news all of the time.

Point being you don’t have to be 80+ to be high risk. There are huge numbers of younger people who are also vulnerable. Younger people seem to assume that they’ll be fine since they’re not old and “sick”.

 

[TooPatient]

So this is probably going to come across wrong, but on other platforms I’m seeing a lot of “don’t worry it’s only bad for the elderly or those with pre-existing conditions”. There are even jokes about thinning out numbers before the next election.

Doesn’t the US have a lot of diabetes and heart disease? I thought there was an obesity epidemic.

These are pre-existing conditions last time I checked...

Homelessness and drug use are huge problems that make the news all of the time.

Point being you don’t have to be 80+ to be high risk. There are huge numbers of younger people who are also vulnerable. Younger people seem to assume that they’ll be fine since they’re not old and “sick”.

I have been seeing that too and it is so offensive. People making it sound like those who are at risk are worth less than others...

Plus what you said about pre-existing conditions and all that. So many are just ignorant and heartless!

 

[sunandsky]

I haven't caught up on this whole thread, but here's a good interview with the doctor leading the WHO coronavirus mission to China, with a section on how to protect yourself.

Someone upthread mentioned hand sanitizer wasn't as helpful as thought, and he notes it can actually be better than washing your hands in some cases.

(the link sounds like it's named wrong, but I've double checked it so fingers crossed):

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/checkup/should-medical-assistance-in-dying-be-an-option-when-the-diagnosis-isn-t-terminal-1.5478629/5-lessons-about-covid-19-from-doctor-who-led-who-mission-to-china-1.5481938

 

[Tekate]

@sunandsky wow that was quick, concise and very helpful, thank you for posting this.. I appreciate it very much.

I haven't caught up on this whole thread, but here's a good interview with the doctor leading the WHO coronavirus mission to China, with a section on how to protect yourself.

Someone upthread mentioned hand sanitizer wasn't as helpful as thought, and he notes it can actually be better than washing your hands in some cases.

(the link sounds like it's named wrong, but I've double checked it so fingers crossed):

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/checkup/should-medical-assistance-in-dying-be-an-option-when-the-diagnosis-isn-t-terminal-1.5478629/5-lessons-about-covid-19-from-doctor-who-led-who-mission-to-china-1.5481938

 

[Dancing Fire]

I just stocked up on more stuff at Costco in Pa. It doesn’t look like much but there’s more stuff in the back..$414 and it barely fills up the back. That’s almost
a $1,000 in supplies in the last few days.
Now we wait..

Now I know where to go if I needed supplies.. Crazy Chinese people are stocking up on rice. A few Asian stores in town are out of rice. Chinese people are scare of each other. I just came back from lunch. The chinese restaurant business are very slow all over town. I heard that SF and NYC chinatown are dead.