Conned on ebay. I quit!

[mrsthomas]

What an unfortunate situation for both parties. I have nothing to say that hasn't already been said but I do have one question to ask of RH. Here goes:

If Kelpie files a claim and the USPS/AGL insurers (for whatever reason - whether it be time or double handling of the item and packaging or something else entirely) rule against paying out the claim, will you still refund Kelpie the entire amount?

Im sorry if this has been asked and answered already - blame it on "baby brain". Best of luck to you both!!!

 

[Imdanny]

You know, I doubt this will get resolved.

Well, if it isn't I don't believe that's anyone's fault but the seller's. Her behavior has been atrocious IMO.

 

[risingsun]

You know, I doubt this will get resolved.

Well, if it isn't I don't believe that's anyone's fault but the seller's. Her behavior has been atrocious IMO.

I agree with Danny. There is no evidence that the OP damaged the stone in any way. There is no legitimate reason that she not be refunded her purchase price in full. Some posters have wondered why it has been difficult for some of us to let this topic go. As a counselor, I believe it is my role to advocate for people. When I see a wrong of this nature, it grinds my gut. Is this the biggest cause that I advocate for...of course not. I do, however, believe in holding people accountable for their actions.

 

[minousbijoux]

There is no evidence that the OP damaged the stone in any way. There is no legitimate reason that she not be refunded her purchase price in full. Some posters have wondered why it has been difficult for some of us to let this topic go. As a counselor, I believe it is my role to advocate for people. When I see a wrong of this nature, it grinds my gut. Is this the biggest cause that I advocate for...of course not. I do, however, believe in holding people accountable for their actions.

Well said - I agree.

Edited to fix quote

 

[Arkteia]

Ok I am sick and tired of this thread because in my mind the issue of postal claim is irrelevant. What is relevant in my mind is:
- no protection from ebay
- limited, if any, protection from Paypal
- total lack of effect from 19 pages on the PS

What this thread does, in effect, is showing eBay vendors that there is no retribution for being dishonest and keeping the customer's money.
So I wonder if it would make sense for the PS to do a thing that I have seen done before (not on PS). Open a pinned thread with the list of problem vendors. To get into that list of course would require a very serious issue, not just being unhappy with the shipping price or the look of a finished piece of jewelry. But this could be our single way of protection.

I know my offer is harsh, and perhaps everyone on the PS will be against me, but if there is no way to deal with similar problems, and 19 pages do not move us anywhere, then I see no other way. Unless Kelpie achieves something legally, but even as such, she'll lose a lot in professional time...

I wonder if my vendor who owes me money is holding onto a portion of it specifically because he is reading this thread...

 

[minousbijoux]

I wonder if my vendor who owes me money is holding onto a portion of it specifically because he is reading this thread...

Crasru: I think you either have scruples as a vendor, or you don't. I doubt that a vendor will change his/her behavior just because they read this thread and thought they could get away with it, but like TL, in general, I believe the best in people...

 

[Arkteia]

Probably you are right. And I do not want my offer to be understood the wrong way. Personally, I see only two groups of problem" vendors. The ones who do not return customers' money and the ones who chronically sell misrepresented items, such as synthetic spinel, with bogus certificates. And of course as long as vendors show their willingness to change, they should be removed from the list. But most of us buy on eBay, where one can get a great deal but there is also no protection. Unlike others, I see no problems with many things that concern other PS-ers here. It does not bother me that RH is a flipper, or may have different last names... she is holding onto the customer's money without a good reason, did not return her customer's emails and is inflexible, is an issue. The rest of it, the damaged stone, the issue of insurance, emerged later. At first, she did not respond for a long time. Just did not respond or reimburse. I think we are going to and fro with this postal claim that will lead us nowhere. Sorry for being blunt. 19 pages without moving anywhere is too much for me.

 

[ooo~Shiney!]

I wonder if my vendor who owes me money is holding onto a portion of it specifically because he is reading this thread...

Crasru: I think you either have scruples as a vendor, or you don't. I doubt that a vendor will change his/her behavior just because they read this thread and thought they could get away with it, but like TL, in general, I believe the best in people...

MB, Crasru, and TL and so many others here are so wonderful in
willing to give the benefit of the doubt.... I really truly admire that in y'all !!!!!

I like to believe the best in people too, but I am also a realist.

In all honesty, some (*not specifically pointing at anyone in particular)
are not going to change their behaviors, and in many
cases do not even find anything wrong in their own behaviors, nor do they
have much in the way of empathy for others.
I have worked with such a person (who ended up getting fired, as she so richly deserved )

I am really rooting for the home team, here!
Come on, RH, give it up and prove the majority wrong ! You can do it !!!!!
You can give that refund and I am then certain that everything will get
sorted out !!!!! And you probably will not come out all that far behind the 8-ball !!!!!

 

[Circe]

I wonder if my vendor who owes me money is holding onto a portion of it specifically because he is reading this thread...

Crasru: I think you either have scruples as a vendor, or you don't. I doubt that a vendor will change his/her behavior just because they read this thread and thought they could get away with it, but like TL, in general, I believe the best in people...

MB, Crasru, and TL and so many others here are so wonderful in
willing to give the benefit of the doubt.... I really truly admire that in y'all !!!!!

I like to believe the best in people too, but I am also a realist.

In all honesty, some (*not specifically pointing at anyone in particular)
are not going to change their behaviors, and in many
cases do not even find anything wrong in their own behaviors, nor do they
have much in the way of empathy for others.
I have worked with such a person (who ended up getting fired, as she so richly deserved )

I am really rooting for the home team, here!
Come on, RH, give it up and prove the majority wrong ! You can do it !!!!!
You can give that refund and I am then certain that everything will get
sorted out !!!!! And you probably will not come out all that far behind the 8-ball !!!!!

I hadn't posted in this thread before, because, well, a) all of y'all are saying what I'm thinking - RH is in the wrong, Kelpie deserves her money back, the postal insurance claim is irrelevant, etc, and, b) resulting directly from a, I just don't love the sound of my own voice that much. If a pretty much universal consensus aside from a couple of sock puppets haven't convinced her to mend her ways, nothing will.

That said, I would enthusiastically support Crasru's suggestion. The point of such a list wouldn't be to reform the vendors: it would be to give the consumer a better idea of whom to avoid. eBay feedback has time constraints that don't apply in cases like this, ToolHaus only goes so far, and there are so many vendors (and pseudonyms) out there that it can be hard to keep track. But if somebody out there has a nasty habit of misrepresenting goods and/or keeping their ill-gotten gains after they're discovered? Yeah, I'd like to know about it, and under all the handles they might use.

 

[Dreamer_D]

http://about.usps.com/forms/ps1000.pdf

The above link is a usps insurance claim form. Maybe I'm wrong but it appears that either the mailer or addressee can file a claim, depending on the situation. In this case, I think it would have to be the addressee. The instructions specifically say, "If you are the addressee, do not return or remail any damaged items." In this case, I believe that already occurred.

If the package was insured, the addressee would need to request the insurance receipt from the mailer. The addressee, who would make the claim, would also specify who receives the payment.

I have my own opinion who is right and who is wrong, but does it really matter? This could have been resolved in a way that neither party had to lose.

This information is the best in the thread, and makes it pretty clear that this could have been resolved quickly and simply. I think the thread makes is clear why it was not

 

[Barrett]

A gem cannot be polished without friction, nor a man or women perfected without trials.

Among Life's precious jewels,
Genuine and rare,
The one that we call friendship
Has worth beyond compare.

 

[portoar]

http://about.usps.com/forms/ps1000.pdf

The above link is a usps insurance claim form. Maybe I'm wrong but it appears that either the mailer or addressee can file a claim, depending on the situation. In this case, I think it would have to be the addressee. The instructions specifically say, "If you are the addressee, do not return or remail any damaged items." In this case, I believe that already occurred.

If the package was insured, the addressee would need to request the insurance receipt from the mailer. The addressee, who would make the claim, would also specify who receives the payment.

I have my own opinion who is right and who is wrong, but does it really matter? This could have been resolved in a way that neither party had to lose.

Reading the USPS insurance claim form, it would appear that RH herself invalidated any possibility of Kelpie obtaining an insurance refund, because she, the addressee, disregarded USPS postal insurance instructions and went ahead and, on her own volition and without permission from Kelpie (who she contends is the owner of the stone) remailed the damaged stone.

Since she has apparantly ruined any chance for an insurance claim to be filed on the stone, I feel that responsibility for reimbursement to Kelpie falls squarely on her shoulders.

I too, feel this thread has gone on beyond any possibility of further enlightenment or resolution. Kelpie should no longer expect any refund from RH. It is simply unrealistic to think that she will achieve resolution, except through legal channels, Small Claims probably being her best bet at this point. I would encourage Kelpie to meticulously document the course of this transaction and pursue compensation through legal channels for a) cost of stone b) lab report c) shipping.

I won't say anything further about the way that RH handled this matter, except that it is unfortunately short-sighted to alienate an entire community of gem lovers over a transaction involving a sub $1000 stone she misrepresented. I think that she has probably lost much more in future business than the $850+ price of the stone. It would have been smarter to consider that $850+ an investment in her future business and reputation in the gem community. In the real world, she would have gained even more respect and a higher reputation in the community for facing up to her mistakes and promptly making it right than she otherwise had.

This, in a nutshell, is the difference between reputable dealers and amateur resellers. A reputable dealer understands that good business is built on reputation and understands the power of word of mouth.

 

[minousbijoux]

Interesting turn of events: It appears that Rockhugger has changed her ebay name from Gemsrock2010 to Facettherainbow. It appears to be the same store, as she kept her feedback score, just with a new name.

 

[kelpie]

Quick update... never received any package. My postmaster has been on the lookout.

 

[beau-wy]

I have been an eBay seller 11+ years. I would VERY much like to see PS do a pinned list of problem vendors. When they eliminated sellers from using feedback blackmail and posting negatives on buyers, that was a huge step forward. I support any measures to clean up eBay and make buyers safe purchasing gems online.

 

[Imdanny]

Interesting turn of events: It appears that Rockhugger has changed her ebay name from Gemsrock2010 to Facettherainbow.

Yes, interesting. Thanks.

 

[Deia]

and the 150% guarantee is gone. SURPRISE!

This is such a joke. I am so sorry this happened to you. It's sickening how someone can get away with it.

 

[lavatea]

Quick update... never received any package. My postmaster has been on the lookout.

What package were you expecting? I thought you had turned away the packages RH tried to send you.

Sorry to see there is still no resolution.

 

[Deia]

Her postman was instructed to send back any package that came from RH. I am assuming Kelpie means there is no package to send back as it has not arrived.

 

[LD]

Quick update... never received any package. My postmaster has been on the lookout.

What package were you expecting? I thought you had turned away the packages RH tried to send you.

Sorry to see there is still no resolution.

RH said she had posted the stone back to Kelpie. Looks like that's yet another pack of lies. I just can't believe how badly somebody would behave knowing it was going to be shared with others in the gemstone community. I'm so sorry but unfortunately not surprised.

Kelpie - just so this thread shows up in any future Google search, can you list the names you know she sells under please as this thread acts as a great warning of what might happen if you choose to buy from her?

 

[lavatea]

Her postman was instructed to send back any package that came from RH. I am assuming Kelpie means there is no package to send back as it has not arrived.

I skimmed back through the thread, and I think you're right. It looks like RH just said that she had sent the stone and packaging to Kelpie. I don't see where the postal worker actually ever had the package turn up in order to be turned away.

 

[LD]

Very interesting. Just look how much she's been buying during the period she's refused to give the refund to Kelpie - not to mention selling several items of a similar amount to what she owes.

http://feedback.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=facettherainbow&ftab=AllFeedback&myworld=true

 

[VapidLapid]

Yes, I saw that too; she's amassed a vast collection of mediocre opal. Hardship, then, was not a factor.

Much sidestepping in her descriptions of current items. Panjir emeralds not ususally oiled?!...with the implication that these are not oiled, yet with nothing to back that up. Isn't oil about the only thing they have in that part of the world?

(please note the clever use of the same implication by spurious reasoning)

 

[decodelighted]

Yes, I saw that too; she's amassed a vast collection of mediocre opal. Hardship, then, was not a factor.

Much sidestepping in her descriptions of current items. Panjir emeralds not ususally oiled?!...with the implication that these are not oiled, yet with nothing to back that up. Isn't oil about the only thing they have in that part of the world?

(please note the clever use of the same implication by spurious reasoning)

Seller currently has NO ITEMS FOR SALE. Someone's cruising PS I imagine?



ETA: Countdown to new store opening 3 ... 2... 1. Can I guess the new name? "FeverForTheFlavor"?????

 

[AN0NYM0US]

Yes, I saw that too; she's amassed a vast collection of mediocre opal. Hardship, then, was not a factor.

Much sidestepping in her descriptions of current items. Panjir emeralds not ususally oiled?!...with the implication that these are not oiled, yet with nothing to back that up. Isn't oil about the only thing they have in that part of the world?

(please note the clever use of the same implication by spurious reasoning)

Seller currently has NO ITEMS FOR SALE. Someone's cruising PS I imagine?



ETA: Countdown to new store opening 3 ... 2... 1. Can I guess the new name? "FeverForTheFlavor"?????

US shipping only...ebay.com

http://www.ebay.com/sch/facettherainbow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

 

[decodelighted]

[
US shipping only...ebay.com
http://www.ebay.com/sch/facettherainbow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

Ahh. That explains the discrepancy. This is innnneresting ...

"Refunds are accepted on all items for 3 days! I guarantee the accuracy of my discription with a full refund guarantee for 45 days! *** Item must be returned in the same condition it was mailed to be accepted (To my loyal customers: I am sorry about the disclaimer, but it is needed to avoid abuse of my liberal return policy) ***

 

[y2kitty]

[
US shipping only...ebay.com
http://www.ebay.com/sch/facettherainbow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

Ahh. That explains the discrepancy. This is innnneresting ...

"Refunds are accepted on all items for 3 days! I guarantee the accuracy of my discription with a full refund guarantee for 45 days! *** Item must be returned in the same condition it was mailed to be accepted (To my loyal customers: I am sorry about the disclaimer, but it is needed to avoid abuse of my liberal return policy) ***

Aww Kelpie abused her....and she abuses the English language.

 

[natsplat]

I don't think I can roll my eyes sufficiently enough

...on another note, the unexpected fake baby at the bottom of the sales page freaked me out...!

 

[Deia]

For items $200.00 or over, insurance is included!

Isn't insurance the seller's responsibility, always? regardless of the price?

Oh..the fake baby is creepy.

She should seriously use spell check on her listings. Or maybe not.

 

[Imdanny]

...on another note, the unexpected fake baby at the bottom of the sales page freaked me out...!

I thought you meant an ad at the bottom. I didn't know you meant she has gems listed for sale and then a fake baby. Creepy.