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Date: 9/12/2009 3:55:14 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
long side:
I just rendered/enlarged both crown mains at the long side and one corner (as you displayed above)..., see the valley it will cut into the existing girdle??? Now you need to insert identical valley''s to the pavilion side enlargement..., resulting in eliminating the existing girdle and shortening the length of the shape.

Hope it is understandable..., pure physics as per your example...

Cehradisc.JPG
 
the other problem your going to have is this facet, its angle can not be more than the main that is part of it so the mains are going to be very shallow unless you reduce the size of the stone.
also you would end up with a twist if the crown wasn't recut as the top would not meet the bottom.
Your resale value just hit 0 as the labs will hammer it.

cbsarinmock1.jpg
 
Date: 9/12/2009 4:17:08 PM
Author: strmrdr
seller have a trade in policy?

that''s optimistic :P

Seriously though I don''t want to trade it in. I will work with it or leave it alone.
 
I am okay with reducing the size of the stone somewhat - I originally thought I wanted between 1.10-1.25 so if it lots a little bit of length I wouldn''t be that upset about it.

Do you think the size of the stone compensates for some of the cut issues?
 
Date: 9/12/2009 4:32:22 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
I am okay with reducing the size of the stone somewhat - I originally thought I wanted between 1.10-1.25 so if it lots a little bit of length I wouldn''t be that upset about it.

Do you think the size of the stone compensates for some of the cut issues?
I dont see cut issues..., sorry...
 
DG you are an artist and I love that about you :)

I have a really nice collection of paintings on my walls from various sources, mostly from San Francisco in the 60''s. Big, grand, interesting pieces that are all totally unique and I have a few pieces of sculpture as well. Now I''m not talking about pieces of craftwork or reproductions or plaster casts... but the real thing.

In my wildest fantasies my most prized piece of sculpture would be my diamond and the cutter would be someone I knew.

I think at least in part it has always bothered me that I have no clue who cut this stone and somehow it feels more like a limited edition print than a genuine piece of art.
 
Cehra,
A wise man once told me to not expect perfection from a diamond. I''m a sucker for culets and will be sad to see that one shortened.
 
culet wouldn''t go anywhere - if anything I wish it was larger lol
 
Cehra, if Diagem and Jonathan say to leave it alone, I''d follow that advice. I trust their judgement. And I think your diamond is beautiful!
 
Date: 9/12/2009 5:51:06 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
culet wouldn''t go anywhere - if anything I wish it was larger lol
Only diamond and gem culets, right?
2.gif
 
DS!! Hi :) your sigline is too apropos lol
I honestly am not pushing for a recut - I''m happy to be convinced it is unneeded but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!
 
Date: 9/12/2009 9:48:33 PM
Author: Harriet
Date: 9/12/2009 5:51:06 PM

Author: Cehrabehra

culet wouldn''t go anywhere - if anything I wish it was larger lol
Only diamond and gem culets, right?
2.gif

LMAO!!! Omg I was looking for all that sarin info and ran across those funny pictures I made way back when. Every time I see your name a voice in my mind goes, "harriet, sweet harriet. Hard hearted harbinger of hagis" lol
 
Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
DS!! Hi :) your sigline is too apropos lol

I honestly am not pushing for a recut - I''m happy to be convinced it is unneeded but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!
33.gif
33.gif
huh?
 
Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM
Author: strmrdr
Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!
33.gif
33.gif
huh?
I think she means the "trade in policy?" line ... not that she was offended by it. Just maybe discouraged?

Anyway -- my vote is new setting period. No recut. No tweaking. And it doesn''t matter *who* cut the darn thing. Seriously. Does it matter who built your house? Do you want to invite them over for dinner & talk about the depth of the kick plates under the cabinets? What happened to the wonkiness being its main appeal? You can "improve" something right into soulessness. Sure you might know the person who ruined your stone but is that gonna help you sleep at night. I think not. Find a temp setting. See how you feel about it in *any* other setting. The way a loose stone performs is very different -- you might have had the same feeling about any perfectly perfect cushion. Or other complaints. Etc. You''ll have two years to think about this while you''re in China. What''s the rush?
1.gif
 
Haha...wish I''d follow my signature line!

Gosh, good emeralds are not easy to find....and they are pretty soft. Sure you''re stuck on that idea?
 
Date: 9/12/2009 11:28:44 PM
Author: decodelighted
Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM

Author: strmrdr

Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM

Author: Cehrabehra

but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don't want him to say aw nevermind I won't comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that's the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!

33.gif
33.gif
huh?

I think she means the 'trade in policy?' line ... not that she was offended by it. Just maybe discouraged?
ah ok, was a logical question because re-cutting it makes no sense and it is very pretty the way it is.
 
Date: 9/12/2009 4:18:43 PM
Author: DiaGem

Date: 9/12/2009 3:55:14 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
long side:
I just rendered/enlarged both crown mains at the long side and one corner (as you displayed above)..., see the valley it will cut into the existing girdle??? Now you need to insert identical valley''s to the pavilion side enlargement..., resulting in eliminating the existing girdle and shortening the length of the shape.

Hope it is understandable..., pure physics as per your example...
Diagem,

Just wanted to say thank-you this is highly informative and interesting to me. Although this may be nothing more than an academic and theoretical excercise I appreciate the time and efforts and diagrams and discussion put forth.
 
Date: 9/12/2009 1:43:44 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
Okay, I''m either lazy or impatient so I''m going to just post my old cushion chart I made like 3 years ago and start a conversation because diagem says I should know and I don''t know but I want to more than know, I want to understand.

So in this chart the stones I am looking at in particular are 5, 6, and 8:

15cushions.jpg


In 5 you have a slightly elongated cushion (I''d guess 1:1.20 and by guess I measured the screen lol) and 8 evenly spaced mains.
In 6 you have a very slightly elongated cushion (I''d guess 1:1.10 but by measure it also is 1:1.20) with thin corner mains.
In 8 you have what by eyeball looks about the same 1.20 ratio with the ends even and wider along the sides.

Here''s my stone - from my sarin:

cbsrnpav.jpg


And here is futzing with my stone in paintshop (I''ll get back to the question in the next post)
Does anyone have a shot of a true old mine brilliant with evenly sized 8 mains?

I think GIA grades any cushion with a Table below (54%) as being an Old Mine Brilliant (wrongly calling an OMC an OMB) but does anyone have a photograph or video of an actual stone that has the facet structure of an OMB (5) in the plots above?
 
Date: 9/12/2009 10:21:18 PM
Author: Cehrabehra


Date: 9/12/2009 9:48:33 PM
Author: Harriet


Date: 9/12/2009 5:51:06 PM

Author: Cehrabehra

culet wouldn't go anywhere - if anything I wish it was larger lol
Only diamond and gem culets, right?
2.gif

LMAO!!! Omg I was looking for all that sarin info and ran across those funny pictures I made way back when. Every time I see your name a voice in my mind goes, 'harriet, sweet harriet. Hard hearted harbinger of hagis' lol
Mike Meyers Forever!
19.gif
 
Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM
Author: strmrdr
Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM

Author: Cehrabehra

DS!! Hi :) your sigline is too apropos lol


I honestly am not pushing for a recut - I''m happy to be convinced it is unneeded but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!

33.gif
33.gif
huh?

No worries storm - Deco is right but I''m not upset at all. I''ve known you here a long time and I appreciate your candor but your sentiments do echo my own doubts so there is that... I figure now is as good a time as any to turn over any mossy stones left strewn around.

I''m not looking to create problems where problems don''t exist (ie recutting something that doesn''t need it), but I also am ready to look at my stone objectively and without the blinders of initial love on.

Anything you have to offer is not only welcome, it is appreciated. I do want to keep my stone though - I have goofy intrinsic love for it flaws and all lol
 
Date: 9/12/2009 11:28:44 PM
Author: decodelighted
Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM

Author: strmrdr

Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM

Author: Cehrabehra

but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!

33.gif
33.gif
huh?

I think she means the ''trade in policy?'' line ... not that she was offended by it. Just maybe discouraged?


Anyway -- my vote is new setting period. No recut. No tweaking. And it doesn''t matter *who* cut the darn thing. Seriously. Does it matter who built your house? Do you want to invite them over for dinner & talk about the depth of the kick plates under the cabinets? What happened to the wonkiness being its main appeal? You can ''improve'' something right into soulessness. Sure you might know the person who ruined your stone but is that gonna help you sleep at night. I think not. Find a temp setting. See how you feel about it in *any* other setting. The way a loose stone performs is very different -- you might have had the same feeling about any perfectly perfect cushion. Or other complaints. Etc. You''ll have two years to think about this while you''re in China. What''s the rush?
1.gif

I love your levelheadedness :) Thank you Deco!
 
Date: 9/13/2009 12:00:43 AM
Author: diamondseeker2006
Haha...wish I''d follow my signature line!


Gosh, good emeralds are not easy to find....and they are pretty soft. Sure you''re stuck on that idea?

I am stuck on the idea but I would like to find a funky emerald - not try to go for perfection, especially at this size! I know it is against the norm but I cannot afford a 9.5x7.5 glorious emerald - but it is my birthstone as well as my husband''s and I can''t imagine a stone more perfect for this family ring (recall the 3 rubies on the underneath). Plus my 40th birthday is in May so the timing is perfect. I''ll have to post on the colored stones forum to throw some more around. If I was flexible on it I''d go for that green sapphire that Deco posted - good grief that is a seriously handsome stone! The price point I''m looking at for the emerald would be such that if anything did happen to it I could replace it without breaking the bank. Bonus is that this setting if you recall is like fort knox with the 8 prongs. I think the setting will be perfect for a right hand ring and family heirloom ring like I always wanted. The ring has several qualities that I really like - it has one of the nicest profile shots I''ve ever seen and I think a colored stone in there will be a perfect contrast.
 
Date: 9/13/2009 12:01:55 AM
Author: strmrdr
Date: 9/12/2009 11:28:44 PM

Author: decodelighted

Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM


Author: strmrdr


Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM


Author: Cehrabehra


but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!


33.gif
33.gif
huh?


I think she means the ''trade in policy?'' line ... not that she was offended by it. Just maybe discouraged?

ah ok, was a logical question because re-cutting it makes no sense and it is very pretty the way it is.
Date: 9/13/2009 12:01:55 AM
Author: strmrdr
Date: 9/12/2009 11:28:44 PM

Author: decodelighted

Date: 9/12/2009 10:55:28 PM


Author: strmrdr


Date: 9/12/2009 10:19:52 PM


Author: Cehrabehra


but when storm makes comments like he did well... and I don''t want him to say aw nevermind I won''t comment anymore, I just want to explore this. The very least I need to reset it but if that''s the case then I have some time. What I need to find sooner is an emerald!!


33.gif
33.gif
huh?


I think she means the ''trade in policy?'' line ... not that she was offended by it. Just maybe discouraged?

ah ok, was a logical question because re-cutting it makes no sense and it is very pretty the way it is.

ahhhhhhh okay that makes sense - I thought you looked at the sarin and went holy sh* that is one hell of a messed up stone, can you exchange it? lol
 
I think GIA grades any cushion with a Table below (54%) as being an Old Mine Brilliant (wrongly calling an OMC an OMB) but does anyone have a photograph or video of an actual stone that has the facet structure of an OMB (5) in the plots above?

That maximilian diamond is not quite as long but it still is somewhat elongated and it has what I consider absolutely beautiful and visually even pavillions
30.gif


by my measurements this is a 1.16 ratio stone. It is a little big at 40+ carats but... to me this is the absolute perfect look to a stone. perfect ratio - perfect pavillions... just gorgeous gorgeous. Slightly out of my price range ;)

cbhea1234rtsmaxdiamond.jpg
 
Mike Meyers Forever!
19.gif
[/quote]

beautiful, bemused, bellicose butcha.
 
Date: 9/12/2009 1:48:20 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
I just want to say WHEEEEEEEE I totally remember why I had so much fun on rocky talk back in the day lol

Okay - so I am not suggesting that my stone be recut in the way I have marked in red on my sarin (probably too shallow to accommodate that) but why couldn''t a stone be cut like that in general at 1.26? You say it like it is a simple concept but I really don''t know. I always hoped that someone would give me diamcalc as a gift but alas, I am not so special lol
Well that is not true - you are very special and your knowledge and interest in diamonds is way above average even for people who worked in the industry for decades.
Sergey asked me to post this message and Admin agrees that it would be fun and educational for all.

“Hi Cehrabehra,
We do not like do gifts but if you are “special enough”, you can receive DC
1) We send you DC( Hasp key for standard version)
2) You try do recut in DC (cut Designer). You need use your current 3D model and optimize pattern or Light Return at least. It is hard task , but you have real chances do it.
3) If you publish reasonable results ( new 3d model with low yield lost (up to you
1.gif
), good LR,.. and YOU AGREE for such RECUT! Reasonable good result means you agree for such recut ) in 3 months on PS, you won DC. Otherwise you need return hasp key
DO you agree for such game? “


Let us know Sara, and we will have someone send you a DiamCalc hasp key.
 
Wow - that is the most flattering thing... I''m speechless! I used the free version a couple years ago. I know I have always said that it''s all physics and the numbers are just waiting to be crunched out, but I never thought I would be handed the tools to do it myself lol I have no idea how long or involved the learning curve is on this. I''m going to email you Garry.

Thank you Sergey! :)
 
Date: 9/13/2009 2:19:57 AM
Author: Cehrabehra

I think GIA grades any cushion with a Table below (54%) as being an Old Mine Brilliant (wrongly calling an OMC an OMB) but does anyone have a photograph or video of an actual stone that has the facet structure of an OMB (5) in the plots above?

That maximilian diamond is not quite as long but it still is somewhat elongated and it has what I consider absolutely beautiful and visually even pavillions
30.gif


by my measurements this is a 1.16 ratio stone. It is a little big at 40+ carats but... to me this is the absolute perfect look to a stone. perfect ratio - perfect pavillions... just gorgeous gorgeous. Slightly out of my price range ;)
Very nice stone obviously, but as Jon pointed out, while the facets may be more evenly sized the optics do not exhibit the same such symmetry. Looks like a considerable amount of darkness and obstruction breaking up those mains.
 
Date: 9/14/2009 10:19:11 AM
Author: Cehrabehra
Wow - that is the most flattering thing... I''m speechless! I used the free version a couple years ago. I know I have always said that it''s all physics and the numbers are just waiting to be crunched out, but I never thought I would be handed the tools to do it myself lol I have no idea how long or involved the learning curve is on this. I''m going to email you Garry.

Thank you Sergey! :)

Sounds fun. :)
 
Date: 9/14/2009 9:38:00 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

Date: 9/12/2009 1:48:20 PM
Author: Cehrabehra
I just want to say WHEEEEEEEE I totally remember why I had so much fun on rocky talk back in the day lol

Okay - so I am not suggesting that my stone be recut in the way I have marked in red on my sarin (probably too shallow to accommodate that) but why couldn''t a stone be cut like that in general at 1.26? You say it like it is a simple concept but I really don''t know. I always hoped that someone would give me diamcalc as a gift but alas, I am not so special lol

Well that is not true - you are very special and your knowledge and interest in diamonds is way above average even for people who worked in the industry for decades.
Sergey asked me to post this message and Admin agrees that it would be fun and educational for all.

“Hi Cehrabehra,
We do not like do gifts but if you are “special enough”, you can receive DC

1) We send you DC( Hasp key for standard version)
2) You try do recut in DC (cut Designer). You need use your current 3D model and optimize pattern or Light Return at least. It is hard task , but you have real chances do it.
3) If you publish reasonable results ( new 3d model with low yield lost (up to you
1.gif
), good LR,.. and YOU AGREE for such RECUT! Reasonable good result means you agree for such recut ) in 3 months on PS, you won DC. Otherwise you need return hasp key
DO you agree for such game? “


Let us know Sara, and we will have someone send you a DiamCalc hasp key.
Interesting..., just lets make it clearer...

Garry..., who will judge "reasonable results" (LR and low yield loss) in OMC?
If Cehra agrees for such a recut..., who will execute? Is she free to pick the cutting house?
 
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