Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for stone.

[zpsale01]

Obviously very excited about my upcoming proposal. My soon to be fiance' is Indian and prefers yellow gold to white or platinum, and edwardian setting at that.

It's been a difficult find to say the least. Going to build the setting custom and purchase the ring from most likely a PS vendor.


Below is a hearts and arrows diamond I am considering.

Since setting the diamond in yellow gold I figure I could go with a J color.
Cut is my most important factor and prefer the diamond is GIA certified.



Calling all Diamond Experts! Does this diamond seem like a good deal? I will have my friend who is a jeweler look at the stone once its delivered but was wondering if anyone could provide feedback on the hearts and arrows image and diamond price?

below are 3 diamonds I am considering.

The first is the hearts and arrows.

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-4868894-1.58-carat-Round-diamond-J-color-VS2-Clarity.aspx?sku=4868894&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-4826008-1.58-carat-Round-diamond-J-color-VVS1-Clarity.aspx?sku=4826008&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com

http://www.b2cjewels.com/dd-4757997-1.66-carat-Round-diamond-J-color-SI1-Clarity.aspx?sku=4757997&utm_source=pricescope.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=pricescope.com


REALLY APPRECIATE THE HELP!!!

 

[luvdajules]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Hi OP, I'm not sure that the first selection would be considered true ideal H&A due to the large table and the other 2 are more 60/60 stones, can be beautiful, though and big for the price. A little clarification? You say cut is most important to you, do you want to stick to true ideal proportions or is good light performance enough? To be safe, I might stick with Whiteflash ACAs, GoG Superior, Brian Gavin Signature and Crafted by Infinity (they have a 1.5 ct. J/Si2 with twinning wisps that's eye clean for $11k). Those are all H&A stones. I'm sure someone more expert will come along soon, especially if I'm steering you wrong

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I would say good light performance is good enough.

My fiance' LOVED many of the antique edwardian rings we looked at, considering many of those stones were lower color grade than J and less brilliant (European cut/miners stone)
Would think the sparkle of a excellent cut GIA would capture her eye.


One item to note.

I cant go too big because she has a 3.5 to size 4 finger. we looked at some 2 and 2.5 carat stones and she said they looked WAY to big on her hand.

Really appreciate the prompt response

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

What is a 60/60 stone?

 

[Just_Starting]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

What is a 60/60 stone?

A stone with a depth and table both around 60%. This is just a different kind of look to what most people on PS would want. 60/60 stones can look amazing, they can look terrible.

I too began my diamond search wanting only a GIA excellent. I now realise that GIA excellent is by no means a guarantee of a beautiful diamond - I would argue the GIA is worse at assessing cut than any of the other 4C's. If you want a diamond that is guaranteed to be really well cut - get an AGS 0 stone. The difference between AGS 0 and GIA excellent can be huge - if you do not know your stuff then I wouldn't take it upon yourself to pick a GIA excellent. You may think, as I did, that GIA excellent would definitely look amazing. AGS 0, provided no clarity issues should do (basically I have far more faith in AGS cut grading and they're excellent at grading the other c's too). I would definitely look at good old gold/get in contact with them and they'll help you find an amazing stone for your budget. They may not be the cheapest, but their price is worth it as they do all the research for you. If you want to be sure to be safe clarity wise, get VS2 or better (VVS and above is probably over kill).

If you still want a GIA excellent cut stone, then at least use the HCA tool (google search it) and input the stats it wants to determine if the stone is likely to be any good. It's an elimination tool - not a selection too, so if you find a stone you like input the data and if it scores above 2 I would reject. AGS 0 do not require to be checked this way.

P.S. vendors like good old gold go way beyond the 4C's, which is incredibly important for selecting a winner.

 

[luvdajules]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Hi OP, 60/60 refers to 60% table and 60 % depth combo. It typically has more brilliance (white light return), less fire (color flashes) and spread (size looks big for carat weight). Okay, that helps clarify. Hmm, since she enjoys the vintage look of edwardian, you may want to look at vintage ring sites and consider an old antique cut too for the stone. Like an oec or oem or transitional. Check out Jewels by Grace and there are more expert vintage posters so they might chime in too with tons of websites for that look. If you do a search for vintage styles or other key word "oec", "transitional", "edwardian" I'm sure lots of old threads will pop up. It helps to read a ton of old threads to get a feel for what you are looking for. Also, you could do a warmer colored stone in an old cut K,l,m or lower, it will look warmer in a yellow gold setting, though.

 

[tyty333]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

The first stone looks good. All numbers look good. It should be a pretty stone. Who called is H&A? It's pretty subjective.
Some folks would call it H&A and others may call it near H&A.

Also wanted to mention you might think about going with 18k gold. I think Indians value it over lower carat gold. Hopefully
some of our PS members will chime in.

Edit - here is some info on 60/60 stones (table/depth).
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/60-60-proportioned-diamond

Here is info on what Tolkowsky proportions.
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/tolkowsky-ideal-cut-diamond

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

What is a 60/60 stone?

A stone that is near 60% depth with a table near 60%.

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

excellent information.

for the poster who commented on antique rings... I have looked at every site mentioned. Scoured over at least 500 antique rings. Problem is, Yellow gold and larger than a carat. Just very difficult to find.

Have a jeweler in town who will create custom based off some beautiful white gold and platinum edwardian settings she likes.

Excellent information. I'm surprised that hearts and arrows is not a certification, you mean to tell me that ANYONE can call a diamond hearts and arrows?

What does everyone think if I moved down to a K color? considering i am setting in 18k yellow gold?

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I too began my diamond search wanting only a GIA excellent. I now realise that GIA excellent is by no means a guarantee of a beautiful diamond - I would argue the GIA is worse at assessing cut than any of the other 4C's. If you want a diamond that is guaranteed to be really well cut - get an AGS 0 stone. The difference between AGS 0 and GIA excellent can be huge - if you do not know your stuff then I wouldn't take it upon yourself to pick a GIA excellent. You may think, as I did, that GIA excellent would definitely look amazing. AGS 0, provided no clarity issues, should do (basically I have far more faith in AGS cut grading and they're excellent at grading the other c's too).

I agree 1,000%! Well said!

 

[Just_Starting]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I too began my diamond search wanting only a GIA excellent. I now realise that GIA excellent is by no means a guarantee of a beautiful diamond - I would argue the GIA is worse at assessing cut than any of the other 4C's. If you want a diamond that is guaranteed to be really well cut - get an AGS 0 stone. The difference between AGS 0 and GIA excellent can be huge - if you do not know your stuff then I wouldn't take it upon yourself to pick a GIA excellent. You may think, as I did, that GIA excellent would definitely look amazing. AGS 0, provided no clarity issues, should do (basically I have far more faith in AGS cut grading and they're excellent at grading the other c's too).

I agree 1,000%! Well said!

Thank you . All information I have attained on this forum, I love PS ^_^.

 

[WinkHPD]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

excellent information.

for the poster who commented on antique rings... I have looked at every site mentioned. Scoured over at least 500 antique rings. Problem is, Yellow gold and larger than a carat. Just very difficult to find.

Have a jeweler in town who will create custom based off some beautiful white gold and platinum edwardian settings she likes.

Excellent information. I'm surprised that hearts and arrows is not a certification, you mean to tell me that ANYONE can call a diamond hearts and arrows?

What does everyone think if I moved down to a K color? considering i am setting in 18k yellow gold?

The sharp contrast between the rich warm yellow color of the 18kt gold and the K color will make the diamond appear to be whiter than it actually is. In a well cut diamond the color is minimal any way, but in 18kt yellow it should be delicious.

Wink

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Agree 100% with Wink. And I must state for the record that, while AGS does indeed have a stricter cut-metric, diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and unilaterally accepted report.

Understanding that, this community is adept at taking GIA numbers and cross-referencing them via HCA, AGS guidelines (etc) to be sure that your GIA graded diamond will also match AGS guidelines for their top performance grade.

In short: Either path is open. GIA with demonstrable proof of top cut quality as well as AGS Ideal, which is (currently) a very strict metric for diamond performance.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Agree 100% with Wink. And I must state for the record that, while AGS does indeed have a stricter cut-metric, diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and unilaterally accepted report.

Understanding that, this community is adept at taking GIA numbers and cross-referencing them via HCA, AGS guidelines (etc) to be sure that your GIA graded diamond will also match AGS guidelines for their top performance grade.

In short: Either path is open. GIA with demonstrable proof of top cut quality as well as AGS Ideal, which is (currently) a very strict metric for diamond performance.

I agree. I have had an outstanding H&A stone before that was GIA graded. I like that GIA can be stricter on color grading as well.

I would go with the J VS2 diamond. It looks nicely cut although I doubt it would be considered true H&A in the stricter sense. I think it is fine, though! I like that they have images for the stone. I don't care to overpay for VVS and I like VS over SI, so easy decision for me between these three! I would not go down to K color. Stick with J and stay in the near colorless range.

Have you seen Beverley K settings? Any of them can be ordered in 18k gold and it is much less risky to me that trying to have an antique style ring custom made unless this jeweler happens to specialize in that (for example, SingleStone).

Have you considered putting an Old European cut diamond in the setting? Because it would make more sense to me to put the right kind of diamond in a replica of an Edwardian ring. Show us your example ring, too, and we might can show you something similar.

 

[Just_Starting]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Agree 100% with Wink. And I must state for the record that, while AGS does indeed have a stricter cut-metric, diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and unilaterally accepted report.

Understanding that, this community is adept at taking GIA numbers and cross-referencing them via HCA, AGS guidelines (etc) to be sure that your GIA graded diamond will also match AGS guidelines for their top performance grade.

In short: Either path is open. GIA with demonstrable proof of top cut quality as well as AGS Ideal, which is (currently) a very strict metric for diamond performance.

I agree with everything you have put here - however I feel that for a beginner a safer bet would be AGS 0 instead of GIA excellent (if rushing into a decision). If someone is prepared to do their research then great but if it's a rush buy I'd stick to the AGS 0 .

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I agree with everything you have put here - however I feel that for a beginner a safer bet would be AGS 0 instead of GIA excellent (if rushing into a decision). If someone is prepared to do their research then great but if it's a rush buy I'd stick to the AGS 0

I certainly understand what you are saying, in the sense that rushing into a decision might need a snap-judgment. That’s where participation on Pricescope can make a difference. As diamondseeker inferred, GIA grades some of the most well-cut diamonds in the world. They grade nearly 100X that of AGSL, including many that would max out both AGS0 and demanding H&A metrics. Bluntly put, it’s the preferred laboratory for the planet.

Now before anyone lynches me please know I ‘get’ the safer-bet and appropriateness of AGS0 for a blind-buy market. I respect and study the AGS cut requirements. As an example, were I kidnapped, covered in water, hooked to a car-battery and told to purchase a diamond sight-unseen with no HCA link, no idealscope or aset and no assistance from specialists then, in terms of cut-quality, yeah AGS0 is the obvious safe play.

But here we are. Pricescope. No forcing, no need to sacrifice and no raw-cranking-amps. In this place one can put-forward any diamond that has enough data plus a scientific image or two, and the community will provide great input about its cut merits, or shortcomings.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

They (GIA) grade nearly 100X that of AGSL, including many that would max out both AGS0 and demanding H&A metrics. Bluntly put, it’s the preferred laboratory for the planet.

That's a pretty smooth spin there Brian! You know, and we know, that GIA is far more lenient that AGS, hence the volume of business.

When vendors are confident in their stones - they send them to AGS, when they need an easy XXX, they send them to GIA.

 

[MollyMalone]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Sandy, it's a mistake to dismiss Diamond Hawk's observation that "diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and [universally] accepted report."

Although both AGS and GiA were founded in the 1930's, GIA issued its first, diamond grading reports in 1955 & now has 10 labs around the world. AGS didn't offer diamond grading services until 41 years later (1996), has just the 1 lab in the US; and even AGS lab client paperwork is more US-centric. For example, AGS wants the client's Jewelry Board of Trade number & US taxpayer ID number (JBT, based in NYC, is open to international members, but it's largely an American trade association)
https://www.agslab.com/bac/pdf/agsl_client_application.pdf

Plus, GIA has, for years, assessed colored gems and pearls, not just diamonds, so that too has engendered greater name recognition & level of familiarity/comfort with GIA amongst retail customers.

It's a GIA lab report you will receive -- not an AGS one -- should you purchase a diamond engagement ring from Harry Winston, Van Cleef & Arpels, Graff, or Cartier. All of whom make a point of noting the GIA reports on their web sites.

 

[tyty333]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I too began my diamond search wanting only a GIA excellent. I now realise that GIA excellent is by no means a guarantee of a beautiful diamond - I would argue the GIA is worse at assessing cut than any of the other 4C's. If you want a diamond that is guaranteed to be really well cut - get an AGS 0 stone. The difference between AGS 0 and GIA excellent can be huge - if you do not know your stuff then I wouldn't take it upon yourself to pick a GIA excellent. You may think, as I did, that GIA excellent would definitely look amazing. AGS 0, provided no clarity issues, should do (basically I have far more faith in AGS cut grading and they're excellent at grading the other c's too).

I agree 1,000%! Well said!

Thank you . All information I have attained on this forum, I love PS ^_^.

He is not taking it upon himself to pick a stone. He is here on PS asking for help. That IS what we do here on PS.

Although, what you state in general may be true, each stone must be judged on its own merits.

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Sandy, it's a mistake to dismiss Diamond Hawk's observation that "diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and [universally] accepted report."

I wasn't dismissing, I was clarifying. In 2006, GIA issued a 5-grade, proportion-based quality system for round brilliant colorless diamonds for the first time. This new system relies upon a 2-dimensional system to determine a diamond’s cut grade. As a result, GIA certs not only include the usual crown and pavilion angles but also lower girdle and star facet information.

However, this new addition to GIA’s grading certification has also become an industry wide downfall. Many have criticised GIA for being too lenient on deeper and steeper cut stones which can be a direct disadvantage to many retailers and consumer’s relying upon GIA’s “Excellent” cut specifications. In other words, GIA’s “excellent” cut grade includes a very wide range of cut parameters with around 50% of the diamonds submitted to the lab getting this cut grade.

Since GIA came out with their new cut grade parameters, many diamond cutters are using this to their advantage. they knowingly cut stones to the maximum possible weight that is acceptable within the “excellent” weight grade while still maintaining the price premium for an excellent graded stone. Don't forget that a GIA excellent cut stone has nothing to do with hearts and arrows symmetry; which is an entirely different subject pertaining to specific cut and facet proportions.

Although GIA “Excellent” cut grade is still considered an elite grading, it is important to know that the American Gem Society (AGS) cut grading system uses a more advanced 3-dimensional system to determine a diamond’s cut. Additionally, AGS utilizes human analysis, an angular spectrum evaluation tool (ASET), and optical physics ray-tracing software to determine the quantity and quality of light that is returned to the observer (in motion as well as in a face-up static position).

All of these tools help to give AGS an overall summary of the interaction of light within any given diamond and therefore is used to determine if a diamond’s cut is AGS “Ideal Light Performance” grade. Because the AGS cut evaluation process is very stringent and exact, (given to less than 1% of all diamonds in shapes where cut is graded), the AGS 0 ‘Ideal’ grade is the world’s strictest laboratory standard for cut.

He is not taking it upon himself to pick a stone. He is here on PS asking for help. That IS what we do here on PS.

Just Starting IS trying to help from the perspective of a newbie and stated his/her opinion. Do they have to help in the way that you dictate?

 

[chrono]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

The sharp contrast between the rich warm yellow color of the 18kt gold and the K color will make the diamond appear to be whiter than it actually is. In a well cut diamond the color is minimal any way, but in 18kt yellow it should be delicious.
Wink

Wink,
Do you really think so? I have an L OMC (or rather AVC) which I've set in 14K WG and 18K YG and saw more warmth/tint when it is set in 18K YG. It looked whiter when it was in 14K WG.

 

[WinkHPD]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

The sharp contrast between the rich warm yellow color of the 18kt gold and the K color will make the diamond appear to be whiter than it actually is. In a well cut diamond the color is minimal any way, but in 18kt yellow it should be delicious.
Wink

Wink,
Do you really think so? I have an L OMC (or rather AVC) which I've set in 14K WG and 18K YG and saw more warmth/tint when it is set in 18K YG. It looked whiter when it was in 14K WG.

Not having seen that particular diamond I can not say, but it has been my experience that the very warm 18kt yellow makes most diamonds look whiter. Perhaps if the head on your diamond is also yellow gold the diamond is picking up some of the yellow from that. I do also have to admit that the rich warmth of the 18kt yellow just gives me the warm fuzzies!

It is also possible that being surrounded by the yellow is allowing a warmth to enter the stone from the sides of the OMC cut, which does handle light differently than a modern round brilliant cut.

With its broad flashes of white and colored light I am imagining the L OMC must be a gorgeous diamond.

Wink

 

[MollyMalone]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Sandy, it's a mistake to dismiss Diamond Hawk's observation that "diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and [universally] accepted report."

I wasn't dismissing, I was clarifying. * * *

It's your broad swipe -- which did not acknowledge the worldwide marketplace realities of longstanding that Diamond Hawk was referring to --

You know, and we know, that GIA is far more lenient that AGS, hence the volume of business.

When vendors are confident in their stones - they send them to AGS, when they need an easy XXX, they send them to GIA.

that prompted my comments.

Of course, the marketplace landscape is subject to change. But it's simply not accurate to declare as unequivocal gospel that GIA's volume of business is due to its leniency [in grading cut].

 

[Just_Starting]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I too began my diamond search wanting only a GIA excellent. I now realise that GIA excellent is by no means a guarantee of a beautiful diamond - I would argue the GIA is worse at assessing cut than any of the other 4C's. If you want a diamond that is guaranteed to be really well cut - get an AGS 0 stone. The difference between AGS 0 and GIA excellent can be huge - if you do not know your stuff then I wouldn't take it upon yourself to pick a GIA excellent. You may think, as I did, that GIA excellent would definitely look amazing. AGS 0, provided no clarity issues, should do (basically I have far more faith in AGS cut grading and they're excellent at grading the other c's too).

I agree 1,000%! Well said!

Thank you . All information I have attained on this forum, I love PS ^_^.

He is not taking it upon himself to pick a stone. He is here on PS asking for help. That IS what we do here on PS.

Although, what you state in general may be true, each stone must be judged on its own merits.

I agree and that was my intended implication that if he does go with a GIA excellent to make sure he gets it checked on here . I certainly wouldn't exclude a stone for being a GIA excellent cut instead of AGS 0 and I would do as I implied and as you suggested, come on here and get advice from everyone else. For the OP note that I'm new here too and still very much in the learning process so make sure you take the advice of more experienced members over mine.

To clarify, whichever stone you go for I would suggest getting it checked on here, even if it is an AGS 0.

 

[chrono]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Wink,
Yes, the entire ring (basket, prongs and all) is 18K YG so I do think the OMC is picking up more colour from the setting. And thank you for the kind words. You are always so generous with compliments.

 

[WinkHPD]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Wink,
Yes, the entire ring (basket, prongs and all) is 18K YG so I do think the OMC is picking up more colour from the setting. And thank you for the kind words. You are always so generous with compliments.

Thank you for your nice comment.

It is so easy to be nice here and to compliment some of the incredible things I see here, there are just so many of them!

I do tend to be a little harsh on GIA X steep and deeps, but I am hoping someday, if they hear it from enough of us, they will fix their aberrant cut grade system with something that has been a little more scientifically derived. That to me is the real strength of the AGS system, they measured everything scientifically and did repeatable tests and set the metric high for receiving the AGS 0 cut grade.

Wink

 

[Roqsteady]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Sandy, it's a mistake to dismiss Diamond Hawk's observation that "diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and [universally] accepted report."

I wasn't dismissing, I was clarifying. In 2006, GIA issued a 5-grade, proportion-based quality system for round brilliant colorless diamonds for the first time. This new system relies upon a 2-dimensional system to determine a diamond’s cut grade. As a result, GIA certs not only include the usual crown and pavilion angles but also lower girdle and star facet information.

I don't think that's a clarification - it's drawing a conclusion and painting the vendors logic with broad brush that doesn't always apply. It's the conclusion that Diamond Hawk is trying to debunk (not entirely, but at least in part).

No one is doubting that AGS' cut system is more stringent than GIA's.

When vendors are confident in their stones - they send them to AGS, when they need an easy XXX, they send them to GIA.

This statement is implying that every GIA XXX is sent because they needed an easy XXX. And that is not necessarily true. The most obvious counterexamples I can think of is GOG's superior/premium H&A stones and Wink's Value Select diamonds. A good number of these are GIA XXX (all of the value select line were GIA XXX). Several of these would be on par with top of the line branded H&A AGS 000 stones, and most would be AGS 000, as confirmed with their own AGS PGS/ASET/IS technology. Why weren't they sent to AGS 000 then?

Again to quote diamond hawk:

And I must state for the record that, while AGS does indeed have a stricter cut-metric, diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and unilaterally accepted report.

The first element is "international" - the GIA's reaches are much broader than the AGS and span the globe in terms of its grading capacity and recognition. For example, Asian (the fastest growing diamond consumer market) consumers, have their mind set that they HAVE to have a GIA graded diamond. So if you were a vendor serving international clientele, you can 1) try to send the diamond all the way to the US (if an international cutter), and also wait longer (AGS is a smaller lab and has potentially a longer turnaround for grading stones) and 2) convince the clientele your serving of an entirely different certificate that they've grown up knowing, and even if you are able to do so, they'd have to convince their social circle that AGS wasn't the cheap-o route to get a good diamond (because again, GIA is the best in their minds). OR you can send it to the regional GIA, get it faster, give the client the peace of mind of the GIA certificate, while knowing you are also selling a quality diamond.

The second element is "unilaterally accepted." I don't think "accepted" here refers to "ease of achieving XXX" cut grade. It refers to the credence and reputation of the GIA across all vendors and consumers. Cutting technologies have improved over the years and polishers are more able to cut diamonds more precisely to what we'd call ideal proportions, but some vendors may simply have the affinity or be accustomed to working with the GIA to cert their diamonds and serve their clients. This is probably especially true in B&M stores.

We have to step back that on PS we're dealing with mostly online vendors, which is unique in and of itself, and also particularly high-end vendors who serve top quality diamonds. So it's definitely a small bubble compared to the vast world that is diamonds. The decision between getting a GIA XXX or AGS 000 isn't just a "cut" decision, it's a business decision. And getting a diamond graded by AGS may not be the best decision for every single vendor out there for who knows what reason. And while getting "not getting an AGS 000" can be one of them, it is is certainly not the only one.

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

They (GIA) grade nearly 100X that of AGSL, including many that would max out both AGS0 and demanding H&A metrics. Bluntly put, it’s the preferred laboratory for the planet.

That's a pretty smooth spin there Brian! You know, and we know, that GIA is far more lenient that AGS, hence the volume of business.

When vendors are confident in their stones - they send them to AGS, when they need an easy XXX, they send them to GIA.

In some cases that can be true, but not always.

Take our situation as an example: We manufacture and sell to bases of clients in different markets. We absolutely produce fine-makes which would earn Ideal if sent to AGS, but doing that would render them unsellable in China, India and Europe because AGS is largely unknown. Instead they go to GIA, which makes them attractive in all markets, and to resellers as well as consumers.

In this community we have ASET information provided by many sellers. Coupled with proportions-data it enables us to make reliable judgments about a diamond’s performance level, regardless of whether it’s graded by lab A or lab B. This isn’t to say your “spin” post is wrong. There are many circumstances where that can occur. But businesses who send to GIA, EGL or others for the purpose of trying to 'hide' poor performance in a liberal cut grade would not then offer idealscopes or ASETs with their diamonds.

And, while not germane to Pricescope, there are diamond shoppers in the world who go in with eyes-wide-open, not requiring AGS 0 H&A performance as a priority. Maybe they want a larger diamond. Maybe they don’t see the difference, personally. Whatever the reason, there are consumers who don’t mind cut a bit below perfect/0 (etc), if that makes some other priority possible. As long as there’s transparency from the seller there’s not a problem. It’s the buyer’s choice to go that route or not.

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Roqsteady - excellent post - right on point.

 

[teobdl]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

What does everyone think if I moved down to a K color? considering i am setting in 18k yellow gold?

I wouldn't go down to K color. Have a look at how yellow K's look, and the variation between tints and hues, at jamesallen.com .

Also, my feeling is that generally, setting in yellow gold makes a diamond look more yellow. It may be an optical illusion, it may be the stone actually taking on more yellow, but it generally makes it look more yellow than it is. It's not universally true, but generally, this plays a big role in why RockDiamond will set diamonds he wants to look yellow in yellow settings, and diamonds he wants to look white in white settings (diamondsbylauren.com).

Much safer to go with J, IMO, if you want a whiter looking diamond in the yellow setting. Otherwise, you might be getting more yellow than you wanted.

For a most critical color comparison of J vs K look at this recent thread: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/laboratory-master-set-photo.201317/page-2']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/laboratory-master-set-photo.201317/page-2[/URL] Then add in the fact that the yellow gold could make the body appear more yellow when looking at it from most angles.