Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for stone.

[SandyinAnaheim]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

This statement is implying that every GIA XXX is sent because they needed an easy XXX. And that is not necessarily true. The most obvious counterexamples I can think of is GOG's superior/premium H&A stones and Wink's Value Select diamonds. A good number of these are GIA XXX (all of the value select line were GIA XXX). Several of these would be on par with top of the line branded H&A AGS 000 stones, and most would be AGS 000, as confirmed with their own AGS PGS/ASET/IS technology. Why weren't they sent to AGS 000 then?

Again to quote diamond hawk: And I must state for the record that, while AGS does indeed have a stricter cut-metric, diamonds are frequently sent to GIA because it’s a far more international and unilaterally accepted report.

You're right, I wasn't taking into consideration the world-wide market in my comments, and I can see where GIA, being an internationally recognized laboratory, would be useful in business practices. And as Brian said, and we have seen here, not everyone values cut above all else.

As for Wink's Value Select stones, he says on his webpage: "Did you know that the GIA Excellent range is five times as liberal as the AGS Ideal range? Now consider that we are extremely selective, even within the high range of AGS Ideal, and you can understand that we will NOT choose and offer “just any” GIA Graded Round Brilliant. At High Performance Diamonds we have always taken the position that laboratory cut-grading is far too liberal, and we make no exceptions here." It would appear he is choosing the creme de la creme from already GIA graded stones. I don't know about GOG.

My personal experience with GIA ratings when I first started researching stones left a LOT to be desired and I was very disillusioned to learn that XXX does not mean a great stone. People who are just learning want to be able to trust that the certificate means something they can rely on, as not everyone actually wants to put in the time and effort to really learn and understand cut, dimensions, facet lengths, h&a, etc. - they just want to make a good choice and not waste their money. And I have been sent ASETs of crappy GIA XXX graded stones, I just didn't know how to read them at the time. So sending an ASET to an uneducated consumer doesn't help unless they have a forum like this to come to and have other impartial people help them navigate the oceans of data and opinion that exist.

 

[teobdl]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

You're right, I wasn't taking into consideration the world-wide market in my comments, and I can see where GIA, being an internationally recognized laboratory, would be useful in business practices. And as Brian said, and we have seen here, not everyone values cut above all else.

As for Wink's Value Select stones, he says on his webpage: "Did you know that the GIA Excellent range is five times as liberal as the AGS Ideal range? Now consider that we are extremely selective, even within the high range of AGS Ideal, and you can understand that we will NOT choose and offer “just any” GIA Graded Round Brilliant. At High Performance Diamonds we have always taken the position that laboratory cut-grading is far too liberal, and we make no exceptions here." It would appear he is choosing the creme de la creme from already GIA graded stones. I don't know about GOG.

My personal experience with GIA ratings when I first started researching stones left a LOT to be desired and I was very disillusioned to learn that XXX does not mean a great stone. People who are just learning want to be able to trust that the certificate means something they can rely on, as not everyone actually wants to put in the time and effort to really learn and understand cut, dimensions, facet lengths, h&a, etc. - they just want to make a good choice and not waste their money. And I have been sent ASETs of crappy GIA XXX graded stones, I just didn't know how to read them at the time. So sending an ASET to an uneducated consumer doesn't help unless they have a forum like this to come to and have other impartial people help them navigate the oceans of data and opinion that exist.

Here's how I think about it:
AGS 0 + branded cut like WF ACA, BGS, CBI = safest buys. Don't really need to think about it. Pay a good premium.
AGS 0 = safe buy.. but consider the character of the diamond if the PA/CA angles are on the extremes from their respective safe means. Pay a moderate premium.
GIA XXX = You need to look at the angles (or run it through the HCA if you don't know what you're looking for), and then look at the images (Idealscope or ASET, and head on view) to verify that it's not screwy. Pay a moderate premium if pre-selected by a vendor; but if you find it on JA, B2C or Ritani (I think, and probably others), then the premium is slight.

Information from the GIA XXX document can give you reason for hoping, but you really need more details to know what you're getting.

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Have you seen Beverley K settings? Any of them can be ordered in 18k gold and it is much less risky to me that trying to have an antique style ring custom made unless this jeweler happens to specialize in that (for example, SingleStone).

Have you considered putting an Old European cut diamond in the setting? Because it would make more sense to me to put the right kind of diamond in a replica of an Edwardian ring. Show us your example ring, too, and we might can show you something similar.

Surprisingly i can say i have not looked at her settings, considering i have looked at 100's.

I have thought about it but honestly... seems like Old Europeans are kinda "In Style" right now, therefore, a little overpriced considering the cut is inferior. Would also, like a new diamond with more fire and brilliance in the old setting.


What my fiance' currently likes is linked below. Will try to post picture later. She likes it rather simple and to sit pretty flush on the finger.

http://www.newyorkestatejewelry.com/engagement-rings/2.45ct-diamond-engagement-ring/22927/3/item#

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I here some of you mention HCA...

Is this the HCA score listed on the pricescope site/search page?

is it safer if the GIA XXX is also an HCA .6 or .8 etc?


FYI, B2C told me those two stones i liked above are not available (whatever that means?)

Thanks everyone.

 

[zpsale01]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

ALSO...

When searching on pricescope... If I search on H&A...

Is this a certification? can anyone claim a stone as Hearts and arrows?

 

[Roqsteady]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Here's my recommendation:

1.48 Brian Gavin Blue J SI1
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...1.483-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-bl-104069928011

Put this stone on hold ASAP. Stones right under 1.5 ct do not last long due to substantial savings. I can also speak personally to this stone as I actually bought it back in March and it was a gorgeous stone - completely eye clean and top notch cut. However since I was far under budget I decided to upgrade in color and returned the diamond. The medium blue fluorescence is actually a plus to me as it faces up a little whiter in certain lighting conditions, plus gives you an extra discount. Make sure to also ask for the PS discount.

If hitting the 1.5 ct mark is not as important to you as it is the face-up size on her finger, I don't think you could get a stone this big, with this quality cut, in your color tolerance level, in your price range elsewhere, let alone on b2c. (nothing against b2c, they provide decent stones at a good price, but they seem to be more of a budget vendor)

 

[teobdl]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Yes, definitely make sure the the HCA score of a GIA XXX is under 2.0. Anything under 2.0 will do, and then get idealscope image if possible, and staight on real image if possible as well

 

[SandyinAnaheim]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

I here some of you mention HCA...

HCA is the Holloway Cut Advisor, found up at the top of the page under Tools. https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

You plug in the appropriate numbers and it gives you a score on that stone's light return based on its dimensions. If you've got scores of .6 and .8, you're ROCKIN! The lower the better. This score is something you use as an exclusion tool, so between however many stones you're undecided on, you plug in the numbers and the tool helps you select based on performance.

 

[Just_Starting]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

On the hca page itself:
'A score below 2 (Excellent) means you have eliminated known poor performers (more than 95% of all diamonds). Your own personal preference may be for a diamond with an HCA score of 1.5 more rather than one with a lower score of say 0.5.'

Also I suggest taking a look at the graph and the zones the score fits into. Take these numbers for example:
Depth 60
Table 57
Crown 32 (here lies a problem)
Pavilion 41

HCA score 0.8 but if you look at the zones it fits into on the graph, it is actually outside of GIA/AGS top cut criteria. I don't have the exact stats to hand on a stone I looked at but it was something similar to this, although it fit just inside the GIA ex but not AGS 0.

My point is the HCA is not perfect and definitely come here to check results with people.

If you don't have it already here's a link:
https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

 

[luvdajules]

Re: Ignorant Man needs Help. Round Diamond 10K budget for st

Hi OP, just wanted to second putting that Brian Gavin Blue on hold asap! It would be a fabulous choice and such a great price. Also, your setting inspiration is beautiful and so romantic looking. It'll be a beauty