Ultimatum

[MissDimity]

Hi all,

Has anyone given their SO a proposal ultimatum?
I did after 1.5 years of dating/ living together.
I gave my SO 4 years from the time we started dating (July 17th 2005) to propose to me otherwise I would walk-out on him. The reason why I did this was his previous gf had been with him for 4 years and had not received a proposal, yet told all of his friends that they were getting engaged "soon": and I think a lack of commitment (proposal) was partly why they broke up. I also think 4 years of living together is long enough to decide if you want to be with someone for the rest of your life.
Anyhow, I have 7 months to go and I'm just thinking how rotten I would feel if he were to propose on the last day ,July 17th 2009. It would be like he didn't have a choice and that he just relented. I love him so much, however if the terms were set and he didn't propose, and he had known of the ultimatum for 2.5 years, I think I could rightly walk-out and not look back.

I would also be 26.5 years by that time, I am wanting to have my first child before 30. So if worst comes to worst I would want to have enough time to find a suitable other SO to fulfill my maternal dream. I could not think of anything worst than being in my early 30's desperate to find a man to settle down and start a family ( which is at what age his ex-gf left him and is still single now at 33 years).

 

[Smurfysmiles]

It may just be me (and it usually is lol) but I don''t think the best reason for giving an ultimatum for a relationship should be based off of his last relationship. They could have been together for 10 years and not gotten engaged...would that change your perspective? Everyone is different and if it''s meant to be it will be I really am against ultimatums altogether but if that is the right thing for you guys to do then I wish you luck.

 

[honey22]

Do not give an ultimatum unless you are prepared to go through with it! Be very very careful here.

Coming from someone who waited 12 years to be engaged (OMG, was that thud you falling off your chair?!

), I would really say think twice before you do this. I am not telling you should wait for ever, and if you seriously can''t see him comitting, or you waiting longer than this, then that''s fine. But I have to ask you, what would break your heart more - losing the man of your dreams, or waiting to be married to the man of your dreams.

I could have started issuing ultimatums around the 7th year, I could have left, I would have lost my soulmate, my best friend. Nothing would have been worse, not missing out on a ring, a wedding et etc.

I would have given up my future happiness, the one single thing in this world that is above all else. Every single year of waiting was worth having this man. If I had to, I would wait another ten years, it wouldn''t be easy, but it would be worth it.

In all honestly, I think if you are not prepared to wait for him to be ready, then maybe he''s not the one? I don''t mean that nastily, but I really think that if you truly deeply love someone, then give then some breathing space, and wait for them to be ready too. Nothing would be worse than knowing your whole marriage that you pushed him in to it.

 

[bee*]

Date: 12/6/2008 4:56:05 AM
Author: honey22
Do not give an ultimatum unless you are prepared to go through with it! Be very very careful here.


Coming from someone who waited 12 years to be engaged (OMG, was that thud you falling off your chair?!

), I would really say think twice before you do this. I am not telling you should wait for ever, and if you seriously can''t see him comitting, or you waiting longer than this, then that''s fine. But I have to ask you, what would break your heart more - losing the man of your dreams, or waiting to be married to the man of your dreams.


I could have started issuing ultimatums around the 7th year, I could have left, I would have lost my soulmate, my best friend. Nothing would have been worse, not missing out on a ring, a wedding et etc.


I would have given up my future happiness, the one single thing in this world that is above all else. Every single year of waiting was worth having this man. If I had to, I would wait another ten years, it wouldn''t be easy, but it would be worth it.


In all honestly, I think if you are not prepared to wait for him to be ready, then maybe he''s not the one? I don''t mean that nastily, but I really think that if you truly deeply love someone, then give then some breathing space, and wait for them to be ready too. Nothing would be worse than knowing your whole marriage that you pushed him in to it.

ditto all honey said. I was with D for over 8 years before we got engaged and I''m glad that I waited until he was 100% ready himself to take that next step. It''s great to have life plans and I applaud you for knowing what you want, but with something like this where you have another person thrown in, it should be about what you both want and not just one person. Does he want to be engaged by next July? Have a child in the next couple of years?

 

[SuiteLady]

As a 37 year old single woman, being single in my 30s isn''t so bad. I look back

and honestly, I am glad that I waited .

I would never give an ultimatum. I haven''t seen those work out well. Yeah, the friends got their rings and they may have even got married, but I know that isn''t for me. I would resent that I had to show my behind or use a threat to get my man to marry me.

I agree with Honey.

 

[MissDimity]

I agree with all of you. I have never put a guy through an ultimatum before and never thought well of those who have done so in the past. In think when I initially made a deadline, it was a flippant tongue and cheek remark , which later was repeated by him to his friends. And so the ''ultimatum'' grew to become what it is.. all his friends/ brother know of it.

I agree that some ultimatum based marriages don''t work. But I think these are usually made in a shorter period of time. Whereas at least I have given him 2.5 years to get into gear. He is 34 and ready for marriage, and to have kids asap. The ultimatum was based on the knowledge that marriage was "on the cards'' and that a proposal would be realistically possible in that timeframe.

On the other had a friend of a friend of ours recently, put forward an ultimatum to her bf of 2 years, giving him a month to propose before her birthday. He made it with 12 hours to spare, and her engagement/ ultimatum was widely publicized in the news ( she is a tv reporter). Saw her fiance recently at a wedding and congratulated him and he just kind of shrugged his shoulders, and was obviously not rapt with applause.

So in retrospect I probably should have not put fwd an ultimatum. However upon asking about his previous 4 year relationship and why he didn''t propose he has said, " she wanted to get married, I never wanted to marry her and never would have proposed or be married to her".

From, this I know he is strong enough to stick to his heart, and if I''m not the one, I know he would never be pushed into it.

 

[bee*]

wow that''s a tight deadline to give someone a month

If he''s 34 and ready for marriage and kids asap, do you know why he hasn''t proposed yet? Have you guys talked about it (apart from the ultimatum thing?)

 

[MissDimity]

Bee: He hasn't proposed because I had to be "ready".. this "ready" could me a number of things, to him but I think it really meant when I finished my physiotherapy degree, which I have just done (2 weeks ago and finally got my results today). Also, he really wanted his older brother ( 4 years older) to get married before him which happened from engagement ( June 0 to wedding (October 0 in 5 months this year.

After his brother announced his engagement to his gf of 1.5 years in June, my bf confided in me that he had intended to propose on our 3rd anniversary in July, however since his brother beat him to it, it was best if we waited till after there wedding to annouce ours so we didn't steal their thunder.

He bought an e-ring with me in September however we had to return the e- ring for a refund ( long story- posted in another thread), 3 weeks ago.

So, he would have probably proposed before the end of this year, however the proposal has been delayed as we have to find another ring/diamond now.

 

[bee*]

Finishing your degree is definitely a good reason to wait! Are you doing out to celebrate now the results are out? I hope that you get the ring and proposal soon!!

 

[MissDimity]

Bee: Thanks Bee I hope for a proposal soon too!.

Not really celebrating.. because they have just been gradually releasing results up to dec 17th so that is the official "result" day, and so today''s results were unexpected. However bf did cook dinner and we went out and bought ice-cream ( we usually don''t indulge in ice-cream so pathetically this is a luxury) to celebrate.

On Friday we went out to dinner( to celebrate my bf finishing his part-time after work web design course) and next Wednesday is my 26th birthday so again we will go out to dinner. So doing enough celebrating for other things.. and xmas!

Yeah I expect a proposal probably early next year, as bf next week will meet with a diamond dealer to choose another diamond. He gave me the choice of going with him? Don''t know whether to go or not? I helped choose the last diamond with him and it was a flop and major headache which I think I could live without doing again and be surprised, yet I know what I want in diamond.

What would you do?

 

[gwendolyn]

I would never give an ultimatum to my SO for anything out of fear that they''d be doing it because I told them they had to. Now, in teaching, that''s another story

, but in my personal life, I want to know it''s happening because we both want it.

 

[trillionaire]

I've certainly never given an ultimatum, and I do think they are dicey territory, but in the OP's defense, her perfect man may include someone who is willing to commit, someone who wants to get married, and someone who takes her wishes into account as well. Granted SO and I have been together for 5+ yrs with no end in sight, and I would stick it out with him for a very long time, but I am the type of person who has difficulty making future plans with someone else sans commitment, so eventually, if my need to make plans and move ahead with my life was affected, I could see myself giving him a timeline for when I was going to "move on." Yes, I love my SO, but my life is not 100% about taking both of our needs into account until we are BOTH committed to do so (which could be achieved formally or informally). If my needs re: committment are not being met, it is my job to make sure they do. It is his privelege to be able to do it, but it is not an entitlement. (this goes both ways. It is my privelege to be in SO's life, but I am not entitled in some way, to that right)

ETA: I don't really see the difference between internal and external deadlines, except that one gives the other person an opportunity to act, and the other keeps the cards all in one person's hands.

 

[MissDimity]

Here is the link to a news report covering our friend of a friends short ultimatum:

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24027042-5012974,00.html

 

[bee*]

Date: 12/6/2008 6:37:06 AM
Author: MissDimity



What would you do?

I''d probably go with him, but this is coming from the girl who went with her bf to pick the ring so the surprise element didn''t mean much to me. If you know what you want in a diamond, then how about picking the diamond out with him and let him pick out the setting so it''s a surprise to you that way. Or if you like a couple of settings email them to him and he can choose out of those so at least you''re getting something that you like!

 

[bee*]

Date: 12/6/2008 7:01:35 AM
Author: MissDimity
Here is the link to a news report covering our friend of a friends short ultimatum:


http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24027042-5012974,00.html

Was she not embarrassed to have this in the paper? I''d be mortified!

 

[MissDimity]

I think she was very much a LIW. As she is friends with the same friends as we are, she must like us have gone to at least 10 weddings over the past year and a half, with people in a similar age group to herself. They are both very successful and are finically in the position to settle down and by lots of property. Although he is younger than her, probably late 20''s (guesstimate as I know a few of his friends even before knowing either of them- small world) and most of his friends are fun, uncommitted, not ''relationship steady'' guys. If anything he is the Aussie version of Drew Carey ( exactly in appearance and manner), he is the kinda guy who needed an ultimatum to speed up the process towards marriage.

The show she reports on ''Today tonight'' is all about over the top every-day realistic dramas. i.e. '' cockroaches '' in the supermarket, '' lottery tickets or scratchies which has the better odds''. The drama associated with the ultimatum could have been a setup for the show. She is very nice and not an extrovert in real life though, so maybe the ultimatum was just meant to be between her and her bf, not public.

 

[BlueSki231]

Date: 12/6/2008 6:37:06 AM
Author: MissDimity
Bee: Thanks Bee I hope for a proposal soon too!.


Not really celebrating.. because they have just been gradually releasing results up to dec 17th so that is the official ''result'' day, and so today''s results were unexpected. However bf did cook dinner and we went out and bought ice-cream ( we usually don''t indulge in ice-cream so pathetically this is a luxury) to celebrate.


On Friday we went out to dinner( to celebrate my bf finishing his part-time after work web design course) and next Wednesday is my 26th birthday so again we will go out to dinner. So doing enough celebrating for other things.. and xmas!


Yeah I expect a proposal probably early next year, as bf next week will meet with a diamond dealer to choose another diamond. He gave me the choice of going with him? Don''t know whether to go or not? I helped choose the last diamond with him and it was a flop and major headache which I think I could live without doing again and be surprised, yet I know what I want in diamond.


What would you do?

Umm.. it sounds like you don''t even NEED to be thinking about an ultimatum.. he bought the ring and for whatever reason it had to be returned.. and now he''s going next week to look at diamonds and wants to know if you want to come with?!?!
I dunno why you''re even thinking about this anymore, it sounds like a proposal is in the works!

I would definitely love to go picking out diamonds with him if I were you, but if you said it just gave you a headache last time then let him pick one out himself!! If you''re up for the surprise! If you know what you want then give him some guidelines to go by and see what he comes up with.. if you''re brave enough to hand over all the control

 

[purselover]

I don''t believe in ultimatums you either want to put a ring on my finger or you don''t, if you don''t I''ll find someone who will without me making threats

 

[wannaBMrsH]

I never gave an actual ultimatum (I never said, propose or I am leaving or anything similar). But, I DID tell him as soon as we got serious that I could never date someone for years and years on end without the relationship progressing. He was previously married for 12 years and he wanted some time, which I could understand.

I don''t have a problem with others who date for a long time (some people are younger, in school, deployed, etc.). But in my case, I am 30 and college educated with a great job and some assets. I already know who I am and what I want in a partner. It won''t take me 6-10 years to know if someone else is the one. And if they are seeing me (or in our case, living with me) on a regular basis, it also doesn''t take a 33-year old college educated engineer with a firm career years and years to know if I am the woman for him.

Occassionally, I would ask him if there was anything that he felt he was waiting to know about me that just hadn''t come up. But mostly, I was very honest with him from the beginning. And I didn''t necessarily hide many "womanly rituals" from him when we moved in together. He doesn''t need to know about my Q-tip obsession (earwax OCD), but I didn''t hide my meltdown when I realized I had gone up a size from all of our yummy, romantic dinners!

In the end, we dated for almost a year and a half before he proposed. But, I think it''s because I was very honest from the beginning and I told him my expectations up front. We all have fantastic men, but they aren''t mind-readers. Just talk to your guy, because if he really is the one, he just wants to make you happy; he just needs a roadmap!

 

[neatfreak]

I think if he waits until the last possible second that should tell you something...that he''s not quite ready for whatever reason. I''m not a fan of ultimatums either, but you better be ready to follow through with it if you threaten it. Your word is all you''ve got.

 

[katica]

I don''t really believe in ultimatums, at least not direct ones like "propose by this time or else". That''s just me but it might work for others. Like some others said, I don''t want to feel like he only married me because of that and always have that hanging over my head. However, notice I said "direct" ultimatums. I see nothing wrong with us older ladies (ok I''m making it sound like I''m geriatric) who are in their late 20s and want to be moms soon "mentioning" that they will not wait around in a relationship that''s not moving forward when talking about other couples. My guy is very good at picking up subtleties so I can afford to say these things as asides (though I''m very direct and it''s hard for me to be subtle, in fact I''m ashamed to say I''ve had my share of meltdowns). I have told him that if he doesn''t see himself with me, to tell me so and then we don''t have to waste each other''s times. I think he''s be honest on that because the reason him and his ex broke up after 3 years was that she brought up getting married and he flat out honestly but gently told her that he doesn''t really see himself with her in the long term (ouch).. but at least he was honest and she can move on.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

I think internal deadlines serve a better purpose than ultimatums. Ultimatums create this tension within a relationship that just hovers over it. My then-boyfriend, now-husband gave me a deadline (for himself) and it was very uncomfortable. When he proposed at the end of his self-imposed deadline it just felt forced...it was genuine, but still unnatural. The issue was that he was only doing it to keep me, not because he was ready, which is the biggest danger with utlimatums. I ended up leaving the relationship anyway.

In my situation we had set up a long-term timeline when we first moved in together. We just wanted to make sure we were on the same page and that marriage was something we were working towards. When I started sensing his cold feet about the timeline, that''s when I set my internal deadline. He already knew our timeline, so it certainly wasn''t that I was keeping him in the dark, but it isn''t feasible for a person to wait forever. When I reached my internal deadline, I told him that I was moving out and moving on. That is when he created his deadline. Even then, he simply wasn''t ready.

That''s the problem with internal deadlines and ultimatums...sometimes they just don''t coincide with the natural progression of the relationship. You have to ask yourself "am I willing to wait?" I wasn''t and it worked for me...at some point you just become overcooked. If you are willing, there is nothing wrong with that either, you just have to keep the dialogue between you and your boyfriend OPEN so that talking about marriage is healthy and comfortable and not something either of you dread.

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 12/6/2008 1:21:39 PM
Author: NewEnglandLady
I think internal deadlines serve a better purpose than ultimatums. Ultimatums create this tension within a relationship that just hovers over it. My then-boyfriend, now-husband gave me a deadline (for himself) and it was very uncomfortable. When he proposed at the end of his self-imposed deadline it just felt forced...it was genuine, but still unnatural. The issue was that he was only doing it to keep me, not because he was ready, which is the biggest danger with utlimatums. I ended up leaving the relationship anyway.


In my situation we had set up a long-term timeline when we first moved in together. We just wanted to make sure we were on the same page and that marriage was something we were working towards. When I started sensing his cold feet about the timeline, that''s when I set my internal deadline. He already knew our timeline, so it certainly wasn''t that I was keeping him in the dark, but it isn''t feasible for a person to wait forever. When I reached my internal deadline, I told him that I was moving out and moving on. That is when he created his deadline. Even then, he simply wasn''t ready.


That''s the problem with internal deadlines and ultimatums...sometimes they just don''t coincide with the natural progression of the relationship. You have to ask yourself ''am I willing to wait?'' I wasn''t and it worked for me...at some point you just become overcooked. If you are willing, there is nothing wrong with that either, you just have to keep the dialogue between you and your boyfriend OPEN so that talking about marriage is healthy and comfortable and not something either of you dread.

Well said NEL. And it should be mentioned that NEL is a "moving out to do your own thing" success story and expert. She followed her internal deadline, left, and he came back to her because he realized he was missing out on a great gal and was finally ready.

Hope you don''t mind me mentioning that NEL...I just think it was such a strong thing for you to do for yourself.

 

[Nocturnius]

I did.

But mine was after he had proposed.

He proposed to me. We were ecstatic. He wanted to be married within the year. He couldn't stop talking about it. He called EVERYONE and started talking about dates (well, actually, he gave me the date he would insist on until I relented) and acted like he was totally ready.

Then I made a mistake. I moved in with him, because I felt secure that he had proposed that obviously we would get married.

All of a sudden, all the wedding and marriage talk totally stopped. And if I had the audacity to bring it up, he'd either give me this huge, irritated sigh, or say "I don't want to talk about this right now. We'll get married eventually."

Eventually? No, sorry, you proposed to me two and a half years ago. "Eventually" is not the right answer.

I finally sat down with him and said I'd had enough. He had taken me moving in as a sign that we didn't have to get married, and if I had known that, I wouldn't have moved in. Some women are fine being live-in girlfriends for the rest of their lives, and that's great that it works for them. It didn't for me. He had already promised marriage to me, and if he didn't keep that promise, I was leaving and I wasn't looking back. Period.

As for your ultimatum, I'm a little concerned. You should NEVER base your lives off of what his ex is doing, or what their relationship was like. She is an ex for a reason.

 

[radiantquest]

ok, i am probably the only one here, but i gave the unlimatum. we met in 2004. i told him that i would be married by 2010 or i would leave. i knew that i wanted to marry him after 2 weeks. he was with his ex for 11 years, 11!! and didnt marry her. i thought that telling him what i wanted and expected was fair. i felt that marriage was something that i wanted and made it clear that being a GF forever wasnt an option. we were married in september of this year and we are happier than ever. i know that alot of people will tell you that the ultimatum isnt a good idea, but it worked for me. i wasnt mean or spiteful or threatning i just made it clear that if he didnt want to marry me that was fine, but i would find someone else who would. simple

 

[vita*dolce]

i gave my boyfriend a "you have to quit smoking or we''re breaking up" ultimatum. it didn''t work. he''s still smoking and we''re still together.

the bottom line is that he isn''t going to do anything that he doesn''t want to do, and you shouldn''t try to force him to propose because that wouldn''t be good for either one of you. marriage should only be entered into by two people who want to make that commitment to one another!! you deserve that! so if you haven''t verbally given this ultimatum to him yet, you shouldn''t. just talk to him about the future of your relationship and ask him if he sees marriage in your future.

good luck!!

 

[babygirl]

WannaBMrsH, I said exactly the same thing to my bf once things (quickly) got serious. I''m very confident about what I''m looking for and told him that I wasn''t interested in "just dating" for an extended period of time. I''m not big on ultimatums/demanding that someone cooperate with my desires, but I did say that if he wasn''t sure if he wanted to marry me after two years of dating, that it wasn''t going to work out. Needless to say, we''re just coming up on our two year anniversary, and he''s saving for a ring : )

 

[laughwithme]

I guess my question (for everybody) is...

Where is the love??

This post and all responses were about timing and guidelines... whatever happened to being so madly in love with one person, you''d be willing to wait till the end of time?

Don''t get me wrong, I want B to propose asap and marriage is important to me, but if it came to no marriage as long as he could still be in my life, we would do that.

I am in love with him, forever. There is no deadline associated.

 

[ckrickett]

Date: 12/6/2008 4:56:05 AM
Author: honey22
Do not give an ultimatum unless you are prepared to go through with it! Be very very careful here.

Coming from someone who waited 12 years to be engaged (OMG, was that thud you falling off your chair?!

), I would really say think twice before you do this. I am not telling you should wait for ever, and if you seriously can''t see him comitting, or you waiting longer than this, then that''s fine. But I have to ask you, what would break your heart more - losing the man of your dreams, or waiting to be married to the man of your dreams.

I could have started issuing ultimatums around the 7th year, I could have left, I would have lost my soulmate, my best friend. Nothing would have been worse, not missing out on a ring, a wedding et etc.

I would have given up my future happiness, the one single thing in this world that is above all else. Every single year of waiting was worth having this man. If I had to, I would wait another ten years, it wouldn''t be easy, but it would be worth it.

In all honestly, I think if you are not prepared to wait for him to be ready, then maybe he''s not the one? I don''t mean that nastily, but I really think that if you truly deeply love someone, then give then some breathing space, and wait for them to be ready too. Nothing would be worse than knowing your whole marriage that you pushed him in to it.

100% agree

 

[trillionaire]

Date: 12/7/2008 8:23:15 PM
Author: laughwithme
I guess my question (for everybody) is...

Where is the love??

This post and all responses were about timing and guidelines... whatever happened to being so madly in love with one person, you'd be willing to wait till the end of time?

Don't get me wrong, I want B to propose asap and marriage is important to me, but if it came to no marriage as long as he could still be in my life, we would do that.

I am in love with him, forever. There is no deadline associated.

For one, you always love who you love until you don't anymore. I love my ex, still, but not in the same way. Two, I think 'forever' is exactly the point. I think you are hearing women saying, 'I want to be with this person forever, and if you feel the same way, make that be known. And if you can't, I need to be with someone who is willing to say I am your everything and forever, too.

Part of being in a relationship is taking leaps of faith, doing things that you don't want to do, or that you are not quite ready for. For example, SO and I went out with a college friend tonight for dinner. He was in a bad mood, he didn't want to go, and he was really cranky, and all of that melted away when I told him it would mean a lot to me if he went. (he said no, more than once at first) To date someone for 12 yrs and be unwilling to either make a committment or FREE the other person can be construed as selfish. If you don't want to love me forever, why do you want to keep me from finding someone who will?

Relationships are about what is best for BOTH people. If security, stability, consistency and commitment are important to someone, it might be reasonable to comminicate that to the person that you are with, even if this involves a timeline.