Would you forgive your SO cheating on you.

[KristyDarling]

What Alj said.

(and very well-said that was.)

BTW, I think it goes without saying that rape could not possibly EVER be confused as either a "breach of trust" or "infidelity. Hopefully no one ould ever need that clarification.

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 1/19/2007 7:35:16 AM
Author: perry
--- Sex that developes in some form of survival situation, where either the gal or guy pairs up with someone to create a supporting team to help survive the situation.

Are we talking Sci-Fi kinda plague on the earth, only two people left to procreate kinda deal?? Or like - stuck in an elevator for an hour or two ... ate the Mentos, read the paper, hey let's ____!

I kinda feel like we're living in different WORLDS, Perry. In my world ladies don't have to sleep with their bosses to keep their jobs & natural catastrophes don't lead to "survival sex". I'd like to stay in my world - thanks!

 

[strmrdr]

Im shocked there is so much debate on this issue.

 

[diamondfan]

Deco, what if the survival of the species was dependant on YOU?

I think this is a big topic because sex is so primal, and it really can be a way to hurt someone. Though, it would hurt me just as much to know my hubby was in love with someone else and had not touched them...so it is more than just the physical act to me, it crosses more than that.

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 1/19/2007 12:02:31 PM
Author: diamondfan
Deco, what if the survival of the species was dependant on YOU?

HAHAHAHAHAHA ... with my petrified eggos, I think "the species" is scrod!

 

[Mara]

i agree DF...i think for me personally, it would hurt me more to know that my husband strayed and fell in love with his affair...than just had a one night stand he was regretful for. physical closeness is one thing but emotional is another.

ROFL Deco...pertrified eggos. i have oatmeal all over my laptop screen now, thanks!

 

[hlmr]

Date: 1/19/2007 11:49:16 AM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 1/19/2007 7:35:16 AM
Author: perry
--- Sex that developes in some form of survival situation, where either the gal or guy pairs up with someone to create a supporting team to help survive the situation.

Are we talking Sci-Fi kinda plague on the earth, only two people left to procreate kinda deal?? Or like - stuck in an elevator for an hour or two ... ate the Mentos, read the paper, hey let''s ____!

I kinda feel like we''re living in different WORLDS, Perry. In my world ladies don''t have to sleep with their bosses to keep their jobs & natural catastrophes don''t lead to ''survival sex''. I''d like to stay in my world - thanks!

OMG Deco, I am ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..........ate the mentos, read the paper.........lololololol

 

[FireGoddess]

Date: 1/19/2007 7:35:16 AM
Author: perry
Agreed; then the next question is what is a breach of trust - and what is cheating?

Now I hope my first example is not considered a breach of trust and cheating by others?

---- Rape where the gal is physically overwhelmed.

How would you consider this one...

---- Sex provided reluctantly under the threat of physical harm.

Or this...

---- Sex provided reluctantly under the threat of a some kind of ''negative situation.''

It may be less common today - but I''ve known a few gals in the past where keeping their job to support their family depended on sex with the boss (and actually, in some countries today getting a promotion often depends on sex with the boss).

Then there is:

--- Sex that developes in some form of survival situation, where either the gal or guy pairs up with someone to create a supporting team to help survive the situation.

Whoa whoa whoa!!! I think Alj summed up what I would have said quite nicely already. These situations you brought up are not in the realm of what I think any of us would call cheating. These do focus on the sex act (being under duress at threat of harm, or being on Mars with only one other person who is of the opposite sex) rather than cheating on someone willingly without any threat over your head. Two entirely different realms!

 

[perry]

FireGoddess:

Whoa whoa whoa!!! I think Alj summed up what I would have said quite nicely already. These situations you brought up are not in the realm of what I think any of us would call cheating. These do focus on the sex act (being under duress at threat of harm, or being on Mars with only one other person who is of the opposite sex) rather than cheating on someone willingly without any threat over your head. Two entirely different realms!

I agree: Two different realms entirely - which is why untill know why a situation occured and all the key variables - you cannot prejudge the outcome of it.


decodelighted

I kinda feel like we''re living in different WORLDS, Perry. In my world ladies don''t have to sleep with their bosses to keep their jobs & natural catastrophes don''t lead to "survival sex". I''d like to stay in my world - thanks

Deco... I hope that you nor anyone close to you has to face any of the "what if" scenarios out there.

But, natural disasters do occure (how about the Tsumani of last year); plane crashes occure in remote places, and various weather events can trap people for days - or longer (how about the unusual winter weather in the south central US). Sometimes groups get lost in the mountains too. Life happens. To me - I''m not going to worry about that stuff.

Oh, for clarification. I would not consider being trapped in a normal elevator for a few hours a survival situation (unless perhaps the building was on fire and everyone thought they might die...).


KristyDarling

BTW, I think it goes without saying that rape could not possibly EVER be confused as either a "breach of trust" or "infidelity. Hopefully no one ould ever need that clarification.

I agree things are getting better in the US. Unfortunately, it has been a slow climb out of "blame the victum" for rape and other sexual assult.... and it is not nearly far enough along in my opinon.

I have actually heard at least one "male" (I can''t call him a man) blame his wife for allowing herself to be rapped - and the male then filed for divorce.


aljdewey:

I agree that wilfully breaking the trust is the issue - and not the sex.

We disagree on where the break in the trust starts. You think you can set an "absolute" condition - and maintain a trusting relationship. I see that as the first failure to have a trusting relationship.

In the case of drawing such an absolute line - and communicating it clearly... What you have just said is that we can''t talk about it without severe repercussions.

So something unplanned happens; and maybe he (or she) feels guilty as hell and is really sorry (and maybe they don''t even know yet how it happened to occur). You, and others, have made it clear that he (or she) can''t tell you. Severe repercusions if they do. So they hide it, which creates more mistrust and changes the relationship... and the cycle continues. When you eventually find out chances are that more damage has been done by the fact that they did not feel they could tell you about something they were really or truly sorry about - or even something where they needed help and knew it - but could''nt ask you... and you feel that all trust has been broken.

You are right about the broken trust - because in my opinion you never had it (and it goes both ways for such clear conditions established by guys as well).

My personal rule is everything can be talked about. While I have expectations - there is room for exceptions with justifying situations (and/or true remorse). The only way problems are worked through is by being honest with each other... and accepting that you are going to hear things that will be difficult to deal with at times - knowing that the easiest way to deal with those issues is to hear about them. That does not mean that there cannot be repercusions to actions - and certain situations will in fact kill a relationship (and continued wilfull unfaithfullness is one of those). But, I just don''t see how the relationship can truely last a long time and weather some storms without that level of communication where everything can be talked about.
It all comes down to the situtaion in my mind. Should I be in a serious relationship or marriage in my case I don''t care one iota if my SO actaully has sex with someone else - from a sex standpoint. What I care about is why they had that sex. The situation and the factors. The "why" is where it is at. If there is an acceptable reason why - no problems will exist between us. If the "why" is not acceptable to me - then there will be problems with the relationship - and for certain situations it would end for sure. I am just not going to prejude them and the why until I hear it. So often what seems obvous on the surface has underlying causes - and I need to try and find those underlying causes.

To me having a trusting relationship involves trusting them to be able to tell me anything, and them trusting me enough to be able to tell me anything; and versa-vica. There are no absolutes except death and taxes. Everything else has variables and I struggle at times to deal with those variables - but I accept that they are there.


I anticipate that we will continue to disagree. That is fine. I wish you and all others a great life - and I know I will have a great life.

Perry

 

[diamondfan]

I think cheating is different to each person. Remember Jimmy Carter''s remark when he was President, in an interview in Playboy? It was something along the lines of "I have committed adultery many times in my mind" or something like that...

I have certain views that others might not share. To me, even going on line to a chat room or meeting someone and having some intimacy whether it be cyber sex or just very intimate discussions, constitutes unfaithfulness to me. I realize that it means there could be something missing or wrong at home, but often, that is NOT true, and some people (notice I am not saying men only) like to carry on ilicit activities even when all is fine. I guess some people just like being able to get away with it, or rationalize that it is not cheating if there is not any contact. But a pal of mine found out that her hubby was doing just this, and was livid, and I am not sure their marriage will survive it...his job involves a lot of travel and he is away often, and she just feels she cannot trust him. If he would do this, what else would he do? So, I think the issue, to me, is that anything that is taking intimacy from my marriage, be it a co worker who is too involved, or being on the computer with inappropriate relationships...sex or no, I am going to feel betrayed and violated.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I agree Diamondfan that there are great dangers in other behaviors and that they are wrong as well.

Here''s a terrific article I just saw this morning...for all you deal-breakers, maybe you can get him thrown in jail!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070118/lf_afp/usjusticesexoffbeat_070118055859

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 1/19/2007 5:15:26 AM
Author: Olive Oil



mtrb, I don''t totally disagree with you here, but I think there is a little bit more to the biology. I''m an evolutionary biologist, so I''ve got a bit of background on the biology of mating systems. It is true that very few organisms are monogamous. Monogamy tends to evolve when resources or environmental conditions are poor, and both parents are needed to successfully raise young. If resources are not so scarce, then you get a conflict between the sexes. Males have sperm, which can be thought of as energetically cheap. Their reproductive success is limited by the number of times they mate. With females, they are investing much more energy and time into a developing offspring, and their reproductive success is more limited by resources to put in that offspring.

Well then, it should be easier to be monogamous as my single friends will tell you that resources and conditions out there are pretty poor!

(Oh, you didn''t mean the quality of most men out there? Sorry. *Slapping man-hating hand and shutting up by eating mentos*)

 

[Janice61]

Wow, what a hot topic! Here is the irony for you..if you were to ask me who is more likely - in theory - to cheat, I would have to say me. My DH is incredibly loyal, he stayed with his first wife until she left him for another guy, even though she was not very nice to him and only agreed to have sex with him about once a month. I was single until I met my DH when I turned 40. I had a great time being single and loved to flirt. If my DH cheated, I could see forgiving him for the sake of our marriage and my son because I understand about being tempted by choice. I also would never tell our son about the infidelity, kids don''t need to know that stuff. And my DH is such a wonderful man that if he did cheat, I would bear a lot of the responsibility because it would mean I seriously neglected him for a very long time. But if I cheated, it would be a dealbreaker for DH. So, as other posters have said, if you don''t want to be tempted, don''t go to Tempation Island! Now I am too tired and hormonally challenged to even consider cheating (not that I want to, my DH is awesome and I never want to lose him) so perhaps it is just as well I married later in life after I sewed all my wild oats. Lastly, for those who would consider cheating a dealbreaker and have kids, consider that if you left your SO, and they remarried, you would have to share custody not only with the other parent, but with the other parent''s partner (If you only knew the grief I have had from my DH''s ex over my stepson!). You would likely be financially strapped and completely stressed out. You might lose your marital home, savings and other assets. Your kids would be a mess. Divorce is not always the best answer to infidelity. For me, this would be a lot harder than working out problems together.

 

[diamondfan]

Whenever this type of thread comes up, the one thing I always think about is LIFE IS ABOUT MAKING CHOICES. Monogamy, when we are living such long lives, is a very deliberate choice in my opinion.

We all, I am sure, could have the chance to cheat. Business trips, long work nights...I have been on a girl''s night out and men have tried to buy us drinks... and I am sure women have flirted with my hubby and who knows what could happen if he were to play along? My hubby is at work all day. Does he really know where I am at all times? Or I him? Of course not. But trust and faith are a given unless there is proof to the contrary. It would be tough to live without that presumption.

A friend asked me once, if my dream hunk movie star was in my house and no one would ever know, could I have a fling? And honestly, it is that I would know that would make me nuts...not what anyone else would know. I do not mind a bit of flirting, it is fun and as long as the intent is on the up and up, I think it is even a bit healthy as long as it does not cross the line. But a clue to me is, if you feel you have to hide it, it is probably wrong...