Padparadscha questions

[Harriet]

Richard, thanks for the information that the East African material can be free of brown. I''m glad that I don''t have to restrict myself to the Sri Lankan material and the accompanying prices.

 

[Art Nouveau]

Does anyone know the history of the 30 ct pad in Ma Re''s first link, the one that Zeolite mentioned almost bidding for in the 1980''s Sotheby''s auction? This pad is featured in David Federman''s book "Consumer Guide to Color Gemstone". When I was considering if I should buy my 4+ carat pad, I used the picture of this stone as a reference. One of the reason I bought the stone was because under some lighting conditions, it looks very similar to the 30 ct pad. My pad is an unheated Sri Lanka stone from the 1920''s. I wonder if the 30 ct pad could have come from the same mine during that period?

AN

 

[Kashmira]

Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all "fake" padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

 

[Gailey]

Date: 8/22/2009 6:45:42 PM
Author: Kashmira
Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all ''fake'' padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

Malaya Garnets can have a peachy kind of look to them that are not a million miles away from a pad. If you check out the Vendors Pics thread at the top of Coloured Stones, I think Tourmaline Lover has hers posted there.

 

[Harriet]

Same colour, yes -- spinel, tourmaline (as Gailey mentioned), imperial topaz. However, their other properties are different from corundum, with spinel being the closest contender.

 

[Gailey]

Gawd my memory fails me these days. Someone here has a beautiful Malaya garnet pear I believe that is very Pad like. It was from Multicolour I believe. Anyone remember?

I swear I''ve seen a pretty spectacular pad coloured spinel recently too, but I can''t for the life of me remember where.

 

[Barrett]

of course tourmaline would..there is almost no color tourmaline won''t mimic...I have seen some nigerian tourmaline that looked very mcuh like a pad..saw 2 or 3 on ebay that looked better than most pads..tried bidding on one but it went over $1000.."selectgem" had one for sale for sale for 8 or $900 dollars a 12ct. orange and pink tourmaline..i will se if he still has a pic of it and get back to you

 

[Sagebrush]

Harriet,

You know my view of country of origin. I don''t care if its from Hoboken, if its a beautiful stone its worth the price.

There were some magnificent padparadscha''s found in Songea some years back and some wonderful stones from Vietnam as well. Ad for Hoboken, I think the mine is closed.

 

[Gailey]

Date: 8/22/2009 3:54:46 PM
Author: TravelingGal

Date: 8/21/2009 1:30:31 PM
Author: Richard W. Wise
All,

Very interesting thread. I am amazed at the increase in the level of knowledge over the past few years. Some excellent responses.

Bear in mind the term ''delicate'' I stress it in the chapter on Padparadscha in my book. In this context, delicate refers to light to medium tones of pinkish-orange to orangy-pink. At darker tonal levels, pink begins to become red and orange begins to go brown.

The stone I sourced for TravelingGal is, I think, exceptional. As for the Morgan Padparadscha, the one in the Natural History Museum, New York and pictured in Secrets; it has a definite yellowish secondary and although some Sri Lankan dealers call that Padparadscha, I don''t. As for ''Ideal'' mix? For once I would agree that that is very much a personal call.

For reference, here it is. Please note the rough is just for comparison and not my stone.

Lovely stone TGal, I don''t think I will ever get tired of looking at it.

Tell me, what happened to your previous pad from Richard? The one that turned out to be a fake, did you get to keep it or did it have to go back?

 

[m76steve]

kashmira-this is a pod pendent i put together several years ago-they are all appraised as pods-a little over 9+ cts in 14kt yel.-some are ceylon & african the rest-mostly african with most of the african stones being heated or treated in some ways-enjoy...

 

[m76steve]

a little better pic of same pendent...

 

[Kashmira]

Thank you all for sharing your knowledge and pictures of beautiful padparadscha sapphires!

 

[MakingTheGrade]

Sigh...Tgal''s pad is so dreamy!

 

[TravelingGal]

Thanks all, I still love the pad too.

Gailey, I sent it back. I have no idea what the fate of the fakey was. It sure was a pretty piece of...fake stuff though!

Speaking of Richard, he has a page on pads in his blog. I remember reading it when I was on the hunt. Maybe the OP will find it helpful.

http://rwwise.com/blog/?p=15

 

[chrono]

Date: 8/22/2009 6:45:42 PM
Author: Kashmira
Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all ''fake'' padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

Yes; there’s spinel, some tourmaline, garnet and even rhodocrosite but none would be sold as a padparadscha because they are expensive in their own right.

 

[zeolite]

Date: 8/22/2009 5:06:58 PM
Author: Richard W. Wise
Zeolite,

In the famous G&G article, Crowninsheild argues that East African gems, specifically Umba River padparadscha do not qualify. I respectfully disagree, though most have the requisite brownish mask that the famous gemologist refers to, some do not. One of the finest I ever sourced I bought in Nairobi and it had all the characteristics of a fine padparadscha. I think yours are quite lovely.

Thank you Richard. I also think Umba pads can be beautiful.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 8/24/2009 8:33:59 AM
Author: Chrono

Date: 8/22/2009 6:45:42 PM
Author: Kashmira
Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all ''fake'' padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

Yes; there’s spinel, some tourmaline, garnet and even rhodocrosite but none would be sold as a padparadscha because they are expensive in their own right.

Do rhodochrosites have enough orange? Note that they are unsuitable for use as jewellery. Doesn''t stop me from loving them, though.

 

[Harriet]

Date: 8/23/2009 11:32:30 AM
Author: Richard W. Wise
Harriet,

You know my view of country of origin. I don''t care if its from Hoboken, if its a beautiful stone its worth the price.

There were some magnificent padparadscha''s found in Songea some years back and some wonderful stones from Vietnam as well. Ad for Hoboken, I think the mine is closed.

I''m on the ''duck'' side too.

 

[chrono]

Date: 8/24/2009 11:26:37 PM
Author: Harriet

Date: 8/24/2009 8:33:59 AM
Author: Chrono

Date: 8/22/2009 6:45:42 PM
Author: Kashmira
Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all ''fake'' padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

Yes; there’s spinel, some tourmaline, garnet and even rhodocrosite but none would be sold as a padparadscha because they are expensive in their own right.

Do rhodochrosites have enough orange? Note that they are unsuitable for use as jewellery. Doesn''t stop me from loving them, though.

Rhodocrosites probably doesn’t have enough orange and are too strongly coloured for the purists.

Kashmira asked about what other stones show similar colours, so I thought I’d throw that out as a suggestion. I did not take setting it into consideration because of the way she worded her question. I have seen quite a few set by expert custom setters though, mostly as pendants or earrings.

 

[chrono]

This rhodochrosite cut by Ben Kho shows more orange and is a 1st place Spectrum Award winner.

 

[chrono]

More rhodochrosite with orangish pink colour.

 

[Linda W]

Chrono those are gorgeous, I LOVE rhodos.

 

[Upgradable]

THUD!!

Chrono, those are truly TDF!!

 

[Harriet]

Date: 8/25/2009 8:50:36 AM
Author: Chrono
More rhodochrosite with orangish pink colour.

May I be naughty and say that I''d like more orange?

Are these Pala''s? Swoon.

 

[Kashmira]

Date: 8/25/2009 8:24:55 AM
Author: Chrono

Date: 8/24/2009 11:26:37 PM
Author: Harriet

Date: 8/24/2009 8:33:59 AM
Author: Chrono

Date: 8/22/2009 6:45:42 PM
Author: Kashmira
Now I am back with another question: Are there other gemstones with the same colour as the padparadscha or are all ''fake'' padparadschas BE treated sapphires or even synthetic stones?

Yes; there’s spinel, some tourmaline, garnet and even rhodocrosite but none would be sold as a padparadscha because they are expensive in their own right.

Do rhodochrosites have enough orange? Note that they are unsuitable for use as jewellery. Doesn''t stop me from loving them, though.

Rhodocrosites probably doesn’t have enough orange and are too strongly coloured for the purists.

Kashmira asked about what other stones show similar colours, so I thought I’d throw that out as a suggestion. I did not take setting it into consideration because of the way she worded her question. I have seen quite a few set by expert custom setters though, mostly as pendants or earrings.

I was wondering if there was a possiblity ending up with a "real" stone other than a sapphire if buying one on-line but it seems as if the deals that are "too good to be true" are either BE treated sapphires or synthetical stones (I was just trying to educate myself- I will NOT buy a padparadscha in an Ebay auction).

Anyway the rhodochrosites you posted pictures of are beautiful! Thanks for sharing!

 

[chrono]

Date: 8/26/2009 12:29:05 AM
Author: Kashmira
I was wondering if there was a possiblity ending up with a ''real'' stone other than a sapphire if buying one on-line but it seems as if the deals that are ''too good to be true'' are either BE treated sapphires or synthetical stones (I was just trying to educate myself- I will NOT buy a padparadscha in an Ebay auction).

Anyway the rhodochrosites you posted pictures of are beautiful! Thanks for sharing!

Kashmira,
You are right; your chance of getting a real stone other than a true padparadscha is very slime to nil if buying from eBay. There are trusted vendors online who sell the real good though so buying online is fine if you know which vendors to approach.

 

[chrono]

Date: 8/25/2009 10:18:08 PM
Author: Harriet

Date: 8/25/2009 8:50:36 AM
Author: Chrono
More rhodochrosite with orangish pink colour.

May I be naughty and say that I''d like more orange?

Are these Pala''s? Swoon.

Sure, I prefer a stronger orange too but they are so difficult to find and expensive.

Yes, these are Pala''s.

 

[ma re]

This might sound a bit crazy, but ametrine rough - if cut the right way - could yield some quite paddish-looking stones

 

[Harriet]

Date: 8/26/2009 7:52:37 AM
Author: Chrono
Sure, I prefer a stronger orange too but they are so difficult to find and expensive.

Yes, these are Pala''s.

I came across one, but didn''t dare to price it.