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Roe v. Wade.

swingtime said:
This self-defeating attitude gets us nowhere.
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All the effort expended to date has brought us right back to square one. Imo, progress can't be sustained when laws can be overturned by the whims of whichever party has voting majority in the house and senate particularly when they vote against measures that the majority of Americans support or because the person occupying the White House isn't a member of their party or because a party has stacked the SCOTUS. We are governing by spite. The entire system has to change. Nothing we have seen to date indicates there would be an iota of hope for a constitutional amendment of any kind. Imo, only the complete collapse of one of the major parties would pave the way for the possibility of discussion about an amendment to occur. I'll continue to engage in and support efforts to make change happen in spite of the fact that my optimism doesn't shine as bright as it once did.
 
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@swingtime, With all due respect, this is now our reality. Sugar coating it isn’t going to help. Woman that are older remember what it was like before abortion was legal. I remember and my guess is @Matata does too. Women are going to have to work together and HARD to get these rights back. It’s going to take many many years to get our rights back. Hell a corpse has more rights than women do at the moment.

It‘s being reported 2 people that are already looking into make this ruling the law of the entire country, eliminating state rights (we know who they are). Many people thought yesterdays ruling would never happen.…. and yet here we are. They are coming for contraception next.

Please look into your states Supreme Court judges. The number of years they are in power varies from state to state. Voting them out is the only thing that is going to get us out of this mess and unfortunately this could take decades.

When voting for all local judges you need to find out their affiliation. It took me over an hour and numerous calls to the state capitol to find out who certain judges were affiliated with. Some local offices do not all tell you (Several judge’s office from one group were honest). I made the calls to be sure I wasn’t voting for someone who did not support my stance on abortion.

If woman want change they are going to make this their voting issue. I’m older. I saw first hand what women went thru to achieve these rights. Younger women have never not had access to safe and legal abortions. They are going to have to put the work in for this to change now.

Some of states will have stricter punishment for a women obtaining an abortion than they have for a man who rapes a woman.

Thank you for the tip @winnietucker.



I apologize for the long post. I’m so angry today.
 
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@Calliecake, I don't need to be lectured on what our reality is. I've been working on this, as well as other human rights issues, for decades!! I get irritated when people say, as @Matata did, that it's "hopeless." The people who worked to deliver this disastrous decision pop the champagne cork every time they hear people say that it's hopeless. Glad you're also working to change things.
 
swingtime said:
I get irritated when people say, as @Matata did, that it's "hopeless."
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I said it was hopeless "at this point" not that it was forever hopeless. Here's another lecture you probably won't appreciate --- membership here confers the right to state opinions as long as they are within the bounds of the rules regardless of whether they are in opposition to others'. We learn from our differences as well as from our similarities.
 
swingtime said:
... I get irritated when people say, as @Matata did, that it's "hopeless." ...
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You're irritated; I hear that.

But I think it's okay for anyone to express their true feelings here, whatever they are.
Letting out what upsets us can be cathartic.
It's healthy.

Please let people vary by not censoring them - though I realize I may appear to be attempting to censoring you.
 
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@swingtime, I’m sincerely not trying to lecture you. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for working on this for decades. I’m angry at myself right now for not doing more than donating money and voting. I have been a one issue voter since I was 26 years old. Abortion has been my one voter issue for more 30 years. I’m beating myself up and don’t even know what more I should have been doing.

In my opinion sugar coating this will not fire women up and we need women mad and fed up and fired up demanding change. We need women doing the work to make change now. It seems that you feel saying it‘s close to impossible defeats people. I have no idea which one of us is correct (heck I’ve been wrong more times than I could ever count in my lifetime) but please know you and I want the same thing. We are both sickened by this decision.

This ruling has hit me so flipping hard. I’m crying as I type this. I was raped when I was young. It sickens me that there are people who feel that a woman or child that has been raped should now be forced to have a rapist child. None of these judges have meet with mental health professionals to find out how damaging this decision would be to a woman who is pregnant by rape. If they had they never could have come to the decision that this is the right thing to do. The cruelty of this Supreme Court is disgusting. EVERY WOMAN SHOULD HAVE CONTROL OVER HER OWN BODY PERIOD. For the record I would be just as angry if there was an exception for rape and incest. I probably wouldn’t be feeling this hurt If there was an exception.

I’ve been on a soapbox all morning here and am feeling like I’m coming off as a crazy person. I‘m so angry and hurt right now.
 
Calliecake said:
@swingtime, I’m sincerely not trying to lecture you. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for working on this for decades. I’m angry at myself right now for not doing more than donating money and voting. I have been a one issue voter since I was 26 years old. Abortion has been my one voter issue for more 30 years. I’m beating myself up and don’t even know what more I should have been doing.

In my opinion sugar coating this will not fire women up and we need women mad and fed up and fired up demanding change. We need women doing the work to make change now. It seems that you feel saying it‘s close to impossible defeats people. I have no idea which one of us is correct (heck I’ve been wrong more times than I could ever count in my lifetime) but please know you and I want the same thing. We are both sickened by this decision.

This ruling has hit me so flipping hard. I’m crying as I type this. I was raped when I was young. It sickens me that there are people who feel that a woman or child that has been raped should now be forced to have a rapist child. None of these judges have meet with mental health professionals to find out how damaging this decision would be to a woman who is pregnant by rape. If they had they never could have come to the decision that this is the right thing to do. The cruelty of this Supreme Court is disgusting. EVERY WOMAN SHOULD HAVE CONTROL OVER HER OWN BODY PERIOD. For the record I would be just as angry if there was an exception for rape and incest. I probably wouldn’t be feeling this hurt If there was an exception.

I’ve been on a soapbox all morning here and am feeling like I’m coming off as a crazy person. I‘m so angry and hurt right now.
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@Calliecake I have tears in my eyes after reading your post. I am so sorry for all that you've gone through.

I'm not sugar coating things when I say it's self-defeating to say that things are hopeless. (I don't understand the difference btwn "things are hopeless" and "things are hopeless at this point.") Of course everyone has a right to express their opinion - & that is my strongly held belief, based on years of working to try to make things better.

I'm enraged with this SC decision. I also understand that for many American women the right to abortion healthcare was taken away long ago.

It takes a lot of hard work to change things. No one wants to sign up for a "hopeless" project. JMO
 
It’s ok @Calliecake, you don’t sound like a crazy person nor do you come across as lecturing. A lot of us feel the way you do. We need to support each other’s feelings, this is raw. Continue to speak your opinions, that includes you also @Matata
 
As always @Bonfire, thank you for your kindness and & for just being you. I am so grateful you are part of this community. Your words help people on this site often and in ways you probably can’t even imagine.

I‘m so glad both you and @junebug17 are moms. Your children won the mom lottery.
 
@swingtime, I know this is hard for so many women. As @Bonfire stated this decision has left many women feeling raw. I also know you too are very passionate about what happened yesterday. If you know of anything I can do to help, please please tell me. Please know you and I are on the same side. We want the same outcome here.

This has shown me that we literally can’t take anything for granted.
 
Calliecake said:
As always @Bonfire, thank you for your kindness and & for just being you. I am so grateful you are part of this community. Your words help people on this site often and in ways you probably can’t even imagine.

I‘m so glad both you and @junebug17 are moms. Your children won the mom lottery.
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I'm sorry too, Callie. And you are not coming across as crazy - anything but.
 
If the Democrats really cared about our right to medical autonomy they would conduct an emergency session in Congress. This is a Constitutional Crisis.

Where are our supporters in Congress? Will they just let this fester until the mid terms, proving this is about them, not us?

YES THEY WILL. THIS WILL BE MANY MONTHS OF USEFUL DRAMA overshadowing all other issues.

Congress must hold an emergency session NOW.
 
LightBright said:
If the Democrats really cared about our right to medical autonomy they would conduct an emergency session in Congress. This is a Constitutional Crisis.

Where are our supporters in Congress? Will they just let this fester until the mid terms, proving this is about them, not us?

YES THEY WILL. THIS WILL BE MANY MONTHS OF USEFUL DRAMA overshadowing all other issues.

Congress must hold an emergency session NOW.
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I agree, sadly this is the reality.
 
If Democrats don’t stop everything to fight this, they are using this as a fundraising drive. We’ll see how much they care about our rights in the next few days. Newsflash to Dems: women can’t and won’t wait for midterms…what is the plan, you should have one since you’ve had plenty of time to plan for this…!!!!
 
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Calliecake said:
@swingtime, I know this is hard for so many women. As @Bonfire stated this decision has left many women feeling raw. I also know you too are very passionate about what happened yesterday. If you know of anything I can do to help, please please tell me. Please know you and I are on the same side. We want the same outcome here.

This has shown me that we literally can’t take anything for granted.
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@Calliecake Yes, we are all definitely raw right now. I appreciate and respect the work you're doing and have done on this issue. I'm angry, but I'm not giving up. The groups that have been working since the 70's on dismantling Roe (and on many other issues), well, I hate what they've accomplished, but I've got to hand it to them. They strategized, and they persisted, and they got what they wanted. When I lived in an area that didn't have an org working on this and other issues that were important to me, I started an org with friends. We grew the org and focused on flipping a district in our area. I pay attention to every race, from school board on up. I volunteer for candidates. If I lived in a district and state where every elected official and candidate supported abortion healthcare, I'd volunteer in tight races in other parts of the country. We also donate money to candidates and to Planned Parenthood.
 
It really does look like the Democrats have “no plan” other than midterms for addressing this immediate risk. Grade of F.
 
@Calliecake, I am sorry for all you've been through. It is very understandable that you are feeling the way you do. You don't sound crazy at all; many of us feel the way you do about this and you have every right to express your emotions. It's important to share our emotions and support each other.
 
LightBright said:
It really does look like the Democrats have “no plan” other than midterms for addressing this immediate risk. Grade of F.
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II don’t know where this is coming from? They aren’t the ones who supported Roe vs Wade being overturned.

Red states have no plans in place of the how all these children are going to provided for. We currently have over 410,000 children in foster care in this country. The same people who bitch and moan about having to provide school lunch for a child are all of a sudden going to taken on fully supporting children? PLEASE! How are they going to pay for it. Let’s worry about that.

What plans do they have in their states to prevent rape or address the problem of rape.

I seem to remember reading how gun deaths are a mental health issue as the state where 19 school children just lost their lives in a school shooting cut their mental health budget by $210 million dollars.

If we are going to be giving a Grade F to anyone I think you picked the wrong group of people.
 
LightBright said:
It really does look like the Democrats have “no plan” other than midterms for addressing this immediate risk. Grade of F.
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I'm confused, after the country's top court rules what "plan" could "address this immediate risk"?
 
Please don't violate any rules that would impede our ability to continue this discussion.
 
@Matata, Do you feel I have violated any rules? I also don’t want this discussion to be shut down. I will delete my post if you feel I have broken any rules?
 
Calliecake said:
@Matata, Do you feel I have violated any rules? I also don’t want this discussion to be shut down. I will delete my post if you feel I have broken any rules?
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No but the comments by lightbright are skating close, imo. I don't want to come across as attempting to speak for a mod because that would be improper but I remember Ella's admonition in other discussions to refrain from speaking specifically about particular parties and people.
 
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redwood66 said:
Thanks for this link as it was an interesting read.
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My mental image of government processes is an endless plain filled with hamster cages in which the furry critters are running in different directions in different multiverses and each thinks they are on the correct path =)2
 
Thank you Matata. I don’t want to make Ella’s job any harder than it already is.
 
Matata said:
My mental image of government processes is an endless plain filled with hamster cages in which the furry critters are running in different directions in different multiverses and each thinks they are on the correct path =)2
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Or this.

1656205327404.png
 
Hypothetical here.

If I go to a doctor to confirm pregnancy in a state that outlaws abortion, does the doctor report it somewhere? Wouldn't this be covered by HIPAA?

If I purchase a pregnancy test, will it be reported somewhere? Logistically how would the state know?

I ask these questions as I suspect Texas will try to fervently enforce this ban. I wouldn't be surprised if they even tried to make it illegal to cross state lines.

Note- I am past the age that this even matters but would like to understand how big brother will track women.
 
@Gussie, I have no idea. It seriously wouldn’t surprise me if they had someone placed in the pregnancy test aisle following people home from Walgreens and CVS and reporting them to be watched.

Is the bounty still in place for reporting someone who received or helped someone get an abortion?
 
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