Royal Jewels

[LadyMaria]

[quote="prince.of.preslav]

PS: MJ, I'm so sorry to hear that you won't be able to follow the wedding closely. I remember ho happy and excited you were at the time of Victoria and Daniel's wedding (waking up early, dressing up, posting here, etc)

Bobby[/quote]


And I planned on doing the same thing for this wedding. I won't even be able to watch it at school since the state rules for proctoring this test mean I can't have my comptuter on. All I can do is stare at the students as they take their state history test...I walk around the room and "actively monitor" the students, I have to change my position in the room every 5 minutes, I can't be reading anything either *sigh*.

But at least I will still have Albert and Charlene's wedding in the summer!

As for the Teck Circle tiara I wouldn't be surprised if Lord Linely and Lady Chatto returned the Teck Circle (and possibly the Turquoise Parure and the Papryus Tiara) back to the crown...perhaps they could avoid the inheritance tax on them by doing so? That was, after all, the reason they gave for selling the Poltimore Tiara and the other jewels.

Would they have had to deal with inhertiance issues on the Snowdown Floral tiara that Lady Chatto wore at her wedding? AFter all, the Earl of Snowdon is still alive and I don't think Margaret ever wore the Snowdon Floral after her divorce, did she?

 

[prince.of.preslav]

And I planned on doing the same thing for this wedding.

All I can do is say how much sorry I feel for you! But then you'll have the weekend to spend here and discuss.
But what about the difference in the time zones? For the afternoon Swedish wedding you had to get up early in the morning (around 6 o'clock IIRC). But William and Catherine's wedding is likely to be in the morning (lets say 10 o'clock British time) - when do you have to wake then? If it is in the wee hours (US time), then you can spend some time here and then go to work?

Re the Snowdon tiara - No, the Princess Margaret never wore the tiara (not in public, that is) But regardless of whether the late Princess wore it or not, the tiara was a wedding present from The Earl and thus the personal property of The Princess and later a subject to death duties. But! What if the tiara was a wedding present from mother to daughter? Lady Sarah's wedding was in 1994 - more than 7 years before Princess Margaret's death - and that's how she would've escaped paying death duties for it.
And I think Lady Sarah wore (parts of) the tiara at The Queen and Prince Philip's golden wedding anniversary:

 

[LadyMaria]

All I can do is say how much sorry I feel for you! But then you'll have the weekend to spend here and discuss.
But what about the difference in the time zones? For the afternoon Swedish wedding you had to get up early in the morning (around 6 o'clock IIRC). But William and Catherine's wedding is likely to be in the morning (lets say 10 o'clock British time) - when do you have to wake then? If it is in the wee hours (US time), then you can spend some time here and then go to work?

Wow, you have an excellent memory Bobby! Yup, I was up early for the Swedish wedding due to the time zones. But alas, I still won't be able to see hardly anything before heading off to school. A regular day means I get up at 5:30 in the morning to get myself and the kids ready for school. Something always happens...my son forgets to do his homework, my daughter spills her cereal on what she's wearing and I have to change her, my daughter spills her cereal on me and I have to change...you get the idea. I might catch a glimpse or two on the TV, but the super tasty tidbits will have to wait until I get home.

If the internet coverage is anything like the Swedish wedding though, I will be able to go back and watch everything to my heart's content. It's a definite plus to the internet age!

 

[neil31uk]

If Queen Mary left this directly to Princess Margaret then it was her personal property, not Crown Property and so it's probably still int he hands of her children as private property.

Hi Neil!

Princess Margaret can't have received/inherited the Teck circles from Queen Mary as it was worn by The Queen Mother in her days as Queen. How it re-entered the royal family is a mystery to me.
And even if we assume that it was the Princess' property, why didn't her children sell it along with everything else? The same questions I have about the Papyrus tiara and the Turquoise parure. Maybe these were bought privately by The Queen?

Hi Bobby,

Princess Margaret received many jewels from Queen Mary, including a diamond collet necklace that was sold in 2006. The Polomire Tiara was sold, prolly as it was bought for Margaret so didn't have any family connection. I assume that the Teck necklace, the Teck tiara and Papyrus tiara and Turquoise parure were not sold as they had strong links within the family. However, those items sold were mostly things that were not from the family. I am certain the Tech necklace was her private property, as to be Crown property it must be owned byt he Queen and then lent out. Those items were never on-loan to margaret.

Neil

 

[neil31uk]

Maybe our British residents could weigh in best on that, Danny. I'll blab anyway, though! Wouldn't be surprised if Charles doesn't take the throne for another 10 years or more, though he may assume increasing duties for his mother with time. I just read an article yesterday about Charles vs. William following HM. It said there is much sentiment that William should succeed his grandmother but that the British are pretty conservative when it comes to their traditions & even though Charles is less popular, he's still next in line. There is NO tradition of sovereigns abdicating (except Edward VIII & he was a loon), plus Charles has spent his life expecting & preparing to be king & William doesn't want to be.

Charles has lived a healthy life so may live as long as the Queen Mum (QE also!). Looks like a long spell of elderly rulers.

--- Laurie

Here in the UK there is no mechanism for Charles to be by-passed as King unless the Queen abdicates and chooses to do so dynastically - so NONE of her children or grandchildren could take the throne. Otherwise the Queen can only abdicate for herself - but it is VERY unlikely that she will do so. The other route I suppose would be an Act of Parliament changing the line of succession but that would be highly embarrassing for the RF and the Monarchy in general. Also, such an act would require, like all UK law, the Queen to give Royal Assent to make it law and she could of course veto it. No government would risk embarrassing the Queen -especially as the Prime Minister has to see her once per week!

Charles could abdicate within hours of acceding to the throne, BUT he would be king and recorded int eh history books as Charles III as, the moment the Queen dies, he will be king and Camilla the Queen consort (yes I know she is going to be called Princess Consort, but in Law she would be Queen). That is also very unlikely. 1) William wants/needs time to grow into the role as Prince of Wales as practice for being King and I am sure he wants time with his new bride and family is they are so blessed, and I think Charles would want to see that they have such time. 2) as far as I know William has never said he doesn't want to be King (not in the UK press).

I could seee Charles Abdicating when he is 75-80 years old to let his Son have a go and a good reign, much like the Dutch royals.

 

[prince.of.preslav]

Hi Neil!

Can you show me where in my post I stated that Princess Margaret's Teck necklace, Papirys tiara and the parure weren't hers? What I said was that it's possible that these jewels were sold privately to The Queen, because of their historical/family value, and now be part of HM's private collection (not Crown property!). (BTW, I think the parure would make a wonderful present for Princess William)

And last but not least, how do you know that the Teck necklace wasn't on loan? Have you talked to the family? As long as there's no official statement/reliable source, we are free to speculate and shere our musings, aren't we?

Regards!

 

[prince.of.preslav]

Here in the UK there is no mechanism for Charles to be by-passed as King unless the Queen abdicates and chooses to do so dynastically - so NONE of her children or grandchildren could take the throne.

Actually, there is - if he marries a Catholic or w/out the consent of the Monarch (i.e. his mother). Neil, can't The Prince of Wales renounce his rights to the throne? And back at the time when his sons were still minors, theirs as well?
On another note - if Her Majesty abdicates dynastically is The Duke of Gloucester going to be the next King?

he will be king and Camilla the Queen consort (yes I know she is going to be called Princess Consort, but in Law she would be Queen).

Just last week in his NBC interview Prince Charles said Camilla could be Queen.
When the reporter asked HRH if The Duchess of Cornwall is going to be Queen once he's King, The Prince said ‘That’s, that’s, we’ll see, won’t we? That could be.’

Here's one of the articles: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...aks-year-silence-future-role-second-wife.html

I agree with you that HRH may chose to abdicate some day.

Bobby

 

[T L]

As to Camilla becoming Queen, there goes the monarchy.

I don't think many people would have had a problem with Camilla becoming Queen if he married her in the first place, instead of Diana.

I think the Queen Mother is rolling around in her grave.

I don't see Charles abdicating, but forcing Camilla down people's throats.

 

[kimchi]

Prince Charles wore it ( and maybe still does) beneath his crest ring with the Prince of Wales feathers, which he wears on his pinky finger. He started doing this after her death.

 

[Imdanny]

As to Camilla becoming Queen, there goes the monarchy.

I don't think many people would have had a problem with Camilla becoming Queen if he married her in the first place, instead of Diana.

I think the Queen Mother is rolling around in her grave.

I don't see Charles abdicating, but forcing Camilla down people's throats.

This is a delicate subject, but, yes, I do feel that the official statement (iirc) saying that Camila would be Princess Consort was misleading. I believe that the plan all along has been that she will become known as the Queen. Charles' most recent statement rather gives the game away, imho.

 

[T L]

As to Camilla becoming Queen, there goes the monarchy.

I don't think many people would have had a problem with Camilla becoming Queen if he married her in the first place, instead of Diana.

I think the Queen Mother is rolling around in her grave.

I don't see Charles abdicating, but forcing Camilla down people's throats.

This is a delicate subject, but, yes, I do feel that the official statement (iirc) saying that Camila would be Princess Consort was misleading. I believe that the plan all along has been that she will become known as the Queen. Charles' most recent statement rather gives the game away, imho.

This reminds me when Henry VIII crowned Anne Boleyn, his mistress, Queen, after deposing a very loved monarch, Katherine of Aragaon. The people were really upset. Not much has changed in 450 years.

 

[Imdanny]

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

[JewelFreak]

My sentiments are with you, Danny & TL. It would sound silly, though, to call Camilla "Princess Consort." It's meaningless & there's no precedent for it in history. Married to the king, she's the queen. Obviously the idea was borrowed from Prince Philip's title of Prince Consort, but ancient monarchical gender bias requires that a man called King actually be the ruler. Not so for mere Queens -- although wife-Queens are sometimes diferentiated as Queen Consorts from reigning Queens. They were right, in my opinion, to bow to public feeling by calling Camilla Duchess of Cornwall -- half the world would've blown lunch calling her Princess of Wales. But Diana never was Queen & Camilla's a fact of life. Princess Consort is a little too precious for me. Besides, by the time Charles becomes king, the edges of resentment will probably have worn down.

I can't see him abdicating, ever. The English rf, more than Continental ones, has a deep feeling of lifetime commitment to duty & country, etc. (Ed. VIII excepted.) Can't imagine what a retired King of England would do or where they'd put him. It was such a shock to the country when Edward abdicated, a totally shaming act in the view of the citizens of the time. Charles has been imbued w/that sense of duty since his first breath -- he'd see himself as a quitter on the nation.

Neil -- I read in a couple of articles when William was in his late teens that he said to friends that he did not look forward to being King. Never in an interview himself. Who knows if it's true. I wouldn't want the job either (just the jewels), so can imagine his feeling that way!

--- Laurie

 

[T L]

I think the current monarch of England has spoilt her people by being the epitome of duty, refinement, dignity and someone who has high moral standards. Even though her children did not follow her example, it is still difficult to imagine anyone replacing her, let alone Charles and "Queen" Camilla. To me, and probably many people, Camilla will always be "Mrs Parker Bowles, the other woman."

Okay, I guess we better get back to "royal jewels"

 

[LadyMaria]

Here's a shot of CP Maxima at the wedding of Prince Carlos of Bourbon-Parma. Very interesting brooch she's wearing, and it looks like the earrings go with it.

 

[LadyMaria]

Here is another picture of Prince Carlos of Bourbon-Parma and his bride, Princess Annmarie. I think this would be a great style of wedding dress for Catherine Middleton to emulate...sleek and elegant, long-ish train (but not over the top), and it has sleeves (I am so sick of strapless wedding dresses...I am so glad I was married long before that trend started).

 

[prince.of.preslav]

My sentiments are with you, Danny & TL. It would sound silly, though, to call Camilla "Princess Consort." It's meaningless & there's no precedent for it in history. Married to the king, she's the queen.
.....

Neil -- I read in a couple of articles when William was in his late teens that he said to friends that he did not look forward to being King. Never in an interview himself. Who knows if it's true. I wouldn't want the job either (just the jewels), so can imagine his feeling that way!

--- Laurie

Laurie, thank you for this post about the Queen/Princess Consort Camilla issue. I totally agree with you.

May I just add a coule of things - Prince Philip is not a Prince Consort. Queen Victoria's husband, Prince Alebrt, was. I hope that The DoE will get the title in 2012.
I can't think of any other contential royal family apart of the Dutch with a tradition of abdication.
Prince William not looking forward to being King - In the NBC interview, which I mentioned above, The Prince of Wales also sais that he doesn't look forward to the time when he'll be King. The reason - it comes as a result of the death of a parent, something no one wishes. I suspect that's William's reason is the same.

Bobby

 

[JewelFreak]

(I am so sick of strapless wedding dresses...I am so glad I was married long before that trend started).

YAY for LadyM!!! First person I've run into who agrees w/me on that subject! Enough already of those -- definitely not everybody can wear them well. And booooring when everyone else does it too.

Nice photo of the wedding & a simple classical dress like that would be great on Kate. I love the bride's tiara too.

It's not only the present queen, LadyMaria, who is dignified & devoted to duty; the British monarchs have been so, pretty much from Victoria down -- apart from goony old Duke of Windsor, that is. Both QE's parents were loved for good reason, her grandparents greatly respected. And regarding abdication, Victoria didn't do much reigning after Prince Albert died, less & less as time went by, but still she would never have considered abdicating.

You are so right about the present Queen, who has given everything she has to her job, I believe from a genuine & deep feeling of responsibility & love for the nation. Somehow I get the feeling she's much more vulnerable emotionally to the occasional widespread disapproval from her subjects than we'd ever know. I don't think her son & his "queen" will equal her.

--- Laurie

P.S. Bobby, thanks for the correction on Philip. Re William, the gist of the article was that he felt constricted & unable to explore many interesting opportunities in life. He was a teenager at the time, though; he may feel differently now or in time -- if indeed he really said that; it was 2nd hand info.

 

[prince.of.preslav]

Here's a shot of CP Maxima at the wedding of Prince Carlos of Bourbon-Parma. Very interesting brooch she's wearing, and it looks like the earrings go with it.

Yes, the brooch is interesting. But, honestly, I was a bit disappointed by Princess Maxima's appearance at the wedding - the trousers and the bold fake jewells. This outfit (the colour) would've looked perfect with the Princess' black/Tahitian pearl set. And she would've looked more properly dressed - this is the wedding of HRH The Duke of Parma & Piacenza, after all!

 

[prince.of.preslav]

I think the current monarch of England has spoilt her people by being the epitome of duty, refinement, dignity and someone who has high moral standards. Even though her children did not follow her example, it is still difficult to imagine anyone replacing her, let alone Charles and "Queen" Camilla. To me, and probably many people, Camilla will always be "Mrs Parker Bowles, the other woman."

Okay, I guess we better get back to "royal jewels"

Before we get back to Royal Jewels, would you please tell me in what way Elizabeth II's children are not dutiful, refined, dignified and without moral standarts? The Prince of Wales and The Princess Royal undertake hundreds of engagements annually. The Duke of York promotes British business around the world. The Wessexes are also working hard on behalf of The Queen.
Yes, three of HM's children divorced and two of them later remarried (the boy to his long time mistress). But other than that I don't see a problem with the royal couple's children.

Bobby

 

[prince.of.preslav]

P.S. Bobby, thanks for the correction on Philip. Re William, the gist of the article was that he felt constricted & unable to explore many interesting opportunities in life. He was a teenager at the time, though; he may feel differently now or in time -- if indeed he really said that; it was 2nd hand info.

Laurie, you're welcome. Now I can understand why William said this. Obviously, however, he has found a way how to explore the interesting opportunities in life - he managed to travel to Africa, engage and return unnoticed. And I'm sure this is not his first time doing so (apart from engaging). The same counts for his brother. What's more, now as a RAF pilot, he can experiance a rather normal life away from the lime light & royal duties.

Bobby

 

[prince.of.preslav]

Today at the Royal Palace in Stocholm The Swedish royal family hosted a gala for the MPs.

The Queen wore her long string of large pearls as a two row necklace:http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716915/preview/watermark

The Crown Princess opted for simple amethyst peandant and studs:http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716901/preview/watermark

Princess Madeleine wore large hoops with diamonds(?):http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716970/preview/watermark

 

[LadyMaria]

(I am so sick of strapless wedding dresses...I am so glad I was married long before that trend started).

YAY for LadyM!!! First person I've run into who agrees w/me on that subject! Enough already of those -- definitely not everybody can wear them well.
.

Agreed. Exhibit A: Zara Phillips at her brother's wedding.

 

[LadyMaria]

Here's a shot of CP Maxima at the wedding of Prince Carlos of Bourbon-Parma. Very interesting brooch she's wearing, and it looks like the earrings go with it.

Yes, the brooch is interesting. But, honestly, I was a bit disappointed by Princess Maxima's appearance at the wedding - the trousers and the bold fake jewells. This outfit (the colour) would've looked perfect with the Princess' black/Tahitian pearl set. And she would've looked more properly dressed - this is the wedding of HRH The Duke of Parma & Piacenza, after all!

I was attempting to charitable when I described Maxima's brooch as "interesting." I really thought it looked like a bunch of black plastic knobs put together with super glue. Some fake jewels look good and make us do a double take if they are real or not. Others just look cheap. You're right, the black Tahitian pearl set would have looked better.

 

[JewelFreak]

Tahitian pearls, yes. That brooch, em........not up to par.

The CP of Sweden always looks so beautifully put together, I wish i had that talent. She's beautiful. And knows when to wear small jewels & when to be splashy, a talent not everyone has.

--- Laurie

 

[T L]

I think the current monarch of England has spoilt her people by being the epitome of duty, refinement, dignity and someone who has high moral standards. Even though her children did not follow her example, it is still difficult to imagine anyone replacing her, let alone Charles and "Queen" Camilla. To me, and probably many people, Camilla will always be "Mrs Parker Bowles, the other woman."

Okay, I guess we better get back to "royal jewels"

Before we get back to Royal Jewels, would you please tell me in what way Elizabeth II's children are not dutiful, refined, dignified and without moral standarts? The Prince of Wales and The Princess Royal undertake hundreds of engagements annually. The Duke of York promotes British business around the world. The Wessexes are also working hard on behalf of The Queen.
Yes, three of HM's children divorced and two of them later remarried (the boy to his long time mistress). But other than that I don't see a problem with the royal couple's children.

Bobby

You are right Bobby, they do take up many charities, but so many people look at the divorces (it should be noted that one of her children has not divoced, Edward). It's a pity that people never bring up their good intentions and I am guilty of that myself. My apologies, as I was a bit harsh. I supposed HM to me, even though she is far from perfect, is a dutiful servant to her country, and I really admire her. She's a tough act to follow IMHO.

 

[T L]

Today at the Royal Palace in Stocholm The Swedish royal family hosted a gala for the MPs.

The Queen wore her long string of large pearls as a two row necklace:http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716915/preview/watermark

The Crown Princess opted for simple amethyst peandant and studs:http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716901/preview/watermark

Princess Madeleine wore large hoops with diamonds(?):http://c.cdn.belga.be/picture/23716970/preview/watermark

Lovely photos of the beautiful ladies of the Swedish Royal Family. Victoria looks especially radiant here. Hmmmm, wonder if she's expecting!! One can always hope!

 

[Imdanny]

I was attempting to charitable when I described Maxima's brooch as "interesting." I really thought it looked like a bunch of black plastic knobs put together with super glue.

LOL!

 

[Josefine]

did madeleine wear the same earings as victoria worn a few times

 

[Imdanny]

The Duchess of Windsor's Cartier panther bracelet.

http://www.sothebys.com/app/ecatalo...id=30338|r.main=lot.jsp?event_id=30338&id=19/