Buyer Beware... If you're non-American, think twice before purchasing from the US

[Bonfire]

Exactly right @Lookinagain. Companies will not absorb the higher costs, it will be passed on to us, the consumer.

ETA: That’s not just luxury goods. It will effect everything.

 

[Tigerlilyrosepetal]

Well, I'm going to jump in here and say that the businesses that will feel the effects the most seem to be the smaller business people who have their goods made in China. Like the woman who makes a baby toy, has paid for her next order, but with the new additional huge tariff on Chinese imports, she needs another $200,000 to get the order she already paid for. And she doesn't have that kind of money. To get the goods made here would take a lot of tooling and time and money. She has no inventory so basically is out of business. It's not just luxury goods at all. It's across all industries and affects businesses large and small, and of course the consumer. I really don't get the impression that @Texas Leaguer is only concerned because his business is affected, as you seem to think. He seems to be concerned about the totality of the effect of these tariffs, as are many of us.

I can see he is concerned, in general. Just to straighten your misperception of me and for what it “seems” I think. So I will tell you instead. I am interested in seeing how it affects the diamond industry and people’s inability to purchase their diamonds. This was the original topic of the thread, right?

 

[Tigerlilyrosepetal]

I'm far more concerned about the overall effects.
The cost of the diamonds is the least of my worries.
It is, after all, a luxury item and companies that offer extra special service can and will charge more than mass market/virtual sites.
But how about the people who work for us?
The diamond setters. Jewelers. They now need to pay more for everything.
They are going to need to charge more.

Now imagine this on a massive scale- all the people you might hire- plumber- whoever.
It's almost inconceivable how bad an idea this sounds like - to so many of us.
And the effects have not begun to emerge.

Hi Rock!
Hmm, maybe it will lead to an extinction of a wide diamond market in the US?

 

[Lookinagain]

I can see he is concerned, in general. Just to straighten your misperception of me and for what it “seems” I think. So I will tell you instead. I am interested in seeing how it affects the diamond industry and people’s inability to purchase their diamonds. This was the original topic of the thread, right?

Thanks for clarifying what you think. It was hard to discern from your posts.

 

[Tigerlilyrosepetal]

Thanks for clarifying what you think. It was hard to discern from your posts.

No worries. I appreciate that you are respectful. Thank you

 

[Texas Leaguer]

I can see he is concerned, in general. Just to straighten your misperception of me and for what it “seems” I think. So I will tell you instead. I am interested in seeing how it affects the diamond industry and people’s inability to purchase their diamonds. This was the original topic of the thread, right?

If I said I was not concerned for my particular industry it would be disengenous. And if we were to go away, maybe nobody would grieve if all other industries and consumers somehow benefitted. But the problem is so, so much bigger than one industry at this point. I think of America and Americans who will be bearing the hardships of foolish economic and foreign policy.

I think of all the young people just starting out. It was hard enough to come of age during a pandemic. And we were getting through it and there was some hope that the future would look better for them. And now you have the genius who suggested Americans inject bleach to cure covid basically forcing bleach down the throats of the rest of the world to cure America's percieved economic ills. At least now the megadonors, who know this is a catastrophic path, have managed to convince him to "pause". But who knows what happens tomorrow, or next week or next month. This uncertainty alone is terrible for business and is costing America by the hour and by the day.

Apple is one of the biggest companies in the world, and they move the whole market. Is the iphone a luxury? I don't know - it seems like a lot of us think they are pretty indespensible. Apple has spent decades building manufacturing plants in China and developing the expertise and supply chains to deliver millions of iphones to the world at a price many people can afford. The estimates are that making an iphone in the US could raise the price to $3,500. How many customers and how much revenue would they lose if they had to sell them for that price? But that is just rhetorical because Apple can't possibly shut down operations in China and move manufacturing to the US. It's not even remotely possible.

And that's just one example of the faulty premise that's the basis of the unnecessary and unwise trade war we have started.

 

[Tigerlilyrosepetal]

If I said I was not concerned for my particular industry it would be disengenous. And if we were to go away, maybe nobody would grieve if all other industries and consumers somehow benefitted. But the problem is so, so much bigger than one industry at this point. I think of America and Americans who will be bearing the hardships of foolish economic and foreign policy.

I think of all the young people just starting out. It was hard enough to come of age during a pandemic. And we were getting through it and there was some hope that the future would look better for them. And now you have the genius who suggested Americans inject bleach to cure covid basically forcing bleach down the throats of the rest of the world to cure America's percieved economic ills. At least now the megadonors, who know this is a catastrophic path, have managed to convince him to "pause". But who knows what happens tomorrow, or next week or next month. This uncertainty alone is terrible for business and is costing America by the hour and by the day.

Apple is one of the biggest companies in the world, and they move the whole market. Is the iphone a luxury? I don't know - it seems like a lot of us think they are pretty indespensible. Apple has spent decades building manufacturing plants in China and developing the expertise and supply chains to deliver millions of iphones to the world at a price many people can afford. The estimates are that making an iphone in the US could raise the price to $3,500. How many customers and how much revenue would they lose if they had to sell them for that price? But that is just rhetorical because Apple can't possibly shut down operations in China and move manufacturing to the US. It's not even remotely possible.

And that's just one example of the faulty premise that's the basis of the unnecessary and unwise trade war we have started.

Thank you. I’m curious as to why you say that Apple couldn’t possibly leave China and move manufacturing to the US? Obviously, one of the broad goals of this economic plan is to bring back manufacturing to the US instead of on foreign soil. In February, Apple announced plans to invest 500 billion dollars in the US, specifically in Texas. And to hire 20,000 workers all by 2028.
No doubt there will be a pinch in the short term, but I think the end game is to make companies manufacture here and with time and commitment, why couldn’t it happen?
There has been a lot of doom and gloom prophecy on here. And there are business-minded aims as you obviously know. They may have harmful effects for some but to go back to another point you made earlier, I just don’t see it possible that a world leader take a Hippocratic oath to “do no harm.” We don’t live in a Utopia.
Anyway, I appreciated your post, so thank you.

 

[Bonfire]

No doubt there will be a pinch in the short term, but I think the end game is to make companies manufacture here and with time and commitment, why couldn’t it happen?

For one example, China and Taiwan make something like 60-70% of the world’s semiconductors (computer chips). We don’t have the rare earth minerals, we only manufacture a small percentage, 12-15%.

 

[Lookinagain]

I’m curious as to why you say that Apple couldn’t possibly leave China and move manufacturing to the US?

There are tons of articles out there that explain why it won't or can't happen. I would link some of them but they may contain names. They come from various sources. Here are some excerpts from two of them:

"The disincentives for Apple shifting its production domestically include a complex supply chain that it began building in China during the 1990s. It would take several years and cost billions of dollars to build new plants in the U.S., and then confront Apple with economic forces that could triple the price of an iPhone, threatening to torpedo sales of its marquee product."

"But during a 2017 appearance at a conference in China, Cook expressed doubt about whether the U.S. labor pool had enough workers with the vocational skills required to do the painstaking and tedious work . . ..

“In the U.S. you could have a meeting of tooling engineers and I’m not sure we could fill the room,” Cook said. “In China, you could fill multiple football fields.”

The $500 billion wasn't tied to making iPhones in the U.S.

"Apple pledged to fund a Houston data center for computer servers powering artificial intelligence — a technology the company is expanding into as part of an industrywide craze."

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Thank you. I’m curious as to why you say that Apple couldn’t possibly leave China and move manufacturing to the US? Obviously, one of the broad goals of this economic plan is to bring back manufacturing to the US instead of on foreign soil. In February, Apple announced plans to invest 500 billion dollars in the US, specifically in Texas. And to hire 20,000 workers all by 2028.
No doubt there will be a pinch in the short term, but I think the end game is to make companies manufacture here and with time and commitment, why couldn’t it happen?
There has been a lot of doom and gloom prophecy on here. And there are business-minded aims as you obviously know. They may have harmful effects for some but to go back to another point you made earlier, I just don’t see it possible that a world leader take a Hippocratic oath to “do no harm.” We don’t live in a Utopia.
Anyway, I appreciated your post, so thank you.

There is a good article on Apple by a reporter that has covered them extensively. I think New York Times. First, Apple has been building the manufacturing capability there for literally decades. It would probably take a similar timeline to recreate it in the US, even if it was feasible. Second, there are 1000 parts in an iphone supplied by many different contractors in China. And there is a unique labor situation in China that Apple is able to leverage. Not just the lower labor cost, but there is aparently a seasonal influx of workers from the countryside to the city at just the time Apple needs to assemble and ship some crazy number like 1M iphones a day.

The article explains how Tim Cook has had to walk a tightrope for Apple with you know who, and how even back in 2017 he made pledges that did not actually or fully happen. Since you know who likes to get over-the-top headlines like "Apple pledges 500B investment", just for the appearance of success.

 

[Sunrises Sunsets]

There is a good article on Apple by a reporter that has covered them extensively. I think New York Times. First, Apple has been building the manufacturing capability there for literally decades. It would probably take a similar timeline to recreate it in the US, even if it was feasible. Second, there are 1000 parts in an iphone supplied by many different contractors in China. And there is a unique labor situation in China that Apple is able to leverage. Not just the lower labor cost, but there is aparently a seasonal influx of workers from the countryside to the city at just the time Apple needs to assemble and ship some crazy number like 1M iphones a day.

The article explains how Tim Cook has had to walk a tightrope for Apple with you know who, and how even back in 2017 he made pledges that did not actually or fully happen. Since you know who likes to get over-the-top headlines like "Apple pledges 500B investment", just for the appearance of success.

Want to have Apple up and running in the USA within 2 years? Stop buying Apple products made in China. Viola!

 

[missy]

Interesting. Smartphones and computers are exempt from the tariffs. For now
Info from CNN

 

[Rockdiamond]

Welcome to 2025.
It’s been thoroughly explained- how it would take many years to create the infrastructure needed to make iPhones in the US.
Facts??? Stop it with that already.
Then, make a suggestion like “ everyone just needs to stop buying iPhones and viola!!”
As if anyone could get “everyone” to do anything.
Yes, it’s frustrating.
Screw the facts. Just listen to what the government is telling you!!!
While our economy is being destroyed

 

[Rockdiamond]

Looks like the sort of job Americans will be lining up to apply for.

 

[Bonfire]

Want to have Apple up and running in the USA within 2 years? Stop buying Apple products made in China. Viola!

See post #458.
We would still need to import semiconductors from China and Taiwan. We don’t have our own supply of the rare earth minerals. The cost of Apple products will become prohibitive with the 145% tariffs. May not be a concern for you, but in the US iPhone has the market share. Follow the money. Again may not be a concern for you, but most Americans can’t do ANYTHING without their phone. That’s a whole other story.I’ve read that some production has moved to Vietnam and India, but they’re not spared from tariffs either.
Like it or not we are a global economy. Bringing back Manufacturing to the extent you are inferring will never make economic sense. As Americans we’ve come to expect the cost of goods at Walmart, Costco, Home Depot etc to be affordable. We can’t have it both ways.

 

[lulu_ma]

One consequence. I’m 100% American btw.

 

[Lookinagain]

We don't have the labor force to make iPhones here. That's been made pretty clear. Americans do not want those kinds of jobs, sitting there all day screwing tiny screws into an iPhone.

 

[missy]

https://www.barrons.com/articles/tariffs-exclusions-exemptions-apple-nvidia-dell-smartphones-pcs-b2e069ff

‘Apple, Nvidia, Dell, and Others Get a Tariffs Exemption Under New Rules”

 

[Bonfire]

Let’s talk for a minute about American soybean farmers.
China is our biggest customer for soybean exports, followed by the EU.
Our own farmers in the heartland are getting screwed over by this administration’s tariffs. How is that America first?

 

[Mreader]

We don't have the labor force to make iPhones here. That's been made pretty clear. Americans so not want those kinds of jobs, sitting there all day screwing tiny screws into an iPhone.

Hahaha there was a hilarious clip about this where someone actually said we can hire Americans to do this. I forget which it was…I’ll try to find it

 

[Mreader]

Let’s talk for a minute about American soybean farmers.
China is our biggest customer for soybean exports, followed by the EU.
Our own farmers in the heartland are getting screwed over by this administration’s tariffs. How is that America first?

It’s not. This is what drives nuts. Supporters aren’t cognizant of the facts.

And again - the bad AI math? Anyone?

 

[missy]

Soybean farmers are concerned as they should be but there might be a renogiation.
They are asking the current administration to reconsider.



"
Farmers are frustrated. Tariffs are not something to take lightly and 'have fun' with. Not only do they hit our family businesses squarely in the wallet, but they rock a core tenet on which our trading relationships are built, and that is reliability. Being able to reliably supply a quality product to them consistently,” said Caleb Ragland, American Soybean Association president and soy farmer from Magnolia, Kentucky.

Ragland explained, “As the #1 export crop for the U.S., soybean producers face huge, disproportionate impacts from trade flow disruptions, particularly to China, which is our largest market. And we know foreign soybean producers in Brazil and other countries are expecting abundant crops this year and are primed to meet any demand stemming from a renewed U.S.-China trade war. Soybean farmers still have not fully recovered market volumes from the damaging impacts of the 2018 trade war, and this will further exacerbate economic hardship on our farmers.

Unlike in 2018, farmers are in a more tentative financial situation in 2025. Commodity prices are down nearly 50% from three years ago. And, they are operating their farms during a time when costs for land and inputs like seed, pesticides and fertilizer are high, meaning much slimmer margins and less savings to draw from when tariffs make circumstances go south.

Ragland said of Mexico and Canada, “ASA represents nearly half a million farmers in the United States who grow soybeans, and those farmers rely on two-way trade coming in and out of Mexico and Canada. Not only are those two markets vital for the export of whole soybeans, soy meal and soy oil, but we also rely on them for fertilizer and other products needed to successfully produce our crops. For instance, around 87% of the potash we use here in the U.S. is imported from Canada.”

Since the North American Free Trade Agreement, NAFTA, was ratified in 1993 and then continuing under USMCA, which was signed into law five years ago in January 2020, Mexico and Canada have developed into major trading partners for soy, our country’s #1 agricultural export. Mexico is the second-largest customer for whole soybeans, soybean meal, and soybean oil. Canada is U.S. soy’s fourth-largest customer for soybean meal. The U.S. imports the bulk of its potash from Canada, along with other crop inputs, equipment and more.

ASA and soy farmers are urging the administration to reconsider these tariffs and continue negotiations with the three countries that include non-tariff solutions.

"

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Soybean farmers will now have to get billions more in taxpayer subsidies to keep them alive. But that's not socialism. Subsidies for people who can't afford health care is socialism.

Or the farmers could simply move to the cities and get those new factory jobs that are going to be pouring in.

 

[Bonfire]

“Asking the current administration to reconsider.”
That’s laughable. There is no consideration or deliberation in these dartboard decisions. As long as he considers himself winning.

 

[Rockdiamond]

“Asking the current administration to reconsider

Or find a way to buy/sell a bunch of stock right before making an announcement!
How none of these considerations were taken into account BEFORE throwing the world economy into chaos…… how is that defendable in any sense. 3d chess my a$$

 

[Snowdrop13]

Ooooooh, smartphones and computers have now been exempt from tariffs. Quelle surprise. Voilà.

Pedant alert: a Viola is a musical instrument, or a flower.

 

[Sunrises Sunsets]

Looks like the sort of job Americans will be lining up to apply for.

Yes, WE are above manual/physical labor and are too busy renting storage lockers for all the cr*p we accumulate with our portfolios. Good thing we are haughty so we can look down our noses at gainfully employed people who aren't scientists, CEO's, politicians and all those with staff.

America doesn't paint a very pretty picture of itself when people are mocked for the manual labor they perform.

 

[Sunrises Sunsets]

Soybean farmers will now have to get billions more in taxpayer subsidies to keep them alive. But that's not socialism. Subsidies for people who can't afford health care is socialism.

Or the farmers could simply move to the cities and get those new factory jobs that are going to be pouring in.

If you lived in farm country, you would know how many farmers, who live very nice lives, live off large government subsidies at this point.

Ah, the poor farmer... If there is a growing season that totally wipes out a crop, I can see that but if exporting the farm production for our country was opened up for free trade, the farmers wouldn't need to live off taxpayers and could afford the big, fancy equipment they own. As an aside, it would be an important statistic to show how many of the farms are now corporations with large tracts of land receiving these subsidies. Look under the covers..

 

[Bonfire]

Good thing we are haughty so we can look down our noses at gainfully employed people who aren't scientists, CEO's, politicians and all those with staff

Gainfully employed under a communist regime you mean? No thank you.

 

[Sunrises Sunsets]

Or find a way to buy/sell a bunch of stock right before making an announcement!
How none of these considerations were taken into account BEFORE throwing the world economy into chaos…… how is that defendable in any sense. 3d chess my a$$

Didn't you sell stock off quickly so you wouldn't suffer the losses others have now suffered? Is that insider trading or cognizant planning with the information at hand?