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Heartbroken: USPS lost preloved Moline pearl earrings

In all of the communications between the buyer and the seller in this transaction, was there no exchange of PHONE NUMBERS so they could TALK to each other? All this "I sent an email," "I never got an email," yada yada yada could have -- IN MY MOST HUMBLE OPINION -- possibly been better resolved with a CONVERSATION.

BTW, I sell literally HUNDREDS of things online every year (NOT jewelry) and NO package with a value of more than $100 is leaving my hands at the post office without insurance. Insurance costs (in the systems I use) $1.60 per $100 over the first $100. (The first $100 of insurance is included with virtually all shipping methods.) So I'm confused as to the lack of insurance... ? Maybe i missed something on that point?
 
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BTW, aside from filing a "claim," has anyone filed a "find my package" request with the Post Office? EITHER party can do that, not just the sender. As a matter of fact, I think anyone who has the buyer/seller/tracking number can file this request. He!!, send ME the info and *I* will file the request just to facilitate a close to this issue.
 
The U.S. Post Office works in mysterious ways. I once bought a ring from The Moonstoned that was lost in the mail. Months (maybe a year?) after she refunded me, the package with ring in it was returned to her.

I hope the earrings show up.
 
Dee*Jay said:
BTW, aside from filing a "claim," has anyone filed a "find my package" request with the Post Office? EITHER party can do that, not just the sender. As a matter of fact, I think anyone who has the buyer/seller/tracking number can file this request. He!!, send ME the info and *I* will file the request just to facilitate a close to this issue.
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Yes, that was tried. USPS is indeed stating it as a lost package. I called USPS myself.
 
fiona00004 said:
Yes, that was tried. USPS is indeed stating it as a lost package. I called USPS myself.
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Got it -- thanks for clarifying that point for me (and maybe I did miss that earlier in the thread).

Tell me again how the decision was made not to get insurance? Or, if I have that point incorrect, please correct me.
 
fiona00004 said:
I understand what you mean. The seller is a private person, not a business so it was my responsibility to choose insured shipping.

However, the package got lost in the USPS system soon after it was shipped out so I think USPS should be held responsible somehow. It's not like it got delivered and stolen off my front door or anything.
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Sorry, but USPS won't help if you didn't buy insurance. Insurance is meant for situations like this.

You said below you were acting in good faith, and it sounds like the seller is doing the same thing. She has filed a claim with USPS, but it takes a long time for them to handle it, so everyone is waiting. I understand you’re upset because she doesn’t always reply to your emails, but if I were her, I might stop responding too if a buyer kept filing claims after I had done everything I could.
 
Dee*Jay said:
Got it -- thanks for clarifying that point for me (and maybe I did miss that earlier in the thread).

Tell me again how the decision was made not to get insurance? Or, if I have that point incorrect, please correct me.
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The seller didn't add insurance, but she gave the buyer the option to buy it. The buyer decided not to.
 
Blingluvr3425 said:
Sorry, but USPS won't help if you didn't buy insurance. Insurance is meant for situations like this.

You said below you were acting in good faith, and it sounds like the seller is doing the same thing. She has filed a claim with USPS, but it takes a long time for them to handle it, so everyone is waiting. I understand you’re upset because she doesn’t always reply to your emails, but if I were her, I might stop responding too if a buyer kept filing claims after I had done everything I could.
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Ok. I understand. It could all be miscommunication. I get its a waiting game. It's hard when some communication goes through and some of it doesn't. I just like to stay updated on what's going on, that's it. So after almost a month , I thought I would reach out and ask what's up. It's only when my attempts don't seem to be getting through do I pursue further.
 
Blingluvr3425 said:
The seller didn't add insurance, but she gave the buyer the option to buy it. The buyer decided not to.
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Hindsight is always 20/20. The buyer SHOULD have opted for insurance. The seller, in the absence of the buyer opting for it, SHOULD have added it at her own cost. But neither of them did.

Regardless, I maintain that the buyer and the seller SHOULD at this point, if they haven't already, exchange phone numbers and DISCUSS a resolution.

To be clear: I have no pony in this race. I'm not either party in this transaction. But being an online vendor myself (again, NOT jewelry) I have definite opinions on how transactions -- and resolutions -- SHOULD be handled. Given that this dispute (for lack of a better word) has now been made very public, any and all input from members of the peanut gallery (and I'm including mine in that bucket) has been invited.

In my OPINION the thing to do now is to see what happens with the Postal Service. Note that there is a mandatory waiting period (as has been stated earlier in this thread) before the PO will do anything. If the package does ever show up at the buyer's doorstep the buyer should repay the seller for the 50% refund that's already been given. (No idea why that happened BTW -- just as an act of good faith on the part of the seller... ?)

As someone who deals with the Postal Service on a daily basis, I have found that the squeaky wheel often gets a package found. So it may take a little while, but I'm hopeful that will happen here.
 
Dee*Jay said:
Hindsight is always 20/20. The buyer SHOULD have opted for insurance. The seller, in the absence of the buyer opting for it, SHOULD have added it at her own cost. But neither of them did.

Regardless, I maintain that the buyer and the seller SHOULD at this point, if they haven't already, exchange phone numbers and DISCUSS a resolution.

To be clear: I have no pony in this race. I'm not either party in this transaction. But being an online vendor myself (again, NOT jewelry) I have definite opinions on how transactions -- and resolutions -- SHOULD be handled. Given that this dispute (for lack of a better word) has now been made very public, any and all input from members of the peanut gallery (and I'm including mine in that bucket) has been invited.

In my OPINION the thing to do now is to see what happens with the Postal Service. Note that there is a mandatory waiting period (as has been stated earlier in this thread) before the PO will do anything. If the package does ever show up at the buyer's doorstep the buyer should repay the seller for the 50% refund that's already been given. (No idea why that happened BTW -- just as an act of good faith on the part of the seller... ?)

As someone who deals with the Postal Service on a daily basis, I have found that the squeaky wheel often gets a package found. So it may take a little while, but I'm hopeful that will happen here.
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I don't think anyone has been refunded? The buyer sent the seller a paypal request for the 50% out of the blue.
 
Blingluvr3425 said:
I don't think anyone has been refunded? The buyer sent the seller a paypal request for the 50% out of the blue.
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Ah! Thank you! I was under the mistaken impression that a 50% refund had been issued. My bad.
 
Dee*Jay said:
Ah! Thank you! I was under the mistaken impression that a 50% refund had been issued. My bad.
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I had to read it a few times to figure out what was happening. I’ll go back to just lurking now, but I wanted to comment because I sell things online a lot and I think it's important for buyers to understand how this works.
 
This is such an unfortunate situation .. and, I think, rare for us PSers. At this point, there is little to be gained airing it out here. The USPS will likely take some time to pay out a nominal amount (if any).
I think we can all agree that insurance is a must when shipping an expensive item. I include insured/signature-required postage/PP fees in my ‘lowest price I can bear’ during pricing or negotiations. As a semi-frequent private seller, I always feel it is my responsibility to get the item to the buyer. If it fails, then that’s on me, thus the insurance.
I truly hope this can be resolved soon for both of your sake.
 
Anytime I have sold something (that I am not willing to cover myself if lost) I include insurance in the price. Don’t even give the buyer the option, just give them the lowest price you can take with the insurance accounted for. It certainly is worth the peace of mind if something does go wrong. Just pointing this out for any newbies reading this thread, not trying to shame anyone here at all. I think the seller here is doing everything she can and acting in good faith to get the item to the buyer.
 
I love it that I don't see this thread (even though I reported it) anymore unless I get a notification for it. As if I'VE been blocked but it's obviously still around. Thanks for all ya'll who know I'm not acting in good faith but I'm done with this.
 
fiona00004 said:
I understand what you mean. The seller is a private person, not a business so it was my responsibility to choose insured shipping.

However, the package got lost in the USPS system soon after it was shipped out so I think USPS should be held responsible somehow. It's not like it got delivered and stolen off my front door or anything.
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That’s not how it works with USPS. If you don’t pay for insurance than it’s too bad so sad. You might get the minimum which is I timing $100 but even that is not guaranteed. It’s also a painfully slow process to make a claim. It took 3 months for my claim to finally be approved on an INSURED international package that they lost. And that was after having to follow up several times. You also have to have all kinds of proof on what was in the package and proof of the items value. Basically they can say that you overstated the items value and not approve your claim. Lots of loopholes. It’s a giant pain to get them to pay out. Luckily my package was a return to a vendor in Japan so my correspondence with them about the item I was returning eventually enough to get them to approve my claim but it was not as easy as just filing the claim and waiting 30 days for my check.

You didn’t ask for my opinion but since you are dragging another member on a public forum in what I can only view as a bizarre tactic to get them to do what you want I am going to give it to you anyway.

My opinion is you took the risk when you decided not pay extra for insurance and it didn’t pay off this time. Since the package was clearly mailed out but the seller (and you had a good experience in the past so there is little reason to suspect they did anything nefarious) you have no cause to insist that they bear any of this burden with you. It is an expensive lesson to learn but that is how I see it.

Also taking this to a public forum is really uncalled for. The seller didn’t do anything wrong in this situation. And in fact is doing more than is really required if YOU chose not to insure your purchase. It’s really not making you look good either by claiming fraud on the PayPal case. That could get their account banned. I can tell you a lot of people might question selling to you in the future with this behavior.

Best of luck. Hope they find the package.
 
I would have never questioned a buyer declining insurance before, on something I was selling P2P like on LT. I’ve chosen to gamble on that, when buying as well.

Not anymore.

The suggestion to include the insurance into the asking price no matter what, has been made numerous times before for peace of mind, but hadn’t sunk in as this type and degree of necessity if I ever chose to sell that way again, until now.

And no more choice to declare low value, either.
 
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Asscherhalo_lover said:
I love it that I don't see this thread (even though I reported it) anymore unless I get a notification for it. As if I'VE been blocked but it's obviously still around. Thanks for all ya'll who know I'm not acting in good faith but I'm done with this.
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Thread notifications will notify you about only the next reply until you visit the thread again, then it will notify you again about the first reply until you visit again, etc. It's not a perfect system but it is what we are working with.
 
I'll post this here since @fiona00004 wants everything public, I will NOT be emailing you again. WHEN USPS eventually sends me whatever they send me from the claim, I'll send it to you via paypal (if they don't close our account due to your fraud claim). I'll post the evidence here so everyone can know that I'm not messing around. I'm really disappointed that PS admins allowed this thread to go on after taking down the FIRST one. This is NOT a place that values it's long time contributors, I know that now.
 
Asscherhalo_lover said:
I'll post this here since @fiona00004 wants everything public, I will NOT be emailing you again. WHEN USPS eventually sends me whatever they send me from the claim, I'll send it to you via paypal (if they don't close our account due to your fraud claim). I'll post the evidence here so everyone can know that I'm not messing around. I'm really disappointed that PS admins allowed this thread to go on after taking down the FIRST one. This is NOT a place that values it's long time contributors, I know that now.
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I think I'd be thankful she made this thread to be honest- she aired everything out and it clearly makes her look like she is being unreasonable and exonerated you of any wrong doing what so ever, maybe reading these replies will make her take a look at the situation from an outside perspective and realize she's likely in the wrong.
 
Rfisher said:
I would have never questioned a buyer declining insurance before, on something I was selling P2P like on LT. I’ve chosen to gamble on that, when buying as well.

Not anymore.

The suggestion to include the insurance into the asking price no matter what, has been made numerous times before for peace of mind, but hadn’t sunk in as this type and degree of necessity if I ever chose to sell that way again, until now.

And no more choice to declare low value, either.
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Sometimes that's not an option, though.

I've bought from PSers twice. Both times insurance just wasn't possible for my destination. Both times declaring low value and some rubbish on the package was necessary to minimise the chances of potential theft.

Both times there was a prior explicit agreement with the seller on who assumes the risk should the package get lost in the mail. This, I believe, is a very crucial part. If a possibility exists, however small, have a prior agreement on what happens should the events unfold unfavourably. Of course, that also requires the consent of the party assuming the risk. If you're not okay with putting that money on the table, simply don't go forward with the sale.

In any case, if insurance has been an option, has been offered and refused, the risk lies with the person who refused.

Personally, if I can pay a little extra to have the peace of mind that my item is going to arrive safely or, in case it doesn't, I'll get my money back, I'll always choose to pay a little extra and I believe everyone else should, too. Having a unique and one of a kind peace of jewellery get lost is enough of a loss all on its own, no need to add lost money on top of it all.
 
anon34985 said:
I think I'd be thankful she made this thread to be honest- she aired everything out and it clearly makes her look like she is being unreasonable and exonerated you of any wrong doing what so ever, maybe reading these replies will make her take a look at the situation from an outside perspective and realize she's likely in the wrong.
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And it has also completely ruined my experience and enjoyment of PS of which I've been a member for 17 years. I feel embarrassed, my character has been called into question and judged, and I don't feel comfortable participating or sharing anywhere here anymore. I'm not even ALLOWED to close my account until this is "settled", I'm being held hostage by this thread.

Oh, I had my husband check my email filters, messages containing "re:" had been automatically sent to trash, no clue how long, it wasn't just the OPs emails, I have missed many. It happens. It's fixed now. OP could have messaged me through paypal as she's done before INSTEAD of filing a fraud claim through PayPal (fraud on her part) and then the NEXT DAY sending me a request for HALF of the money $155 (a whopping $310 of which she CHOSE not to spend another $15 for full insurance).

And how long did all of this happen in? I sent her an update August 5th. I DID get an email from USPS telling me I had to wait another 30 days to actually file an insurance claim. I was on my summer break WITH MY CHILDREN so I FORGOT to send it to her. You know, LIFE? Then I didn't get her email for an update, and all of sudden the paypal stuff and then this thread.

I'm glad others think positively of me still and that I have done all I can, which I HAVE. I have explained to OP MANY TIMES through email (which I will no longer do) that dealing with the government USPS is NOT QUICK but she doesn't seem to comprehend that. I also have a LIFE and sh*t happens, I'm not sitting around sending frequent update on NOTHING emails.

Anywho, I'll update here until this is done. Anyone who still wants to follow bling fun can find me elsewhere.
 
Asscherhalo_lover said:
And it has also completely ruined my experience and enjoyment of PS of which I've been a member for 17 years. I feel embarrassed, my character has been called into question and judged, and I don't feel comfortable participating or sharing anywhere here anymore. I'm not even ALLOWED to close my account until this is "settled", I'm being held hostage by this thread.

Oh, I had my husband check my email filters, messages containing "re:" had been automatically sent to trash, no clue how long, it wasn't just the OPs emails, I have missed many. It happens. It's fixed now. OP could have messaged me through paypal as she's done before INSTEAD of filing a fraud claim through PayPal (fraud on her part) and then the NEXT DAY sending me a request for HALF of the money $155 (a whopping $310 of which she CHOSE not to spend another $15 for full insurance).

And how long did all of this happen in? I sent her an update August 5th. I DID get an email from USPS telling me I had to wait another 30 days to actually file an insurance claim. I was on my summer break WITH MY CHILDREN so I FORGOT to send it to her. You know, LIFE? Then I didn't get her email for an update, and all of sudden the paypal stuff and then this thread.

I'm glad others think positively of me still and that I have done all I can, which I HAVE. I have explained to OP MANY TIMES through email (which I will no longer do) that dealing with the government USPS is NOT QUICK but she doesn't seem to comprehend that. I also have a LIFE and sh*t happens, I'm not sitting around sending frequent update on NOTHING emails.

Anywho, I'll update here until this is done. Anyone who still wants to follow bling fun can find me elsewhere.
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Don't go.

We don't think badly of you at all and your reputation is fully intact. This has been a valuable learning exercise about insurance and how USPS does business.

Show of hands who wants @Asscherhalo_lover to stay?

(Begonia's hand up)
 
@Asscherhalo_lover I hope that you stay.

I have only sold a couple of things preloved but only within the US because I have been concerned about the some of the issues that you have encountered.

I've learned some lessons from this exchange and will continue to ship fully insured only within the US .

I do hope that the earrings are eventually found and both parties are made whole and can move on!
 
This is pretty straightforward to me. I don't really buy and sell but I ship things for repair or custom work all the time and if I choose not to insure then I know loss is a risk I am taking.

If shipping costs are being covered by a purchaser and that person chooses not to insure then they are also accepting that risk. It seems like the seller here is trying to do what I'd consider the right thing by passing on anything she recovers. She's not obligated to give any more.
 
@Asscherhalo_lover -- so sorry you are going through this -- hope you don't leave PS as I've always enjoyed your posts -- I also think you are one of the many/several lovely PSers with whom I have pleasantly bought & sold with through the years (??) in any case, as my pop always said, don't sweat the small stuff, you did the right things, and the rest just doesn't matter
 
I don't want to analyze and find blame with the seller or buyer here. But I think we need to address one of the main problems that leads to this: It's the Paypal Friends&Family usage.

I know we all do it as it saves us taxes and fees but it is categorically wrong. In this situation the buyer would have had a claim of not receiving an item and would have had support from Paypal and all kinds of agreements could have worked out with the seller.
Using F&F for the sale of actual goods and services (and that is what we do here) is against Paypal rules and might get your account banned. It is also tax evasion.
Now many of the sellers will only sell with that feature. It basically means it's a cash gift not hooked to the exchange of an item. The seller does not even need to mail the item. It opens us up to so much fraud.....

I think as a preloved community we should be more open to G&S. And it also protects the seller against claims from the buyer like charge backs etc. This feature will also be helpful if the item still appears later. By then the seller might have paid part of the claim from the post office 100$ insurance. But if that payment is done also via F&F they can not claim it back later when the earrings still show up.

In any case I do not mail any jewelry without the full insurance coverage. No matter what the buyer indicates.

Hope this works all out for both sides!
 
Not to derail the thread, but a $600 Paypal tax threshold is ridiculous, especially when many parties sell at a loss.
 
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