May 1st Planned City Shutdowns...

[LAJennifer]

Date: 5/2/2006 8:52:54 PM
Author: AGBF

Date: 5/2/2006 7:13:10 PM
Author: LAJennifer
Importing poverty is not a good idea.

No? I am glad you had no say in immigration policies during the Irish potato famine.

different time, different issue. And not a sound basis for current national policy. I suppose you are "ok" with the US becoming a third world country.

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 5/3/2006 12:02:10 AM
Author: ForteKitty
Driving was awesome yesterday. It only took me 30 minutes to get from downtown L.A. to the Arrowhead Pond in Anaheim, and i had plenty of time to get food before my Ducks game. (Go Ducks!) Normally I''d be stuck in traffic for 2 hours.

Seriously now...

for the people who are all for making every illegal immigrant ''legal'', have you ever been to S. California? Have you ever visited a County Hospital? Ever spoken to a Child Support Services Officer regarding child support and welfare abuse? Ever seen the slums of L.A., such as Walnut Park, Athens, Firestone, and Belvedere? (all in unincorporated L.A., near Compton and Watts) Ever been hit by a driver who was an illegal immigrant w/ no insurance, get injured, and have your own insurance increase?

Our tax dollars service more illegal immigrants than you can imagine. I have personally worked with and spoken to other people who work first hand with illegal immigrants, and I have seen how much money pours out of our funds. It pours out of every possible nook and cranny, and it adds up fast. I knew people in high school whose parents had anywhere from 7 to 13 kids... kid after kid... just so they can continue to collect welfare for them. I''m not exaggerating either. If it wasn''t Confidential, I''d actually post all of the details. Point is, it''s unfair. Why should my tax dollars pay for them, when my high school ceilings are falling off and leaking?

Now, before someone calls me a bigot, I''m not. I just oppose people who come to this country illegally. My grandparents legally migrated here from Taiwan 30 years ago, after a long process and a 12-year waitlist. Kinda unfair that someone can just come here and get citizenship w/o the wait. Worst of all, I''m tired of the expectation that things should be handed over on a platter. You want it, wait in line like everyone else. No cutting.

ABSOLUTELY!!!

 

[rainbowtrout]

To be fair, I grew up for a time in a pretty bad slummy area in LA, and the white ( legal )women were cranking out kids for welfare as well. It's partially the system being screwed, partially people being irresponsible, legal and illegal.

Anyway, I only visit LA now to see my family in the summer, and whew. I think its a big mix of issues, but the drain of the school systems and public health systems is overall AWFUL.

RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn't they largely come here legally? I know our policy was different then, but still.

Does anyone else feel that the urge to learn English and acculturate in S. Cali is being driven down by school systems basically acceding to be bilingual? But not bilingual in a GOOD way--we aren't teaching the white kids Spanish and the Latino kids English--we're teaching the Latino kids IN Spanish. So we keep accentuating the cultural divide instead of teaching people to communicate with each other. If we let in enough Spanish speakers, California will and should become essentially bilinugal. In case anyone forgot, we have no offical language in the U.S. It's kind of a big deal. But why aren't we making more of an effort to make people on both sides truly bi-lingual from a young age? We could turn an educational problem into an educational bonus--the U.S. has terrible language education programs, why not use this to our advantage?



ETA: if as someone said, most illegal immigrants are renting and thus paying the educational fees, is it fair to say that they are the ones draining our schools?


Also, I took a course in ecology once in Arizona. In large part the U.S. has caused Mexico's poverty by refusing to honor water treaties from the 1800s which should allow the Rio Grande and other rivers to retain most of its flow by the time it hits Mexico. I think it retains something like 10 or 20 percent...

Now, the Mexican government has also screwed over their country big time. But it's difficult when you have no natural resources--bit like Palestine.

 

[sunkist]

Date: 5/2/2006 7:24:47 PM
Author: Dancing Fire
what a JOKE!!!

these people had already broken the law and now trying to blackmail the U.S. government.

i'm so mad

that i'm thinking about calling my congressman.

Thinking?!? Do it, DF!!

and send a copy of this thread while you're at it

 

[AGBF]

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM
Author: rainbowtrout
RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn't they largely come here legally?

Yes, that was my point. The United States, at that time, was quite willing to accept the impoverished. I thought perhaps this group needed a little reminder of our history.

My posting was in response to LAJennifer's comment that, "Importing poverty is not a good idea,"!!! If it were not for poverty and religious intolerance, there would be no United States as we know it today!

 

[moon river]

Exactly AGBF. Did our ancestores all immigrate here for a ''worse life''? NO. This country was founded on making a better life. I don''t think we can pick and choose which impoverished person we want here.

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 5/3/2006 1:19:02 PM
Author: AGBF

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM
Author: rainbowtrout
RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn''t they largely come here legally?

Yes, that was my point. The United States, at that time, was quite willing to accept the impoverished. I thought perhaps this group needed a little reminder of our history.

My posting was in response to LAJennifer''s comment that, ''Importing poverty is not a good idea,''!!! If it were not for poverty and religious intolerance, there would be no United States as we know it today!

I am well aware of the history of the USA. Again - different time, different issue.

 

[ForteKitty]

Interesting article today:

http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/articles/2728311.html?showAll=y&c=y

 

[rainbowtrout]

So I asked FI who is taking a development econ class at the moment:

Is importing poverty a bad idea:

So, if we assume that once we bear the cost of educating "human capital" from other countries, they will be just as productive as native citizens, and that they invest that wealth back into our economy, the difference evens out pretty rapidly.

Problem: most immigrants from poor countries send "remittances" back home--some developing countried have A THIRD of their GDP coming from remittances sent back to families from the U.S.

Problem: Organized crime in poor immigrant communities. Italian mafia, Latino gangs, etc.

Problem: Poor immigrants often do not make it through the educational system and fall into poverty and welfare, etc. We then bear all the cost, not just education. The reason for this failure can be many: lack of support from the native government, lack of language education, lack of ability, lack of drive to suceed, culture of poverty reinforcing itself.

Good point: The "raw" human capital of poor immigrants can produce intensely driven individuals whose only barrier to success had been poverty and lack of opportunity. We can see this in France where 90 percent of the small business owners are immigrants from IndoChina. They are willing to work longer hours than most French citizens.

Questionable point: why do some equally poor groups of immigrants have such higher success rates, such as immigants from Japan and Hong Kong? Is it a cultural differance, an educational differance, or what?

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 4/28/2006 2:57:17 PM
Author:tawn
I live in San Diego, and we've already had a lot of rallies and school walk-outs, etc...

Is this as big of a deal in the rest of the country?

I know that I'm seriously thinking about just staying home that day!

Back to answering the orginal question of this thread - the rallies of "a day without illegal immigrants" that took place, actually made my day in Southern California better. I don't think it was that big of a deal in places like "Mayberry" (term used by another pricescoper) as places without large populations of illegal immigrants are not as affected with this issue in their everyday lives. Since my day went so well, I would be happy if they would rally for "a MONTH without illegal immigrants" or better yet, "a YEAR without illegal immigrants". Then, perhaps, the people who ARE here legally may be able to get better paying jobs and actually afford healthcare.

 

[moon river]

Speaking from the Mayberry perspective, we do have a good sized hispanic community. I have been in the house the past two weeks recooping from another surgery so I didn''t get out to see the impact on our community. I''m sure from the economic standpoint, things were affected. We don''t have a traffic problem, so I can''t comment on that. I work with several hispanics and have befriended many. I tend to treat all people the same. I''m sad for the people that think their lives would be better off without certain groups of people in them.

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 5/3/2006 2:30:25 PM
Author: moon river
Speaking from the Mayberry perspective, we do have a good sized hispanic community. I have been in the house the past two weeks recooping from another surgery so I didn''t get out to see the impact on our community. I''m sure from the economic standpoint, things were affected. We don''t have a traffic problem, so I can''t comment on that. I work with several hispanics and have befriended many. I tend to treat all people the same. I''m sad for the people that think their lives would be better off without certain groups of people in them.

There is a difference between legal and illegal. A point you seem to be missing. I''m all for diversity! I''m not "anti" any "groups of people". And I''m sad you resort to generalizations and would label me so. A good sized hispanic community is a big difference from millions of "illegal aliens" in your own back yard. The US takes in how many "legal immigrants" a year? Does anyone know the exact figure? I believe it is around 1 million per year - certainly way, way, way more than any other nation in this world. I welcome these people. Mexico certainly controls their southern border, do they not? I''m sorry you think it is sad that I feel I am better off not being surrounded by those who don''t play by the rules and blatantly disrespect the immigrants currently going through the proper channels to gain citizenship . I don''t know about you, but my mother taught me to obey the law and not "cut in line".

 

[LAJennifer]

I missed this in my previous post, so I will comment on this now.

Date: 5/3/2006 2:30:25 PM
Author: moon river
I work with several hispanics and have befriended many. I tend to treat all people the same.

As do I - both at work and socially. Two of my absolute favorite people in the whole world are mexican american. Funny that they feel the same way I do. I guess feelings about this issue really depends on where you are and what you encounter on a day to day basis.

 

[moon river]

Does anyone know how hard it is to be here legally from Mexico. It seems that almost anyone from any other country can come here legally without as much of a problem. I know people personally who have gone through the process and it is rougher on those from Mexico. I even know two people from Iraq here legally and their journey was nowhere near as hard as for those from Mexico. I think the rules should be the same for everyone. I''m not saying to do anything illegal. Just make it fair, I guess I''m trying to get across. I just don''t understand a government that will let terrorist into the country and allow them to be educated on flying planes and such and let them try and destroy our country, but not let in a group of impoverished people who come from Mexico to make a better life for their family. I just don''t get it. Call me PollyAnna but I think all should be fair. God didn''t make this country for just one race. He also said ''Love thy neighbor as thyself''. I don''t want my family to starve and live in deplorable conditions and I don''t want anyone elses to either.
My point, and I do have one, is to make a law so everyone has the same chances. I also believe that our government should be helping our neighboring country as much as they help those on the other side of the world and maybe they wouldn''t have to come here for a better life. They''d already have it. Just a thought.

 

[tawn]

Date: 5/3/2006 1:19:02 PM
Author: AGBF

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM
Author: rainbowtrout
RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn''t they largely come here legally?

Yes, that was my point. The United States, at that time, was quite willing to accept the impoverished. I thought perhaps this group needed a little reminder of our history.

My posting was in response to LAJennifer''s comment that, ''Importing poverty is not a good idea,''!!! If it were not for poverty and religious intolerance, there would be no United States as we know it today!

Accepting them LEGALLY!

Illegal immigratin is not legal!

 

[tawn]

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM
Author: rainbowtrout
To be fair, I grew up for a time in a pretty bad slummy area in LA, and the white ( legal )women were cranking out kids for welfare as well. It's partially the system being screwed, partially people being irresponsible, legal and illegal.

Anyway, I only visit LA now to see my family in the summer, and whew. I think its a big mix of issues, but the drain of the school systems and public health systems is overall AWFUL.

RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn't they largely come here legally? I know our policy was different then, but still.

Does anyone else feel that the urge to learn English and acculturate in S. Cali is being driven down by school systems basically acceding to be bilingual? But not bilingual in a GOOD way--we aren't teaching the white kids Spanish and the Latino kids English--we're teaching the Latino kids IN Spanish. So we keep accentuating the cultural divide instead of teaching people to communicate with each other. If we let in enough Spanish speakers, California will and should become essentially bilinugal. In case anyone forgot, we have no offical language in the U.S. It's kind of a big deal. But why aren't we making more of an effort to make people on both sides truly bi-lingual from a young age? We could turn an educational problem into an educational bonus--the U.S. has terrible language education programs, why not use this to our advantage?



ETA: if as someone said, most illegal immigrants are renting and thus paying the educational fees, is it fair to say that they are the ones draining our schools?


Also, I took a course in ecology once in Arizona. In large part the U.S. has caused Mexico's poverty by refusing to honor water treaties from the 1800s which should allow the Rio Grande and other rivers to retain most of its flow by the time it hits Mexico. I think it retains something like 10 or 20 percent...

Now, the Mexican government has also screwed over their country big time. But it's difficult when you have no natural resources--bit like Palestine.

I own a house, and rent it out. I'm the one who pays the taxes, not the renters! I also paid the Real Estate Taxes when we bought it and will end up paying Capital Gains taxes when we sell it.

My son has enrolled in Spanish for his elective next year, and I'm glad his school is offering it. I recently went to the DMV, and they didn't have any of the study guides in English...only in Spanish! Shouldn't you have to be able to read English to get your driver's license? How much do you think it costs the DMV to have everything bilingual?

ETA: My Hispanic friends are all here legally, and they resent the Illegal Aliens for not going through the proper channels.

 

[tawn]

Date: 5/3/2006 1:33:57 PM
Author: moon river
Exactly AGBF. Did our ancestores all immigrate here for a ''worse life''? NO. This country was founded on making a better life. I don''t think we can pick and choose which impoverished person we want here.

The issue isn''t who gets permission to get in! It''s about who''s entering without permission!

 

[ForteKitty]

Date: 5/3/2006 3:54:04 PM
Author: tawn

ETA: My Hispanic friends are all here legally, and they resent the Illegal Aliens for not going through the proper channels.

Same here. More than 75% of my friends are Latino. All of their families migrated here legally, and all of them are quite vocal regarding their bitterness towards illegal immigration.

 

[rainbowtrout]

Date: 5/3/2006 3:54:04 PM
Author: tawn

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM

Author: rainbowtrout

To be fair, I grew up for a time in a pretty bad slummy area in LA, and the white ( legal )women were cranking out kids for welfare as well. It''s partially the system being screwed, partially people being irresponsible, legal and illegal.


Anyway, I only visit LA now to see my family in the summer, and whew. I think its a big mix of issues, but the drain of the school systems and public health systems is overall AWFUL.


RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn''t they largely come here legally? I know our policy was different then, but still.


Does anyone else feel that the urge to learn English and acculturate in S. Cali is being driven down by school systems basically acceding to be bilingual? But not bilingual in a GOOD way--we aren''t teaching the white kids Spanish and the Latino kids English--we''re teaching the Latino kids IN Spanish. So we keep accentuating the cultural divide instead of teaching people to communicate with each other. If we let in enough Spanish speakers, California will and should become essentially bilinugal. In case anyone forgot, we have no offical language in the U.S. It''s kind of a big deal. But why aren''t we making more of an effort to make people on both sides truly bi-lingual from a young age? We could turn an educational problem into an educational bonus--the U.S. has terrible language education programs, why not use this to our advantage?




ETA: if as someone said, most illegal immigrants are renting and thus paying the educational fees, is it fair to say that they are the ones draining our schools?



Also, I took a course in ecology once in Arizona. In large part the U.S. has caused Mexico''s poverty by refusing to honor water treaties from the 1800s which should allow the Rio Grande and other rivers to retain most of its flow by the time it hits Mexico. I think it retains something like 10 or 20 percent...


Now, the Mexican government has also screwed over their country big time. But it''s difficult when you have no natural resources--bit like Palestine.

I own a house, and rent it out. I''m the one who pays the taxes, not the renters! I also paid the Real Estate Taxes when we bought it and will end up paying Capital Gains taxes when we sell it.


My son has enrolled in Spanish for his elective next year, and I''m glad his school is offering it. I recently went to the DMV, and they didn''t have any of the study guides in English...only in Spanish! Shouldn''t you have to be able to read English to get your driver''s license? How much do you think it costs the DMV to have everything bilingual?


ETA: My Hispanic friends are all here legally, and they resent the Illegal Aliens for not going through the proper channels.

I don''t know if you "should" have to know it or not, but the fact is the U.S. has no offical language. No law says you must learn English...
I don''t think multilingualism is inherently bad; I do think that there is not enough push for both sides to learn the other language.

I''m not a tax expert, I just saw someone that had mentioned illegals as paying property tax when they rent, so I commented on it.

 

[colormyworld]

I can't help but laugh out loud when I hear people use " We are a nation of laws " ploy. From the president on down, we all break the LAW. Why? IMO a lot of the laws are hideously outdated.
I'm not saying that we should have a completely open border but all this crying about the people that want to work hard and make a better life ... We have much bigger problems to worry about!
I also think it is rather short sighted to think that just because you are the one who hands the money over to the government for property taxes. That you are not including taxes in what you are charging the tenets to live there.

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 5/3/2006 5:16:24 PM
Author: colormyworld
I can''t help but laugh out loud when I hear people use '' We are a nation of laws '' ploy. From the president on down, we all break the LAW. Why? IMO a lot of the laws are hideously outdated.
I''m not saying that we should have a completely open border but all this crying about the people that want to work hard and make a better life ... We have much bigger problems to worry about!

Actually, I don''t. I don''t speed. I don''t jaywalk (especially in this town). I didn''t have an alcoholic beverage until I was of legal drinking age (rare, I know). I don''t steal and I don''t cheat. I actually despise cheaters the most - because when somebody cheats, somebody else always gets cheated.

 

[MINE!!]

Date: 5/3/2006 5:16:24 PM
Author: colormyworld
I can''t help but laugh out loud when I hear people use '' We are a nation of laws '' ploy. From the president on down, we all break the LAW. Why? IMO a lot of the laws are hideously outdated.
I''m not saying that we should have a completely open border but all this crying about the people that want to work hard and make a better life ... We have much bigger problems to worry about!

So we should ignore this problem.. sounds to me like someone else is avoiding a problem. Look.. it has nothing to do with IRAQ.. it has nothing to do with BUSH, it has nothing to do with wether or not you like BUSH and you do not want to be in IRAQ. It has nothing to do with wether I want to live next to a person from Mexico. IT HAS TO DO WITH THE FACT THAT THEY ARE ILLEGAL!!!!!!

Go through the right channels, the right legal channels. Imagrate here LEAGALLY... Not Illegally. There is no nation of laws "ploy".. quit screaming about there not being a nation of laws and wanting there to be one.. but not wanting to follow the laws that are already in effect.. or the ones that should be.

IN North Carolina we have a HIGH population of illegal Mexicans. We also have a HIGH number of LEGAL!!!!! Mexicans, who are here LEGALLY!!!, who pay taxes LEGALLY!

I am an Ad Litum Gaurdian and have to go to Social Services often to work. Have you been there? Have you ANY CLUE how much of the taxes YOU PAY is going to feed those people who are here.. OK.. let me say it once more just incase I am losing you to Iraq again~ ILLEGALLY!!!!!

This is about ILLEGAL vs LEGAL. Not about racism, not about immagration, not about IRAQ.. and not about the Adminstration. THIS IS ABOUT ILLEGAL immagration....

 

[rainbowtrout]

dumb question:

how do illegal immigrants get welfare and not deportation?

 

[colormyworld]

Hmmmm!

 

[MINE!!]

Good question.. but Social Service cannot DENY anyone services.. It happens.. cal your local Socail Service dept. Go to the free health clinic or the city health clinic, they cannot DENY anyone either. So, they get free medical care as well.... Personally, I think they shoud round them all up and send them back.

 

[rainbowtrout]

It becomes sort of a vicious cycle with the deportation--in Morocco they round them up, send them back, they come back next season. By that point they have already done the damage they were going to do in terms of draining services, and been abused by whomever wanted to abuse them.

Of course as a solution the Moroccan gov''t has started dumping them in the Sahara so they can "walk" back--read die in the f*ing desert...

So--there''s a happy medium, I suppose, between dumping people in the desert and just not deporting them.

What makes me angry is when we DO have a hardworking, smart illegal who has fallen through a paperwork crack THEY can get deported, but somehow all the people working for less than minimum wage conveniently fall through the cracks? There was this child from Senegal who was excelling at his high school in New York, won some big prize, and then they found out he was an illegal as he was going to get on the plane.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
4/26/2006 10:42 am -
A small, troubled high school in East Harlem seemed an unlikely place to find students for a nationwide robot-building contest, but when a neighborhood after-school program started a team last winter, 19 students signed up. One was Amadou Ly, a senior who had been fending for himself since he was 14.

The project had only one computer and no real work space. Engineering advice came from an elevator mechanic and a machinist''s son without a college degree. But in an upset that astonished its sponsors, the rookie team from East Harlem won the regional competition last month, beating rivals from elite schools like Stuyvesant in Manhattan and the Bronx High School of Science for a chance to compete in the national robotics finals in Atlanta that begins tomorrow.

Yet for Amadou, who helps operate the robot the team built, success has come at a price. As the group prepared for the flight to Atlanta today, he was forced to reveal his secret: He is an illegal immigrant from Senegal, with no ID to allow him to board a plane. Left here long ago by his mother, he has no way to attend the college that has accepted him, and only a slim chance to win his two-year court battle against deportation.

In the end, his fate could hinge on immigration legislation now being debated in Congress. Several Senate bills include a pathway for successful high school graduates to earn legal status. But a measure passed by the House of Representatives would make his presence in the United States a felony, and both House and Senate bills would curtail the judicial review that allows exceptions to deportation.

Meanwhile, the team''s sponsors scrambled to put him on a train yesterday afternoon for a separate 18-hour journey to join his teammates from Central Park East High School at the Georgia Dome. There, more than 8,500 high school students will participate in the competition, called FIRST (For Inspiration and Recognition of Science and Technology) by its sponsor, a nonprofit organization that aims to make applied sciences as exciting to children as sports.

"I didn''t want other people to know," said Amadou, 18, referring to his illegal status. "They''re all U.S. citizens but me."

Most team members learned of his problem only yesterday at a meeting with Kristian Breton, 27, the staff member at the East Harlem Tutorial program who started the team, inspired by his own experience in the competition when he was a high school student in rural Mountain Home, Ark.

Alan Hodge, 18, echoed the general dismay. "We can''t really celebrate all the way because it''s not going to feel whole as a team without Amadou," he said.

Amadou''s teammates have struggled with obstacles of their own. When Mr. Breton called a meeting of parents to collect permission slips last week, only five showed up. One boy''s mother had a terminal illness, Mr. Breton learned. Another mother lived in the Dominican Republic, leaving an older sibling to manage the household. One of the six girls on the team said her divorced parents disagreed about letting her go, and her mother, who was willing to approve the trip, lacked the $4 subway fare to get to the meeting.

But Amadou''s case stands out. As he tells it, with corroboration from immigration records and other documents, he was 13 and spoke no English when his mother brought him to New York from Dakar on Sept. 10, 2001. He was 14 when she went back, leaving him behind in the hope that he could continue his American education.

By then, he had finished ninth grade at Norman Thomas High School in a program for students learning English as a second language. But his mother left instruction for him to take a Greyhound bus to Indianapolis, where a Senegalese woman friend had agreed to take him in and send him to North Central High School there.

"It was the same thing when I was in Africa," he said, describing a childhood spent shuttling between his grandmother and the household of his father, a retired police officer with 12 children and three wives.

The woman in Indiana, who had four children of her own, changed her mind about keeping him after his sophomore year, and he returned by bus to New York in the summer of 2004. "I had to find a way to help myself for food and clothes, and to buy some of my school supplies," he said, recalling days handing out fliers for a clothing store on a Manhattan street corner. "I ended up living with another friend — I''m under age and I can''t live alone."

Taking shelter with a taxi driver, a friend of the family who could sign his report cards, Amadou enrolled in 11th grade at Central Park East. Under longstanding Supreme Court decisions, children have a right to a public education regardless of their immigration status, and in New York, as in many other cities, a "don''t ask, don''t tell" approach to legal status has prevailed for years.

 

[colormyworld]

Mine If you feel so strongly you should be reporting this to the proper authorities.

 

[rainbowtrout]

Date: 5/3/2006 5:41:17 PM
Author: MINE!!
Good question.. but Social Service cannot DENY anyone services.. It happens.. cal your local Socail Service dept. Go to the free health clinic or the city health clinic, they cannot DENY anyone either. So, they get free medical care as well.... Personally, I think they shoud round them all up and send them back.

That doesn''t make a ton of sense to me. If you aren''t a citizen, they why are you entitled to Social Services or free heathcare? Maybe I''m just being naive, but sheesh.

 

[AGBF]

Date: 5/3/2006 1:34:21 PM
Author: LAJennifer

Date: 5/3/2006 1:19:02 PM

Author: AGBF

Date: 5/3/2006 12:40:24 PM

Author: rainbowtrout

RE: the Irish potato famine, other large groups of poor immigrants: didn''t they largely come here legally?

Yes, that was my point. The United States, at that time, was quite willing to accept the impoverished. I thought perhaps this group needed a little reminder of our history.


My posting was in response to LAJennifer''s comment that, ''Importing poverty is not a good idea,''!!! If it were not for poverty and religious intolerance, there would be no United States as we know it today!

I am well aware of the history of the USA. Again - different time, different issue.

If you did not need a reminder of the the history of immigration, you may ignore my posting. I am sure there are readers of this forum who did and do need a reminder, however. Some of the readers are, admitedly, new US citizens or are not US citizens at all. They may not have the grasp of its history that people whose families immigrated here years ago have. (Or, then again, they may.)

I do not know what you mean by "different time, different issue". You said that we didn''t need the impoverished. I pointed out that it is the impoverished who have enriched the United States. Can you imagine the United States without the Irish? The Italians (almost all of whom came from poor, southern, Italy? The Poles and Lithuanians?

What is "different" in all this?

 

[colormyworld]

Who sets policy or sets the degree to which the laws of the federal gov't. are enforced ???