Need to get some perspective

[Rhapsody]

Oh Ally, I''m so sorry you''re going through so much confusion and turmoil about your relationship.

My fiance and I are also highschool sweethearts, started dating at the end of our junior year. After our freshman year of college I found out he had been quasi-dating a girl he met online. It had been going on for months before I found out. We broke up for a while and I had no idea whether I even wanted to try and "fix" things, wasn''t sure I''d be able to trust him again. After about 6 months we decided we did want to try and work things out. My BF just bent over backwards trying to prove that he was 100% in it this time and indulged my every whim to show that he could be trusted again. It was years before I was really comfortable with him being friends with women but we did get there, but it took a lot of work on both our parts. You mentioned that you still don''t trust his word, because of the other girl and the little inconsiderate things he does. I can''t imagine being in a relationship where I questioned everything my BF said, where I couldn''t trust him to hold to his word. I wouldn''t be able to stay through that.

My BF also had a problem with doing selfish, inconsiderate things quite frequently. He''d change plans we made without telling me let alone asking, keep us out late when he knew I had to work early the next morning or had exams I had to study for, stay out late and not call. It was made worse by the fact that we had so little time together. He worked grave, I worked mornings/weekends and we both had class in the afternoon-evening. The only time we really had together was Saturday evenings and when he made plans with other people or decided to go play video games instead of see me I would get pissed! We would fight about it every time and nothing would change. I dont know when or why but he just doesn''t do it any more. I don''t know if one day he just grew up or decided to reinvest in our relationship but things changed. And again, I wouldn''t have stayed if they hadn''t. I felt too disrespected and taken advantage of.

And even though you love him very much it just can''t make up for the fact that your needs aren''t being met. I don''t believe that love is enough to make a solid relationship. I wouldn''t want a marriage that was purly functional (my fiances parents are like that and it seems so odd to me) but I need to be with someone who I can really live with from day to day and year to year without consistent struggles because someones needs/wishes aren''t being fulfilled. My parents love each other very much but they just aren''t compatible, they have different views of what a marriage should look like and they want some fundamentally different things from life. But they stick it out because they "love each other" and don''t want to give up on a long relationship. They''re miserable. LIfe is too short to be miserable. if you''re not happy, find what will make you happy.

Sorry for the novel, theres obviously a lot of personal bias in there, but I hope it can help in some way to know others have gone through the same type of pain. Good luck sweetie!

 

[blueroses]

Hey Ally (And hey guys.....I''m sorry, I''m hiding under a rock, I''ll be back, I promise, I just can''t deal w/ it right now!!)

Anyway, your post was enough to drag me out of seclusion for 2 minutes. I''m not even going to address your specific relationship issues. Lord knows I have my OWN ten years of baggage there.

But I think you''re going through--and HAVE BEEN going through--a depression. I have my baggage there too

Things haven''t been "the same" for you and FI for over 6 years.....and maybe they aren''t supposed to be, but more importantly, they now aren''t the same for you with yourself. I think it would do you a world of good to seek some counseling. And consider couple''s counseling too. It may be that you really do have no intention of going through with this marriage, or it may be that you''re at some sort of internal emotional impasse you have to deal with before you can go through with it--with either a marriage or a break-up. Either way you probably need to sort through some "issues" to get clarity for yourself and the relationship.

As I type this it occurs to me that you''re dealing with some parallel-universe version of where I''ve been over the last year--in a general sense--in that it has to do with limbo (am I in or am I out) and it REALLY does a number on your emotional well-being. You need to figure out once and for all if you''re in this or not, and you are strong and brave enough to get through this one way or the other. Seek help if you need to. (((HUGS)))

 

[WTNLVR]

Date: 9/28/2006 1:56:49 PM
Author: diane5006
Hi I feel the need to chime in here...and I hope I don''t offend

I read you post and most of the others...

The thing that struck me (from a health care provider perspective) is that you show some signs of depression...and that you should be evaluated and treated if necessary...

Depression happens...and causes us to have difficluty in our relationships or even relating...whether they are good or bad

Wishing you well

EDIT: I just re-read this and it comes off not quite as I intended...I think is it something you should look into...

As a mental health professional I agree that you should seek counseling. You may be suffering from depression and/or an anxiety disorder. Sounds like you have alot of fears that may or may not be completely rational. Seeking a trained therapist can help you sort out what is biological and what is tied to your relationship. Medications may also help. I''m not saying that there aren''t certainly issues in your relationship, but you need to look at yourself first and get what you want straightened out before tackling deeper relationship issues. Good luck!

 

[appletini]

Ally, I haven''t read through everyone else''s posts, b/c they all wrote a book for you, but here is what i have observed in the last two years that I have "known" you on PS.

1. You mentioned this recently in another thread...you are afraid of being alone. Honey you are so busy with school, you don''t have time to be alone. And if there is another man out there is meant to be, you''ll never find him unless you are "alone". But you never will be truly alone, just because a person is single doens''t mean they are alone, you have school, a great family, and friends to support you and keep you busy.

2. You and your boyfriend breakup whenever you are upset with him, and usually seems to be for the same reason(s) every time...like him breaking plans and not calling you on hockey night, and the mother''s day incident that you never really filled us in on the resolution. But everytime you shut him out, and then he calls repeatedly and some how you reconile and then the cycle starts again.

3. I had a BF for 5.5 years (end of high school to 1 year after college) and we grew in different directions, and at the end of the day I was miserable in that relationship and knew I couldn''t marry him. Less than 6 months after I broke up with him, I met my DH. It seems that you and your BF has grown in different directions and have different priorities.

4. I think that beautiful Leon Mege ring on your finger has blinded you. Ever since you got engaged it was all about the ring (good and bad) and what he did for you. But you never were so excited to be engaged to your BF and to spend the rest of your life with him. You were excited about the ring, and always finding something wrong with it. You also kept saying how you weren''t ready to get married, and wanted to wait because you have trouble dealing with change. I think this was you knowing that you don''t want to be with him, and you kept making excuses for why you had to have a 4 year engagement.

Thats just some food for thought...will check in later, and will be thinking of you.

 

[AmberGretchen]

Hi Ally,

You''ve gotten a lot of very good and hopefully useful insight here, so I''ll try not to repeat others too much, but I thought I''d throw in my 2 cents since you asked for advice.

The thing that stuck out to me reading your post (I too, like so many others here, was in a relationship that produced feelings similar to what you''re describing) is that your BF doesn''t sound like a FRIEND. If you have really solid, long-lasting friendships, you''ll understand this. A friend is an equal, and they treat you like one. The person you marry should be your best friend. Marriage is not a necessity in life, especially for someone like you - you are smart, and ambitious and you will soon have the means (and then some) to support yourself financially, if you don''t already. Marriage should always always be a conscious choice. You decide to get married because the person truly makes your life better, and if they don''t, then you shouldn''t marry them, simple as that. That''s not to say that things should be perfect, because nothing is perfect, but you should always know that this is a friend and a partner above all else. Friendship and partnership require compromise and understanding, and frankly you two seem to be lacking in both at the moment. That''s not a judgment of your personalities, its just a comment that unless those two things are present in the relationship things aren''t going to work out over the long run. This has very little to do with being in love - my bad relationship ended with my ex walking out of the room and the last thing he said before he did was "I love you." And I know he meant it, but sometimes that just isn''t enough to make it work.

I think a separate but related issue is your feelings about marriage. I really strongly believe what I said that marriage is not a necessity. Honestly, I never saw myself getting married at all. And yet here I am. But its not because I thought I "should" or because it was part of some life I pictured, it was because I met someone who it was worth it to me to make that commitment to. This is so important to be in this mental space before you even start to make the choice about whether or not to marry a given person.

I think the ladies here have given you some excellent advice and I would like to echo it - get some distance from this relationship, figure out what''s going on with you (preferably in counseling), then see where you are. If you and your BF are meant to be together it will work out - I know that sounds trite but its almost always true, in my experience.

Finally, my sympathies on all of this - I remember what it was like to feel miserable with paralyzing self doubt, staying in a rollercoaster relationship when I knew deep down it would never make me happy. Its a horrible feeling and I can understand why you feel confused and overwhelmed. I hope that you are able to gain some clarity on the situation and begin to make peace with yourself soon.

 

[appletini]

one more thing...one of the reasons that DH and I knew we were meant to be is that we bring out the best in each other. I also very against having kids, and I certainly don''t want to anytime soon, but he was the first guy that I felt open to the idea of having children, because I know he''ll be a great father. We don''t plan on having any more many years if we do at all. But those are some questions to ask yourself. Do we make each other better people? If we were to have children (planned or unplanned) would he be a good father?

 

[allycat0303]

Hey everyone,

I'm so tired! Exam today so I'm ready for this to be done. So to address some things...

Depression/Anxiety: No none of these apply to me. Even during that very terrible year, I never have met the criteria for clinical depression or anxiety order as listed by the DSM-IV-TR (The criteria used by Psychiatrist to diagnose all matter of mental health illness). It's very useful being a medical student (and having two other medical students in your family) issues like that are impossible to miss. It was a hard year and I times I really wanted the answer to be depression but it wasn't.

We did have a long talk yesturday about everything....and nothing got solved. It was one of those unusal times when he felt the need to talk which took me aback.

It was like Ally-bashing day, but whatever. Basically it came down to:

a) You're not committed to this relationship/don't want to get married
b) You never wear your ring so other guys think you're available (I don't wear it cause I find it annoying)
c) You never show any support for the things I like (because I refuse to go watch him play hockey, baseball, whatever....I DON'T HAVE TIME!)
d) You're always distracted when I talk to you
e) You're always too tired to do anything
f) You never let me socialize with your friends etc.

The problem is that I don't see marriage the way most people do.My outlook in life is that everyone puts a different meaning to different things. There is no right way or wrong way to look at things. The important thing is to be accepting that people can have different values, beliefs.

In my situation it isn't "starting our life" both of us will have fantastic, successful lives whether or not we are married. To me, if he wants to be "a part of my life" that's cool. And I'm not excited to get married. Aside from my parents, all the marriages around me are misreable, terrible affairs, where people live in stony, cold disdain for each other. I have 5 uncles, and 4 aunts, and it's awful, they've always told me "Don't get married it's the end of your life" Even my mom who is HAPPY says the same thing. I grew up hearing this! I always thought they were exaggerating, until that little incident made me a little jaded.

So Back and forth it went Him: You show me that your committed and I'll work on my behavior
Me: You put a little effort into being nice to me, and then I'll be more committed"

We have a house, a life, and plans together. He just doesn't see that as committement. So what can I do???

Oh yes. And he was lying when he told me (about 2 months ago) that he didn't mind if we didn't get married. He minds. A LOT. A LOT. Which would have been nice to know 2 months ago when we had this really honest, and open discussion of if HE MINDED. I only asked him for about 2 hours what his feelings on the subject were. He must have told me 10 times that being togther was enough. And even if I was willing to pay for a silly circus wedding, I really wasn't going to when he made me so unhappy.

Which by the way, he told me that he honestly "forgot" about the 1 hour discussion we had 3 weeks ago about him being home on time after hockey. Now mind you I was sobbing during this discussion, telling him how much it hurt me. And yesturday he tells me he honestly "forgot" because it was 3 weeks ago, and he didn't think I was serious.

And then we broke up.

And now he wants to try conselling. Which he was adamently opposed to before.

But I'm not really intrested because he's obviously only listening to me when I decide I'm going to leave him. But maybe I'm being mean and uncooperative because I'm really tired and frustrated. Which really hurt his feelings. But I'm finding that I really don't care at this point.

Rhapsody: I feel like you know the most how I feel. It's hard for me to get over the sense of betrayal (even thought I KNOW that there wasn't one) It was a shock. But although he has grown up a lot I feel that there are still issues.

Blueroses: I'm glad you check in. I know it must be hard. But us 10 year + relationship know that it's never cut and dry. And maybe the fact that we are tenacious enough to make it through 10 years, makes it harder for us to let go. Miss you on the boards and check in when you feel you can.

Diane, Janinegirly. Blue, WTNRLV, Amber, Appletini:Thanks for all your input. I really appreciate it.

Exam. Then a nice long nap. I'm sure I'll be less grumpy after my exam is done.

 

[janinegirly]

well i wish you the best, and you''ve gotten a lot of feedback here, so ultimately it''s up to you how to utilize it all.
it seems like a very exhausting relationship though, even just reading about it. sometimes i think you''re kinda hard on your bf, i don''t think he''s "lying" when he said his views on marriage a few weeks back--he is obviously struggling with this too, and wants to hold on to this relationship and may say things to please you as a result. things are confusing for him too. of course i''m new to your story, and don''t know all the back stuff. i hope it works out in the end even if it means being apart (which just seems the healthiest option). And none of us can diagnose you (or anyone else) as "depressed", but it is clear you have floods of emotions that are overwhelming (it feels that way just reading it!) and counseling may the best solution for that when it seems to be getting the best of you or making you out of balance.
anyway, enough of my soapbox. best of luck on your exam.

 

[~*Alexis*~]

I am sorry that you feel this way and I am sorry that you feel the need to end things with him after 10 years. Everyone does have a different look on marriage. You are enititled for that. However, I will say that I understand how you feel. Maybe you resent him in a way for having all of this free time to go to the hockey games and hang out with his friends while you are going to medical school.....???

Just a thought.

Kepp me posted.
~*Alexis*~

 

[oshinbreez]

Ally,

I really believe that you made the best decision for yourself. It took courage and I congratulate you on that. I am sorry for all the hurt you''re going through right now. If you feel like it, try to have some time with your friends and/or family this weekend. It''s OK to cry. That''s one of the best stress relievers I know of. I''ll keep you in my thoughts and prayers. I hope you do great on the exam.

 

[Curls]

Depression/Anxiety: No none of these apply to me. Even during that very terrible year, I never have met the criteria for clinical depression or anxiety order as listed by the DSM-IV-TR

Counselors still can help you even if you do not meet the qualifications for a particular disorder. Unfortunately, from the sounds of it you don't seem to have a lot of spare time with med school, but sometimes it might be worth the time to spend an hour once every other week or so with someone who can help. Counselors can teach you techniques to help manage your stress and unhappiness. Just being active and doing something to help yourself may in itself help you feel better.

Perhaps this relationship is the only reason that you are unhappy or stressed out at times, but it wouldn't hurt to try to manage it.

Good luck on your exam!!!

 

[pyramid]

I have read all of your posts and my opinion is, remember my opinion, is that you are a very moody person, up and down kind of thing.

I feel sorry for your ex-fiance because I don't think it is normal that he has to call you if he cannot get back at a certain time. I mean if he was going to pick you up to go on a date then yes because you would be looking for him and be ready to go, but if he is just out on a casual night out with his mates, and you know it is a friendly get together why does he have to act like he is in school and the bell rang and he must go to class or the teacher will tell him off, if you are out with friends would you like to have to watch the clock because you have to go home to him when you were enjoying yourself and the rest of your friends were talking about going onto another bar or something. I would feel I was missing out on a good night out if I had to go back by a certain time. His friends must have thought he was to use an expression 'under the thumb' when he could not stay out if he wanted to.

I think that you are trying to punish him all the time instead of be his friend.

Oh and is there a reason you won't let him socialize with your friends?

You not talking for ages, he didn't notice, lots of guys are not as talkative as we women, but I wonder if he is pulling himself away because of your being moody or because you are always distracted the times he does speak to you as he said. You also said before it was hard to get him to see thiings because he is happy in the relationship and thinks nothing is wrong but then again you wrote just above the list of what he thinks is wrong, you not being committed, not going to his baseball etc. That doesn't sound like he is happy in the relationship to me. It makes me think again that you saying in the first place he was happy in the relationship and you couldn't get him to see what was wrong was you boasting again about how you could see what was wrong and he just couldn't.

You are not a control freak are you? Like the way your write that getting married it turned out was very important to him as though you were happy to report that to us but then when he wanted to consider counselling, you were not going to entertain that ideal with him, as though you were trying to either boast that you were in charge not him or that you are trying to pretend you don't care when you do but won't go for counselling because it was his idea.


You wrote about him not seeing it and it was hard to get him to change when he was happy and thought nothing was wrong, so why not go for counselling now that he is admitting something by going.

I sort of wondered too if the faults you are writing about him are really yours and what you are writing about you is really him.

You wrote: 'The problem is that I don't see marriage the way most people do.My outlook in life is that everyone puts a different meaning to different things. There is no right way or wrong way to look at things. The important thing is to be accepting that people can have different values, beliefs'. Can you say that you are accepting of his different values, beliefs? Does he believe that he should phone everytime he may be 1 hour late when at a baseball game. He wants to get married now so that is his value but you do not? are you accepting of this towards him, he was when he said it wouldn't matter to him if you didn't get married. He was willing to forego his values by accepting yours.

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 9/28/2006 1:23:58 PM
Author: Mara
ally i totally understand. it''s HARD. but your last sentence where you said, 10 years, this is almost half my life. brought to mind this thought.

half your life...and now you are unhappy, crying all the time, don''t want to get married, thinking of settling. is that how you want to spend the NEXT half of your life? or the REST of your life?

just because it''s half your life does not mean the next half can''t be BETTER. and it SHOULD BE BETTER. you should NEVER SETTLE for half-lives. life is too short.

I wish everyone could read this. I know SO many people who could benefit from this bit of clarity.

Well, well said, M.......

 

[aljdewey]

....

 

[galeteia]

Date: 9/29/2006 11:48:37 AM
Author: Pyramid
-snip-

I feel sorry for your ex-fiance because I don't think it is normal that he has to call you if he cannot get back at a certain time. I mean if he was going to pick you up to go on a date then yes because you would be looking for him and be ready to go, but if he is just out on a casual night out with his mates, and you know it is a friendly get together why does he have to act like he is in school and the bell rang and he must go to class or the teacher will tell him off, if you are out with friends would you like to have to watch the clock because you have to go home to him when you were enjoying yourself and the rest of your friends were talking about going onto another bar or something. I would feel I was missing out on a good night out if I had to go back by a certain time. His friends must have thought he was to use an expression 'under the thumb' when he could not stay out if he wanted to.

I have avoided posting on this thread because of a past dust-up between Ally and me, and I didn't want to offend her by posting on her thread.

Pyramid, I really have to disagree with you on this one.

Part of being in a relationship with someone you really care about is respecting their needs (sometimes different than wants) even if they are 'inconvenient' for you. I used to be very much of a similiar opinion to you, until I actually cared enough about someone to make sacrifices for their peace of mind. Suddenly, the 'peace of mind' of my loved one was worth, oh, finding the nearest payphone and letting them know I was going to be late. Why? Because I was raised that decency ditactes that you don't make people worry about you. And that you keep your word. If you can't keep your promise, don't make one in the first place.

But back to this business about it not being 'normal' to call if you can't get back. It is not 'normal' to insist that your man does not get drunk in the company of an unaccompanied woman. But my FF understand that A) we are long distance, so more effort has to be made, B) my father was an alcoholic and I have serious issues about drinking, and C) in my experience, 1 man + 1 woman + booze = 1 dangerous situation. So he makes this 'abnormal' (perhaps by your standards, surely he should be able to have 'his night out' and drink with a mate, regardless of their gender) effort on my behalf, because he values my peace of mind. He knows I will worry, and he doesn't want me to worry, because he loves me and my happiness is important to him.

Compared to that, Ally's request that her FI keep his word that he will support her need to have restful sleep, because he knows how much she needs it, isn't 'abnormal' at all.

Best of luck, Ally. You may not want it, but you have my sympathies. I was broken hearted for almost year after the end with an ex that behaved the way yours has been, sweet and shockingly hurtful by turns.

 

[avant]

Please forgive me in advance, but you need to be told the truth....and yes, the old saying "the truth hurts" applies here

Author:allycat0303
....and I realize that I have NO INTENTION of going through with it....Have a visited a venue? No, I sat in the car and he chose. Did we book it? NO WAY. DO we have a date? Nope. Does anyone even know we''re engaged? No. Because I know that at this point, I would never go through with it.

At this point in time, there should have been a SERIOUS sit down where you told him this to his face, that even though you''ve been dating for 10 years, you have no intention to get married. Don''t you think he deserves to know ???

Author:allycat0303
I''m so sad, and confused, and I can''t seem to get any advice. My sister knows everything about me, and she can''t even give me any advice. I just can''t wrap my head around what the ''REAL'' issue is. I think I''m just looking for someone to TELL me what to do.

Unfortunately, it seems your sister doesn''t have the heart to tell you the truth...

Author:allycat0303
When we I was 20 years old, my boyfriend left me and started dating another girl. It was within a week of ending at that time, our 4 year relationship. And it was a girl that he picked up from a bar. We got back togther after that but everything BEFORE that, and AFTER that is different for me. I still love my boyfriend (but it''s not the same kind of love, or with the same intensity) and I''ve never felt the same...

So, you never told him about these changes in feelings? You never address it? Just let the relationship sail along ...

Author:allycat0303
But the most important part, is that somewhere in that mess, I stopped believing in guys in general, in marriage, and to a certain part in love. I believe that my boyfriend loves me, but I always remember that he can change his mind very easily, without me even knowing what''s up. I think that''s a part of my personality now, that I KNOW there is no guy out there that is going to make want to run to the alter. It''s never going to happen.

That''s really unfortunate because it means any guy has no chance from the start. If your mindset is that you could be betrayed at any corner, then how can you put your trust and love in him? It means you are going to be actively looking for vindication that your theory is accurate at every turn. This seems to already have manifested itself in such things as "not trusting his word"

Author:allycat0303
3) But I cry a lot. I startd keeping track in my journal and I notice that I cry too much. Maybe once every 3 weeks. I don''t know if I''m too sensitive or that I make a big deal out of everything. So I don''t know if it''s me, or if it''s him.

This is a direct result of not dealing with issues. If unresolved issues, that you feel strongly about, are just floating around in your head then of course you are going to be (seemingly) randomly upset...it''s cause you haven''t resolved them yet!

Author:allycat0303
For example he plays hockey on wednesdays, and before he started playing, we talked about how it was going to be, set some ground rules (we''ve had some major issues about this in the past). So he starts to play. And then...he just ignores everything that he promised he would do. So I talk to him about it, for example, I can''t sleep when he''s not home. I asked him to be home at 11:30. He promised he would be, swore up and down and he comes home yesturday at 12:30. I have an exam on friday (which I''m exhausted) my Dad is in the hospital and he didn''t even bother to CALL me. So for about half an hour while I was waiting, I was also TERRIFIED that he''d gotten into a car accident and the police were going to show up at my house. AND he''s mad at me because he says I''m too hard on him.

You are completely out of line on this one. It''s so far unfair and unreasonable I don''t know where to begin. It''s plainly obvious to see that you set unrealistic "ground rules" to start with (I''d love to know what those are).

You can''t go to sleep without him? Buy a stuffed animal. I don''t know what else to say. What do you expect to do if he is on a business trip? Or, if he gone for a long weekend with the guys? Will you simply stay awake until his return? Well, the point of that rhetorical question was to point out that this is an issue that you can resolve, and you will both be better off when it is solved.

Author:allycat0303
But this is consistently a problem with him. And it really hurts me. Whenever he''s with his friends, it''s like he forgets that I exist, loses track of time (I''m sure those that have been on the board for long, remember how more then a few incidents when this has come up) It''s this kind of casual disregard for my life, my feelings when it comes to this issue. But he''s not like this on anything else. He''ll consult me with every major (and minor life decision) and will do everything to make me happy. Except for this.

I don''t understand this one either. How did you manage to insert yourself and your feelings into this scenario?
Just repeat after me: "It''s ok for him to be with friends" ... "It''s ok for him to sometimes stay out late" ... "Him staying out late with friends is not a personal attack on me, it''s simply him being out with friends"

Author:allycat0303
And obviously, this is an example. There''s just this casual selfishness sometimes, that really hurt me.

Could this be selfishness on your part?

Author:allycat0303
So his word doesn''t mean much to me. Which makes me wonder why we would have to have a wedding a vow to each other that we''ll love each other forever when a) he breaks his word all the time b) it''s not like I believe because he says it in a church means he''s going to do it.

So, him coming home later than he said he would means his vows are meaningless? Wow...how can you possible equate those? Simply amazing...

Author:allycat0303
4) But then there''s also this feeling. Like maybe he has ''too much of a life?'' to be compatibe with me. A lot of times, we''ll go 3-4 weeks only sleeping beside each other and never talking, etc., and he NEVER notices. It''s never him that says to me ''I miss spending time with you'' And I need to hear that, and feel that I matter to him. Or he''ll say he misses me, but the first day he has off, he''s with booking a hockey game with his friends. So I know he can''t REALLY be missing me THAT much.

Why did you let it go 3-4 weeks? Why didn''t *you* talk to him? If there is a problem, talk it out! Don''t play the passive aggressive card again, and lie there wondering when he is going to do something. Obviously it can''t be that important to you if you let it go 3-4 weeks. You must share the blame, he has no idea it is bothering you because you never said anything about it (hes not a mind reader)

Author:allycat0303
....It''s honestly a book. I don''t know what to do anymore. I''ve been through everything, crying, talking, screaming. It''s not as though it''s not clear to him. I''m very straight foreward kind of girl

I''m sorry, but you are far from a straight forward kind of girl

Author:allycat0303And he''ll always promise that it will be different and it NEVER is. Because it won''t be, because it''s a compromise he''s not willing to make. He''ll put me before everything else, his family, his career, even most of the things he wants to do....but then out of nowhere, comes things that are so incredibly selfish, I''m stunned.

It sounds like he is making an effort, but you aren''t cutting him any slack. Again, this is something you need to address instead of writing him off. From the way you describe it, it sounds like 80% of the time you are the sole thing in the universe to him, but the other 20% of the time is what you judge him by.

Author:allycat0303
He''ll drive 4 hours a day (everyday for 2 weeks) to come home to me every night instead of going on a business trip (fully paid for by his company), I didn''t ask him to. I told him to stay there because I was scared he would get into a car accident etc., but he insisted.

Some of that is because he cares I''m sure, but honestly some of that has to be the guilt trip you induces with things like "I can''t sleep without you" etc

Author:allycat0303
But he won''t come home 1 hour early so I can sleep because I''m stressed and exhusted and worried. Moreover, it''s something that he promised to do? How does that make sense? But at the same time, even if I don''t spend 1/2 a week actually talking to him for 3 weeks, he won''t notice? How does this make any sense. These 2 events happened within the space of a little over 1 MONTH.

Again, it was unreasonable of you to ask.

Author:allycat0303
I just don''t know what to do. It''s 10 years. It seems like a shame to throw it away. But I''m so misreably unhappy so often. I just don''t know what to do, what to try. I want to save this relationship, but I don''t see where to go.

You have to put every issue on the table, and be completely willing to let him put all his issues with you on the table. You have to have a completely open mind to what he has to say, and you must be willing to compromise. Above all else, you have to work these things out...you can''t continue with this behavior any longer.

BUT...if you ask me, it seems like you''ve already checked out of the relationship. If we are talking about the next step, well, we are talking about marriage. IF he wants it, and you don''t then that is an impasse that will end the relationship (or should)

I''m sorry if you feel insulted by anything I have said, but it needed to be said. I sincerely hope you can work it out.

 

[anchor31]

Hey, ally! There''s a lot I''d like to say to you, but if you still want to call me, I''d rather talk on the phone. I''ll be back Sunday evening if you''re up to it.

I still wanted to let you know I''m thinking about you and wishing you the best, whatever happens...

 

[AceP]

i don''t often respond to these threads, and i think the previous posters have pretty much covered the territory, but i just have one quick thought: ally, you''re clearly a reasonably bright girl. and you know that your 10 year relationship has run its course and is deteriorating slowly and excruciatingly. but it appears to me that you are so paralyzed by your fear of being alone that you''re willing to cling to false hope. being with this man obviously does not make you happy. if you don''t take action now, you will wake up in five years trapped in an unhappy marriage. don''t allow your life to be ruled by 10 years of habit.

 

[Mara]

Date: 9/29/2006 2:27:22 PM
Author: AceP
i don''t often respond to these threads, and i think the previous posters have pretty much covered the territory, but i just have one quick thought: ally, you''re clearly a reasonably bright girl. and you know that your 10 year relationship has run its course and is deteriorating slowly and excruciatingly. but it appears to me that you are so paralyzed by your fear of being alone that you''re willing to cling to false hope. being with this man obviously does not make you happy. if you don''t take action now, you will wake up in five years trapped in an unhappy marriage. don''t allow your life to be ruled by 10 years of habit.

this is such a succint way of putting it!

also while avant''s post was very much ''tough love''....it has many merits in and of itself. of course we all know you and feel sympathy for you ally, but your boyfriend must be having his own mental turmoil as well right now. i do think that some of whay you say is unreasonable on him (aka the i can''t sleep unless you are here so you HAVE to be home) but that''s kind of your thing with him. for me there are more serious issues here like you say you don''t plan to ever marry him. good point avant makes which is have you told him that? does he know you are so unsure?

anyway much else has already been said, but i still feel bottom line is you need to get out of this relationship and have a separation to figure out what you want to do with YOUR life. it doesn''t have to be permanent breakup but you need some time alone. quite obviously your situation now with stressful school and stressful relationship are not working out.

what is the immediate plan of action for you? because things CANNOT stay the way they are now. you surely know that.

 

[janinegirly]

Great post from Avant. Really makes the point by using your own words and maybe help u to see how some of your "issues" with your fiance/ex fiance are really your OWN issues. i too cannot fathom how you do not feel he should be permitted to have any independence (without being on an extremely short leash) and should not allow you to sleep alone for any portion of the night.
anyway, this is probably all moot since *maybe* you guys are broken up (I can't tell if this was the case or just late night convo). I really wish you clarity and eventual happiness with all of this.

 

[firebirdgold]

He deserves a woman who is excited about marrying him. Everybody deserves that!
If you love him, let him go!

 

[bee*]

Hi Ally,
I really dont mean to offend you either but avant covered a lot of things that I thought when I was reading the previous posts. In your last post as to what your fiance said to you, I would also be really hurt if my fiance didnt wear the engagement ring that I gave them, or talked/planned the wedding at all.I dont think he lied to you about his not minding when you got married-he proposed to you so I think that makes it clear that he was interested in marrying you. It just seems like you dont have much time for him. I know that you are studying for your dream career, but it just seems like you''re not supporting his dreams very much. I think that its really nice that he wants you to go see him go play hockey or other things that he''s interested in. Your answer that you dont have the time doesnt seem to be taking his feelings into account. There are 2 people in the relationship and your needs seem to be taking up a lot of it. I just dont see what he''s getting out of it. I think you know what you have to do

 

[allycat0303]

Well I'm not going to get defensive because it's useless. So I'm going to answer the most pertinent questions.

1) Does he know that my feelings changed when he strayed? Yes he did. Of course you don't forget something like that.
It took us about 3 years of talking about the thing constantly to get to the point where I felt I could be ok with it.

2) He knows a) why I don't want to get married b) why it changed. c) admits he's responsible d) is being mean to me in the hopes of getting me to go through with it. Talked about, addressed lack of trust issues. However him breaking his word on casual things doesn't make me trust him more. Why say " you can trust me?" and then break your word? Is that suppose to inspire trust.

3) and the 3-4 weeks with nothing. I do talk. And I beg for him to spend time with me. Sometimes I scream....but he's got stuff, friends, UFC, floor hockey. So I know it won't happen.

I'm going to just be really clear:

All this summer it was Monday:Baseball
Tuesday: Baseball
Sunday: Floor Hockey, Sunday afternoon Poker
Wednesday: Ice Hockey (early game)
Thursday: Ice Hockey (early game)

For winter: Baseball has been replaced by Ice Hockey. So that's hockey 4 times a week (and only 1 late game), and floor hockey a week. The late game is the only one I put a restriction on because the boys have a tendency to drink like crazy. As in driving home drunk which I don't agree with. So I try as much as possible to insure he doesn't end up in a coffin. And the floor hockey doesn't bother me because he doesn't drink.... so I'm going to add, which I should have added, that I can't sleep because I'm scared he's driving home drunk. I didn't want to share that because to me, it's private but I do feel I need to defend myself. Not because I'm afraid of the dark. When he was 21 he hit an electrical pole one night in a car accident and came within inches of being killed. It was after a late hockey game when they stayed until 1-2 drinking and he drove home drunk.

He had a gambling problem too and I made him get banned from all the casino's in Canada. Does that make me a control freak too?

So I'm going to be really clear, because I feel beaten and exhausted. Many of you assumed that I had him on a short leesh because I'm a girl, and therefore one of those typical needy, unreasonable girls.

And for all of you that think I'm some psycho-crazed girl and totally unreasonable all of the issues and the messes he's made. Over the years. Alchol, gambling, all of it. My boyfriend is a very good looking guy, he goes out and girl's flock to him. He's rich, he's successful and he's got great values.We went to a bar once, and there was a group of girls that threw matches at him to get his attention. This NEVER happens to me. He can get girls. I'm shy, awkward, and there are no guys beating down the door. I've probably never been hit on by a guy. EVER. I'm leaving him knowing that with my shyness and introverted ways, I would be shocked if I didn't end up alone.

And although I'm going to admit to high maintence. I'm going to admit to being the big B. But not to being selfish because I'm not, and not to being a control freak because I just want him safe. And I have him on a short leesh when (after 10 years you know the weaknesses) when he's shown a consistent pattern of behvior that is dangerous/self destructive.

I stayed with him because I really, really love him. I feel like I'm going to collapse in a million peices, and I'm scared that he can't take care of himself. And honestly to go to a counseller, would have to mean laying it ALL out. And I know what the counseller is going to say "this is toxic for you" end of the story. And I'm frankly embarrassed of some of the things I've done for him. And in order for a counseller to help us, well I'd have to tell all. And I'm not willing to do that. So maybe that means I'm against conselling. I can say these things because it's anonymous. But to have someone sitting in front of me, and to say all these things whie she looks at me and judges me, or judges him. I wouldn't be able too.

So I'm going to try and stay away from this thread because it's really hurting me and some of the stuff some of you are saying brings tears to my eyes, because I feel like I'm abandoning him, and the things that many of you are saying make me feel like I'm being selfish and I should give him another chance. And I don't want to be convinced back into this. I know alot of the things he said to me yesturday was his way of trying to make it about me so that I would feel like we could work something out, etc. but it's not. He's busy, he's got baggage, and some freakin flourescent orange flags. But I did believe that if I worked hard enough, stayed vigilent enough, we would be ok. But I feel like with my father, school, the things I could handle before, are too much for me now. I'm starting to decompress and self destruct myself.

Anchor: Thanks sweetie. I'll talk to you soon. I'm a mess. And the exam was hard.

 

[oshinbreez]

Ally,

I know you are doing the best thing for yourself. Alot of the things I don''t see as being unreasonable. If he''s going to be late, he should call so that you don''t worry. He should have given more of himself. We''re all entitled to our feelings. Sometimes, you just have to realize that enough is enough. Even after all the crap my exhusband did to me, I still loved him...in a way. You ARE doing the right thing. Take time for yourself.

 

[Mara]

ally, above anything else...you know what the therapist would tell you. this relationship IS toxic for you at this point in time.

you are NOT his mother. you are NOT responsible for him. he is an ADULT. i realize that it hurts and you are scared because he has his issues (and i remember you mentioning his drinking in that other post about the party) and he may self-destruct without you but that is NOT YOUR PROBLEM. he has made his choices in life just like you have. he has to choose how and when he wants to stop being party boy and turn into adult boy. that is totally his thing. you cannot SAVE HIM FROM HIMSELF. i think that is super important to realize. by you leaving to take time to figure yourself out, you are not *abandoning him*.

if nothing else, this separation will hopefully show both of you how to exist on your own. you without having to mother and watch and take care of him as well as do all your own stuff on the side. and him how to really be an adult. it sounds to me like all this time with you, you just took the nurturing place of his mother. maybe he never had to grow up and be on his own before.

as for people jumping to conclusions because of the info you put out, well you know how it is. you put out 1/2 the story and you will get 1/2 ass advice in return. since this IS anonymous, be honest with the people on here. no one is judging you. i don''t think that you are perfect. i don''t think he is perfect. i think there are two sides to what is going on. and no it''s not fair for him to sit there while you tell us that you have no intention of every marrying him. just like it''s not fair to you that he puts you in the position of having to care for him like a parent. there is a serious lot of ''not fair'' going on in this relationship. half life.

just to make myself SUPER clear. i do not think you should even think about giving him another chance right now. LEAVE. get yourself situation. work things out for yourself. and GET OVER yourself and GET INTO some therapy. you know that you need it. you think the therapist doesn''t see more jacked up cases than your story? of course she does!!!! so don''t worry about what they think about you. you need to get some professional help and be able to ''put it all out there'' as you said and to an impartial third party. only then will you really be able to begin to figure out what you need in your life. when you put out 1/2 information and are dishonest with yourself in the process...you are not doing anyone any favors, least of all you. i really believe that if you can get into therapy and get someone to really listen to you....you would be a world of better.

lastly...do not take what is said here as anything other than what it is. people here care about you and that is why they are responding. even the blunt ones, myself included. no one wants to see you continue spiraling downhill. i''m very happy that you seem to be thinking about yourself even if it means leaving him to his own devices for a while. you need the time.

 

[icekid]

well, I''ve barely been around in months and just lurking once in a while when I get the chance, but I''ll delurk for you miss ally.

first, I just want to say that I am so sorry that you are hurting so much. I know how hard that is, and I really know how hard it is to keep struggling through crazy med school when you feel torn up inside. but sweetie, you can''t keep doing what you''re doing. if you want the situation to change (and I''m pretty certain you don''t want to be unhappy forever!), then YOU have to do something different. you can''t just keep doing the same thing, and expect that magically everything comes together. you should not stay with him because you''re afraid to leave, or because you''re afraid to be alone.

I think we all understand that you love your bf. But loving someone does not make them right for you. It should not be this tough all of the time. You should be happy. This is no way to live, girl! and to be honest, it''s only going to get worse. when you''re studying for boards, or in the hospitals and stressed to the MAX and still dealing with this drama at home- it''s going to be scary; I don''t think I could handle it myself under those circumstances. your bf does not seem to be there for you when you need him the most, and that''s not the kind of person who is going to help get you through a long and trying residency.

The drinking thing is a serious problem. I went through a similar situation with my ex, where I would feel scared about him driving home at night and not be able to sleep. And I know he still drinks heavily to this day, and DAMN,I don''t want to be wondering if my husband is laying in a gutter every night when he''s a little late.

I''m going to have to agree with Mara- you should not be in this relationship right now. He is clearly not good for your mental well-being, and it''s time that you start taking care of YOU and let him alone so he can figure out how to fix his own problems. I don''t remember a time when you seemed to be genuinely happy in this relationship, and the fact that you have no intention of marrying speaks volumes. Maybe your subconscious knows better, but you can''t wrap your head around it yet. I do think counseling would be a good thing- not with bf, but for you alone. And yes, you would have to spill your guts eventually, but that is the point afterall. No one is going to think less of you; just try to help you get your head in the right place.

Take care of yourself, sweetie. You deserve so much better than what you''ve got right now. I''m thinking of you!

 

[diamondfan]

Ally, first, Ihope your dad gets well soon. That is not helping your emotional state. I read your post and agree you seem very unhappy. It seems you do not not see a future with him, and it scares and upsets you. You mentioned you hoped not to toss out ten years of being a couple, but I have one comment and I hope you see it in the spirit intended. IF he is not right for you, should you put MORE years in just because of the past? Meaning, you have ONE life, and if this is not what you see for your future, just look at the last ten years as growth and good stuff, but do not let that tie you to MORE years if you are not happy. Of course, if you are still in love and want to be married to him and have his kids and think you can work out some of these issues, no worries. But do not let that time spent be what KEEPS you in a relationship that seems to be clearly not what you want and is not making you happy. Try to think over all the main concerns and issues and see if you want to keep going or not...tough to do, but either way you need to do some thinking...good luck andhope to hear how it is going for you...

 

[AmberGretchen]

Ally, I don''t know if you''re still checking this thread, but I don''t think you are being unreasonable at all with expecting him to keep you updated on his basic schedule and whereabouts. My husband and I had some issues about this when we first started dating but he got pretty quickly that its about being a "we" not an "I" and that basic respect for the other person dictates that you give them a general idea of what''s going on with you, when you''ll be home, etc...and not break your word without letting them know and/or a very good reason (i.e. emergency for you or a friend/family member, etc...).

Anyway, there are clearly many other issues to deal with here, I just wanted to let you know that not everyone feels that you are being too controlling in this particular respect, and that I and my DH both think its healthy and normal to expect what you expect from your partner in a relationship around this issue. All due respect to others on this board who feel differently, but I wanted to let you know what we are reasonable intelligent people in a healthy relationship that happen to agree with you on this point.

I sincerely hope that you are able to find a way to work things out with yourself and get to a better place personally, no matter what happens with your relationship.

 

[galeteia]

Date: 9/29/2006 11:38:11 PM
Author: AmberGretchen
Ally, I don''t know if you''re still checking this thread, but I don''t think you are being unreasonable at all with expecting him to keep you updated on his basic schedule and whereabouts. My husband and I had some issues about this when we first started dating but he got pretty quickly that its about being a ''we'' not an ''I'' and that basic respect for the other person dictates that you give them a general idea of what''s going on with you, when you''ll be home, etc...and not break your word without letting them know and/or a very good reason (i.e. emergency for you or a friend/family member, etc...).


Anyway, there are clearly many other issues to deal with here, I just wanted to let you know that not everyone feels that you are being too controlling in this particular respect, and that I and my DH both think its healthy and normal to expect what you expect from your partner in a relationship around this issue. All due respect to others on this board who feel differently, but I wanted to let you know what we are reasonable intelligent people in a healthy relationship that happen to agree with you on this point.


I sincerely hope that you are able to find a way to work things out with yourself and get to a better place personally, no matter what happens with your relationship.

Hear, hear.

 

[ljmorgan]

Ally honey, I wish you the best. What a difficult time! You will get through this.