PS Mommy Thread-Newborn to 12 months!

[Tacori E-ring]

Whining and crying is different. I don''t worry about whining. There are times she whines in the middle of the night and I ignore her and she goes back to sleep. Full out crying is where I give her 15 minutes. Once she realizes that I am not coming she goes back to sleep. I had to train her. I think for Hunter you should not BF. Maybe offering a bottle would be the last step. With Tessa it was different since she was low weight for awhile there. Hunter is using you for comfort and *needs* to learn to self-soothe. Does he like white noise? We used that for awhile with T. Also I put multiple pacis in the crib so they are easier for her to fibd.

 

[fisherofmengirly]

Tacori, as always, adorable new name icon!! So cuteness! Is her hair getting lighter, or is the sun just hitting it differently being that it''s all flipped out on the swing action?

 

[puffy]

DD i am with Tacori on this one. i was super lucky with a great sleeper from the start so it didn''t take much sleep training to get him to fall asleep on his own and get back to sleep on his own. there have been nights though, that he will wake and whine and i hear it, i just let him alone and he''ll go right back to sleep within minutes. and there were nights when he would full out cry like he was in pain, but i knew it couldn''t be because he was hungry cause he stopped having a middle of the night feeding around 2 months, so i let him cry for 10-15 minutes, and he would fall back to sleep.
is it that he is waking because he can''t roll back over or he needs you to help him to get back to sleep? whatever the reason, it needs to stop cause 5 times a night where everyone is getting up is just going to lead to 6-7 times a night, if you continue to feed him and you know he isn''t hungry. sure, the first 6 months, everyone says is all about survival...you gotta do what you gotta do to get some sleep. but honestly, it sounded like he was sleeping ok for awhile, i believe. you just have to put an end to him needing you or your DH to get back to sleep. he is falling asleep on his own when you first put him to bed?
this is all what you are comfortable with doing, CIO, or picking him up and putting him back down, patting, etc. whatever it is, it''s going to take time, but stay consistent.
i''m sorry you are going through this, i hope it gets better soon!

 

[Tacori E-ring]

fisher, thank you! She is a happy girl for sure. Her hair looks lighter b/c of the sun but it is lighter than mine. I am actually surprised she is not blonder since DH had light hair as a child. I would say she has medium brown hair.

Puffy, you are SOOO lucky with B. T had to be trained. She did not sleep through the night until 6 months. Those were a LONG first 6 months for sure!

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 7/18/2009 10:38:26 AM
Author: natalina

Date: 7/18/2009 10:00:44 AM

Author: fisherofmengirly

Thanks for that information, NF.

I will pass it on to my hubby, for sure. The only thing with the longer names is that I don''t think any of them are pretty. The one ending in ope is so weird to me, and makes me think of a centipede. Can you think of any that you have heard and wouldn''t have minded having been your ''real'' name while you went by your name (you know, the one I just adore)?

You''re killing me with the mystery, NF & Fisher! Specifically because there is a name that DH and I both love but hesitate to use because we really want our little girl to have a formal name that shortens into a nickname, but this one sounds like a nickname and we don''t *love* the longer forms we can think of. Your last comment about ''ope'' has me thinking we may have the same name in mind. I don''t want to say too much for NF''s comfort, but can you give any other hints as to what the name might be?

Lol-I do like to try and avoid my first name on here but I will add that there is another longer name that ends in "ista" too!

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 7/18/2009 11:37:21 AM
Author: Tacori E-ring
Whining and crying is different. I don''t worry about whining. There are times she whines in the middle of the night and I ignore her and she goes back to sleep. Full out crying is where I give her 15 minutes. Once she realizes that I am not coming she goes back to sleep. I had to train her. I think for Hunter you should not BF. Maybe offering a bottle would be the last step. With Tessa it was different since she was low weight for awhile there. Hunter is using you for comfort and *needs* to learn to self-soothe. Does he like white noise? We used that for awhile with T. Also I put multiple pacis in the crib so they are easier for her to fibd.

OK, that makes sense. I think if we ignore the whining he might go back to sleep. We have a fan in there and I think he likes it. He is shy of 5 months now, so discerning his likes and dislikes is hard still

He also hasn''t really figured out putting the soother in his mouth. He will grab it and chew and suck on any part of it, not necessarily the nipple part

Usually he wakes and he is on top of it somehow.

I know he used to be able to put himself to sleep because he would only wake 1x per night to feed, *maybe* 2x. This issue has come up for a couple reasons -- one is that he rolls on his tummy, wakes that way, and then he gets all worked up arching his back and lifting his arms like a swan dive! We are going to start putting him to sleep on his tummy because he always rolls that way and so he needs to learn. It also came up because he stays awake longer and it seemed he needed another feed before he slept, which often resulted in feeding him before a nap. I think now he does not need another feed before a nap, he can go 4 hours easily when I am not present, so I am going to work on getting back on a proper EASY routine. He has been "snacking" lately and it makes me mental. So these issues are all intertwined.

I am not totally sure how I feel about CIO, even for 15 minutes. I will think about it and talk with DH. I totally understand the teaching/learning thing, but I worry about baby learning that caregivers don''t come when baby cries. It may be silly, but there it is. I will think about it, but no matter what I will get rid of nighttime nursing except for perhaps one big feed (which I think he still needs) and I won''t let him fall asleep at the breast at that one if I do it.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 7/18/2009 12:31:41 PM
Author: puffy
is it that he is waking because he can''t roll back over or he needs you to help him to get back to sleep?

I think this is the case. He knew/knows how to fall asleep on his back, but he doesn''t yet know how to fall asleep on his tummy. We will work on putting his down on his tummy to sleep. I also think he is teething!

he is falling asleep on his own when you first put him to bed?

Usually, it depends on how tired he is. Our typical routine is bath, nurse, bed, and sometimes he falls asleep at the breast. He won''t be totally asleep, but dozey. Obviously, he is too dozey and has become reliant. I think we will make it nurse-bath-bed and see what happens.

Thanks Puffy!

 

[gailrmv]

DD - on the sleep issues, know that you are not alone. We are struggling with many of the same issues, and A is about a month younger than your H. I am reading everything I can get my hands on. Not much new to add. I''ll let you know if we have any breakthroughs. My A is also becoming a snacker and the eating/sleeping/no naps are intertwined, I''m sure. Just today I began keeping a sleep log again to see if we can develop a better nap schedule.

Could it be that he is teething and is fussy for that reason?

Be glad your DH can help with the night feedings. My DH has to be really alert for his job and also is a deep sleeper, so I''ve been doing 100% of night duty for 4 months (since A''s birth). It is HARD. I am working part time from home which I know is not as demanding as a FT job but is still hard to find time to work, and the concentration to do so.

This has got to get easier - and at least they are cute!

 

[Tacori E-ring]

DD, you have to do what is right for you! I know not every parent and not every child can handle the CIO method. My dad (who did a pedi residency) and my pedi both suggested the 15 min rule and it worked for us. My dad also says some crying is good for them. It is the only way they can get their stress and frustrations out and is how they communicate. That being said if your child is hurt, ill or crying for longer than that then of course I would tend to him. I don''t think 5 months is too young at all for 15 mins of CIO. But you could always start with 5 or 10 and work your way up to it. He is starting to learn these habits and is training you and your DH (instead of the other way around). So you have to decide if you have hit your rock bottom (in the sleep department). If so CIO is much easier to do

Good luck!

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 7/18/2009 7:43:56 PM
Author: Tacori E-ring
DD, you have to do what is right for you! I know not every parent and not every child can handle the CIO method. My dad (who did a pedi residency) and my pedi both suggested the 15 min rule and it worked for us. My dad also says some crying is good for them. It is the only way they can get their stress and frustrations out and is how they communicate. That being said if your child is hurt, ill or crying for longer than that then of course I would tend to him. I don''t think 5 months is too young at all for 15 mins of CIO. But you could always start with 5 or 10 and work your way up to it. He is starting to learn these habits and is training you and your DH (instead of the other way around). So you have to decide if you have hit your rock bottom (in the sleep department). If so CIO is much easier to do

Good luck!

I think with CIO it is all or nothing -- if you let them go 5 minutes then 10 etc, all you do is teach them that they need to cry longer to get what they want! LOL! So if we adopt that method we will go all in. It may come to that, for now I think we are going to try the baby whisperer methods for a week and see if we can see some changes. We had sort of fallen off the routine. Today I didn''t nurse Hunter to sleep at all and he went 3-4 hours between feeds -- we had fallen into the habit of nursing every 2 hours or so, which is obvuously ridiculous for a larger baby, he wasn''t eating very much each time. Tonight, when I put Hunter down, he started crying so DH went in there and held him until he calmed, it took about 5 minutes of hard crying in dad''s arms! Then he put him down. He started crying again 5 minutes later, but this time it took about 30 seconds for DH to calm him. The last time he cried it took less time, and then Hunter went to sleep! The whole thing took 20 minutes. I think what is hard is that babies change so much. Hunter never used to go into full-on wild cry mode, and so when he started doing that it was shocking and so I would nurse him to calm him down!

Tonight we stuck it out and discovered that he only cries for 5-7 minutes, and I am ok with him doing that in Dad''s arms, it is different than on his own.

Tonight we are going to use a rule of no BFing until 3am! We will use the pick-up put-down method and a pacifier before that time. Typically, he wakes 1 or 2 times before then. We''ll see how it goes! After thre nights, depending on how much he eats at 3am (if at all), then we won''t give him and BF and he will get a bottle at 3am or perhaps even later. That''s what the baby whisperer recommends so we shall see how it goes this week. If it isn''t working then we may try CIO like you suggest.

 

[mela lu]

DD - having zero experience (yet) myself, I'll throw in my 2c, in which you can take with a grain of salt.

In the book "The Baby Sleep Solution", they claim a GOOD habit take 3 days to make and 3 days to break. They also claim that a BAD habit takes 3 days to make and 7 days to break. If we were to follow this formula, then hunter will need 7 days of (modified) CIO in order to break this bad habit he's picked-up.

That said, it's up to you what method you want to use to break this bad habit. If it were me, I'd try the 15 min CIO, then go in and pick-up-put-down (which may take a LooooooG time to soothe him down from his hysteria). That may feel like an eternity in the middle of the night, but as the book said, you *should* be out of the woods after 7 days.

My Girlfriend did CIO to break the bad habit of waking up in the middle of the night, and her LO would CIO for upwards to an hour some nights. She eventually would fall asleep (pure exhaustion) but wake up like a flower the next morning as if nothing happened. Her DD now sleeps 12 hours straight. I don't know if this works for every child, but if you set it up as a 7 days "trial", you have only one week to lose.

ETA: We do "feed, bathe, sleep" and it works like a charm. Also, I feel like 10-15 mins of CIO is harder on the parent than it is on the kid. Again, I'm no expert, so -grain-of-salt.

 

[nycbkgirl]

AFM- sis and i got sick of everythin and went to get tattoos

 

[mela lu]

In unrelated news, we dug out a photo of my DH to compare to Romeo. Um, can you say "IDENTICAL"!?

DH:

 

[mela lu]

Romeo:

 

[Blenheim]

NYC - OMG! What does it look like? Where is it?

Mela - They really do look exactly the same. That''s really cool that you could find that.

DD - We won''t do CIO for similar reasons. We value kindness and compassion, and we don''t want to teach George that it''s okay to ignore people who are crying. So if you''re silly, then we are too. I hear that the No Cry Sleep Solution is really good if you want more non-CIO methods in your arsenol... I haven''t read it yet (DH was supposed to put a hold on it at the library) but I''m reading her discipline book right now.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Blen, with all due respect I don''t think my daughter learned it is okay when others cry. In fact I KNOW she hasn''t b/c recently one of her friends was crying and she went to pat him on the back. I also value kindness and compassion but also think falling asleep is an important SKILL that children need to learn. Children learn to manipulate very young and quickly catch on to how to get what they want. My daughter didn''t STTN until 6 months so maybe it was easier for me to try CIO method since I know many other moms get luckier than I did and have good sleepers from the start. I also didn''t have to have her CIO for a long period. She caught on fairly quickly and learned bedtime was not a game. She sleeps 12-13 hours a night with a 2-3 hour nap so I think it was worth it.

 

[Blenheim]

Tacori, we''re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I''m glad that you found techniques that worked well for you and your family.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Date: 7/18/2009 9:14:35 PM
Author: Blenheim
Tacori, we''re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I''m glad that you found techniques that worked well for you and your family.

I agree but think it might be more thoughtful not to openly judge other people''s parenting. DD''s situation is not working and she was asking for help. I told her what worked for us.

 

[Blenheim]

Date: 7/18/2009 9:23:48 PM
Author: Tacori E-ring

Date: 7/18/2009 9:14:35 PM
Author: Blenheim
Tacori, we''re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I''m glad that you found techniques that worked well for you and your family.

I agree but think it might be more thoughtful not to openly judge other people''s parenting. DD''s situation is not working and she was asking for help. I told her what worked for us.

I''ve just seen several mentions on here about how sometimes CIO is necessary to teach children how to sleep - which carries the implication that if you''re not doing it, then you''re doing a disservice to your children. DD has expressed that she has reservations about CIO and would prefer to try other methods first, and I was trying to express to her that we feel similarly about CIO potentially teaching children things that we don''t want to teach them, and recommended a source that I''ve heard is really good if you''re looking for sleep techniques that don''t involve CIO. I really don''t see how I''m being more judgmental than other people on here have been.

 

[Pandora II]

DD - I find it really hard at times to stick to the EASY routine - especially if we are doing other things that mean life isn''t revolving around her. I do notice that things start to get out of kilter pretty fast -she''ll do a lot of snacking rather than having a proper feed, and do 10 minute naps that don''t make her less tired but do give her the energy to fight sleep.

It''s really hard when you are tired to not think sod it, I''ll stick them on the boob and then they''ll fall asleep - hooray, so it''s great that it seems to be working with your DH (who won''t smell like lunch

) holding him. I''m really interested to see how you get on over the next few days. I do think Tracy Hogg talks a lot of sense. Good luck!

Tacori - Gorgeous new avatar, Tessa is so pretty!

TDM - I''m the same in that DH can''t help at night as he has to be awake for work so it falls 100% to me. I was really worried about the co-sleeping thing, but she never cries at night so he isn''t disturbed at all.

Are you trying the EASY schedule and getting anywhere? I so hear you on the eating/no sleeping issue where you feed them, play with them, they don''t sleep so you end up back at feeding again with no sleep in between...

Mela - OMG, they are IDENTICAL! I saw the photo before reading it and thought it was a ''traditional'' style one you''d had done at the baptism or something!

NYC - photos please!

Daisy has been a bit miserable today - I think it''s probably from the shots as she never normally cries much and definitely never keeps on crying when she''s picked up and cuddled. I gave her some Calpol and it made a huge difference, but why the heck do the manufacturers have to make it pink? It''s a complete PITA when they spit it everywhere and their clothes get stained by it... grrrrr.

Here''s a new pic at 8 weeks 4 days...

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Date: 7/18/2009 9:30:41 PM
Author: Blenheim

Date: 7/18/2009 9:23:48 PM

Author: Tacori E-ring

Date: 7/18/2009 9:14:35 PM

Author: Blenheim

Tacori, we''re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I''m glad that you found techniques that worked well for you and your family.

I agree but think it might be more thoughtful not to openly judge other people''s parenting. DD''s situation is not working and she was asking for help. I told her what worked for us.

I''ve just seen several mentions on here about how sometimes CIO is necessary to teach children how to sleep - which carries the implication that if you''re not doing it, then you''re doing a disservice to your children. DD has expressed that she has reservations about CIO and would prefer to try other methods first, and I was trying to express to her that we feel similarly about CIO potentially teaching children things that we don''t want to teach them, and recommended a source that I''ve heard is really good if you''re looking for sleep techniques that don''t involve CIO. I really don''t see how I''m being more judgmental than other people on here have been.

I said SEVERAL times she needs to do what is right for her. I have never pushed my views on anyone on here. I KNOW what it is like to have a child that doesn''t sleep. I also KNOW what it is like to now have a good sleeper. Not only are we happier, so is she! Different things work for different kids. I found what you said was offensive. To me this statement, "We value kindness and compassion, and we don''t want to teach George that it''s okay to ignore people who are crying." is VERY judgmental. You are saying those of us who use CIO (and most have been successful BTW) lack kindness, compassion and will have bullies for children. How do you not see that?

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Pandora, thanks! She is CLEARLY a happy girl. LOVE D''s new pic! It is really beautiful.

Mela, adorable new pic as well. I don''t come on here often (b/c of time) but am glad DD asked the toddler moms for help so I could see both your and Pandora''s beauties!

 

[Blenheim]

Tacori, you''re twisting my words and I''m not going to engage any further with you.

 

[gailrmv]

Someone mentioned trying to read the no cry sleep solution. I read it and thought it was quite good. I liked that many of the methods dovetailed with what I read in HSHHC. I found it not as scientific as HSHHC, but good. It's a quick read.

Blen and DD I also am not comfortable doing CIO at this young age, however I am not ruling anything out for the future. I know every kid is different. When we've tried to let him cry for 5-10 min he just gets more and more worked up. I wind up comforting him and often feeding him. It is so hard to know whether I am doing the right thing at the time or not. I don't want to feed him when he's not hungry, but often times he really does seem hungry - even though he's just eaten - it is such a rough cycle to be trapped in right now.

Pandora (I always want to call you Daisy now! She is BEAUTIFUL!!!) You have hit the nail on the head. We have tried EASY and that is EXACTLY what happens. We wind up doing EAESY on a good day or EAEAEAEAEAEAEAEAEA with failed nap attempts in between, on a more typical day

I'm now going to put aside the EASY routine and try instead to anticipate his sleepy times of day and make sure we are home, have him fed, and can get him in the crib when those times hit. I am doing a sleep log now to see if I can find trends. The problem is, like you say, when we plan to do anything outside of the house, it can mess with naptime because I don't know exactly when naptime is going to be. Often, it is NEVER. So frustrating. I hope we can get into a loose routine, for example, having naps at 9, noon, and late afternoon (which many of the books recommend). If I know when approx naptime should be, I can plan outings around the times he needs to sleep.

I am also considering pumping and feeding from the bottle more often so I can see how much I am making and how much he wants/needs per feed. I am so confused and tired. Being a (mostly) SAHM is really really really hard, but I think it would be at least as hard if not harder to be dealing with all these issues PLUS juggling full time work. Being a mom is hard work any way you slice it.

 

[nycbkgirl]

MELA- he is a carbon copy!

Pandora- that picture is just beyond words

Pandora/Blen- hehe i feel so good after the tat ...i watched a tyra show today(yeh duno why lol) but she actually said smthg that stuck with me...she said u cant be a good caregiver without taking time for yourself...and thats what my sis and i did and it was a great experience.. sis has many cool tats already but this was my first

its on my right inside wrist and its a libra balancing scale carrying a diamond on each end (scale is my sis and diamonds are my kids birthstones and of course my favorite things

) its in black and white and as soon as i figure this posting pics thing i will post it!....im actually working on posting all my jewels bc i have a lottt of nice pieces...im just a computer idiot !! and everyone is currently teaching me lol

 

[Dreamer_D]

Blen and Tacori I value both of your opinions and respect both opinions. FWIW, I didn''t read Blen''s comment as judgemental of parents who use CIO, but rather as a simple expression of her family''s reasons for not CIO. I have also not personally read comments in support of CIO as judging people who don''t do it. I think it is important to share every experience. I''m really sorry that either of you have felt judged about this issue, but I suspect that we all have felt that way sometimes, I know I have. It is hard not to with so many different points of view, but I doubt in most cases that the perceived slight wa intentional.

Some of my best friends used CIO, most actually, and I think when used correctly and at the right time in your child''s life it may really be a necessary and important tool. I certainly agree with Tacori that sleep is a learned skill. But for now I want to try and use other teaching tools, such as allowing Hunter to CIO in his father''s arms, which feels very different to me than crying on his own. We may transition to the more pure form of CIO when we are down to one wake up in the night.
I fear that as things stand now, jumping straight to CIO would result in a lot of crying at night and I''m not ready to do that yet.

Mela That makes a lot of sense. DH and I were amazed at how quickly Hunter went from one wake up to five

I think it won''t take too long to get back on track because we were not in the bad pattern for too long. I also know on one level that if we CIO HUnter will not remember in the morning and he will be fine, but on another level I wonder whether the message it send him -- that no one comes when you cry -- is not what we want to send at this point. That''s why we will try the CIO in Dad''s arms, or mine later if need be, because as I said, it feels different to me.

Tan Dog Mom I''ll let you know how it goes!

Gotta go to bed, will write more later... Pandora NYC, will catch up tomorrow.

 

[Blenheim]

NYC, I can''t wait to see a picture! Sounds very cool.

Pandora, she is just adorable. I love Daisy''s chunky cheeks. They kind of remind me (in a good way!!) of all the times that you said that you were going to give birth to an elephant.

TanDog - LOL about EAEAEAEAEAEAE... that was totally George''s napless Tuesday, after his shots.

DD - Thank you - that''s the spirit that I wrote it in. Good luck tonight, I really hope that it goes better.

Babies looking like parents... George doesn''t look anything like DH did as a baby. DH was a very chubby baby, and George isn''t. My mom''s convinced that George is a spitting image of me, and I don''t see it at all. I was evidently skinny, and a baby

, but I think that the similarities end there. Me:

 

[Blenheim]

And here''s a picture of my uncle when he was young... I can see a ton more resemblance in this picture.

By the way, looking through some of my baby pictures I had a sudden realization - my parents had intended to name me Catherine, and didn''t... And I have pictures of myself and my cousin Katie as newborns... and she''s 6 days older than me... I think I''ve realized why they decided to scrap their first choice name.

 

[puffy]

pandora what a great pic, she is so happy!!!

DD i''m glad to hear that the pick up method worked for you guys tonight! hope it continues and all of you are able to get some sleep, including hunter. i am sorry if by my post i implied that CIO was the only way at this because that is not what i am saying at all.
i was one of those people who said that i would never CIO, and honestly, i don''t consider 10-15 minutes of crying CIO, but if B was not a good sleeper to begin with i know that i would have tried every method until something worked. and i think that''s just it, not all methods work on all babies, so do what is best for you and your family. and not all infants should be STTN by now no matter what the books say.
there are a ton of methods out there and CIO is definitely not for everyone. i know people who have done CIO and couldn''t finish or go through with it because it was just too much, but for some other people, it worked like a charm.
one of B''s best play buddies had to CIO at 7 months and it became so much for the mom, she moved out of the house for 1 week at night cause she couldn''t handle it, but both mom and toddler are now happier because they both get the sleep they need. they had tried everything and for them, CIO was a last resort and it worked.

ok i am just rambling now. SORRY. the no cry sleep solution is a great book and her methods have worked on so many, but it takes time and time and lots of PATIENCE for it to be successful, at least that''s what i read in the book.

 

[cdt1101]

wow...lots of sleep talk

We are having a HORRIBLE time as well! Lex was up from 1:00am - 9:00 am today! My DH and I are ready to pull our hair out! Lex is NOT a great sleeper to begin w/...he's always fussy, never sound asleep for more than 30 minutes...i think the reflux has a lot to do w/ that. But yesterday he napped REALLY well, so I was hopeful (you know sleep begets sleep thing), but the night was a pure nightmare! We cannot get him to go more than 3 hours between feeds even w/ trying to do the EASY cluster feeding thing before bed. Just doesn't work. I'm starting to think E.A.S.Y. ain't so EASY

Lex is 6 1/2 weeks so I'm not expecting much, but it would be nice to at least get 4-5 hours straight at night instead of just 2! And I have NO idea what happened last night....he's still not asleep now, but quietly babbling to himself in his crib. I just don't know how he can't be tired at this point???

I know I'm rambling, but could use any advice! Maybe I'll pick up another book because I'm not so sure about EASY for us! Do you think we are expecting too much of an almost 7 week old? Or should he be sleeping better at night and it's us (DH and I) that has to change something?

Mela - Lex looks just like my DH too...so not fair..we carried them